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Ole Anderson
09-18-2020, 8:32 AM
I am upgrading our network at church adding 3 Unify access points, a 16 outlet POE switch, Cloud key and firewall, all Ubiquity equipment. Got it all done and working except for 2 pesky 100' long Ethernet runs. Using CAT6 non-shielded riser grade 23 gauge cable https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07D53FD64/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o08_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 and EZ-RJ45 CAT6 connectors. Using a 4 pair Ethernet cable continuity tester, the cable tests good, but won't connect to the equipment. I had a buddy come in that has installed miles of cable. Using his continuity tester he sees two wires that show open, even after re-terminating. Why different results with two testers? Cable was run above a drop in ceiling, no hangups while pulling, all went in nice and smooth. I pulled out one cable that wouldn't connect after testing good with my tester and re-terminating twice. Checked continuity with an ohmmeter, all 8 wires showing essentially zero resistance. All he could suggest was to install punch-down CAT6 connectors on the cable ends and use a jumper to the switch. So I have RJ45 keystone jacks and a punch down tool on order. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Frank Pratt
09-18-2020, 9:21 AM
Terminating the CAT6 cable is not an approved method, and for good reason. We install a lot of network cable & in the past have done that at customer's request, but won't do it anymore because of the very high failure rate. And it usually isn't an easy to identify open circuit, it's usually an intermittent open, or high resistance connection.

The way it's supposed to be done is to terminate the cable in a female RJ45 jack & then use a patch cord to connect from the jack to the equipment. It's extremely rare for us to get a fail using this method, probably 1 in thousands. Except, of course, when the tech is asleep & crosses a pair or something like that :(

When doing cable installations, you should at least have a wire map tester. It tells you whether or not you have the right wires connected to the correct pins at either end. Even better is to have a bandwidth tester that actually measures the transmission capability of the link. You can have a link that passes the wire map but will not properly transmit data.

Jim Becker
09-18-2020, 9:32 AM
I agree with Frank on the method...it's always been the best practice to do long runs like that. The cable gets punched down on a patch panel or even a single "female" jack and then appropriate patch cords are used to connect to the equipment on either end. Putting connectors on is an "art" already and the stringent requirements for Cat6 make it even "more fun".

mike stenson
09-18-2020, 10:24 AM
I haven't terminated any data cable with an RJ45 in years, for this very reason. Punchdowns are so much more reliable, and flexible. If it needs an RJ45 on the end, I buy them that way.

Bill Carey
09-18-2020, 10:48 AM
I need to run a new cable from the shop to the house and have been putting it off because I know nothing about how to terminate the ends into the jack after I pull it. I want to use my extender as a wireless access point for better wifi in the house. Suggestions for tools that make it easy (or easier) to terminate the ends into the jacks?

mike stenson
09-18-2020, 10:56 AM
A proper punch down tool makes it cake, you'll want one with a 110 blade (not a 66). If I were local, I'd just swing by and do it. A couple ends is literally a 5 minute job :)

lowell holmes
09-18-2020, 11:18 AM
When I saw this thread, my first thought was
"I am not going to terminate any kitties."

Ted Calver
09-18-2020, 11:39 AM
Frank. Thank you for posting this information. I've been wrestling with the same issue as Ole in setting up my home network. Jacks and punch down tool on order.

Bill Carey
09-18-2020, 11:58 AM
A proper punch down tool makes it cake, you'll want one with a 110 blade (not a 66). If I were local, I'd just swing by and do it. A couple ends is literally a 5 minute job :)


so this should only take me a couple of hours and some new, imaginative vocabulary. LOL. What I want to do is run the cable and put a rj45 male on each end to plug it into the modem and the access point. A punch down tool looks like it's for panels. No? And a crimper is 80 bucks - a lot for a one time use. Boy I hate electrical work of any kind.

mike stenson
09-18-2020, 12:00 PM
You do not want to put male ends on. Doing so is notoriously unreliable. You always want to put female jacks in, and use factory terminated patch cables.

edit: There was a time all I did was datacenter installs for a living. Even then, it wasn't worth the time to do male RJ45 terminations as the failure rate was high enough.. and that was before CAT5e became the standard. As things get faster, the tolerances shrink.

Mike Henderson
09-18-2020, 12:11 PM
One way to get a cable with RJ45 male ends is to measure the distance you need and then order a cable that length made up with RJ45 ends. The factory people can put RJ45 ends on reliably. I think all Ethernet cable is rated for 100 meters so you can order your cable a bit long and just coil it at one end.

Of course this only works for situations where you only need to run one cable, probably at home. It's not practical for wiring up an office building.

Mike

[I did this with some outdoor Ethernet cable that I ran between two buildings at my home.]

glenn bradley
09-18-2020, 12:17 PM
Your mixed test results demonstrate variations in threshold for different test sets. We run miles of CAT-6 on campus and terminate with abandon. Failures are extremely rare but, we have the right tools and have been properly trained. Certainly CAT-6 is more fussy than CAT-0 (that's a joke). We are also certified to terminate various types of fiber and do so with success in house where we see "certified" vendors fail.

The idea that male ends are unreliable on one part of the cable but, reliable on the drop cord portion of the path seems a little silly. Not to be harsh but, I assume what we are saying is that the male end terminations are not being done correctly and the successful drop cord is a factory cord that one doesn't need to terminate themselves(?).

Some things are not as easy as you think and some things can't be fudged. We are doing an excellent job of pushing more payload and faster clock speeds over existing media. At the leading edge of these efforts there is always more precision required than after the electronics catch up and become more tolerant. Remember when 100Mb was fussy as all get out? Remember when 100Gb could only go a couple of meters?

We certainly have folks onsite that despite repeated training and practice just have an unacceptable failure rate. Kind of like my hand cut dovetails. Those folks have awesome skills in other areas. Just keep them away from the tools. ;-)

Bill Carey
09-18-2020, 12:20 PM
Mikes: so run the cable and do female ends. then a 3' factory cable from that female end to the modem and then the same at the access point. The reason I don't want to order a pre-terminated cable is I can drill smaller holes for just the cable thru the breeze way into the house. This sound about right? Might actually be something I can do.

mike stenson
09-18-2020, 12:22 PM
It's the hand termination (of the RJ45s) that's unreliable. It's cheaper to buy factory molded terminated patch cords from greybar than it costs my time to do them. Even when, perhaps especially when, I was installing data cables all day long. Expecting someone with big box tools and no real training to get them terminated correctly just isn't fair.

mike stenson
09-18-2020, 12:22 PM
Mikes: so run the cable and do female ends. then a 3' factory cable from that female end to the modem and then the same at the access point. The reason I don't want to order a pre-terminated cable is I can drill smaller holes for just the cable thru the breeze way into the house. This sound about right? Might actually be something I can do.

This is exactly what I do.

Mike Henderson
09-18-2020, 12:25 PM
Mikes: so run the cable and do female ends. then a 3' factory cable from that female end to the modem and then the same at the access point. The reason I don't want to order a pre-terminated cable is I can drill smaller holes for just the cable thru the breeze way into the house. This sound about right? Might actually be something I can do.

You're right about the smaller hole. I drilled a bit larger hole - big enough to fit the RJ45 through - and then caulked it.

Mike

Jim Becker
09-18-2020, 2:10 PM
I need to run a new cable from the shop to the house and have been putting it off because I know nothing about how to terminate the ends into the jack after I pull it. I want to use my extender as a wireless access point for better wifi in the house. Suggestions for tools that make it easy (or easier) to terminate the ends into the jacks?
My solution for that was to buy a pre-terminated, exterior rated Ethernet cable off Amazon. The slack is just coiled in my shop before it connects to my mesh node.

Frank Pratt
09-18-2020, 2:53 PM
Suggestions for tools that make it easy (or easier) to terminate the ends into the jacks?

We use the Fluke JackRapid. Perfect termination every time, easy to use.

https://www.flukenetworks.com/datacom-cabling/installation-tools/JackRapid-Punchdown-Tool

Frank Pratt
09-18-2020, 3:04 PM
The idea that male ends are unreliable on one part of the cable but, reliable on the drop cord portion of the path seems a little silly. Not to be harsh but, I assume what we are saying is that the male end terminations are not being done correctly and the successful drop cord is a factory cord that one doesn't need to terminate themselves(?).

The pre-terminated patch cables have stranded wire and are factory made to specs. Field cable has solid wire and terminating it with a male RJ45 plug automatically puts it out of TIA/EIA-568 specification. I'm not saying it can't work, just that if you want to maintain the greatest chance of the link working as it should all the time, every time, one should follow the specs. Another reason we don't do it is because the engineers will not sign off on it if it is out of spec, even if it does work.

When we did do those "illegal" terminations, failure rate was high, maybe 1 in 100 would have to be reterminated at some point down the road. Glenn, I'm sure with the volume that you do, you've become skilled enough to get a reliable result.

Derek Meyer
09-18-2020, 5:51 PM
That JackRapid tool looks amazing. We use Leviton keystone jacks so I might have to look into that.

I like the EZ-CAT6 ends as they are much easier to work with than standard ends. I found that bad terminations are still possible, though. It took me a while to get familiar with the tool, but my success rate with them is much higher now than it was with standards CAT 6 ends.

For cabling and supplies, try BestlinkNetware.com. They are a supplier with a factory in China that they bring product over from every few months. I've been buying from them for over 20 years and have been very happy with their quality and pricing. They sell all kinds of patch cables and bulk wire, as well as jacks, tools and other accessories. The minimum order is $10 (there is a processing fee of $1.50 for orders below $10) and shipping is reasonable.

I use a Fluke Linkrunner at home to test my terminations. It can test network and coax cables, and will measure length and report any opens, shorts or cross-links in the cable. At work we use a Fluke CableIQ, which can also do a data rate test and tell you if the cable will pass gigabit speeds, 100mb speeds or only 10mb speeds. That meter with the toner and accessories was around $2000, though, so it's definitely a professional-grade tool for people who do lots of network wiring.

Ole Anderson
09-18-2020, 6:43 PM
Lots of good information here, thanks. Fortunately I only needed to run 6 cables, 3 to access points, two to PC's and one to our video switcher. Three other devices are in the same room as the 16 port switch and use factory cables. Other than crossing a few wires, which the tester found before I tried to get a signal, the first four wires were fine. Looking back I should have at least added a 16 port patch panel to the rack instead of trying to go directly into the switch with field terminated cables. That would at least have that end covered. Hopefully the female jacks and factory jumpers will solve the problem. I would have thought that terminating a second time would have solved the problem, just my bad luck/skills kicked in though. My failure rate was WAY higher than 1/100.

Edit: Terminating the CAT6 with EZ-RJ45 male connectors SEEMS like it is foolproof as long as you don't nick the wire and you have them in the correct order. Plug design seems quite foolproof and any crimper is going to seat the pins correctly as long as they are flush. Not sure where it can go wrong but is sure does.