Need help on finding epoxy

[Matthew Curtis]

I would like to have some two part epoxy on hand. I would be using it to fill voids, stabilize knots and some occasional glue ups.

Which epoxies would be good choices and also not break the bank?

[Bryan Lisowski]

Most epoxy will be fairly expensive. Check out West Systems, Total Boat, Ecopoxy, or System 3. If you watch YT and people the do epoxy river tables, sometimes they will have a % off code.

[Richard Verwoest]

For what you just described, I would recommend West Epoxy. Get the quart size, with hardner and pumps. Less than a B. Franklin from Amazon.

[Jim Becker]

I use a variety of products...there is no one thing good for everything. I use T-88 for structural stuff where I need open time, Z-poxy for grain filling and other situations where a thin finishing resin is required, keep some 5-minute stuff for quick fixes and "hole filling" and if I decide to do any pours, it will likely be the Total Boat product which is designs for it.

[Dave Mount]

I buy from raka.com and have been very satisfied. They have a number of different resins viscosities and hardener speeds, and their prices are good. If you call them with what you're looking for, they'll make a recommendation. Another nice thing is that they'll let you customize your kits at no extra charge. For example, if you get a 3 qt kit (2 quarts of resin and a quart of hardener), they'll let you order a pint of fast hardener and a pint of medium or slow hardener and still give the kit price discount. Allows you to adjust the set speed to your work (and temperature).

Some tips:

IMHO, the way to mix epoxy is by weight, not volume. You can get a cheap electronic scale for like $5-$10 (get one that weighs to 0.1 gram), and you can weigh your epoxy mix more accurately and more easily than you can measure it by volume, even with the pumps. Pump springs get tired or gum up, more viscous resin may not fill the pump as readily. I'm not saying pumps are bad, just that weighing is more robust (again, in my opinion). For the raka resin, the ratio is 100:43 resin:hardener. Sounds fussy but it isn't. 1 gram resin gets 0.4 gram hardener. 10 grams resin get 4.3 grams hardener. You can easily make up any quantity you want. If you don't like doing the math, make a chart. And the ratio isn't super fussy, especially if it's not a critical application in terms of strength.

Resin stored for a long time may get cloudy, which is actually the crystallization of the resin, which is apparently a supersaturated solution. If that happens, it can be recovered by heating the resin bottle in a hot water bath; at higher temperatures, the crystals will go back into solution. Unlike many things, you don't want to store epoxy resin in a place that's too cool because it encourages this crystallization. The hardener doesn't seem to share this problem.

Buy some 2 oz Dixie cups, or some plastic shot glasses (easily found for cheap on the web). Make great disposable containers for mixing small amounts of epoxy. Take some wood scraps and make yourself a cup full of tongue depressor type mixing sticks, maybe 1/16" by 3/8" by 6 inches long.

As long as you're ordering, order some wood flour (I think this is actually sanding dust from oak, going by the color and smell). Works great as a filler when you want to make more of a putty than just clear resin. Even when you're gluing wood with epoxy, a little bit of filler is useful to get a good consistency that will stay on the work, and as a bonus it stretches the epoxy. For decorative fills, the sky is the limit. I often use ground coffee with filling voids in wood (most often bowls, but cracks in knots, pitch pockets, etc too).

Epoxy is great stuff, lots of creative things you can do with it. I always keep it on hand.

Best,

Dave

[andy bessette]

...there is no one thing good for everything...

I hate to admit it, but.....you're right. :)

[lowell holmes]

You can buy small containers of epoxy adhesive at Home Depot and Lowes.
That's where I normally buy it.

[Jim Becker]

I hate to admit it, but.....you're right. :)

Sometimes a very general statement actually hits the mark. LOL :D

[Jim Becker]

You can buy small containers of epoxy adhesive at Home Depot and Lowes.

Yes, you can. But what they sell is somewhat generally aimed at quick-fixit stuff that homeowners might be faced with. Woodworking has a substantially larger variety of situations where a "made for the purpose" epoxy or resin is a better choice based on the actual characteristics needed for a particular job. That's why the "big names" like West Systems and System 3 have so many different formulas.

[Matthew Curtis]

So no reccomendations on a good all purpose epoxy? Would having two different hardeners available make sense?

[andy bessette]

So no reccomendations on a good all purpose epoxy? Would having two different hardeners available make sense?

Get the WEST epoxy 105 resin and 206 hardener for just about everything. To make glue and fill gaps, add colloidal silica and microfibers. To make fairing compound add microballoons and colloidal silica. Where you need extremely fast repairs, use minute epoxy. Pick up the book "The Gougeon Brothers on Boat Building". Read it and practice for decades and become an expert like me. ;)

[Erik Loza]

One of my colleagues just did some slab work and went with Ecopoxy. Good results, no complaints. I believe he said it was a tad cheaper than West but as others have said, good epoxy is not cheap to begin with. Hope this helps.

Erik

[lowell holmes]

Titebond III Ultimate is waterproof exterior/interior is available at Lowes or Home Depot and I have a 16 ounce bottle of it. You have to clamp it for a minimum of 30 minutes, longer is better. I have never had a failure, and a bottle lasts me for a long time.
I have also bought epoxy at both stores. If I had a large job, I would buy it in larger quantities.

That having been said, I sometimes will nail would together and glue it as well. I have glued and screwed drawers if they are exposed to weather.

[Stephen Rosenthal]

+1 on Dave Mount’s advice. Call Raka. You’ll actually speak with a knowledgeable human. I stumbled upon them after watching a few YouTube videos in which everyone was using West Systems. At the time I knew nothing about epoxies. I went to a nearby West Marine boat supply (no connection but they stock West Systems), but the clerks knew virtually nothing about woodworking applications. So just out of curiosity I did an Internet search for alternatives and clicked on the Raka link. Their products are top notch and, while not cheap, competitively priced. And Dave’s tip on weighing it is spot on - minimal to no waste.

[Jim Becker]

Titebond III Ultimate is waterproof exterior/interior is available at Lowes or Home Depot and I have a 16 ounce bottle of it.

TB-III is a great product, but it's not epoxy which is what the OP is asking about.

[Mark Hockenberg]

I just made my first attempt using Alumilite casting resin to fill some small voids. I was very happy with the results.

However, it sounds like I need to look at West and Raka. I also like the sound of how the wood flour works.

[johnny means]

We use a lot of epoxy. My go to is West with Fast hardener. It gives plenty of open time for complex glue ups ad laminations. It's viscous and slow setting enough to get deep penetration into tight cracks and voids. You do need to build deeper pours in multiple layer because it overheats easily, and it's long open time mean epoxy is always a last task of the day activity. There are trade offs, but I can't think of any situation in which I could make West work.

[bill epstein]

Seems to me the OP is asking for occasional and general purpose use, not wood specific or for large projects like rivers. That's me and I buy the 1/2 pint kits of System 3 for about $ 25.

For filling small gnots, gluing oily tropicals, or joining panels for invisible book matching it's perfect.

My two cents on Titebond III: it's a blade killer.

[Zachary Hoyt]

I use Raka too, they were recommended to me by my canoe building online mentor. It lasts a long time on the shelf, and I've used it for other things besides canoes. At the time I was buying they were substantially cheaper than West System.

[Wes Grass]

Another 'reasonable' priced product is MAS. Used a lot of it on composites. Probably only available mail order, and in larger containers. They also have a variety of hardeners.

Weighing it is a good idea. The other advice I've seen, for any brand, is to mix it well (stir, don't whip), pour it into a clean cup along with what you can scrape off the walls, and stir it some more with a clean stick. Probably not very useful for small batches though.

We had estimates of how much to use per sq-ft of cloth, but it surprised me how much Baltic Birch ply would absorb when we were using it in a layup to add compression strength. Those were the first parts I would wet out, and go over again before stacking and bagging.

[Matthew Curtis]

Seems to me the OP is asking for occasional and general purpose use, not wood specific or for large projects like rivers. That's me and I buy the 1/2 pint kits of System 3 for about $ 25.

For filling small gnots, gluing oily tropicals, or joining panels for invisible book matching it's perfect.

My two cents on Titebond III: it's a blade killer.

My uses would be wood specific. And yes small occasional projects.

[Kevin Jenness]

Most of the major vendors have similar general purpose formulations. Fast hardener will work for small projects, slow hardener is useful for larger or more complicated tasks especially in warm weather. If you want to support a vendor that has a serious ongoing r&d program and phone tech support Gougeon Brothers is a good bet.

A few things to consider:

Epoxy bonds better to rough (sawn or sanded) surfaces than smooth. Gougeon Bros. (WEST system) recommends sanding @ 80#.

Epoxy cures via an exothermic reaction. Large or concentrated mixes can get hot and kick off in a hurry. To extend pot life, mix your epoxy in a tub, then pour it out into a flat pan like a roller tray. In hot weather you can surround the tray with ice. Don't mix more than you can spread within the anticipated pot life.

Most general purpose epoxies entrain air when mixed, and air bubbles slowly rise to the surface leaving unwanted voids. Where possible, tape over the finished side, turn the workpiece over and fill from the back (top) side. You can also dam and overfill from the face side.

Uncured epoxy can be cleaned up with vinegar, denatured alcohol and acetone. Squeezeout tends to soak in and show up under finish unless vigorously diluted and scrubbed. Often it is best to prefinish or wax parts to be joined then pop the squeezeout off after curing.

[Randy Heinemann]

I used epoxy for the first time to fill in checks in a slab table top project I'm working on. I ended up buying System 3 from Woodcraft; the slower drying version of System 3. I was able to buy a pint of the hardener and a quart of the other part, but the total cost was still about $55 and I have quite a bit left because I tried to mix up the minimum I needed for the fills.

I had great success with it, but I'm sure that most epoxies with the same hardening time work about the same and would have yielded about the same result for me. I'm also sure that you can buy epoxy cheaper than I did, but I didn't want a large quantity (in fact I hope I can use it up before the end of it's shelf life) and I found a Woodcraft in-store staff person who was knowledgeable at the level of expertise I needed, so I just bought it so that I could move forward.

The summary is that it worked great for my use. It was relatively easy to use. I didn't have to buy a huge quantity. Overall, I found nothing to be dissatisfied with for my purposes except I wish I had bought a faster setting version. I was just afraid I wouldn't get the job done in a short time period given I have never used epoxy before.

[Mark W Pugh]

I have West System 3, with fillers, make a great adhesive.

For filling, Total Boat, hands down. Their High Performance product is low VOC, flows well, bubbles just come out easily. You can add fillers for an adhesive application. They have a penetrating epoxy that works great. Customer support, excellent. No, I have no stock in the company. I am not an expert, but for me, my go to epoxy for now.

[Alan Schwabacher]

I would agree that you can use various fillers to make a basic epoxy serve in avariety of roles. The great variety now available is partly because people don't like mixing things precisely, and partly because the epoxy companies can do a very good job of formulation.

I have used many different types of System Three epoxy (5 on my last canoe alone). A couple of decades ago I found their free epoxy book, which I was amazed to discover had accurate information about chemistry, something I had not previously encountered in a commercial product aimed at the general public. I have used many gallons of several different types of their epoxy since then. It turns out West also has good information.

If you get the System Three resin with fast and slow hardeners, and a few fillers (silica, microfibers, microballons, and wood flour) you can do an awful lot of things with it. But you may not need to do all those things, so start by reading the System Three and West documents, and get what it takes to do the things you want to do.

Just make sure to measure carefully and mix thoroughly.

[lowell holmes]

Like I said, you can buy small amounts at Home Depot and Lowes for a few dollars. I suggest you try theirs, see if it is what you want, and you have not broken the bank.

[Mike Henderson]

I use West Systems but also use those syringe type epoxy dispensers that you get from the Borg. It's more expensive but more convenient for small jobs.

The Borg epoxy us plenty strong for most applications.

Mike

[Jim Andrew]

Does anyone use fiberglass resin? Walmart used to sell it by the gallon. Uses hardener, and smells the same as bondo, so expect it is the glue basis of bondo. I use bondo to fill knot holes, then just use a marker to color it before applying finish. Best wood filler I have ever found. Seems to last forever.

[Josko Catipovic]

I use WEST epoxy for everything (that I need epoxy for) and haven't found any shortcomings.

[Jim Becker]

Jim, there are multiple kinds of resins used in two part formulas, depending on what the purpose is and also related to things like "pour depth" because curing is exothermic and the material can get REALLY hot. The products designed for really deep pours in one shot have incredibly long cure times...as much as 72 hours...because of this to minimize heat. Resins for fiberglass work also have variable qualities depending on the purpose from building to finishing, etc. They can certainly be used in alternative situations, but their properties for curing have to be taken into consideration.

[andy bessette]

Also polyester resins aren't worth a darn as wood glue.

[Jon Snider]

My choice is different from those above, although I’ve used nearly all of those products. Having built several kayaks, and now building whitewater dories, ive been extremely happy with Resin Research, specifically the 2040 resin and fast hardener. Unlike most other epoxies, and ALL polyester products, there’s essentially no smell. Very low VOC’s. Great strength, I should know since I did an unplanned test with my last dory on the Green River!

For smaller work, I’ve been very happy with G-Flex from West. Comes in different sized two part tubes.

[Dan Gaylin]

Wondering how you know what the final “cure” will be. I’ve worked with all kinds of epoxies for repairs and have had good experience. But the other day I had made some decorative ridges in a bowl I was turning. My plan was to use T88 expoxy tinted black to fill the ridges. It worked fine but the end result was both a bit rubbery and also shiny and was hoping for hard and matte.... is it a matter of experimentation?

[Jim Becker]

T88 is a structural epoxy adhesive. Best results for filling/inlay will come from a casting resin, but the epoxy will generally work fine for smaller stuff. The "rubbery" feel may be a result of not nailing the ratio, an effect of whatever you tinted it with, or the nature of the particular epoxy resin. You'll always get shiny after it cures until you work it to something with less sheen if that's what you prefer. Matte takes work just as polishing up to a full gloss after sanding/scraping does.

[Dan Gaylin]

Thanks Jim. That's helpful. I've seen that some people also use artistic epoxy putty for this purpose.

[lowell holmes]

I know he was asking about epoxy, but if he is in a bind, he might experiment and see if it will do the job. I experiment and sometimes am happy I did.