Where do you store a Moxon vise?

[Bob Jones 5443]

Well, I've made my handwheels and I have the hardware and the suede and a nice thick chunk of hard maple. Now that a three-month kitchen remodel is over I am ready to make my Moxon vise, to set me up to practice and master dovetailing.

Now I can't decide if I want to 1) mount the Moxon onto the side of my bench (2-1/4" thick beech), "Murphy-bedded" to the wall –– or 2) build the vise with side wings to clamp to the top of the bench edge.

Option 1 might crowd access to the surface of the bench, for example for planing. I can envision constantly bending around the wheels and the extension of the screws.

Option 2 avoids this problem, but where in the world can I store the beast? It will probably weigh 18 or 20 pounds. The shape will be unwieldy, with lead screws protruding off the rectangular wood like spikes. Still, this seems to be the prevailing option as I look around. I suppose I'll make a caddy for it to slide into under the bench.

What do some of you do with yours?

[Mark Rainey]

Always a problem, clamped to a steel I beam - a pain to get down. Under my bench top - screws jab into my hip. Got it lying on the floor under my bench...out of the way for now at least, just interfered with my sweeping up a bit.

[mike stenson]

I hang mine from a beam on a dowel, actually I hang a lot of things in my shop now

https://photos.smugmug.com/Woodworking/Shop/Tools/Moxon/i-GLzZqRv/1/7a235c0a/XL/IMG_5884-XL.jpg

[Bob Jones 5443]

Yeah, Mark: all problems to consider.

I know guys like Bill Carey have theirs mounted on a dedicated Moxon bench, complete with a deep raised platform that functions as the rear chop. See, that's why I'd like to mount it to my bench, to have the flat area behind the vise for layout purposes.

But I have only the one bench, and can already only use one long side of it, as it's hinged to the wall. How would I use if for planing with the Moxon out front? So it just seems like I'd regret permanently mounting the vise to the bench.

If I make one like Bill Carey's, but also have everything removable, I'd need a full rear chop plus another largish, heavy thing behind that, that all has to be stored. I can almost see doing this, though. The portion behind the rear shop could be a hollow box. Hmmm.

[Bob Jones 5443]

I like that, Mike! That's my kind of storage. Great food for thought. How much does yours weigh?

[mike stenson]

I like that, Mike! That's my kind of storage. Great food for thought. How much does yours weigh?

To be honest Bob, I haven't weighed it.. but it feels like less than a bag of dog food, so I'd say around 20lbs? It works well, for me, because I can basically just hold it on my shoulder and hook it. It's also well out of the way, which was a serious concern with the screws

[Bob Jones 5443]

OK, I'll go with storage up instead of down. Thinking of it near the floor under the bench conjures up images of lots of dust and shavings on it all the time. Thanks for the ideas.

Also, I'm going to have maybe 16 or 18 max between the screws, so that will lighten it.

[David Eisenhauer]

Mine stores on a shelf under my TS catch table. It is of the type with wings for clamping down on my main bench when I want to use it. I recently cut my Acme thread lengths in half so that the protruding lengths of Acme thread did not interfere as much with the rest of the bench top activity as they previously did. My Acme threads were 18" long, now 9" long. I never did use it to more than the max opening it now has as I had originally planned for. I have other, handier ways to hold an assembled drawer for working on and can always go back to longer Acme threads if I change my mind again.

[Christopher Charles]

Congrats on finishing the kitchen remodel!

Mine's currently standing on the floor on one end because the ends ended up square enough to do that.
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Here's how it clamps to the benchtop. I may end up drilling a hole and finding a spot on the wall as well.

[steven c newman]

Where do I store mine? Simple...i do not have one. can't store what I don't have....

[Steve Kang]

Mine lives under my bench, where it's accumulating a layer of dust, shavings and offcuts. 445020

[Don Dorn]

That is the exact reason I don't have one anymore. No shelf under the bench and don't want one due to an inability to easily sweep and sawdust and shavings get over everything on the bench. I came up with a new method for no more than I use it anymore that is very small and is used in conjunction with the vice for any size panel. Works well enough for the girls I date.

[Mike Brady]

I made one at a class, using Bencrafted screws and ash as the wood. This design is bench-on-bench and storage of it is a problem. I leave it on my bench quite a bit or set it out of the way, but it is heavy and has a large footprint that runs against my reason for having just a bench and tool chests, in my rather small shop.

On the plus side it is great for dovetailing.

[Jim Matthews]

Mine is permanent, as a face vise where most leg vises are mounted. Kept clean and lubricated, it's excellent.

[Derek Cohen]

Mine lives under the bench. You can see it here in the dark recesses ....

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/BuildingTheThreeCorneredStools_html_6affdb9b.jpg

However ... there is a lot of other junk that accumulates there as well.

I plan to change this, so this topic is a reminder. I would like to add some a small, removable cabinet below the bench, with shall drawers for tools used at the bench. The problem then is where to store the Moxon vise. I already have other fixture piling up behind and nearby. Space is at a premium.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Bob Jones 5443]

Mine stores on a shelf under my TS catch table. It is of the type with wings for clamping down on my main bench when I want to use it. I recently cut my Acme thread lengths in half so that the protruding lengths of Acme thread did not interfere as much with the rest of the bench top activity as they previously did. My Acme threads were 18" long, now 9" long. I never did use it to more than the max opening it now has as I had originally planned for. I have other, handier ways to hold an assembled drawer for working on and can always go back to longer Acme threads if I change my mind again.

David, this is why I posted, to gather ideas. Under the table saw...very interesting. I might be able to make that work. I'll have to build it first to see its exact size and shape, but I just got under the saw and there is definitely room, even with the dust box under the router lift and the foot lever to move the base around. It would be a highly productive way to use that wasted space. Definitely in contention. Thanks.

Bob

[Bob Jones 5443]

Congrats on finishing the kitchen remodel!

Mine's currently standing on the floor on one end because the ends ended up square enough to do that.
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Here's how it clamps to the benchtop. I may end up drilling a hole and finding a spot on the wall as well.

Christopher, that's a clever end shape. It reminds me of my router fence, a massive 1" x 6" x 28" laminated pair of oak slabs, T-slotted onto a back frame that clamps to my Biesemeyer when I use the router table. After use, the router fence comes off the table, swings up vertically, and rests on end its custom caddy, French-cleated to the wall. A stout magnet-held catch pops down to keep the fence from swinging out of the caddy. But I digress. What makes it all work is that the sliding parts of the fence can be locked to give a flat, square end –– like your Moxon vise has –– for sitting upright.

I just like to get everything off the floor. It's become a theme over the past year, and I'm almost done. When I make the Moxon I'm committed to keeping it away from floor dust bunnies.

[Bob Jones 5443]

Mine lives under my bench, where it's accumulating a layer of dust, shavings and offcuts. 445020

Steve, very nice looking Moxon and bench top bench. Must be a dream to use. It also looks like it weighs about 40 pounds. Am I close?

[Bob Jones 5443]

That is the exact reason I don't have one anymore. No shelf under the bench and don't want one due to an inability to easily sweep and sawdust and shavings get over everything on the bench. I came up with a new method for no more than I use it anymore that is very small and is used in conjunction with the vice for any size panel. Works well enough for the girls I date.

Don, I'm well past my dating days. My Moxon is going to have no more than 16 or 18 inches between screws, so it too should be a manageable size. I should be able to both saw with it and chisel parts between it and the front vise. When I read about people with Moxons, I see a lot about how well they work for sawing dovetails, but never seem to see much about the chiseling part.

How about some pictures of your "new method?"

[Bob Jones 5443]

I made one at a class, using Bencrafted screws and ash as the wood. This design is bench-on-bench and storage of it is a problem. I leave it on my bench quite a bit or set it out of the way, but it is heavy and has a large footprint that runs against my reason for having just a bench and tool chests, in my rather small shop.

On the plus side it is great for dovetailing.

Mike, yep. That's what I'm envisioning and what I want to avoid. I'm going to start with just the two chops, clamped to the bench when in use and hung up otherwise. After I use it for a while I'll know more about whether I really want that back bench. Now, on to Derek's post.

[Bob Jones 5443]

Mine lives under the bench. You can see it here in the dark recesses ....

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/BuildingTheThreeCorneredStools_html_6affdb9b.jpg

However ... there is a lot of other junk that accumulates there as well.

I plan to change this, so this topic is a reminder. I would like to add some a small, removable cabinet below the bench, with shall drawers for tools used at the bench. The problem then is where to store the Moxon vise. I already have other fixture piling up behind and nearby. Space is at a premium.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Ah, there's that sweet little jarrah beauty! I was hoping to smoke you out, Derek. I also seem to recall you made a precisely sized I-beam assembly that takes care of the tail/pin board alignment. I like the small mass of that idea.

This reminds me to ask you: you once spoke against beveling the front edge of the moving chop. I think your rationale was to use the front chop to register the chisel when cleaning the sockets. Your latest Moxon has that coved edge. What brought you around? Did you stop chiseling in the Moxon?

So, for the community: with all these size and storage considerations, are Moxon vises just a fad, or will I always be glad I have one? My goal is to make dovetailing second nature to me.

[Michael J Evans]

Excuse my ignorance, but do all of you with moxons have low bench tops or is it mostly for the wide clamping function? I believe my bench top is around 37" and it seems high enough. I still have to slightly bend over but not much. I have a little QR vise so clamping a wide board can be slightly difficult, but I don't see how the moxons raising it up 6" or so makes a huge difference? The other thing that seems most of you could do, would be just use your leg vises and then a holdfast for wide boards.

[Derek Cohen]

Ah, there's that sweet little jarrah beauty! I was hoping to smoke you out, Derek. I also seem to recall you made a precisely sized I-beam assembly that takes care of the tail/pin board alignment. I like the small mass of that idea.

This reminds me to ask you: you once spoke against beveling the front edge of the moving chop. I think your rationale was to use the front chop to register the chisel when cleaning the sockets. Your latest Moxon has that coved edge. What brought you around? Did you stop chiseling in the Moxon?

Hi Bob

The reason for the cove at the front of the chop was to reduce the extra width in that area. A full width chop would get in the way of sawing at a steep angle, such as for half-blind dovetail sockets. There is still enough chop left if this is needed to act as a rest for the chisel.

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/TheLastMoxon_html_47a18bf7.jpg

The "I-beam" is still there, but only needed for long panels. The clamp at the top deals with all else.

​http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/TheLastMoxon_html_1ff98093.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Derek Cohen]

Excuse my ignorance, but do all of you with moxons have low bench tops or is it mostly for the wide clamping function? I believe my bench top is around 37" and it seems high enough. I still have to slightly bend over but not much. I have a little QR vise so clamping a wide board can be slightly difficult, but I don't see how the moxons raising it up 6" or so makes a huge difference? The other thing that seems most of you could do, would be just use your leg vises and then a holdfast for wide boards.

Hi Michael

The purpose of a Moxon vise, as I understand it, is to raise the work up to a height that permits better ergonomics. My bench is 32" high and I am close to 5'10" (when I do not hunch over, as my wife keeps reminding me!). The Moxon adds about 6" of height in my situation. Clamping the work in the leg vise, or any other face vise, and raising it high, does not enable support for sawing. The board will vibrate.

I assume that you have not used a Moxon vise? Try mocking up something to get the feel of all this.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[steven c newman]

When the mountain won't come to.....

rather than raise the work...I simply sit down on my shop stool for dovetails and other such joinery....including chopping mortises...but, then..I work at the end of my bench, rather along the side...except when doing Jointing, for a glue joint..
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Then it is the leg vise and a clamp....

[Michael J Evans]

Hi Michael

The purpose of a Moxon vise, as I understand it, is to raise the work up to a height that permits better ergonomics. My bench is 32" high and I am close to 5'10" (when I do not hunch over, as my wife keeps reminding me!). The Moxon adds about 6" of height in my situation. Clamping the work in the leg vise, or any other face vise, and raising it high, does not enable support for sawing. The board will vibrate.

I assume that you have not used a Moxon vise? Try mocking up something to get the feel of all this.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Hi Derek
Yes I understand the function of the moxon and no I don't use one. I am also 5'10" but my bench is 37" so about 5" taller than yours, and the same height at yours when you add the moxon. (Which answered my question about bench heights so thanks)

I followed Paul sellers advice in regards to bench heights when I built mine, so it is quite a bit taller than most, I've read about on here.

My thinking of using the leg vise plus holdfast would be for a taller bench.

[Bill Carey]

Mike, yep. That's what I'm envisioning and what I want to avoid. I'm going to start with just the two chops, clamped to the bench when in use and hung up otherwise. After I use it for a while I'll know more about whether I really want that back bench. Now, on to Derek's post.

Hey Bob - if I didn't have the moxon permanently fixed, I would go with just the 2 chops as well. And like you say, I would find a place to hang it up, out of the way, and not have it collecting dust etc under the bench. Besides, the under the bench storage is for all that other important stuff we don't have a place for.

It would be cool to have the moxon built into the bench with a mechanism to raise and lower it. Perhaps small hydraulic pistons. And the screws sticking out the back or front would be a problem as well, so the chops would have to be small pistons as well. Or maybe small scissor jacks. But I digress.............

[Steve Kang]

Steve, very nice looking Moxon and bench top bench. Must be a dream to use. It also looks like it weighs about 40 pounds. Am I close?

I think you're probably dead on at 40lbs. I don't mind the weight since I bring it up relatively infrequently.

[David Eisenhauer]

A continuous, subtle, slight stoop or bend in my back to get my eyes closer to "close" work quickly gets to my lower back and causes back issues that don't soon go away. I did it to myself again (after a couple of years of paying attention) earlier this year and had to stay away from the shop for three weeks or so to get it completely healed. A slight stoop that lasts for a while is the worst culprit. I have learned that cleaning up mortises or dovetail "tails" is the worst activity for me if I don't bring the work up to my eyes rather than taking my eyes down to the work. A bench-on-bench, leg vise and Moxon vise all have their places for me to use. The Moxon is biggish, heavy, sorta clunky and definitely takes up storage space. I don't use it daily or even weekly, but I will continue to use it when it is time to do so. Bob Jones - just to confirm, my Moxon lives on a shelf underneath a separate 4'x8' catch table located on the outfeed side of my TS and not under the TS itself. There are different successful ways to hold, elevate and store stuff. That's what I do.

[Clifford McGuire]

Mine has wings, but also a lip for a holdfast.

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I take it off my bench and store it on a shelf. It's close, so I can have it ready to go in seconds.


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The Moxon vise is one of the best things I've added. The extra 6 inches of height makes a world of difference for my sawing position and my aching back.

[Clifford McGuire]

I hang mine from a beam on a dowel, actually I hang a lot of things in my shop now

https://photos.smugmug.com/Woodworking/Shop/Tools/Moxon/i-GLzZqRv/1/7a235c0a/XL/IMG_5884-XL.jpg


I gotta ask. Mike, what's the item hanging next to the Moxon?

[mike stenson]

I gotta ask. Mike, what's the item hanging next to the Moxon?

Hi Clifford, it's a saw vise. Keeps it nicely out of the way too.

[Bob Jones 5443]

Mine has wings, but also a lip for a holdfast.

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I take it off my bench and store it on a shelf. It's close, so I can have it ready to go in seconds.


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The Moxon vise is one of the best things I've added. The extra 6 inches of height makes a world of difference for my sawing position and my aching back.

Clifford, it looks like you have a couple of Cohen-inspired features: flip-up shelf and I-beam prop with Crubber on the tops. Also, thanks for the sensible, convenient storage photo.

Glad you like it. I think one other desirable feature of a Moxon is the ease of securing the work in between the chops.

[Clifford McGuire]

Clifford, it looks like you have a couple of Cohen-inspired features: flip-up shelf and I-beam prop with Crubber on the tops.

Indeed. If I recall, Derek's had a groove for a sliding clamp in the flip up shelf. That would be a nice upgrade to mine someday.

[Tom Bender]

My second bench is 41" high. Many uses but thus far, no vise.

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[Christopher Charles]

Tom,

That's awesome. Where did you find the base? And nice looking shop-would be fun to see more pictures.

[Norman Pirollo]

Where to store was also a small issue. So when I added a platform at top back of the Moxon, I extended the rear bottom to square it off to store the Moxon vise vertically along a wall and not have the handwheels and shafts protrude. You can see the bottom extension in the pics. Also eliminated wings to reduce the length. It attaches to my workbenches extremely well using holdfasts instead.

Norman

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