Here is my SAWSTOP situation/dilemna

[Anthony Anderson]

I have been considering the Sawstop cabinet saw for some time. In fact that is how I found, and became addicted, to this forum. Still have not done a formal intro yet. But I am going to do that before next week along with a shop tour (promise). Shop is not big, but good enough:) . Here is the dilimna: Now get this, I showed the wife the technology of the Sawstop and she was sold. She told me, about 3 or 4 months ago, to buy it:eek: :eek: :eek: Guys if you knew my wife you would have fainted too. For her to have said that so easily :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: (wait I am still catching my breath), is truly a miracle. The other amazing thing is that I have taken this long to order one. But I want to make sure this is a good investment, and a decision that I will not regret. Guys I never dreamed in a milliion years that I would ever spend this much money on a tablesaw, nor did I ever think that my wife would agree to this.

So please anyone who owns, or has used a Sawstop cabinet saw, would you be so kind as to share your thoughts and opinions about this saw (since you have now owned it for a while). Do you still feel that it was a good investment? Please share any pros and cons that you have discovered. I have read all of the posts that were found in the search function of the forum. But I want some recent input before I make the final decision. Right now I am using a Craftsman contractor saw. I have never been able to get the fece completely square to the table top. Now the pulleys are starting to vibrate loose. I have owned the saw for about 12 years, and cannot really complain, but I think it is time. PLEASE HELP. Really Grateful, Bill

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Anthony....I don't own a Sawstop but I can tell you the reports from those here that do .....It's a great machine. If you do a search on Sawstop you can probably find many threads and several reviews of same. Good Luck with you decision!

[Jim Becker]

Anthony, there are a number of SawStop owners here at SMC and there has been a lot of discussion over time. (Use Advanced Search to pick up on that if you haven't already) One of the more recent buyers of this saw is Alan Turner...he put it in his new teaching facility.

[Frank Pellow]

I am yet another person who does not own a Saw Stop (I have a General 650) but, from what I have heard (and I have read a lot about it), the Saw Stop is a very good saw. I could care less about the "feature" for which the saw is named, but I very much like the fact that it has a riving knife.

[Tom Ruflin]

Anthony,

I have owned a Sawstop cabinet saw for 2 months now and love it. I'm no expert but it is a very well built machine. It was delivered to my house 1 week after I ordered it and it took me another 2 weeks to get it into my basement and running ( had to get the 220v hookup). There was some damage to one side of the fence, I called Sawstop and they overnighted me a new one at no charge and they answered any questions I had quickly. The setup was easy and aligning the table to the blade was very easy. There are 2 set screws to move the table to either side and they also keep the table from moving when you tighten the bolts to lock the table down. I had to take the top off to reduce the weight to get it in my basement. I was impressed with the what I saw inside the cabinet, lots of iron. The fence is fully adjustable and much heavier than the Beismeyer and clones. I did alot of research on table saws before I bought the sawstop and feel I have made a very good investment. I was looking for a saw with a riving knife, which is awsome, and the blade brake was an added feature. I personally know 2 people that have amputated fingers on table saws and do not wish to have that happen to me. I do not take the brake for granted and try to be as careful as possible. I used to have a Delta contractors saw before this and the difference is night and day. It was more than I wanted to spend but I think it is worth every penny. Stop thinking and buy it!!!!

[John Bailey]

I don't know about your dilema, but your situation is that your wife is telling you to go buy one of the best thought-of table saws around. This is a no-brainer. Go buy the saw and a dozen roses.

John

[Bob Johnson2]

I don't know about your dilema, but your situation is that your wife is telling you to go buy one of the best thought-of table saws around. This is a no-brainer. Go buy the saw and a dozen roses.

John

Tell me that John isn't always thinking. The roses just might get you that 8" jointer you'll want after the sawstop gets there.

[Dev Emch]

Congrats on your victory. First of all, Tony, things could be a lot worse. Sawstops are actually fairly cheap as far as high end table saws go. If you dont believe me, check out pricing on the latest Felder, Panhans or Martin saws. But these are panel cutting table saws for pro shops.

After having seen a sawstop, I have to say that this is a great first starter saw for someone just getting going. Many folks here like them and I can see why. And the safety features are great for those just getting started.

Personally, the sawstop is not my cup of tea. Having used a table saw from the mid 1970s until now, I have become very picky about my saws and what they can do and what I can do with them.

In general, I have thought about this in detail and have concluded that there is no single perfect table saw. Not now and not then. Many saws have excellent features but then fall short in other departments.

So I personally would not buy one. But that is my own opinion based on my vision of what a table saw is and should do.

Best of luck in your quest....

[Roy Wall]

Anthony,

My wife convinced me to get the SS cabinet saw also. I had a old, <1 hp Sears contractor that had served it's purpose......but I was ready to get a real saw. I got the Sawstop saw in June of 2005.

The RIVING KNIFE and RIVING SPREADER w/ blade guard are HANDS DOWN the best feature(s) of the saw. They provide you with the best possible protections from kickback and guarding the fingers. I had never used a blade guard or spitter before the Sawstop - these are good features that you will use and not just flip in the trash (as with other saws - like most of us has done).

The machining of the table top is good. I lay my LN #7 on edge (it's my best machined straightedge to .0015) ......and can slide a piece of paper under the LN in only one or two small spots. So I guess the top is pretty good to within + or - .005 overall. The max. gap allowed by Sawstop is .010 diagonally across the top. I believe the GENERAL cabinet saws have the best specs on tabletop flatness.

With a assembled weight of 685 lbs......vibration is minimal and it easliy passes the "nickel test"...I can put several all over the table an cut a board with none fallling over. So I expect the saw to stay accurate.

This being said - the quality of cut is great, but I doubt if it's any better than any other quality (and or highly tuned) tablesaw. You can get great results with virtually any saw with skill and proper setup.

Customer Service is good - I made a lot of calls. It took me several days to get the saw assembled and such....kind of a pain but its a lot of machine for me. I had some trouble with the riving knife assembly so they sent me a new one.

Dust contol is good as it has a "shroud" underneath the cabinet that hooks directly to a 4" hose and out the back cabinet. But, if you really want to get rid of the dust, you do need a blade guard DC port/ connection too. I actually changed out the blade guard with a Felder blade guard that had a DC port on top. It hooks up to the riving knife just like it was meant to be and works well.

I think it boils down to this: Is the Sawstop Technology and especially the Riving knife(s) worth the extra $1-2k over a PM / Unisaw / Bridgewood /etc??

I do believe my expectations of the Sawstop were a little to high when I first got it....I guess I thought the thing should have been put together perfectly for me for that kind of $$$$! Like any machine, it will take some time and care to get it properly set up.

You'll have to add 220v power. You can use a shop vac to clean out after cutting....

Really, the riving knife and the knife spreader / blade guard are the visible selling points of the saw. Then there is the "invisible" current around the blade to help prevent some serious damage should something go crazy wrong......

[Don Frambach]

I have had a SawStop for several months now. It replaced a 15 year old Delta Contractors saw. Please understand that I am not a professional and have had no experience with other saws. That said, I am very pleased with the SawStop and believe that it is the last table saw I'll ever buy. It has plenty of power (for me), very little vibration (I've done successful "penny tests"), and it was (as far as I can tell) adjusted perfectly on arrival. Most importantly, I believe is much safer than my old saw. The riving knive is much better than the splitters I was using. I hope to never test the actual saw-stop mechanism but I'm glad it's there.

[Charlie Kocourek]

I've had the SS for a few months now. It is a great saw. It runs very smoothly and cuts quite well. There is not much I can say that has not already been said about this saw. Dust control is very good, but I would still like it if they included a hose fitting on the blade guard. I did not buy the SS fence because I already have a Vega fence that I like very much. The only thing that I am disapointed with is the table insert. I have had a tough time getting it level AND secure at the same time. I find that if I run a narrow piece that the back end of the insert droops down as the board passes by. The SS was adjusted almost perfectly right out of the box, even the 90/45 degree stops were right on! Overall, I would recommend this saw.

[Michael Ballent]

I got my SS around around the same time that Roy got his... My previous saw was a DeWALT 746 hybrid which I liked a lot and I had planned on keeping it for a very long time. I too showed my wife the video and she suggested I buy it instead of a replacement to my Jet 14" BS. So I still have the Jet and never looked back since getting the SS. The riving knife is the cats meow, the blade guard rarely comes off, but if you want to remove it takes less than 30 seconds to do it.

SS came to the last WW show in Phoenix and I finally saw the stopping function in action and let me tell you that if you blink you will miss what happened. You hear a dull thud and and the blade just disappears. The gal that demoed the machine basically ran a piece of plywood with the famous hot dog sitting on top of the ply. She ran the wood MUCH faster than I would ever want to, to simulate some slipping a finger into the blade, the hot dog basically had a very small nick on it maybe a stitch if that would have been needed.

There are people out there that think that the safety feature of the saw will make one complacent around the saw, but even if you do not have an amputation it will still hurt you pocket book. The blade becomes scrap metal, and you have to replace the brake cartrige so you are looking at 150 bucks minimum. I still use the blade guard for most cuts and even bought a grrr-ripper for thin cuts if I needed.

Take your wife out to a nice dinner, or do what I did, get her a really nice sewing machine if she is into that sort of thing... hehehe We look forward to seeing your machine in your shop along with your big grin :D

[Anthony Anderson]

Thanks to everyone for your response.
Michael Ballent it is good to see you around the Creek again.
Thanks Dev, I always enjoy reading your posts.
Jim, I used the search feature, but wanted to get any recent feedback that users may have. You are a wealth of info, and I was reading your posts from one of the other forums, where you were a moderator some time ago. There was another person named “Dizzy” there too. I often wonder what happened to him.
Frank, I like the feature that the saw is named for, just in case I ever need it. Actually I am buying this saw more for my son than for myself, as he now wants to learn woodworking. He wants to go on to become a scientist, which would be difficult without a few fingers. I would hate to live with regrets if I had the opportunity to buy this saw and didn’t, and he lost fingers. Rest assured, I will still stress safety. I know that is your big thing. And the riving knife will add to that as well.
I have a few specific questions. Forgive the ones that may seem obvious.<O:p
1. Has anyone had any “false alarms”, where the brake tripped without cause? If so, could you explain?
2. Is the miter gauge accurate and worth keeping and using, or would it need to be replaced with an Incra or Jessem?
3. For those that have the Sawstop, or any cabinet saw, in the basement, can two guys move it into the basement, or would there need to be more man power? I have a 36” walkout door in the basement with four step leading up to the walkout. To the entrance to the basement shop I have a 72” double door.
4. If the saw is off, but in the operation mode, and the blade has stopped turning, is it safe to touch the blade without tripping the safety brake?
5. Did anyone upgrade to the 5hp motor? Does anyone feel that it would be necessary?
I will definitely buy the wife a dozen roses (did this two weeks ago, but this warrants buying another dozen) and take her out to dinner to celebrate the new saw (she is not into sewing machines), if I make the decision to buy a Sawstop. I know my hesitation does not make sense, but I just want to make sure that I get the right saw this time.
Thanks Guys, Regards, Bill

[Jim Becker]

Anthony, thanks. It's great to see you here at SMC. 'Haven't heard from Dizzy in a long, long time...

[Ian Barley]

Your wife - like most of her gender - knows a good thing when she sees it. The technology would be nought if put on a junk saw but that is not the consensus from the owners. Buy it (and the roses)

[Roy Wall]

Bill,

My opinions:

1. Has anyone had any “false alarms”, where the brake tripped without cause? If so, could you explain?

Not me, but it has happened. sometimes the riving knife is set TOO close to the back of the blade....it needs to be about 1/4"

2. Is the miter gauge accurate and worth keeping and using, or would it need to be replaced with an Incra or Jessem?

It can be set accurately - and it's fairly heavy as guages go....but nothing special. I have it set at 90* and use it specifically for box joints.

3. For those that have the Sawstop, or any cabinet saw, in the basement, can two guys move it into the basement, or would there need to be more man power? I have a 36” walkout door in the basement with four step leading up to the walkout. To the entrance to the basement shop I have a 72” double door.

I think I'd get a couple extra recruits to be safe on this...use some plywood ramps, dolly, some rope, and extra muscle so it really becomes a simple task - and not a dangerous one.

4. If the saw is off, but in the operation mode, and the blade has stopped turning, is it safe to touch the blade without tripping the safety brake?

The brake will not trip. A code is sent to the front of the machine verifying detection while in standby mode. The machine will reset in about 5 seconds or so - but will not allow the saw to start until then.

The safety system IS running even when the blade is spinning down...if you nick it when reaching for an offcut during spin down......it will activate.


5. Did anyone upgrade to the 5hp motor? Does anyone feel that it would be necessary?

I did not..........but.......for the $200 extra - I wish I had. More HP is generally a good thing, and this saw will last a long time to diminish that little $200 extra.

[John Bush]

Hi Anthony(Bill),
In response to your earlier post, I've had my SS for a few months and been very happy with its performance. It was right-on out of the box and no adjustments were needed. I also bought a new Infinity rip blade and the cut edges are perfectly smooth. This is a vast improvement over my previous 2hp Jet cab saw and I'm glad I stepped up to this level of machine. In deference to Dev, this is a great machine for hobbiests that have no experience or exposure to the old iron. I think Dev should invite us all over so we can see these beasts firsthand!!!

I would recommend getting several beefy friends to help with moving the saw. It is quite heavy and on top of not wanting anyone to get hurt, you sure don't want to bang up your new machine. I got the HTC mobile base and it is worth the extra $$$ if you plan on moving it around.

I have the 3hp and it has plenty of power.

You will really like the riving knife and blade guard. I've never used either and now couldn't imagine making any cuts without them.

Good luck John.

[Don Frambach]

My SawStop has never tripped for any reason. However, once I adjusted the cartridge too far from the blade, the saw detected that, gave an error message and would not operate until I adjusted the gap properly. It's all documented in the manual.

I don't use my miter guage much. I prefer to use sleds.

The saw is so heavy that I think you'd be best to take the saw apart before you move it into your basement (even with help). I did not need to do that but I understand that its not hard to do.

As said previously, you can touch the blade AFTER it stops moving. If the blade is spinning down, the sawstop mechanism will activate when you touch the blade.

I'm happy with the 3 hp motor. I'm not sure that I could even run the 5 hp motor with the service I have in my home shop.

[Tom Ruflin]

Anthony,

To answer your questions from my experiences:
1. I have not had any false triggers of the brake. I asked sawstop that question and they said that they can tell what made the brake fire and all supposed false triggers have been explained. I did read in a new group that someone had some and they were due to electrical noise problems, sawstop sent them a filter and replacement brake catridges. Another instance was in a cabinet shop with 3 people using the saw, they had 3 "false" triggers but all were with the same person operating the saw which looks to me like operator error (just stories I read and cannot confirm how true they are).
2. The miter gage is better than the one from Delta on my contractors saw but I have an Incra and don't use that much.
3.My shop is in my basement. I had to go up 3 steps to get into the back door (used 2 by 10 ramps) and then down 11 steps into the basement. I took the whole top off the saw to reduce weight, used an appliance dolly and 1 friend to make the move. It took all of 10 minutes for the actual move. It sounds like you should have no problem and the appliance dolly is key for going down the stairs (make sure it has the tracks on the back that run on the stairs).
4. If the blade is FULLY stopped you can touch the blade without the brake triggering. There are 2 leds, one green and one red, by the power switch that flash in codes that let you know what is going on.

You can download the complete operations manual for both the saw and the fence at the sawstop website and it explains it all.

Let me know if you have any other questions, I'll answer them the best I can from my 2 month experience with the saw.

[Alan Turner]

"I have a few specific questions. Forgive the ones that may seem obvious.
1. Has anyone had any “false alarms”, where the brake tripped without cause? If so, could you explain? NOPE
2. Is the miter gauge accurate and worth keeping and using, or would it need to be replaced with an Incra or Jessem? PERHPAS BETTER THAN COMMONL, BUT NOT REMARKABLE.
3. For those that have the Sawstop, or any cabinet saw, in the basement, can two guys move it into the basement, or would there need to be more man power? I have a 36” walkout door in the basement with four step leading up to the walkout. To the entrance to the basement shop I have a 72” double door.
4. If the saw is off, but in the operation mode, and the blade has stopped turning, is it safe to touch the blade without tripping the safety brake? YES, IT IS SAFE.
5. Did anyone upgrade to the 5hp motor? Does anyone feel that it would be necessary?" I DID SO, AND I CUT A LOT OF HEAVY STOCK. THE EXTRA HP IS NICE TO HAVE HWNE YO9U NEED IT FOR RIPPING 12/4 STOCK AND SUCH.

The only thing I would add is that while it is a good saw, and esp. the riving knife, the SS fence is perhpas not your best option. IMHO, of course.

[Anthony Anderson]

Alan, which fence, that you have first hand experience with, would you recommend. Which fence do you have on your Sawstop? And if you have the Sawstop fence what do you not like about it? One more thing, does the Sawstop come with a brake cartridge? I know that this may be a silly question, but after all it does not come with a fence (one would assume that any table saw would come with a fence, but you know what they say about assuming). Thanks, Bill

[Craig Colvin]

1. Has anyone had any “false alarms”, where the brake tripped without cause? If so, could you explain?

I have 2 SawStops and early on, one of them had 2 false trips. SawStop sent some electrical filters to put on one of the cables and 2 free replacement cartridges. Solved the problem.

Have had 2 actual firings that were caused by people cutting metal without using the bypass switch.

2. Is the miter gauge accurate and worth keeping and using, or would it need to be replaced with an Incra or Jessem?

It's an OK gauge but nothing like an Incra or Jessem. I use a crosscut sled and don't bother with the miter gauge.

3. For those that have the Sawstop, or any cabinet saw, in the basement, can two guys move it into the basement, or would there need to be more man power? I have a 36” walkout door in the basement with four step leading up to the walkout. To the entrance to the basement shop I have a 72” double door.

I 2nd the suggestions to break it into pieces and use ropes/pulleys if possible

4. If the saw is off, but in the operation mode, and the blade has stopped turning, is it safe to touch the blade without tripping the safety brake?

Others have already answered this. Yes it's safe to touch the blade when it is not spinning

5. Did anyone upgrade to the 5hp motor? Does anyone feel that it would be necessary?

Have the 3HP and it cuts everything we put through it.


Someone mentioned the fence. I think it is a very good fence. Certainly as good as the fence on the PM66 that got replaced by the SawStop.
[/quote]

[Alan Turner]

Alan, which fence, that you have first hand experience with, would you recommend. Which fence do you have on your Sawstop? And if you have the Sawstop fence what do you not like about it? One more thing, does the Sawstop come with a brake cartridge? I know that this may be a silly question, but after all it does not come with a fence (one would assume that any table saw would come with a fence, but you know what they say about assuming). Thanks, Bill

Bill,
I have about 14 years on my Unisaw fence, and it is great. I llike the ease of fine adjustment, and I like the height of the primary position of the fence for the way that I work. Each to his own on this point, of course. I will now investigate buying a Unifence. The SS fence is not flat, and requires shimming. This I cannot understand, but there is a belly in the middle of the left side of the fence. Also, fine adjustments are difficult. Tap it a bit, and it moves either ore or less than you want. This is time consuming and frustrating.

Yes, the saw comes with a brake cartridge for a 10" blade, but not for the 8" dado set. This I bought separately.