Troubles replacing arbor bearings 1979 Powermatic 66

[Patrick Curry]

I've finally started refurbishing an old table saw I picked up a few years ago. New arbor bearings are on the way but I'm having some problems pulling the current ones off the arbor and also have a few questions. I'll just number these to keep the post semi organized:

1. The woodruff key is stuck. I've applied PB Blaster a half dozen times a day for the past 4 days. I've also tried a blow torch (and cool) 5-6 times; even left it overnight in a freezer. I've tried pulling it out with different styles of pliers, tapping it out with flat head screw drivers, and leveraging it with a metal bar while gripping it with pliers. There's not enough material showing to drill a hole through it (wire and pull). The only movement its made comes from tapping one end with a small hammer which raises the opposite end, and disproves my belief in invisible welds. I've gone back and forth with this to see if it will grow looser but so far it has not.

2. Removing the old arbor bearings I've already tapped them a few times with a hammer and they are not moving down the shaft toward the key. Suggestions are welcome.

3. Bearing Spacer. It seemed odd to me that the spacer between the two bearings just flops around loosely with an internal diameter much larger than the arbor shaft. I referenced the parts manual I had and noticed the diagram showed an "inner bearing spacer". My actual arbor is sitting on top of that diagram. But I also found a second parts manual that appears to be from the 1980s (see image of that manual) that shows a "wavy washer" and "retainer ring" in lieu of an inner bearing spacer. It doesn't look like I have either of those on my arbor shaft. Let me add that I don't know the history of these bearings. The one on the blade side of the spacer is toast (before I torched the key) and so I am somewhat concerned about the loose spacer.




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[Steve Eure]

Do you have access to a good air chisel? That's what we use on the farm for stubborn bearings, races and keys. If that doesn't work, try heating it again and then hit it with the air chisel. Make sure that the arbor is secured before trying any of this. If that fails, I'd say machine shop time.

[Bill Dufour]

Woodruff key use small punch to push one end down. Probably best to push on end nearest end of shaft. You may need to use a nail ground flat to continue to punch it below flush so the other end rotates up and out. You will be punching almost parallel to the shaft axis by the end.
Bill D.

[Bill Dufour]

Bearing spacer looks like part #54 to me. It keeps the outer races spaced apart. I agree normally I would see a smaller one to keep the inner races apart. using less material but inner diameter must be good. With the bigger one the inner diameter does not matter as long as it is big enough to not touch the rotating inner race. The outer diameter is also not critical as long as it fits in the bore. It does not rotate so no need for any thing special. A piece of water pipe would be fine as long as the ends are parallel and the outer diameter fits in the hole.
Bill D.

[Patrick Curry]

Steve, I haven't used an air chisel before. I do have a decent size air compressor and a Harbor Freight in my zip code that likely sells affordable Chinese chisels. :)
Thanks for the suggestion

[Bill Dufour]

Buy a bearing splitter for one inch and smaller. Actually I think they only make them 2 inch and smaller. Then use a hydraulic press or the forcing bolts to remove the bearings one at a time. A bearing splitter should last a lifetime. even a harbor Freight one should be plenty good for most hoemowners.
I bought used OTC made in Amercia ones from Ebay. No more cost then the Horrible fright ones. Watch out the knife edges are not bent or broken. My stand up hydralic press lives in the woodshed with fire wood stacked on and in it. I dig it off about once a year as needed. PVC pipe and couplings can often be strong enough to support the bearing splitter while pressing on or off.
Bill D.

https://www.otctools.com/products/bearing-splitter-1

[Patrick Curry]

Bill, that sounds like a winner. I'll give it a try and report back. Thanks!

[Patrick Curry]

Buy a bearing splitter for one inch and smaller. Actually I think they only make them 2 inch and smaller. Then use a hydraulic press or the forcing bolts to remove the bearings one at a time. A bearing splitter should last a lifetime. even a harbor Freight one should be plenty good for most hoemowners.
I bought used OTC made in Amercia ones from Ebay. No more cost then the Horrible fright ones. Watch out the knife edges are not bent or broken. My stand up hydralic press lives in the woodshed with fire wood stacked on and in it. I dig it off about once a year as needed. PVC pipe and couplings can often be strong enough to support the bearing splitter while pressing on or off.
Bill D.

https://www.otctools.com/products/bearing-splitter-1

That's a new tool to me. I was already thinking about ways to push them off the shaft with equal pressure and a splitter is just what I need.
BUT...still trying to get that darn key out. I've been working one end with a nail like you suggested but I haven't gotten it below the surface yet. Hit it with the torch again before taking a break (I think the torch just helps me)

[Jerry Bruette]

I'd skip the splitter and just get a bearing puller. Harbor Freight or maybe a local auto parts store will lend/rent one. Put the center screw of the puller in the center hole of the shaft and pull both bearings off at the same time.

Be sure to clean up the shaft after you get the key out. But be careful not to change the O.D. of the shaft where you clean it or the sheave won't fit properly.

[Bill Dufour]

two big crowbars or two crowbars may be enough to get the bearings off but the key has to come first. I would look at the slot carefully. It is probably hammered and dented. A air chisel may just make it worse, faster. I agree that a bearing puller will work if there is enough room to get the jaws under. It will damage the bearing in doing so. Problem will be to find one with small enough fingers to reach in and long enough to handle the shaft. The bearing splitter may be able to get to the inner race and save the bearing.
Bill D

[Tony Joyce]

May or may not be cheap, but it's sure is faster. No affiliation, just a source. Search ebay Powermatic 66 saw arbor and scroll.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Powermatic-Model-66-Tablesaw-complete-Arbor-Assembly-2024018/122711328461?epid=1708057809&hash=item1c922a46cd:g:iTkAAOSwYlBZmNQq:sc:USPSPrio rityMailPaddedFlatRateEnvelope!27046!US!-1

[Doug Dawson]

I've finally started refurbishing an old table saw I picked up a few years ago. New arbor bearings are on the way but I'm having some problems pulling the current ones off the arbor and also have a few questions. I'll just number these to keep the post semi organized:

1. The woodruff key is stuck. I've applied PB Blaster a half dozen times a day for the past 4 days. I've also tried a blow torch (and cool) 5-6 times; even left it overnight in a freezer. I've tried pulling it out with different styles of pliers, tapping it out with flat head screw drivers, and leveraging it with a metal bar while gripping it with pliers. There's not enough material showing to drill a hole through it (wire and pull). The only movement its made comes from tapping one end with a small hammer which raises the opposite end, and disproves my belief in invisible welds. I've gone back and forth with this to see if it will grow looser but so far it has not.

Re the key, hit the _shaft_ (not the key) with a torch, rub an ice cube on the key, then yank on the key with a slide hammer. It should pop right out.

[Matt Day]

Please do not use a hammer or crowbars in any way trying to remove the bearings. Get the proper tool, a bearing puller. My HF ones are crap, stripped the threads on 2 of the 3. Get quality older ones like OTC (or newer ones). If you’re doing it yourself, do it right.

Regarding the key, try striking it with a hammer on the high end, with the arbor shaft firmly supported.

[Patrick Curry]

May or may not be cheap, but it's sure is faster. No affiliation, just a source. Search ebay Powermatic 66 saw arbor and scroll.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Powermatic-Model-66-Tablesaw-complete-Arbor-Assembly-2024018/122711328461?epid=1708057809&hash=item1c922a46cd:g:iTkAAOSwYlBZmNQq:sc:USPSPrio rityMailPaddedFlatRateEnvelope!27046!US!-1

I had that in my basket this week!
Probably would have pulled the trigger had I missed that it's only threaded on one end. Not sure what years that one fits but mine has threads and nuts on each end.

[Tony Joyce]

I had that in my basket this week!
Probably would have pulled the trigger had I missed that it's only threaded on one end. Not sure what years that one fits but mine has threads and nuts on each end.


Interesting, what color is it(the saw)? I'm no expert, but I've never seen one like that. What purpose do the threads serve? The pulley is keyed and pretty sure has one or two setscrews.

[Patrick Curry]

Re the key, hit the _shaft_ (not the key) with a torch, rub an ice cube on the key, then yank on the key with a slide hammer. It should pop right out.

This worked! Took some muscle and a second set up hands to hold a small pry bar but it worked. Thanks!

434360

[Patrick Curry]

Once the bearings arrive I may take everything over to a buddy's auto brake center and see if he can get the old bearings off and the new ones on (safely) with a press. I've had enough time with this arbor for now.


two big crowbars or two crowbars may be enough to get the bearings off but the key has to come first. I would look at the slot carefully. It is probably hammered and dented. A air chisel may just make it worse, faster. I agree that a bearing puller will work if there is enough room to get the jaws under. It will damage the bearing in doing so. Problem will be to find one with small enough fingers to reach in and long enough to handle the shaft. The bearing splitter may be able to get to the inner race and save the bearing.
Bill D

[Tom M King]

That's a good plan. It's an easy job with a press. I wouldn't even bother to try any other method.

[Patrick Curry]

Interesting, what color is it(the saw)? I'm no expert, but I've never seen one like that. What purpose do the threads serve? The pulley is keyed and pretty sure has one or two setscrews.

yes, the pulley has a set screw and both ends are threaded.
434362

It was made in 1970. Kind of a cool story worth sharing is that the man who sold it to me was the junior school shop teacher that procured all the classroom equipment nearly 50 years ago. He told me they closed woodworking about 5 years later and the machines went largely unused while remaining at the school. The school closed down and the retired shop teacher got a sweetheart deal on all that he could store in his garage. It’s all 3 phase equipment though. It’s in my old hometown and we’ve kept in touch since the sale.

[Matt Day]

That's a good plan. It's an easy job with a press. I wouldn't even bother to try any other method.

Seriously? I do it all the time with a bearing puller or bearing splitter. It’s a worthy investment if there’s any chance you will ever replace a bearing again. I think I have 6 pullers (good ones, not counting HF) and a splitter (which actually is H and works great, lol).

[Alex Zeller]

I don't know why it would be different but my '95 PM66 has snap rings on both sides of the pulley side bearing on the shaft. So when you remove the bearings do it one at a time. I used a bearing separator and a 20 ton hydraulic press. They came off like butter. There's also a wavy washer next to that spacer. It applies a little force but not too much to keep it from moving. When you install the new bearings make sure to press them on pushing on the inner race. They should go on pretty easily. It's a little late now but I would have suggested measuring the runout on the shaft before removing it. If it's not true now would be a good time to replace it. Between the shaft and the gears for raising and tilting the blade everything else seams to last forever.

I went a bit further when I rebuilt my PM66. I removed everything, cleaned it all up and lubricated it (both dry and grease as needed). How are your raising and tilting functions? Mine worked pretty stiff. The knob that locks the handwheels was the problem. It's nothing more than a shaft with a point on the end. That point pushes on the end of a key (just like the one you had a tough time removing). Both keys were crudded up. Once the shaft the handwheel mounts to is removed the keys are easy to get out as tightening up the locking knob forces it out. From there just cleaning it up and then some grease and now they work super easy and lock great. I actually bought handles for the handwheels (see below) since they spin so easy. Before tilting the blade took a little but of effort, now I focus 100% on the blade to get the exact angle I want. if you've gone this far I would suggest going a little further.

[Tom M King]

Seriously? I do it all the time with a bearing puller or bearing splitter. It’s a worthy investment if there’s any chance you will ever replace a bearing again. I think I have 6 pullers (good ones, not counting HF) and a splitter (which actually is H and works great, lol).

I have plenty of bearing pullers, but much prefer pushing out, or pressing in a bearing, or bushing with a press. Even small things, if I can rig up a way for it to work.

[Bill Dufour]

I assume the bearing nearest the blade is locked in place and the one at the far end can float to allow for heat expansion of the arbor length as it heats up under use.
Bil lD

[Jared Sankovich]

Relatively quick to press the old bearings off and new bearings back on
434380

[Alex Zeller]

I assume the bearing nearest the blade is locked in place and the one at the far end can float to allow for heat expansion of the arbor length as it heats up under use.
Bil lD

The bearing near the blade is just pushed on as far as it can go, then the spacer, then the wavy washer for the spacer (this is what would take up any expansion, then a snap ring (that's too small to touch the spacer), the pulley side bearing, and then a snap ring on the other side of the bearing. There's a set screw that holds the spacer in place so the bearing nearest the blade can't move. So, yes if the arbor heats up the pulley will move slightly.

[Tom M King]

Even with a press, I like this stuff, and especially the little bottles with the needle tip. After I use it, and take something apart, the parts are almost always coated with it.

https://logrite.com/Category/bluecreeper

[mike stenson]

Seriously? I do it all the time with a bearing puller or bearing splitter. It’s a worthy investment if there’s any chance you will ever replace a bearing again. I think I have 6 pullers (good ones, not counting HF) and a splitter (which actually is H and works great, lol).

Given the choice between pullers and an arbor press, I'm going to the arbor press every.. time.

[Doug Dawson]

Given the choice between pullers and an arbor press, I'm going to the arbor press every.. time.

You can buy an acceptable 20-ton press at HF for around $200, or less if you have the coupons and/or it’s on sale. Very useful. They also sell a cheap bearing separator plate that is “okay”. I have this press, and I also have a trunk full of worn out Honda 5-speed parts that I use as jigs with it. :^) Jody drives his Honda hard. Don’t throw away your scrap metal.

[Bill Dufour]

I save the old bearings and grind down the outer race a little bit to push in the new one. The inner race I heat up in the wood stove or campfire to a glowing red. In the morning I drill the inner bore a little bigger and use that as a presser as well.
Bil ¬D

[Tom M King]

One of the best cheap Chinese tools sets I've bought was this set of press dies that has one every mm. But, as you can see in that picture of the 300 lb. tractor axle, other stuff is often required.

Always store this set flat in a drawer. It's no fun having to put all the pieces back in their correct slot.

edited to add: Even if I'm installing something as small, and delicate as a crank seal in a chainsaw, I'll use the press. It's just so much less violent than hitting with a hammer.

[Matt Day]

Given the choice between pullers and an arbor press, I'm going to the arbor press every.. time.

Obviously, if you HAVE a press you’re going to use it. It’s not a very common tool for a wood shop. Bearing pullers are a lot more common, smaller, and cheaper.

[Bill Dufour]

A hydraulic press is such a good tool that there are multiple you tube channels of using them to bend and crush things for fun and profit?
Bil lD

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35OBfk1F8Ps

[Doug Dawson]

A hydraulic press is such a good tool that there are multiple you tube channels of using them to bend and crush things for fun and profit?
Bil lD

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35OBfk1F8Ps

That video was a toy model of what happened in an instant with the collapse of the WTC, but with much more violence and speed. :-(

[mike stenson]

Obviously, if you HAVE a press you’re going to use it. It’s not a very common tool for a wood shop. Bearing pullers are a lot more common, smaller, and cheaper.

They're not terribly expensive, but I was referring to the OPs decision to go use his friends press. It's a smart move and makes the job pretty trivial.

[Alex Zeller]

I use my press for gluing segmented bowls. The cheap Harbor Freight ones don't have a pressure gauge but the slightly more expensive ones do. Once you have one you start to collect short pieces of pipe in different diameters and other things to remove and install things like bearings. Also you will end up with steel arbor plates which work well for supporting the underside of the wood and to spread out the force on top of the wood. If you will never use it again it doesn't make sense but they don't take up much room and if money isn't too tight they can be a nice asset to have.

[Jared Sankovich]

Obviously, if you HAVE a press you’re going to use it. It’s not a very common tool for a wood shop. Bearing pullers are a lot more common, smaller, and cheaper.

Though a common enough tool for most well equipped garages. Bearing and gear pullers are also common in any well equipped garage.

[Patrick Curry]

New bearings arrived today and they slid right up to the old bearings without any force.

Should new ones be this loose? Maybe the arbor has a slightly larger diameter where the bearings sit? (I havenÂ’t taken the old ones in to be pulled off yet).

The new ones (WJB 5204 2RS) are sized the same as the ones on the arbor (Fafnir W2O4PP), which is 20mm ID, 47mm OD.

IDK...maybe IÂ’m just looking for something to go wrong at this point

[Bill Dufour]

Shaft is normally a tad smaller up to the boss where the bearing sits. Reduces need for accurate finish in the middle saving time and money. Shaft may well be english size were the pulley sits or at arbor. ball bearing inner bore will be metric if it was made after the great war and likely any ball bearing will be metric outer diameter regardless of age.
I am not aware of any ball bearing ever being made with english outer race sizes. It is bizarre at my local ace hardware they have cabinets with a few ball bearings in with specialty hardware. But they list the size in english units so they re like 1.259" instead of say 30mm. No mention of the true metric measurements anywhere. Ball bearing have been made to metric dimensions since their modern invention around 1860 in Metric France. I do not know if you can get really accurate single english balls by themselves. You can buy super accurate ground metric balls made for high precision bearings.
Bill D

[Patrick Curry]

Okay, that makes sense. Thanks for the reply

[Daniel Berry]

I know this is an old thread, but I have the same arbor shaft. Is the nut holding the pullies on reverse threaded? Mine is stuck and I'm about to resort to extreme measures to get it off. Shaft rotation tells me it should be reverse, but it's not mentioned in the manual.

[Bill Dufour]

On a saw arbor AFAIK all the threads are left handed. Don't be afraid to use a little heat to break the things apart. Keep it under 400 degrees so no temper is affected.The worst you can do is burn up the seals in the bad bearings you are going to replace.
Bill D.

[Bill Dufour]

Save the old bearing to use to push on the new. Grind down the outer race by a few 1/1000's then take them apart. Heat the inner race to red hot and let cool slowly. Drill the bore one size larger.
Bill D