Marking gauge improvement

[Rob Luter]

I normally use a Tite-Mark but the oak I often use scoffs at the cutting wheel. I made a cutting gauge a few months ago that worked well but was unstable due to an imprecise mortise and an ineffective locking wedge.

I was puttering in the shop to stay out of the heat and decided to give the fence another go. I had a chunk of figured oak and used the Mike Peckovich tape trick to mark and cut a crisp mortise. Rather than monkey with another wedge I installed a threaded insert and used a clamp knob with a wooden pellet on the end for friction. It’s solid as a rock and doesn’t mar the maple beam. The cutting insert is a tool steel cutter from a metal lathe. Super sharp and super durable. It cuts a deep, crisp line in hard maple and oak. No more wimpy dovetail baselines.

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[Jim Koepke]

Nice looking gauge Rob.

jtk

[glenn bradley]

Nicely done. I sharpen my wheels like I do carbide inserts for lathe tools; face down on an abrasive and draw little figure-8's till the edge is razor sharp. They seem to slice through anything. That said, I do have a knife-type marking gauge similar to yours and use it as much as the others I have. I'm not sure what drives the choice . . . maybe my mood(?).

[Jim Koepke]

Nicely done. I sharpen my wheels like I do carbide inserts for lathe tools; face down on an abrasive and draw little figure-8's till the edge is razor sharp. They seem to slice through anything. That said, I do have a knife-type marking gauge similar to yours and use it as much as the others I have. I'm not sure what drives the choice . . . maybe my mood(?).

My pin/knife type gauges are used when a deep mark is desired. My Tite-Mark® is used when a light mark is fine.

jtk

[David Eisenhauer]

I like that Rob. I have zero experience with tool steel cutters and wonder how one sharpens them. Do they sharpen like a chisel or plane iron on my water stones? Come already sharp-sharp and don't ever need sharpening in this application?

[Rob Luter]

Nicely done. I sharpen my wheels like I do carbide inserts for lathe tools; face down on an abrasive and draw little figure-8's till the edge is razor sharp. They seem to slice through anything. That said, I do have a knife-type marking gauge similar to yours and use it as much as the others I have. I'm not sure what drives the choice . . . maybe my mood(?).

I do the same. It still doesn’t cut the QSWO.

[ken hatch]

My pin/knife type gauges are used when a deep mark is desired. My Tite-Mark® is used when a light mark is fine.

jtk

I use both type gauges. The light mark made by the Tite-Mark isn't a problem, if I need/want a deeper mark I freehand deepen the mark with one of the marking knifes. Even with a "classic" gauge I usually make a light mark and then deepen it if needed.

Rob, nice looking gauge. It should serve you well.

ken

[Bill Carey]

Nice Rob. I might have try one like yours. As you say the titemark seems to bounce off the qswo. And that's about all I use.

[Derek Cohen]

Rob, that’s a fine looking cutting gauge. I hope it brings lots of pleasure when using it (that is what is so great about making gauges). I find screws far, far better than wedges for holding.

About cutting with wheels: did you sharpen yours before you decided that is would not cut hardwood? As you know, I work with hard wood, and a sharp wheel works well.

Knives need to be sharp as well, and a knife like yours is easier to sharpen than the Japanese bent knives I have. Pros and cons - the bent knives are easier with which to set and mark. Both knife types, however, have a disadvantage compared with wheels: the wheels are thin and leave a thin line. The knife blade is wider and leaves a more triangulated impression, which gets wider as the deeper you cut. So, try and keep the bevel under 25 degrees.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Stephen Rosenthal]

I’ve got a Tite-Mark and Hamilton. I usually use the former for cross grain marking and the latter with the grain. Seems to work better that way, but I prefer the Hamilton.

[Rob Luter]

I lapped the wheel on my Tite-Mark. It will draw blood :o

While my Tite-Mark will cut a very precise line on oak, it’s very thin and not deep enough to see well. Getting a chisel to drop in it requires a light touch. It works great on cherry and fine grained woods.

The knife on my shop made gauge is very sharp, and single edged like a marking knife. It leaves a similar knife line.

[Derek Cohen]

I’ve got a Tite-Mark and Hamilton. I usually use the former for cross grain marking and the latter with the grain. Seems to work better that way, but I prefer the Hamilton.

Stephen, this is interesting. Perhaps you can comment, or try a little experiment ...

My explanation: The TM wheel is thin, and it is terrific across the grain. It can more easily be diverted when cutting with the grain. The thicker Hamilton knife will better resist this when cutting with the grain.

Try this (if you do not do this already - my apology if I am telling you how to suck eggs): light strokes with the TM when marking with the grain. The first 2 or 3 strokes should be feather light. Just enough to score the top fibres. Then increase the downforce slightly. And progressively. You should not have a problem with the grain now.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[ken hatch]

I lapped the wheel on my Tite-Mark. It will draw blood :o

While my Tite-Mark will cut a very precise line on oak, it’s very thin and not deep enough to see well. Getting a chisel to drop in it requires a light touch. It works great on cherry and fine grained woods.

The knife on my shop made gauge is very sharp, and single edged like a marking knife. It leaves a similar knife line.


Rob,

It is easy to deepen the line with a knife. I know an extra step but often worth it. Most of the time it is just part of my marking routine.

ken

[Derek Cohen]

I lapped the wheel on my Tite-Mark. It will draw blood :o

While my Tite-Mark will cut a very precise line on oak, it’s very thin and not deep enough to see well. Getting a chisel to drop in it requires a light touch. It works great on cherry and fine grained woods.

The knife on my shop made gauge is very sharp, and single edged like a marking knife. It leaves a similar knife line.

Rob, I never drop a chisel into a knife line. It is a recipe to push the line back. What I do is pare a chisel wall. It can be very shallow - that would be enough to register the chisel in the line but prevent it from moving backwards over the line.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[ken hatch]

Rob, I never drop a chisel into a knife line. It is a recipe to push the line back. What I do is pare a chisel wall. It can be very shallow - that would be enough to register the chisel in the line but prevent it from moving backwards over the line.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek,

I usually do this with a pattern makers chisel cross grain. I see folks pare to the line with the grain, too busy and easy to screw up. I have a hard time getting a good line with a heavy hand no matter what the marking gauge is. Cross grain a light hand with a tite-mark followed by a knife will make a perfect mark. Easy and quick.

ken

[Rob Luter]

Rob, I never drop a chisel into a knife line. It is a recipe to push the line back. What I do is pare a chisel wall. It can be very shallow - that would be enough to register the chisel in the line but prevent it from moving backwards over the line.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Understood. All my recent dovetailing practice has clearly illustrated the fragility of the baseline, especially if trying to remove too much waste at once. My point was that on certain wood, the crisp but shallow line from the wheel gauge doesn't offer much in the way of registration, Whether it be for supplementing with a marking knife or for establishing a chisel wall/knife wall.

[Phil Mueller]

Nicely done, Rob. If you get a chance, I’d like to see the clamp knob/wooden pellet. Can’t quite picture how that was done.
Thanks!

[Jeff Ranck]

Nicely done! I have a few wheel gauges from Lee Valley. I do like them, but I reach for my Japanese marking gauge more often than not. So I tend to like slicing gauges better and it looks like you have a winner!

[Mark Rainey]

Rob, that is one nice hand tool!

[Stephen Rosenthal]

Stephen, this is interesting. Perhaps you can comment, or try a little experiment ...

My explanation: The TM wheel is thin, and it is terrific across the grain. It can more easily be diverted when cutting with the grain. The thicker Hamilton knife will better resist this when cutting with the grain.

Try this (if you do not do this already - my apology if I am telling you how to suck eggs): light strokes with the TM when marking with the grain. The first 2 or 3 strokes should be feather light. Just enough to score the top fibres. Then increase the downforce slightly. And progressively. You should not have a problem with the grain now.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Hi Derek,

Never a problem getting advice from others (especially you), even if I already know it. Anyway, your suggestion of starting light and progressively increasing the downward force with multiple passes does improve the ability to score the line with the grain, but I find it also increases the chances of messing it up as a result of the additional passes. That said, it’s likely a matter of my technique with a wheel gauge. I’ve never quite gotten the hang of scoring long lines with the grain with it. That’s why I purchased the 6” Hamilton (not their traditional marking gauge). Unlike a wheel gauge it is perfectly balanced and has that long flat fence. This allows me to place consistent downward pressure without shifting my hand throughout the cut. The Tite-Mark (or any wheel gauge), with its limited point of contact with the edge, tends to tip or wander. Again, probably a matter of my technique, but as my dad always told me, there’s nothing like the right tool to make the work easier.

[Rob Luter]

It's raining today, so I spent a couple hours in the shop cleaning up the aftermath from the last project and creating another debris pile from the new one. I thought I might follow up and show the kind of results I get with my marking gauges.

I use the three gauges below for marking. From left to right is my homebrew, an old Stanley #62 with a pin scribed to a spear point, and a Tite-Mark

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I scribed lines cross grain on a piece of 8/4 QSWO I use as a backer for chopping dovetails. I used the same pressure on each. They follow the same left to right order as the gauge photo. As you can hopefully see, the Tite-Mark left a razor thin line that is very crisp. The #62 left a nice V shaped line that was a bit deeper than the Tite-Mark and less crisp. The home brew left the deepest line, and due to the shape of the cutting blade it's a nearly vertical cut on the left side due to the grind on the cutter. It's set up like a marking knife. It cuts deep enough that I can use a chisel or knife to create a knife wall, and do so confident in the fact that I won't likely screw it up. When I try that with the line from the Tite-Mark, I do not have the same confidence due to the shallow cut. Note this is only on oak and similar hard timber. Finer grained wood like Alder or Cherry mark just fine with the Tite-MArk.

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[Jim Matthews]

In White Oak I follow the knife line with chalk.

DC favors Blue Tape for the purpose.
Chalk doesn't peel off in my dank shop.