Best cabinet production CNC

[Matt Vivion]

Hello all,
We are a custom cabinet shop with a pretty high production pace. We currently do not have any automation , but are looking to do it soon.
I've been searching through threads here and I've noticed CAMaster suggested some as well as the Laguna Smartshop 2.
Curious what everyone's suggestion for me would be? I am needing either 5x10 or 5x12 table, automatic tool change...
Beyond that I'm open to anything!
I suppose I'm a little partial to machines not made in China, though I'm not completely against them.

Thanks in advance!

-- Matt Vivion
MVP Cabinets in Abilene, TX
http://MVP.cab

[Jim Becker]

I will admit right up front that I'm a Camaster owner and fan...made in USA in Georgia and they use North American sources parts to the extent that's actually possible. They are hefty machines for sure and prices are very reasonable for the features. That said, the level of automation you want/need will come into play, too, if you are thinking about automatic sheet loading, etc. You're getting into serious higher-end industrial gear at that point. Talk to Grant or Cody at Camaster and see what they can do for you.

[Kevin Jenness]

Since you seem new to cnc, start by googling "Gary Campbell cnc do your homework". You should be able to view a very helpful introduction to buying your first cnc router without actually subscribing to the Camheads forum on which it was posted, At that point you will have an idea of what you don't know yet and need to.

There are a plethora of manufacturers out there and you will have to do your due diligence to sort out the best value for your specific operation. Besides the hardware, operating system and cad/cam software, technical support is key. When you are depending on one highly technical machine for your sheet processing you need to be able to count on someone to hold your hand if problems arise. The fact that Camaster and Shopbot have active user forums is a real plus for both those outfits although you should be able to depend on the techs at whatever vendor you decide on. I have received extremely generous and helpful advice from the Camheads group.

For cabinet cutting don't stint on vacuum, you will want 10 hp at a minimum.

Figure out what you want to use for design/cutting software and start training on it before you get your machine. Ideally it will mesh with your current drawing process.

[Jerome Stanek]

If you want a very good machine I would look at Beisse the company I worked for had 2 and they will out perform a Camaster hands down. I worked installing Revco and CVS casework and most of thecompanies that supplied it had Beisses. The first CNC that I saw was a large Beisse with a loader and unloader but they were making hundreds of cabinets a day.

[Mark Bolton]

If your literally looking at serious production and automation you can start looking anywhere at "lean cell".. your talking machines that are nowhere in the class of Camaster, Laguna, Shopsabre (I own a ShopSabre). If your truly looking at full automation looking on any any online forum is a waste of your time. You will be contemplating $500k investment. Be wary of certain companies in the large format and do your homework. Jerome mentions Beisse but I bought a large bander from a company that upgraded to one of their monster machines (like a 180K bander) that wouldnt run for months and months after delivered waiting on support. There are numerous similar accounts to be found. Do your homework. Talk to and visit other shops.

If your seriously looking to full automation, no offense to this place, but your in a pickle posting on hobby forums.

This is the future of cabinet making in the US... if this isnt the direction your heading... look for a different career. P.S.... keep in mind.. this video is 4 years old lol.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kqml38fHALo

[David Falkner]

All that automation is cool but not for most cabinet shops who want a CNC. My friend is on his second CNC - wore the first one out and parts became obsolete. He bought this one (new) after a trade show about 4 years ago for less than $100k. Seems like it has a 12HP main spindle and a 6HP drill spindle with three 5HP vacuum motors. It serves their needs well; at one point they were cutting well over a thousand cabinet doors per month (not counting drawer fronts, for themselves and smaller cabinet shops). That's probably higher than most cabinet shops with 7-8 employees.

I don't recall who manufactured this CNC but it's a beast!

436330

436331

David

[Mark Bolton]

I don't disagree David. If your in a market where you can capitalize on low grade mdf cnc sprayed doors a router is a no baronet and if your lucky enough to be in a market with a bunch of other close shops spooling out the same that are unwilling or unable to invest in their own machining its as win win. Feeding spec homes and flippers with mdf door slammers is very lucrative. But beyond that its a hard market

[Mark Bolton]

The MDF craze in my opinion is already in its initial stages of the particle board issues of the 70s and 80s. There are already endless issues with dowel retention. Door dowel retention. And so on that many of us who avoided doweled hardware have been able to avoid. That said, the checks have been cashed and the homeowners have to hope the insurance was paid

[Jim Becker]

One of the key factors here for the OP is like I mentioned earlier..."level of automation" and what the OP defines as automation. That could merely refer to automating the cutting of the parts on a sheet with the convenience of ATC for tooling or range all the way up to full material handling for both raw infeed to cut parts removal on outfeed.

[Mark Bolton]

One of the key factors here for the OP is like I mentioned earlier..."level of automation"

May well be so Jim, but most markets are headed in a single direction. Its clearly an issue specific to ones market but pretty much across the board the stat's are fairly consistent. Uber high end, or the rest. And even the Uber high end is getting crunchy. The point is that if your going to be productive making anything beyond specialty/niche'ey/uber high end, your likely going either currently ignoring your need to address high speed production, or your looking into it specifically.

The lean cell is the extreme, but it speaks clearly to the fact that profitability in even modestly large scale cabinet production brutal. No need to put frosting on in or spin the standard machine pitch...

[Jim Becker]

Mark, we don't know if this is a one person shop or a really big operation or something in-between. Level of automation vs investment required absolutely comes into play. The small shop is going to do Camaster, ShopSabre or similar machines with ATC and vacuum, but they are not going to drop a half-mill on a fully automated "it slices it dices" solution because their volume and cash flow isn't' going to support that. The OP's website doesn't really indicate business size, either.

[Ted Calver]

Matt...Don't forget the used market. An Onsrud Panel Pro similar to this one (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTvclso5YTc)lives in a friends shop in Oklahoma City and was acquired at auction for much less than the 100K high end figure others have mentioned. 12 bit auto changing...came from a cabinet shop and runs like a top. Something like that might make a good choice if your production warrants the investment.

[Jerome Stanek]

There are a lot of good buys on used heavy iron machines. I follow IRS auctions Industrial Recovery Services they have some very good buys on their site.