Straight Line Rip on Tablesaw w/ Feeders?

[Stewart Lang]

I'm looking for a way to speedily straight line rip 6-10' lumber, in relatively large amounts. Obviously a straight line rip saw would be ideal, but it is both out of my budget and out of my electrical requirements at the moment :)

From my basic understanding, a SLR is essentially a hi-powered tablesaw with feeders above that keep the board on a straight line. (obviously with a bottom track and additional safety feeders too) But it has me curious. If I mounted two feeders on my tablesaw, one towards the front of the blade and one towards the rear, could I achieve similar results? Provided the feeders were dialed in, along with the saw?

I've never used feeders on a tablesaw, so perhaps this is already an acceptable practice or wide-spread knowledge? If it is, kindly let me know, ha!

I'm not looking for perfect glue lines or ultra-accuracy, but a nice straight edge would be the goal. As well as a quicker way for processing a lot of edges than on my jointer or track saw.


BTW, for my application, would I benefit from a track feeder vs. 4-wheel feeder?

[Erik Loza]

Stewart, everything you know is accurate. I haven't used a feeder on a cabinet saw, myself, but it's not uncommon in the industry. I would say, make sure to keep the cast iron table waxed and make sure the feeders tires are in good shape. Otherwise, seems straightforward.

Erik

[Stewart Lang]

Stewart, everything you know is accurate. I haven't used a feeder on a cabinet saw, myself, but it's not uncommon in the industry. I would say, make sure to keep the cast iron table waxed and make sure the feeders tires are in good shape. Otherwise, seems straightforward.

Erik

Great! I've seen guys use feeders on TS's for years but apparently never fully understood their uses, but as my needs are changing to involve quicker lumber processing, it's coming into my radar. A couple questions for anybody who uses them.

1) Would one feeder be fine? Or would I benefit from more control/straighter feed with two feeders mounted in-line? Or would they fight each other?
2) Any benefit with track feeders vs. roller feeders?

[Peter Kelly]

A track feeder is only necessary with shorter workpieces. A 3 or 4 wheel feeder with better rollers should be ok. https://www.westernroller.com/products/super-feed

One feeder, not two.

[Stewart Lang]

Peter, ahh that makes sense! Thanks for that!

[Bob Falk]

I have ripped a lot of longer trim (10'-12') on my cabinet saw with a old Delta feeder (1/2 hp). Works great and yields much more consistent results than when fed by hand. A very safe way to rip. I simply bolt and unbolt feeder when needed.

[David Kumm]

I run a four wheel feeder on my Whitney and use it a lot. I hate the stock wheels that come with feeders but they are great on a saw because I don't feel bad sacrificing one or two by letting the blade nick into it. I place the feeder so the front wheel engages before the blade, the blade nicks the two middle wheels and the final wheel causes the stock to completely move free from the cut before the board is released. You want the wheels to contact both sides of the stock so both exit and you don't have to pull the offcut by hand. The blade should be set only about 1/4" higher than the stock so you don't saw into the hubs. The feeder seldom needs to be moved other than vertically.

A feeder puts a lot of stress on the table, base, and arbor so it isn't for a light duty machine. You want decent thickness cast iron, and I prefer a 1" arbor. Keep the table waxed and make sure the feeder is locked down and machined well enough to the base that under stress the feeder doesn't move towards the fence and wreck everything in sight. Dave

PS. An extended arm is nice so you can keep the feeder base as far away as possible. Taking it off the saw leads to buying a second saw or hernia surgery. Dave

[Greg Parrish]

Stewart, couldn’t figure out how to message you so excuse the off topic post. Did you ever sell my PM66? Just curious what happened to it. Regards. Greg

[Patrick Kane]

This is probably more for my benefit, but maybe for the OP's too. The way i am reading it, he wants to rig up a DIY straight line ripsaw. Not a gang rip etc, but he wants to put a straight edge on a rough board independent of a fence. I dont know how you do that with a feeder and a cabinet saw. The feeder would have to be aligned parallel to the blade, and maintain that setting. Otherwise, if the feeder cants toe in or toe out from the blade, it will produce a curved rip, no?

Maybe im the dummy here, but most of the responses refer more to ripping with a fence and a feeder AFTER an edge has been jointed.

[Tony Joyce]

You can obviously use a feeder on a table saw and they work great, but don't expect a straight edge board unless it's straight going in.

You could possibly use an extended fence as a work around. Think six foot front and back of blade. Quality of cut may be acceptable for what you're doing.

If it's production quantity work then an SLR will quickly pay for itself.

Just to qualify my comments. I've run tens of thousands of feet of lumber through an SLR(Diehl SL-55) for architectural mouldings, paneling, & flooring.
I used a 14" Powermatic table saw with feeder in the early days. Night and day difference.

[Tony Joyce]

This is probably more for my benefit, but maybe for the OP's too. The way i am reading it, he wants to rig up a DIY straight line ripsaw. Not a gang rip etc, but he wants to put a straight edge on a rough board independent of a fence. I dont know how you do that with a feeder and a cabinet saw. The feeder would have to be aligned parallel to the blade, and maintain that setting. Otherwise, if the feeder cants toe in or toe out from the blade, it will produce a curved rip, no?

Maybe im the dummy here, but most of the responses refer more to ripping with a fence and a feeder AFTER an edge has been jointed.


You are correct in your assumptions. An SLR holds the board top and bottom, and doesn't really need a fence to straight line rip. The fence is just used for rip to width.
A table saw with a feeder will have a drag or friction on the table and will go as it wants.

Tony

As an aside bit of trivia, you can adjust some SLR's to rip with(create) a curved edge.

[Patrick Kane]

You are correct in your assumptions. An SLR holds the board top and bottom, and doesn't really need a fence to straight line rip. The fence is just used for rip to width.
A table saw with a feeder will have a drag or friction on the table and will go as it wants.

Tony

Good deal. Ive never used a SLR, but ive been around them and im familiar with the engineering. Ive also used a feeder at the table saw and produced bowed boards : )

OP, you say you dont have the power, but what about the taiwan baby SLRs? Tony mentions his Diehl, which is probably a 20hp power hog. The oliver, powermatic, grizzly, northtech, or whatever other brand are in the 10hp range, i think. It helps they are significantly smaller than the mattisons and diehls.

[David Kumm]

I see I missed the point of the question. Woodmaster used to make a gang rip attachment for their molder that might work somewhat. Dave

[Tony Joyce]

As another thought on the subject. Depending where you get your lumber a lot of dealers offer SLR as an added service(usually reasonable). With one straight edge, your table saw with feeder would make short work of ripping strips.

Just throwing that out there.

[lowell holmes]

A circular saw with a straight edge clamped to the wood will allow you to rip wood with a circular hand saw,
sometimes called a side winder.

[Colin Helms]

I have a feeder on my table saw that I have had for years and I do love it. I just set it up for the width that I want to rip the boards a let it rip. It works great, I did upgrade my wheels with Westernroller.com after I bought it. It was used. I do this with the boards that I need to run on my Woodmaster molding machine for all my moldings. I've also used my Woodmaster to cut the boards to the sizes that I needed too. But it was easier to use my table saw and just drop the new boards into the molding machine.

Colin431356431356431358

[Kevin Jenness]

As Patrick Kane said, you would have to have the feeder precisely aligned with the blade for this to work. As well, most powerfeeders won't have room between the wheels for a splitter, so kickback may be more of an issue.

The main thing would be feeding the workpiece in without a fence while minimizing waste and avoiding a tapered cut that runs out of the stock. I believe straight line ripsaws typically use an overhead laser for this. Before I had a sliding table saw I used to use a straightlining jig that ran in the tablesaw's miter gauge groove, and I have seen some that run against the rip fence. Perhaps you could use something like that in conjunction with the powerfeed (or without it).

If you are doing any real production an slr may be a good investment. There are some threads on the topic at Woodweb that might be helpful.

Getting your material in with one straight edge (SLR1E) and then ripping to width with a powerfed tablesaw is something to consider.

[Bobby Robbinett]

First off, I don’t believe this method will be worth it as you would have to set the feeder dead on parallel with the blade and at the same time you would absolutely have to make sure it was feeding straight so as to not cut a crooked or curved shape into the boards. It might be possible to do this but I have my doubts.

You mentioned that you have a track saw. That would be your fastest and most accurate method of straight lining rough cut lumber.

One other thing to consider is that you can purchase a cheap Chinese SLR saw off Alibaba or any otter Chinese website that sells Chinese wood working machines. You could probably find a decent small one for under $3,000. Maybe significantly under that. I have a friend that bought a cheap Chinese edge bander off Alibaba and it works great. He said that his $2,500 generic Chinese edge bander gives him less head aches that his older SCMI did when it was newer!

[Peter Kelly]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkBsNvEHV30

[Peter Kelly]

One other thing to consider is that you can purchase a cheap Chinese SLR saw off Alibaba or any otter Chinese website that sells Chinese wood working machines. You could probably find a decent small one for under $3,000. Maybe significantly under that. I have a friend that bought a cheap Chinese edge bander off Alibaba and it works great. He said that his $2,500 generic Chinese edge bander gives him less head aches that his older SCMI did when it was newer!OP's first post indicates he doesn't likely have 3ph power available....

[Stewart Lang]

Thanks for the replies everyone! Seems like it might not work after all for straight line ripping. Worth a shot to ask. I don't have 3-phase at my building but I could invest in a phase converter if necessary. I may just look into getting a 10' slider and use that for SLR work. I have a short-stroke 5.5' at the moment. Won't be as efficient as an SLR, but it'd be multi-useful.

[ChrisA Edwards]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkBsNvEHV30

Thank you for posting that.

[Jim Becker]

I do my straight line ripping on my slider, Stewart. It's certainly not fast and automated like a dedicated for-purpose machine would be, but the cut is excellent, especially if one has already flattened the side that goes on the wagon. I don't joint edges other than in extremely rare situations at this point.

[Mark Bolton]

The only way your going to GLUE LINE rip long material on a table saw with a feeder is that you MUST have a fence twice the length of the material your ripping. And you have to setup the feeder without so much toe-in that it springs the crook out of the board as it goes through. You have to feed the board with the crown out (tips of the board touching the fence through the entre cut), flip, and rip to width.

This will require a fence setup that is rigid enough to resist the force of the feeder and any force an unwieldy board will add to the feeder force (a lot).

We straightline 10 fooot material when we have to on the slider and then rip on the slider with a 1hp feeder running wide open. 10" 20 tooth full kerf heavy carbide ripping blade. 7.5 hp saw. And it sucks.

Find a SLR in your area that will run your material (it will be well worth the money).

[Darcy Warner]

I wouldn't attempt it on a TS with feeders like that.

I love my SLR's and gang rip saws. My scmi M3 was less than a domino. Lol.

[Mark Bolton]

Agreed. But space is reality. Cost is usually far less an issue. Used isn't too bristly expensive but as you've stated repeatedly getting an SLR that glue line rips at 10' ain't a fart and conjuring up the floor space out of thin air is an easy talking point. Less so in the real world.

[Joe Calhoon]

For years before having a slider and SLR we did a lot of straight lining on a table saw with this Tage Frid style sled. I had two, a 8’ and a 12’.
Sandpaper on the one end helps hold the board from moving. The screw point on the other end works and so does a wedge like sliders usually have. Not a glue joint method but effective and quick for getting a straight edge.
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[Richard Coers]

You could always invest in a CNC router, they are great for straight lining.

[Kevin Jenness]

Joe, I used that same jig from Tage Frid's first book. He was a very practical fellow who could produce sophisticated results with relatively simple resources and a straightforward approach. In the same vein, I recall a quote from Charles Hayward to the effect of "No matter how complicated a veneer job you are planning, remember that some oldtimer accomplished its equal with little more than a knife, a pan of hot glue, and a lump of iron."

[William Hodge]

I'm looking for a way to speedily straight line rip 6-10' lumber, in relatively large amounts. Obviously a straight line rip saw would be ideal, but it is both out of my budget and out of my electrical requirements at the moment :)

From my basic understanding, a SLR is essentially a hi-powered tablesaw with feeders above that keep the board on a straight line. (obviously with a bottom track and additional safety feeders too) But it has me curious. If I mounted two feeders on my tablesaw, one towards the front of the blade and one towards the rear, could I achieve similar results? Provided the feeders were dialed in, along with the saw?

I've never used feeders on a tablesaw, so perhaps this is already an acceptable practice or wide-spread knowledge? If it is, kindly let me know, ha!

I'm not looking for perfect glue lines or ultra-accuracy, but a nice straight edge would be the goal. As well as a quicker way for processing a lot of edges than on my jointer or track saw.


BTW, for my application, would I benefit from a track feeder vs. 4-wheel feeder?

What is a large amount of lumber? Edge jointing few hundred feet of wood is not that bad.

The bigger issue is the stock feeder. If you rip much wood, you need a stock feeder. Set it up with the blade between the first and second wheels, toe it in 1/4" front to back,and the blade should just clear the wood. If your fence deflects, clamp a dial indicator base at the outfeed end to hold it steady. To move the feeder off the saw, have a cart that is the same height as the table. Put a 3" thick piece of wood under the feeder beside the wheels, unbolt, and slide the feeder on to the cart. Finally, put a shop vac crevice tool between the first and second wheels, from above. This keeps the wheels from becoming fouled with saw dust, and losing traction. Clean the wheels with isopropyl alcohol if they slip. Keep a chunk of wax on the saw to wax the infeed table edge while ripping.

Running wood on a saw with no fence and a feeder will result in an interesting variety of curves and tapers.

[Jim Becker]

You could always invest in a CNC router, they are great for straight lining.

Yes, they can cut straight lines...VERY straight lines. But setting up to do this for solid stock just isn't something that's generally done with such a machine. It's not efficient. Further, the cost of a CNC with "only" an 8' bed is still pretty substantial, even if it's a "kit" machine from Avid CNC (formerly CNC Router Parts) or similar. Where I use my CNC for "processing" solid stock the most is for surfacing slabs that can't fit through my thickness planer...as long as they can fit on the machine's bed. (my capacity is only 50" on the y axis)

[Joe Calhoon]

Joe, I used that same jig from Tage Frid's first book. He was a very practical fellow who could produce sophisticated results with relatively simple resources and a straightforward approach. In the same vein, I recall a quote from Charles Hayward to the effect of "No matter how complicated a veneer job you are planning, remember that some oldtimer accomplished its equal with little more than a knife, a pan of hot glue, and a lump of iron."

This reference dates us for sure Kevin. 😊
I’m going to make one of these for my T17. Even with a SLR it’s handy to have something that requires no setup to use. I cannot see a feeder ever working for this. Even with a SLR the material has to be well faced with no twist to get a good glue joint.

[Mark Bolton]

I cannot see a feeder ever working for this. Even with a SLR the material has to be well faced with no twist to get a good glue joint.

I straight line/glueline rip in the shop with a feeder on TS all the time but not at regularly at 10'+ though we have in a pinch with a shop fabricated long fence. Not something I would be interested in doing on any type of regular basis. No different than anything it may require a second round after dry fit but when its the only short option available it does work. Uber-long fence, super rigid, good setup on the feeder.

I have a monster shop built fence that hangs on the wall that allows for feeder straight line and glue line rip of 9' material with the feeder and we have built one-of fences for rare batches of 15' work that get tossed and rebuilt as needed. For just a couple boards that are within the stroke of the slider we use the slider but if there is a bunch to be glue line ripped we use the feeder as its way faster, less operator fatigue, more consistent, way better blade life.

[Joe Calhoon]

Mark,
I was just referring to using the feeder only without a fence to get a glue joint. I’m sure with a feeder and fence you can get a glue joint.

[lowell holmes]

If I rip, I normally run the pieces through my jointer and if need be I will rip the joined pieces and re-glue the pieces.
I get good results with this technique.