Has Anyone Seen These Hinges?

[Mike Henderson]

I found this picture on the web. I want to convert a drawer to a keyboard tray and need a hinge that will open the drawer front to be flat with the bottom of the drawer.

This one (https://www.rockler.com/nickel-fully-adjustable-concealed-fall-flap-hinges) from Rockler will not work for me because the drawer front extends down too far.

Other suggestions will be appreciated. But remember that I want the drawer front to be flat with the bottom of the drawer.

Mike

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[Dick Strauss]

How about gluing a second piece of wood to the inside of the front to make up the difference in height once the front pivots down? This extra piece of wood will need to be slightly shorter than the inside dimension of the drawer but should do the job.

[Jamie Buxton]

A butler tray hinge isn't what you've pictured, but it will do what you're asking for. https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/hardware/hinges/tray/40209-butlers-tray-hinges

[Mike Henderson]

A butler tray hinge isn't what you've pictured, but it will do what you're asking for. https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/hardware/hinges/tray/40209-butlers-tray-hinges

As I look at the problem, a butler tray hinge will not work. A butler tray hinge assumes that lower edge of the drawer front is aligned with the top of the bottom of the drawer so that when you fold it down, the surface is flat. But if I did that, the drawer front would be too high when it's closed.

The problem is that the bottom of the drawer front has to protrude downward, below the top of the bottom surface of the drawer bottom - and that makes hinging it problematic.

I'll post whatever solution I come up with, even if it's not perfect.

Mike

[Mike Henderson]

How about gluing a second piece of wood to the inside of the front to make up the difference in height once the front pivots down? This extra piece of wood will need to be slightly shorter than the inside dimension of the drawer but should do the job.

This is essentially what I'm thinking of, but this will leave a gap between that second piece of wood and the drawer bottom when the drawer front is lowered. I'm working on how to make that as small as possible.

Mike

[Jamie Buxton]

Is this what's in your picture? https://www.hardwaresource.com/hettich-markant-flap-hinge-bundle.html

[andrew whicker]

Does a Soss hinge work in this case?

I guess the knuckle would stick up when the drawer was flat.. I don't know. My mind goes towards something of that sort of mechanism.

[Jamie Buxton]

Here's a way to do a fall-front with a traditional knuckle hinge.

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The drawer front is drawn in the closed position. When it opens, it pivots down so that the inside face is flush with the drawer bottom, and there's no gap between the front and the bottom. The hinge has one leaf which is longer than the other. It is often called a flap hinge. I've drawn it with the knuckles up, so they do protrude up from the surface. Some knuckle hinges can be opened far enough that you can mount the knuckles down.

[Bruce King]

Take a look at these
https://www.hardwaretree.com/proddetail.php?prod=H313012N

Or
https://www.hardwaretree.com/proddetail.php?prod=M-170SLIDERHD

[Mike Henderson]

Is this what's in your picture? https://www.hardwaresource.com/hettich-markant-flap-hinge-bundle.html

I don't think so, it looks different to me.

Mike

[Mike Henderson]

Take a look at these
https://www.hardwaretree.com/proddetail.php?prod=H313012N

Or
https://www.hardwaretree.com/proddetail.php?prod=M-170SLIDERHD

Those are the same as the Rockler ones I pointed to my my OP. Because of the dimensions of the drawer I have to work with, I couldn't see how I could make them work. I have used those on another project so I'm familiar with them.

Mike

[Mike Henderson]

Here's a way to do a fall-front with a traditional knuckle hinge.

439605

The drawer front is drawn in the closed position. When it opens, it pivots down so that the inside face is flush with the drawer bottom, and there's no gap between the front and the bottom. The hinge has one leaf which is longer than the other. It is often called a flap hinge. I've drawn it with the knuckles up, so they do protrude up from the surface. Some knuckle hinges can be opened far enough that you can mount the knuckles down.

That one looks good. I'll do some searching for that. Thanks.

Mike

[Maybe the name is incorrect. When I searched on knuckle hinge it didn't return what I expected. What we want is a hinge with one leaf longer than the other, as shown in your diagram. I know that kind of hinge exists but I don't recall the name. Maybe some modification to a butler tray hinge?]

[Tony Joyce]

Search "Drop leaf hinge"

[Phil Mueller]

Maybe something like this?

https://www.vintagehardware.com/proddetail.php?prod=26267&optn0x0y0=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwyo36BRAXEiwA24CwGd2ITz2PNFE6o5fItDv0 E2IFYiIOqxvyb_nZOqctA-7XUHfylkT4OhoCCUoQAvD_BwE

[Mike King]

Rabbet on the bottom of the drawer. Rabbet on the inside bottom of drawer face. Knuckle hinge. Then it all fits.

[Mike Henderson]

Search "Drop leaf hinge"

That's it! Thanks. I'll get one and try it out.

"Give that man a cigar."

Mike

[Mike Henderson]

Rabbet on the bottom of the drawer. Rabbet on the inside bottom of drawer face. Knuckle hinge. Then it all fits.

When I search on knuckle hinge, this (https://www.thehardwarehut.com/cabinet_hinges-olivehinges.php)is what I get. I don't see how this would fit. Or is there some other "knuckle hinge"?

I also found this (https://www.hafele.com/us/en/product/five-knuckle-institutional-hinge-grade-1-opening-angle-270-steel-for-3-4-door-thickness/000000b40003433900030023/).

Mike

[Mike Henderson]

I think I came up with an idea for how to do this. I'll post back if I'm successful.

Mike

[Mike Henderson]

I finally solved the problem. I used those fall front hinges that I referenced in the OP - the ones from Rockler that I thought wouldn't work.

I went down several blind alleys before I got to this solution. Also, I built a drawer front from some scrap wood I had to make sure it would work before I cut and drilled the real drawer front. I didn't take any before pictures but I think you can see what it was. Here's the final, with the drawer front up.
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And with the drawer front down. The goal is to make the drawer into a "tray" to hold a keyboard. So when the drawer front it down, it needs to be flat with the rest of the drawer.
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A view from the side to show what I did. I had to cut a rabbet on the drawer front and on the underside of the drawer.
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And from the side with the drawer open.
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Note that I added a 1/4 inch backer to the drawer front. The reason for doing that is because the drawer front was only 1/2 inch at the outside. If I had cut the rabbet without adding any material to the drawer front, the remaining wood behind the rabbet would have been very thin and would probably break easily.

Anyway, I'm satisfied with the way it came out. It was an interesting problem.

Mike

[Jim Becker]

That looks like a good solution, Mike, especially with the lipped drawer front helping with additional support in the "down" position.

[Mike Henderson]

Just to beat this to death, the client sent me two pictures of the drawer in use. Here it is closed:
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And open and in use.
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All I had to work on was the drawer.

Mike

[Jim Becker]

That worked out nicely...