Shiplapped back with a bead

[Axel de Pugey]

Dear Creekers,

I am desperately looking for info on ship lap beading and my investigations are quite unsuccessful, if I missed a dedicated topic here could somebody be kind enough and provide a link?


I am using the bit of extra time I have on hands thanks to Covid19 to build a small shelf for speciality planes with leftover quartersawn pine.

I am planning to use a #50 and a #78

I have three questions so far:

Question 1: Design: Option 1, Option 2?
From what I see on the internet, there are 2 ways to do the bead, and I am a bit unsure what are the downsides of each. I did a quick photoshop:

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My feeling is option 2 is more traditional and easier to do as there is more registration for the fence at the rebate' stage.
What is your usual way of doing this joint?

Question 2: Build: Bead first, Rebate first?
Is there a specific order things should be done? To my point of view in option 2 for example, the bead should be done first, again to allow more registration of the fence, the rebate being hidden an error there is not an issue.
How do you usually proceed with this joint?

Question 3: Expansion
Is 1 or 2mm gap enough between boards to allow for expansion?

Many thanks for your input

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Axel

I have an article on shiplapping here: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/ApothecaryChestShiplappingTheBack.html

While a bead was not used - this was for the rear of a cabinet, and would not be seen - the process indicates that any beading may be done at the start. The reason for this is that the boards are fitted with a spacer.

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/ApothecaryChestShiplappingTheBack_html_m7f9124d.jp g

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/ApothecaryChestShiplappingTheBack_html_50d97b69.jp g

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/ApothecaryChestShiplappingTheBack_html_m6eb6fa60.j pg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Mark Rainey]

429306429307Axel, option 2 is better, rebate first. This thread may be of interest https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?269255-Beading&highlight=

[Mark Rainey]

Here is the random width, shiplapped & beaded backboard under construction

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[Jim Koepke]

Axel, Your bead #2 is the correct way to make the bead so as to not weaken the overlapping wood.

The Stanley #45 has a 'Beading Depth Stop' for making a bead along the edges of the tongue side of the joint:

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It would also work when putting a bead on a shiplap joint after the lap is cut.

Otherwise if one is careful cutting the lap, the bead can be cut first.

jtk

[David Eisenhauer]

Thanks for asking the question Axel and thanks for the info guys. I have some shiplap coming up and figured I'd add in some beads because I have a beading plane. I would have had the same questions as Axel.

[Axel de Pugey]

Dear all,

Many thanks for your help, I have now clearer ideas on the way I will proceed

Hi Derek, to be honnest I was musing on your website few days ago but I did not bump into this specific page. I bookmarked tons of others. So I understand from your page that the gap is 2-3mm.
As for doing the bead first otherwise it would interfere with the spacing of the boards is a bit unclear to me. Sorry for being slow. I guess I will have to do it to understand what you mean there. Thank a lot.

Hi Mark, thank you for your help. I had little doubts Option 2 would be my choice in fact, thanks for confirming. Thanks for the link as well. Mea culpa I realise I did a search on "ship lap", not on "beading", that was a wrong choice and I will do a new search then. I will dig into my stock of wooden planes but I am not sure I have even a simple edge beading one, I will look for that. The last plane posted in your thread is incredible.

Hi Jim, thank you for confirming option 2 as well. Thanks for mentioning the #45 skate, I have the same kind on my little #50. I guess that is solving the issue of fence registration once the rebate is done, the downside is you don't have the choice of distance between the bead and the rebate then, I will try this anyway.

Hi David, I am glad to read that. On the other side of the channel, would they say that I have killed two birds with one stone? ;-)


So option 2 it is, with 2-3mm gap between boards. Now the question on the order of action is not so trivial finally. Two of you are advising for rebate first and one for bead first...I will have to try both to understand the pitfall.

As I planed my boards down to 12mm thick, I would have space for a tongue and groove instead, but I never did a ship lap before so I want to try this.

Many, many thanks for your help!

[Mark Rainey]

Glad to be of help Axel. You mention the option of tongue & groove, but the advantage to the bead is that it distracts the eye from the small gap needed for expansion & contraction of the wood. I am sure Derek did not add the bead because, as he stated, it was the back of the cabinet.

[Jim Koepke]

Hi Jim, thank you for confirming option 2 as well. Thanks for mentioning the #45 skate, I have the same kind on my little #50. I guess that is solving the issue of fence registration once the rebate is done, the downside is you don't have the choice of distance between the bead and the rebate then, I will try this anyway.

Having a quirk next to the lap joint might actually increase the visual gap a bead is there to hide.

jtk

[Axel de Pugey]

Mark, Jim, Thank you both for your explanations.
Generally speaking, is a quirk a flat part?

I checked my little stock of beading planes and actually found one that looks like a ship lap beading plane...the others are normal side beading planes. The only issue is that this model is way to big for what i need to do today.

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So following your advices I will make a test this week end, rebate first, using the specific skate of the #50.

As a side note: to save space I am storing my unrestored wooden planes in wooden crates with the iron and wedge out. I noticed yesterday that for 3 or 4 of them there is no way to put the iron back in place, like the wood shrunk. My shop is not heated but the rest of the planes is fine. I don't want to force them too much, is there a way to fix this? Should I put these specific planes in a warmer environment (indirect heat) so I can place the irons back in place?

[Mark Rainey]

Axel, the quirk is the groove that is right next to the rounded bead. Jim, I am confused by your comment that the quirk may make the gap between boards look larger. The quirk is separated from the gap by the bead, so it looks like a dowel is there.

[Jim Koepke]

The edge of the bead on a lap joint should be flush with the wall of the lap/rabbet.

The quirk can come to a point or be flat bottomed. Here is a blade being worked on from an edge beading plane:

429470

The quirk is shaped to match the sole or skate of the plane. It has to be proud of the sole or skate all the way around where it is to engage the work and cut.

Here is a post on molding planes and blades > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?242156

jtk

[Axel de Pugey]

Thanks again everybody for your input.

I finished my first project made 100% without electrons today.

The ship lap went without issue thanks to your advices.
I will still keep my eyes peeled for a ship lap wooden plane, it would be better.

I learnt a lot, thank you.

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[Mark Rainey]

Well done Axel! Beaded shiplapped joints are frequently mimicked with production furniture, but they never look like the hand made versions. You did a great job!

[David Eisenhauer]

I like it Axel. Good stuff. I will copy that idea for my next cabinet back.

[Mel Fulks]

I prefer the point , as that is how the old ones were done.

[Jim Koepke]

Well done.

jtk

[Axel de Pugey]

Mark, David and Jim, many thanks for the nice words!

[Mike Allen1010]

Nicely done Axel. As to spacing for expansion it of course depends on the species of wood and your environment. Here in So. Cal. where humidity swings aren't that big, I use dime in the summer and quarter in the winter. Double that for wider dimensions.

Cheers, Mike

[Axel de Pugey]

Hi Mike, thank you for sharing your tip. I understand you use your local coins, I chose 2mm myself.
I used wood I normally don’t use and I am not really planing of buying more of this. We have an unusually dry and warm spring here and as this shelf is located by my bench I will be able to monitor the seasonal changes.

You are right mentioning the species, I am sure the milling comes into play as well.
I normally only use quarter sawn oak and walnut that I mill myself. This here was crappy construction pine leftover from a garden shed but I am confident this test will still give me an idea on how to plan for the next ship lap I build.

Thank you for your help.

[Jim Koepke]

I understand you use your local coins, I chose 2mm myself.

A US Dime is 1.35mm. A US Quarter is 1.75mm.

A little further information for those who like to use common objects for measuring, a US Cent is 3/4" or 19.05mm and a US Nickel weighs exactly 5 grams.

jtk