Ripping square, then ripping bevels on a slider .... !

[Derek Cohen]

I am in the process of building a number of stools (based on Wharton Esherick's famous design). The seats are shaped and the mortices cut. Now I need to build the legs.

The slider (Hammer K3 short stroke), using an F&F jig, was great for breaking down a wide Hard Maple board roughly 2" thick. The legs were ti be turned from 40mm square sections. This was completed using this simple fixture: a length of veneered ply with two hold downs and a side stop (this was screwed on for here, but I would like to make up a sliding version). This fixture enabled rapid setting up of 40x40mm sides ...

https://i.postimg.cc/2yfS7xT7/1.jpg

Leg section positioned ...

https://i.postimg.cc/ZK4q9VWT/4.jpg

Ripping underway ...

https://i.postimg.cc/hvbPy75W/2.jpg

Now I wanted to bevel the sides in preparation for the lathe and turning cylinders.

I could not do it! The blade leans the wrong way to do this (right tilt) ..

https://i.postimg.cc/PJqFcg6X/5.jpg

And there is too little registration to clamp the leg to the slider.

So how would you do this? (I ended up using a scrub plane - painless).

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Brian Tymchak]

Hi Derek, isn't that blade tilting left in that last photo? No idea how to cut that bevel on a slider. I clamp or sometimes double-side tape narrow pieces to a carrier board and run thru against the fence (left tilt saw). Offcut falls below the blade.

Edit: I just realized that that last photo may be using a different saw?

[Mark e Kessler]

If I am understanding you correctly you want to have the wood to the right of the blade when you make the cut? Like if you made a jig to run against the fence on a traditional saw but want to use the slider? if that's the case how about a ply "sled" wide enough to clamp on the slider side and wide enough to fix your material for the cut on the right, you would need to build a "bridge" that would tall enough to not cut through, I have done similar but smaller type jigs for the slider for cutting short stubby bridal joints for example. idk, could be completely off here....


Mark

[Mark e Kessler]

Weird, I am not seeing photos...


Hi Derek, isn't that blade tilting left in that last photo? No idea how to cut that bevel on a slider. I clamp or sometimes double-side tape narrow pieces to a carrier board and run thru against the fence (left tilt saw). Offcut falls below the blade.

Edit: I just realized that that last photo may be using a different saw?

[Mark e Kessler]

ok, now I am - work computer must strip them. so yea guess my original comment of making a sled with a bridge could work. that last photo must be on a regular ol' cab saw?


Weird, I am not seeing photos...

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Derek, isn't that blade tilting left in that last photo? No idea how to cut that bevel on a slider. I clamp or sometimes double-side tape narrow pieces to a carrier board and run thru against the fence (left tilt saw). Offcut falls below the blade.

Edit: I just realized that that last photo may be using a different saw?

Hi Brian

Yes, the table saw is a different saw. It tilts left. My slider tilts right.

A 40x40mm leg-to-be cannot be attached to a carrier board on the slider as it is too narrow to be held securely.

The thought of running the board under the angled blade leaves my blood cold.

I have freehanded legs through a bandsaw, carving away a bevel. In the current case, I used a scrub plane, and this did the task quickly and safely. I am curious about the slider, and how this might be accomplished using the wagon.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Derek Cohen]

If I am understanding you correctly you want to have the wood to the right of the blade when you make the cut? Like if you made a jig to run against the fence on a traditional saw but want to use the slider? if that's the case how about a ply "sled" wide enough to clamp on the slider side and wide enough to fix your material for the cut on the right, you would need to build a "bridge" that would tall enough to not cut through, I have done similar but smaller type jigs for the slider for cutting short stubby bridal joints for example. idk, could be completely off here....


Mark

Mark, has anyone done this?

How to clamp the work piece securely?

How safe would it be?

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Becker]

You kinda need to rip the bevels while the board is still a wide one since on a slider you can't move the fence to the opposite side of the blade. :) The bandsaw can also be employed for this work and then do your cleanup with planes as you will anyway.

As an aside, the Wharton Esherick Museum (https://whartonesherickmuseum.org/) is nearby and I'm glad I had the pleasure of visiting it a few years ago. Fascinating place (it was his home) including a "wow" floor in the kitchen. Should you ever travel to this side of the planet, be sure to put it on your list of places to visit.

[Christopher Giles]

I usually put a temporary fence on my bandsaw and tilt the table to 45 degrees. Then rip and rotate until you have the octagonal shape. Seems pretty safe and accurate.

[Derek Cohen]

Thanks Jim ... thanks for the offer to put me up ... along with my wife, our 16 children ... a few weeks? :)

Incidentally, this is one of Esherick's stools ...

https://a.1stdibscdn.com/archivesE/upload/9045/234/9045_1323214238_1.jpg

More complex than it looks.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Derek Cohen]

I usually put a temporary fence on my bandsaw and tilt the table to 45 degrees. Then rip and rotate until you have the octagonal shape. Seems pretty safe and accurate.

Christopher, that sounds too sensible :)

I have this on my list for future legs.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Malcolm McLeod]

I'd probably do it on a jointer w/ fence tilted back at 45deg; also safe and accurate. It is a LOT of passes I guess (depending on number of stools), but probably about the same as the scrub plane?

(The temperature in my shop might weigh heavily in this math!)

[Mark e Kessler]

Here is a super rough idea but the details would need tweaking based on your known geometry. The vee block “vee’s” would need to be tall enough to locate the block on the last cut because it will have a flat on it, depending you could register the block in another way so this is just an idea. I would personally have no safety concerns with this type of set up but some may, I would probably use a bandsaw to do this unless I wanted a less rough cut.

here is a Mickey Mouse quick sketch
443142




Mark, has anyone done this?

How to clamp the work piece securely?

How safe would it be?

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Becker]

Thanks Jim ... thanks for the offer to put me up ... along with my wife, our 16 children ... a few weeks?

I think the latter part of that family description is likely at least partial fiction 'cause all that baby making wouldn't leave any time or energy for woodworking. :) :D

[glenn bradley]

Sounds like the answer is to not use the slider. tablesaw or bandsaw get my vote.

Be sure to post photos of the 23 of you at Jim's place . . . :D:D:D

[Kevin Jenness]

Why not just turn the square blanks down on the lathe?

[Aaron Rosenthal]

I think the latter part of that family description is likely at least partial fiction 'cause all that baby making wouldn't leave any time or energy for woodworking. :) :D
Hold on a second, Sparkey......
I've had 103 through my house in the latest 50 years of marriage, and I have tim e for woodworking AND a full time plus an on-call job.

[Jim Becker]

Hold on a second, Sparkey......
I've had 103 through my house in the latest 50 years of marriage, and I have tim e for woodworking AND a full time plus an on-call job.

That brings new meaning to "be fruitful and multiply"... :) :D Two was enough for me and we skipped the diapers and went right to puberty. (Adoption ] :D

[Derek Cohen]

Why not just turn the square blanks down on the lathe?

Kevin, one can and I have, but with dry Hard Maple there is the risk of an edge splintering and tearing off. Better to first remove the edge.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[johnny means]

I build a purpose built sled that has the bevel cut on the edge. This gets me enough surface to clamp to.

[Jim Becker]

Kevin, one can and I have, but with dry Hard Maple there is the risk of an edge splintering and tearing off. Better to first remove the edge.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Make a jig that will hold the blank in the proper orientation locked down on the slider if you really want to use that tool, but the bandsaw is quicker and more practical, especially given you'll be turning them round on the spinny thing...

[Wes Grass]

Since you're putting centers in it for the lathe anyway, maybe some angle brackets with 'centers', and an angle plate to clamp to. Or a subplate as mentioned already.

[Mike Wilkins]

Last time I ripped the corners off a blank, the bandsaw was called to duty. A bench top Rikon to be exact. Since my machine is the older model, it does not have a fence. I used a guide clamp on the table, tilted the table to the desired angle and cut away. Safer than a table saw.

[Kevin Jenness]

One way to remove the corners safely is to add a sacrificial wood layer to the rip fence and raise the tilted blade up into it. Relieve the wood fence below the blade so the offcut is not trapped. This may not work well with your slider if there is a large gap between the slider and main table, but you could add a layer spanning the gap or make a zero clearance throat plate.

[Derek Cohen]

Since you're putting centers in it for the lathe anyway, maybe some angle brackets with 'centers', and an angle plate to clamp to. Or a subplate as mentioned already.

Great idea!

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Never tried it, but my first try would be to mount it in "centers" on the slider carriage, set the blade at 22.5, and use the fresh surface each pass as the index surface on the carriage top. Could easily set your taper that way to I'd think.

[Rick Potter]

If I understand correctly you just want to clip off the corners, and end up with an octagonal piece to put on the lathe. If this is the case, you will still have flats on each original side that can ride on your original jig.

I would just cut the square pieces a couple inches long, drill holes near the ends, screw the piece to the jig...cut, readjust, and repeat. Screwed down, the small flats on the original piece should be enough to align and hold it.

Then again, I may be misunderstanding the problem.

[Dave Cav]

I would probably cut the bevels on the shaper (or router table) with a 45 degree bevel cutter. I have one for each tool.

[Winston Chang]

I've made octagons on the table saw using a sled with a V cut out of it.

443353

To use it safely, I used a featherboard to keep the sled against the fence and a push stuck to hold down the workpiece.

443355


It's not obvious from the photo, but the groove is at a slight angle. This is because it was for making tapered legs. (Note that the legs already had a taper before these bevels were cut.) I made the sled by first cutting the groove straight, and then sending the sled through the table saw with a shim taped to the fence side.

I now have a jointing/tapering sled with hold downs for the table saw, so if I were to do this today, I might not make the V-groove sled with an angle. Instead, I'd probably make a sled with a straight groove, and then clamp it down to the tapering sled at an angle.

I initially used the sled on the band saw, but it left a pretty rough cut, so I moved it to table saw, which was faster and left a cleaner surface, so I didn't have to do as much clean-up work with hand planes. I made a lot of legs, so I wanted to make the process as efficient as possible!

443357

[Derek Cohen]

Thanks Winston, I shall make up a fixture similar to that for the slider after this bunch of stools. There are likely to be many occasions in the future to make use of one.

In the meantime I used the scrub plane ...

https://i.postimg.cc/9fNNL5ZH/10.jpg

Here you can see the corners removed and the round being turned. Dry Hard Maple is not the most fun to turn, although it finishes well.

https://i.postimg.cc/HLLh0sJt/11.jpg

And enough legs for three stool. All rough turned at this stage.

https://i.postimg.cc/zG7QRRfB/12.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek