Harbor Freight Dust Collector circuit pops

[Craig Andresen]

I added a dedicated 20 amp circuit after picking up a used HF DC. I installed an upgraded impeller from Rikon so I know power draw will be a bit more than stock, but many on the web have done this same upgrade. Unit runs totally fine EXCEPT if I turn it off, let it spin almost all the way down, and turn back on before it has totally stopped spinning. Blows the 20a breaker. If I turn it off and then back on while it’s still spinning pretty fast, it kicks back on with no problem. Any idea what I can try to fix this? I wear ear protection with music and won’t typically be able to hear that this thing is all the way stopped before turning back on and it takes forever to spin down.

Of course I just spent the last 3 weeks installing this and all the piping. Tons of work so I just want it to work!!

Craig

[Ron Selzer]

"EXCEPT if I turn it off, let it spin almost all the way down, and turn back on before it has totally stopped spinning. Blows the 20a breaker. "
think the centrifugal switch is not engaging until the motor stops, as long as the fan is wound up the motor can speed back up quick enough not to trip the breaker. Could try opening the motor up and cleaning/lubing the centrifugal switch. Could try changing the capacitors also however don't think you will gain much.
Best choice probably would be to keep the dust collector running when you are needing it more than 6 starts a hour. My dust collector is set up to automatically turn on when stationary tools are turned on also have a switch to turn it on and use the switch when going from machine to machine.
this keeps the dust collectors from starting too often.

good luck
Ron

[Craig Andresen]

"EXCEPT if I turn it off, let it spin almost all the way down, and turn back on before it has totally stopped spinning. Blows the 20a breaker. "
think the centrifugal switch is not engaging until the motor stops, as long as the fan is wound up the motor can speed back up quick enough not to trip the breaker. Could try opening the motor up and cleaning/lubing the centrifugal switch. Could try changing the capacitors also however don't think you will gain much.
Best choice probably would be to keep the dust collector running when you are needing it more than 6 starts a hour. My dust collector is set up to automatically turn on when stationary tools are turned on also have a switch to turn it on and use the switch when going from machine to machine.
this keeps the dust collectors from starting too often.

good luck
Ron

Ok interesting. Thanks. I have this thing wall mounted up next to my garage door rails and it would be a total bear to take down. Any tips to finding and lubing the centrifugal switch should I decide to do that? I guess this is what I get buying a used unit thinking that these motors are indestructible.

[sean meltvedt]

Craig, just keep it running while your in the shop, no need to shut it off. If your worried about electric use, just be sure to close all the blast gates.
Cheers
Sean

[Craig Andresen]

Ok thanks Sean. I was hoping to keep the noise down a bit for my family (this is in the 3rd stall in my garage) but can keep it running when I know I’ll be bouncing from machine to machine. Seems like an odd problem though that I shouldn’t have to worry about, no? Or totally normal?

I’ve also read to keep at least one blast gate open while the DC is running. Is that correct? If that’s the case, jumping from machine to machine becomes a lot more difficult (open 2nd machine‘a blast gate, go back and close first one).

[David L Morse]

That issue may have more to do with your breaker than the motor. The Rikon fan has a lot more inertia than the OEM fan and so it takes longer for the motor to reach full speed. The thermal trip part of your breaker has to withstand about 70A for 3 seconds or so. That's right on the edge of the tolerance band for some breakers. After running the DC for some time the thermal trip has already been "warmed up" and will trip sooner than it does from a cold start.

Closing all blast gates will reduce the start time by about 15% compared to an open fan inlet and make it easier on the breaker.

All blast gates should be closed when idling. This reduces current and so reduces motor temperature. Lower temperature means longer motor life.

Of course it might a sticky centrifugal switch, as others have mentioned.

[Ron Selzer]

David stated it a lot better than I did.
You stated you added a dedicated circuit for this dust collector, if it is 12 gauge or heavier copper wire then you could try a 25 amp circuit breaker to see if this eliminates the problem.Not the first choice of solutions however sometimes when dealing with fans that take time to come up to speed due to heavy rotating mass you have to upsize the breakers or fuses. Try the blast gates closed first or preferably let the dust collector run when multiple start/stops in a hour.
Good luck
Ron

[Bill Dufour]

Voltage? extra words to make it count

[Craig Andresen]

Voltage? extra words to make it count

Sorry, the HF unit runs on 120v.

[Craig Andresen]

That issue may have more to do with your breaker than the motor. The Rikon fan has a lot more inertia than the OEM fan and so it takes longer for the motor to reach full speed. The thermal trip part of your breaker has to withstand about 70A for 3 seconds or so. That's right on the edge of the tolerance band for some breakers. After running the DC for some time the thermal trip has already been "warmed up" and will trip sooner than it does from a cold start.

Closing all blast gates will reduce the start time by about 15% compared to an open fan inlet and make it easier on the breaker.

All blast gates should be closed when idling. This reduces current and so reduces motor temperature. Lower temperature means longer motor life.

Of course it might a sticky centrifugal switch, as others have mentioned.

Thanks, that’s really helpful info about closing the blast gates and goes against what I intuitively thought (I’m used to my shop vac screaming at me when it gets clogged, and figured this would be similar with my first dust collector). Perhaps what I read about keeping at least 1 blast gate open was for people that use cheaper 30ga pipe or something. Mine is all 26ga so it’s solid.

[Craig Andresen]

David stated it a lot better than I did.
You stated you added a dedicated circuit for this dust collector, if it is 12 gauge or heavier copper wire then you could try a 25 amp circuit breaker to see if this eliminates the problem.Not the first choice of solutions however sometimes when dealing with fans that take time to come up to speed due to heavy rotating mass you have to upsize the breakers or fuses. Try the blast gates closed first or preferably let the dust collector run when multiple start/stops in a hour.
Good luck
Ron

Interesting, ok. I did run 12ga copper wire and thought about that potential solution but thought I may have to run new 10ga to do that. You think the 12ga would be ok do ya? Another situation is I have a dual 20a breaker (I added two new circuits in one slot). I have seen dual breakers with a 25 and a 20 so that may actually be a pretty simple solution if I can find one that fits my panel. Ultimately I probably just need to see how this situation impacts my workflow and see if the inability to restart it until the fan stops spinning causes me a lot of lost time if I turn it off but then decide I need to use another tool quickly. When I put these types of things together I want them to work without any potential issues so part of me wants to just go pick up a new unit at Harbor Freight and replace the motor in my setup (although I don’t even know if that would help!)

[Bill Dufour]

AFAIK #12 copper is 20 amp max breaker size. I would guess a dc is rated as a continuous load so no creativity on the ampacity is allowed. If the FLA is over 16 you are asking too much from a 20 amp breaker.
Personally 20 amps is too low for 120 volts. Can you switch motor to 240?
What is the FLA on the motor label?
Bil lD.

[David L Morse]

What is the FLA on the motor label?
Bil lD.

There's no label. See this post (https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?269876-Hfdc-fla&highlight=hfdc+fla) for more information.

[Ron Selzer]

"so part of me wants to just go pick up a new unit at Harbor Freight and replace the motor in my setup (although I don’t even know if that would help!)"
probably won't help much if any
back in the late 70's was working in an old apartment building that had knob and tube wiring, 12 gauge copper fused at 60 amps with no visible signs of damage to it. I don't recommend this and would not do this. However 25 amp breaker, 12 gauge copper wire and dedicated outlet I feel would work good. The load is only there for a brief time while the motor is spinning that heavy impeller up to speed. The wire can take the load.
Good luck
Ron

[Ron Selzer]

Thank you for the information definitely informative.

[Craig Andresen]

There's no label. See this post (https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?269876-Hfdc-fla&highlight=hfdc+fla) for more information.

Mine actually does have a label on it. I don’t see how to add a pic here but the label says:

Central Machinery model #45378 Dust Collector 70g, 2hp
Motor: 2hp, 20 amps peak, single phase 60 Hz, 110V
RPMs: 3450
Power Cord: 5 1/2 feet, 16AWG x 3C Gauge

[Steve Fish]

I found the following info with google. I’m curious if the impeller upgrade is causing an too much draw on startup.
https://manuals.harborfreight.com/manuals/97000-97999/97869.pdf

does not appear to be another wiring option aside from the 120
430068
I am curious if you upsized the intake pipe as well

[Steve Fish]

Whoops, I did not see page two Craig. You’re one step ahead

[Jim Dwight]

I have the 2hp HF wall mounted above a super dust deputy and discharging outside. I am using the original impeller (but am thinking of upgrading to the Rikon). I have had no breaker trips and sometimes turn it on and off without it spinning down in between. I would try another breaker, as has been mentioned. If that didn't solve it, I might try going back to the stock impeller. While I wouldn't turn down a little more, my airflow isn't bad.

[Craig Andresen]

I found the following info with google. I’m curious if the impeller upgrade is causing an too much draw on startup.
https://manuals.harborfreight.com/manuals/97000-97999/97869.pdf

does not appear to be another wiring option aside from the 120
430068
I am curious if you upsized the intake pipe as well

The new impeller is definitely bigger and heavier and many YouTube videos I’ve watched have documented the additional current draw (and additional performance!). I have not heard of issues like I’ve had though and I would bet most of those you tubers are using 20a outlets, but then again maybe some folks just don’t shut it down and start it up again like I did.

I did upsize the intake. I’m using a super dust deputy which has a 6” outlet on top, so I cut out the old DC intake flange and added a 6” take off. I also matched the dust deputy inlet by using 5” pipe, which necks down to 4” only at the drops to my different machines. It’s a good setup and while I’ve barely had a chance to use it, it can definitely suck some air! I’m exhausting into a 13” diameter Wynn filter with a homemade box under it with a door for emptying if necessary.

[Craig Andresen]

I have the 2hp HF wall mounted above a super dust deputy and discharging outside. I am using the original impeller (but am thinking of upgrading to the Rikon). I have had no breaker trips and sometimes turn it on and off without it spinning down in between. I would try another breaker, as has been mentioned. If that didn't solve it, I might try going back to the stock impeller. While I wouldn't turn down a little more, my airflow isn't bad.

That is really good info that you don’t have the tripping problem. I’m starting to wonder if the centrifugal switch is bad on my unit. I did buy it used for only like $30 :-) and it’s definitely seen some use. But like I said, it starts up just fine from a standstill and seems to run strong, albeit with an occasional squeal here and there that don’t seem to be a big deal.

In terms of another breaker, do you mean upsizing it to 25a with the same wiring? I checked and the dual breaker in single slot style I used to add two 20a circuits (one dedicated to the DC) just seems to come in a 20/30 combo. Rewiring with 10ga wire is not an easy task at this point. I could potentially swap the dual 20/20 for a single 20 and single 25 (for the DC), which would force me to convert a couple other breakers into a dual due to no more space in my panel!

[Ron Selzer]

That is really good info that you don’t have the tripping problem. I’m starting to wonder if the centrifugal switch is bad on my unit. I did buy it used for only like $30 :-) and it’s definitely seen some use. But like I said, it starts up just fine from a standstill and seems to run strong, albeit with an occasional squeal here and there that don’t seem to be a big deal.

In terms of another breaker, do you mean upsizing it to 25a with the same wiring? I checked and the dual breaker in single slot style I used to add two 20a circuits (one dedicated to the DC) just seems to come in a 20/30 combo. Rewiring with 10ga wire is not an easy task at this point. I could potentially swap the dual 20/20 for a single 20 and single 25 (for the DC), which would force me to convert a couple other breakers into a dual due to no more space in my panel!


I would not go up to a 30 amp breaker on 12 gauge wire. I personally would have no problem with a 25 amp breaker on a 12 gauge wire DEDICATED circuit for a motor that acts like yours is. Probably best solution is to get some amp readings on it so you are not guessing an know exactly what is going on.
This might help if you don't have an clamp on amp meter, I have not used it before always use a meter.
Good luck
Ron
https://www.ebay.com/itm/100A-AC-Digital-Power-KWh-Watt-Meter-Volt-Amp-Voltmeter-Ammeter-Open-Close-CT/383421695588?_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SI M%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D225074%26meid%3D7cd2258bae3e4db 2a30f6ea870727c0b%26pid%3D100677%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D 30%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D153323562137%26itm%3D383421 695588%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2386202%26algv%3 DSimplAMLv5PairwiseWeb&_trksid=p2386202.c100677.m4598

[Craig Andresen]

So today I opened the motor up as far as I could without taking piping off and removing this beast from the wall (which isn’t much). Wiring in the switch looks good, the capacitor looks fine, and while I was able to remove the metal fan cover, I couldn’t get the plastic fan to slide off the shaft to look at the centrifugal switch which I think is under that side.

Long story short, I saw no visible issues so got to work making some last adapters for piping up some of my tools. When I switched the DC on, the breaker now blew immediately! I reset it and tried again and it kicked in and ran fine. Turned it off a bit later and did some other things and came back and tried to use it again and the breaker blew immediately again! Something clearly is not right as this has gotten worse. There’s far too many people that have used the Rikon impeller for it to be just related to that.

I found good directions for checking the Cap so I’ll try that tomorrow. I’m wondering if that’s the culprit now. If not, I’ll keep trying. Lemme know if anyone has any ideas based on the new issues.

[David L Morse]

...Motor: 2hp, 20 amps peak,...

Wow, PEAK. So HF is now rating their dust collector like a shopvac or router. It's certainly possible to make it draw 20A with the 12" fan. Just do this:

430112

That's ten feet of six inch test pipe with a bell mouth entrance on the inlet. In that configuration the fan moves over 1100CFM and the motor draws a bit over 20A. It won't do that for very long. Maybe an hour until the motor smokes?


... dual breaker in single slot style I used to add two 20a circuits (one dedicated to the DC)...

I wonder if tandem breakers have the same time delay curves as full size. It might be worth trying a single breaker.

I didn't post this before because it's a bit obtuse but I'll try to clear up what I can:

https://sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=430113&d=1586686335

This is part of the trip curve for a SquareD QO series breaker, the type I use. The horizontal axis represents a multiple of the rated trip current. That is, for a 20A breaker, "1" means 20A, "2" means 40A, etc. The breaker will trip for time and current values to the right of the Grey zone and hold for values to the left. The Grey zone is the tolerance range over age, temperature, and manufacturing variations.

I added my measured time/current values. The Red ones are for starting the motor with everything open. Green is for sealed. Any realistic situation will fall between these extremes.

I also tested the effect of extension cords. Unlike a running motor the start current will decrease with additional voltage loss. The highest values are for no extension cord.

The point of this is that it's only a matter of luck that I can start this fan without tripping the breaker.

[Bobby Robbinett]

So today I opened the motor up as far as I could without taking piping off and removing this beast from the wall (which isn’t much). Wiring in the switch looks good, the capacitor looks fine, and while I was able to remove the metal fan cover, I couldn’t get the plastic fan to slide off the shaft to look at the centrifugal switch which I think is under that side.

Long story short, I saw no visible issues so got to work making some last adapters for piping up some of my tools. When I switched the DC on, the breaker now blew immediately! I reset it and tried again and it kicked in and ran fine. Turned it off a bit later and did some other things and came back and tried to use it again and the breaker blew immediately again! Something clearly is not right as this has gotten worse. There’s far too many people that have used the Rikon impeller for it to be just related to that.

I found good directions for checking the Cap so I’ll try that tomorrow. I’m wondering if that’s the culprit now. If not, I’ll keep trying. Lemme know if anyone has any ideas based on the new issues.

I would almost bet money that it is the centrifugal switch. I have a couple of the HF 2hp dust collectors and both had times when the centrifugal switches needed adjusting. See if there is an electric motor shop in your area and pull the motor and take it to them to test it out. I think that my local shop charged me something like $40 to redo the centrifugal switch. Have you tried using a new double pole 20amp or a new double pole 25amp breaker? That might be your problem there. I have been considering upgrading my HF dust collectors with the Rikon impeller. Just not sure that the performance upgrade is worth the time and money. It might be, but I haven’t researched it enough to know for sure. I know that the stock filter bags drastically reduce performance after they get dirty but instead of a Wynn style cartridge filter I plan to vent mine outside as that is even better than a cartridge filter when it comes to performance.

[Ron Selzer]

With the breaker tripping immediately like that sure seems like the centrifugal switch is hanging open. Try changing the capacitor 1st just because of all the additional work to get the motor down. Might get lucky but don't think so
Good luck
Ron

[David L Morse]

With the breaker tripping immediately like that sure seems like the centrifugal switch is hanging open.

If Craig really means immediately, as in instantaneous, then I think there's a bigger problem than just the starting components. If the centrifugal switch sticks open the locked rotor current is less than with it properly closed. At the lower current level the breaker should hold for an even longer time before tripping. More than three seconds for sure since it can, sometimes at least, hold that at full LRC.

If the breaker is tripping instantly the current is high enough to activate the magnetic trip function. That usually requires about ten times the rated current, or in this case about 200A.

[Bill Dufour]

20FLA is how I read peak amps. 1.25 times 20 amps =25 amp breaker minuiumum size. You need to upgrade to a 30 amp breaker and wiring. I do not think you will be able to find a 25 amp breaker or 25 amp wire so just step up to 30 amp which is a common size.
Or switch the motor to 240 volts and amps will drop to 10. 1.25 times 10amps is 12.5 amps so a 20 amp breaker will be fine.
Bil lD

[Craig Andresen]

A couple of updates today:
1) The dust collector wouldn't even turn on today. Just blows the breaker immediately upon switching it on. As I mentioned above, yesterday it would blow at first attempt and then start up at the 2nd attempt after resetting the breaker. No such luck today, but it seems like further evidence of a motor issue.
2) I tested the capacitor using the method described at about the 2:45 mark of this video from Grizzly (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-j6PhthXJY&t=193s). Rather than the Ohm reading continuing to climb, mine slowly climbed to just 2.5 ohms and stopped. I think that tells me that I have a bad capacitor. Based on that, I cut one of the wires and tested it disconnected per the instructions at 4:45 of this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpUs1MTL0Jc&t=817s) testing capacitance directly, and get no reading. Of course, based on the info towards the end of the Grizzly video, the reason I have a bad cap could be because I have an issue with the centrifugal switch and thus replacing the cap could mean I just ruin another cap. I think I'm going to try it though if I can find one I can get pretty quickly on Amazon.

[Craig Andresen]

If Craig really means immediately, as in instantaneous, then I think there's a bigger problem than just the starting components. If the centrifugal switch sticks open the locked rotor current is less than with it properly closed. At the lower current level the breaker should hold for an even longer time before tripping. More than three seconds for sure since it can, sometimes at least, hold that at full LRC.

If the breaker is tripping instantly the current is high enough to activate the magnetic trip function. That usually requires about ten times the rated current, or in this case about 200A.

It's instantaneous. I flip the switch and the breaker pops.

[Craig Andresen]

20FLA is how I read peak amps. 1.25 times 20 amps =25 amp breaker minuiumum size. You need to upgrade to a 30 amp breaker and wiring. I do not think you will be able to find a 25 amp breaker or 25 amp wire so just step up to 30 amp which is a common size.
Or switch the motor to 240 volts and amps will drop to 10. 1.25 times 10amps is 12.5 amps so a 20 amp breaker will be fine.
Bil lD

It does seem like your calculations make sense, but I don't trust the "20amp peak" on the HF unit. Also, others I've seen on the web with the same Rikon impellor I'm using have measured the current draw (unfortunately I don't have the tool to do so). One guy over on Lumberjocks measured an increase from 9a to 10a during run and got about 25a during startup (and specifically noted he'd never blown his 20a dedicated breaker). See post 39 here (https://www.lumberjocks.com/topics/48783).

This one (https://www.woodtalkonline.com/topic/23656-harbor-freight-rikonstein-dc/) is a bit different, but he ends up with:

Before: Startup amps, 14.27 Running 10.17 After: Startup 18.7, Running 12.7
Like I said in my previous post, it looks like I have at least a capacitor issue, possibly more, so I'm going to hold tight on any electrical changes as there's just too many examples of people with a similar setup as me without issues.

FYI, the HF DC cannot be wired for 240V.

[Jim Dwight]

When I said I would try another breaker I meant another 20A breaker. I guess "cheating" up to a 25A wouldn't be terrible but breakers really should match the wiring. That way they won't overheat and burn the house down.

I also increased the size of the blower inlet to 6 inch and use 5 inch snap lock pipe (from HD, not the thin stuff the local Lowe's had) and my discharge to the outside is 6 inch.

My experience with bad breakers is with old ones but I wouldn't be surprised to have a new one be bad sometime. I have a circuit I rarely use that the breaker trips with no load in the circuit. I need to replace it (and if the new one trips, I will have to figure out what is wrong in the circuit). I like replacing the breaker because having a spare breaker is a good thing anyway.

[Craig Andresen]

When I said I would try another breaker I meant another 20A breaker. I guess "cheating" up to a 25A wouldn't be terrible but breakers really should match the wiring. That way they won't overheat and burn the house down.

I also increased the size of the blower inlet to 6 inch and use 5 inch snap lock pipe (from HD, not the thin stuff the local Lowe's had) and my discharge to the outside is 6 inch.

My experience with bad breakers is with old ones but I wouldn't be surprised to have a new one be bad sometime. I have a circuit I rarely use that the breaker trips with no load in the circuit. I need to replace it (and if the new one trips, I will have to figure out what is wrong in the circuit). I like replacing the breaker because having a spare breaker is a good thing anyway.

Understood, Jim. I can try plugging it into my other new 20a circuit and see what happens. Could be a bad breaker, although brand new. I think the tests on the capacitor show that I at least have a problem there so I have one of those on order. Will try the other circuit tomorrow. Only difference is I will have to use an extension cord.

[Craig Andresen]

Understood, Jim. I can try plugging it into my other new 20a circuit and see what happens. Could be a bad breaker, although brand new. I think the tests on the capacitor show that I at least have a problem there so I have one of those on order. Will try the other circuit tomorrow. Only difference is I will have to use an extension cord.

Well I think I had a double whammy with a bad capacitor as well as a potentially bad breaker. Just my luck. For those that have been following along, here's the latest:

1) I got a new capacitor from Amazon for $7 and installed it yesterday to replace the old one that showed issues on the old used DC I bought. Here's the one I ordered (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IWYFSOE/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1).
2) Testing. I could not turn on my DC at all prior to installing the new Cap. After installing, it fired right up no problem. Turned it off, turned it back on, all good. I did my previous test where I turned it off and then back on before the fan stopped spinning down. While spinning fairly fast, it kicked back on. While almost stopped, it still blew my breaker when trying to turn back on. That's OK I thought, I'll just leave it on rather than turn it off and on when I know I'll need it again before too long. I reset the breaker, and came back 30 minutes later and tried to start it up again and it blew the breaker again!! That was a deal breaker so at this point I was super frustrated!
3) Now that I had a new capacitor in place, but still having electrical problems, I got out an extension cord and plugged into my 2nd new 20a circuit (which I plan to use for my tablesaw, bandsaw, etc, since I ran outlets by those machines on that circuit). With an extension cord to that circuit, the DC ran without any problems and I couldn't get the breaker to blow no matter what I did, including turning it back on while it was still slowly spinning down (which it does for a long, long while!). The initial dedicated outlet tests fine with my outlet tester, so I'm thinking I have a bad breaker even though it is brand new. I'm going to swap it out and see if that finally solves all of my problems!

Because the DC works fine on the 2nd outlet, I do not think I have a bad centrifugal switch at this point. So good news is I shouldn't have to take my DC down and get it repaired or replaced, but the issues aren't quite fully resolved yet.

Thanks for all the help and advice, everyone!

[Jim Dwight]

I'm glad you got it working.

[Craig Andresen]

I'm glad you got it working.

Thanks Jim.

Final update if anyone is curious - I finally changed out the new breaker today. No problems at all with the new one in place! Goes to show you that brand new breakers can have problems too!

[Ryan Yeaglin]

Craig, new breakes can be bad for sure. My house was built in the early 70s and I have a Zinnsco panel, which I was told I should replace... So I wanted to run a sub panel to the basement for my shop. I got a 2-pole 60A breaker from Amazon (there is only one company that makes replacement breakers for Zinnsco). I hooked up (2) 20A 110V outlets and (1) 20A 230V outlet. After I got done I checked everything with a multi-meter, one of the 110v outlets was good, the other didn't have current, and I only had 110V at the 230V outlet. So one of the 110v legs from the breaker in the garage didn't work. I ended up getting the same brand breaker this time from a local electrical supply house for twice what I paid on Amazon, but it worked.

[Craig Andresen]

Craig, new breakes can be bad for sure. My house was built in the early 70s and I have a Zinnsco panel, which I was told I should replace... So I wanted to run a sub panel to the basement for my shop. I got a 2-pole 60A breaker from Amazon (there is only one company that makes replacement breakers for Zinnsco). I hooked up (2) 20A 110V outlets and (1) 20A 230V outlet. After I got done I checked everything with a multi-meter, one of the 110v outlets was good, the other didn't have current, and I only had 110V at the 230V outlet. So one of the 110v legs from the breaker in the garage didn't work. I ended up getting the same brand breaker this time from a local electrical supply house for twice what I paid on Amazon, but it worked.

That’s super frustrating. I ended up wasting a lot of time and effort trying to troubleshoot. At least changing out a breaker is really easy :-).

[Bruce Lowekamp]

Final update if anyone is curious - I finally changed out the new breaker today. No problems at all with the new one in place! Goes to show you that brand new breakers can have problems too!

Glad you got it figured out.


My house was built in the early 70s and I have a Zinnsco panel, which I was told I should replace...

The house my parents bought in 87 had a Zinsco panel. The panel was behind a kitchen cabinet, so it would have been a PITA to get to if a breaker had tripped. But they didn't trip; short circuits just continued to arc until something melted. Replaced it after a couple of years.

Bruce

[Peter Kelly]

Thanks Jim.

Final update if anyone is curious - I finally changed out the new breaker today. No problems at all with the new one in place! Goes to show you that brand new breakers can have problems too!Been going through the exact same issue recently, seems that the HF blower does not like tandem 20a breakers. This was driving me insane and assumed I'd need to move up to a 25a but I rearranged things a bit so that particular circuit is on a dedicated 20a slot, now working fine as long as nothing else is consuming any power. Worth noting that the motor supplied with the HF unit is pretty inefficient and cannot be re-wired for 220v.


The previous owners of this house had left a 30a breaker on what had been a 14ga wired circuit :rolleyes:

[David L Morse]

Been going through the exact same issue recently, seems that the HF blower does not like tandem 20a breakers. This was driving me insane and assumed I'd need to move up to a 25a but I rearranged things a bit so that particular circuit is on a dedicated 20a slot, now working fine as long as nothing else is consuming any power. Worth noting that the motor supplied with the HF unit is pretty inefficient and cannot be re-wired for 220v.


The previous owners of this house had left a 30a breaker on what had been a 14ga wired circuit :rolleyes:

In a previous post in this thread I mentioned that I didn't know if tandem breakers had different trip characteristics. I got curious after that and looked it up. For the QO breakers I have there is a significant difference. The tandems trip sooner at moderate overloads and the magnetic trip current is much lower, 100A vs 240A for a 20A breaker.

[Peter Kelly]

Ah, ok makes sense as my load center is a QO as well.

[Camden Nettestad]

Craig -

Are you using a standard breaker (non AFCI/GFCI etc)?

I'm having problems with my harbor freight dust collector tripping my breaker, too. I ran 10 gauge wire (just in case) and am using 20 amp receptacle and 20 amp dual function (AFCI/GFCI) breaker. I've read vacuums (aka dust collectors) have internal arcing and will trip AFCI breakers.

For my testing, I plugged it into another 20 amp circuit using a 20 amp dual function (ACFI/GFCI) breaker and it tripped. Next, I plugged it into another 20 amp circuit using a standard 20 amp breaker with a GFCI receptacle in line and it does NOT trip. Therefore, I'm assuming it's due to internal motor arcing and not the circuit/wiring.

Bummer because I'd like to use the dual function breaker ($50) for safety purposes, but I can't if it's going to trip all the time.

[Bill Dufour]

What gets me is it seems like it will start up cold from a dead stop no problems. But after the motor is warmed up it does not want to restart. Normally a motor is easier to start when the bearings are warmed up.
Bil lD

[Craig Andresen]

Craig -

Are you using a standard breaker (non AFCI/GFCI etc)?

I'm having problems with my harbor freight dust collector tripping my breaker, too. I ran 10 gauge wire (just in case) and am using 20 amp receptacle and 20 amp dual function (AFCI/GFCI) breaker. I've read vacuums (aka dust collectors) have internal arcing and will trip AFCI breakers.

For my testing, I plugged it into another 20 amp circuit using a 20 amp dual function (ACFI/GFCI) breaker and it tripped. Next, I plugged it into another 20 amp circuit using a standard 20 amp breaker with a GFCI receptacle in line and it does NOT trip. Therefore, I'm assuming it's due to internal motor arcing and not the circuit/wiring.

Bummer because I'd like to use the dual function breaker ($50) for safety purposes, but I can't if it's going to trip all the time.

Sorry, didn’t get a notice about your response. Yes, just a normal dual 20/20 breaker.

[Tim Elett]

Reading this, and shopping for a dust collector, would the best advice be,shop wisely? I have had no problems with HF stuff, just pay for a warranty? I would like to add a new collection for a table saw and a 12 inch planer.

[Jim Becker]

Reading this, and shopping for a dust collector, would the best advice be,shop wisely? I have had no problems with HF stuff, just pay for a warranty? I would like to add a new collection for a table saw and a 12 inch planer.

"Shopping wisely" is always a best practice. But keep in mind that you can have an issue with any make and model machine "just because".