Casolin shapers?

[Jared Sankovich]

Anyone have any first hand experience with these? Info is severely lacking on the web.

[Jared Sankovich]

Anyone have any first hand experience with these? Info is severely lacking on the web.

Well I guess I have first hand experience now.. I will say it's a heavy pig at 850kg

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Interestingly the machine plate calls out 9hp but the motor tag is 7.5)
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[Mike Kees]

That looks like a massive machine with a nice big table.

[Jared Sankovich]

That looks like a massive machine with a nice big table.

It took everything I had to get it up the slight.. and I mean very slight incline off of the drop deck trailer and into the shop. The table is about 30x48 if I remember right. Seems solid and well built.

[Darcy Warner]

Well I guess I have first hand experience now.. I will say it's a heavy pig at 850kg

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Interestingly the machine plate calls out 9hp but the motor tag is 7.5)
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At 60hz its 6.6kw which works out to just under 9hp.

Something is odd about the motor tag, should be a difference in amps too between 50/60 hz.

[Jared Sankovich]

At 60hz its 6.6kw which works out to just under 9hp.

Something is odd about the motor tag, should be a difference in amps too between 50/60 hz.

That's what I would have expected, but its Italian so? I read the motor plate as 5.5kw for both 50 and 60hz

[David Kumm]

SCM does the same thing with their motors. The 50 hz motor is rated 20% higher while other Euro motors are rated the same at 50 or 60hz. Others are rated the same at 50/60. To speed up a motor and increase hp, the volts to hz ratio must remain the same so the motors like that on the Casolin or SCMI must be wound differently . I do know they tend to burn out or have bearing issues so I would look the motor over and replace the bearings if needed. I have motors almost 100 years old and have rewound more Italian motors than any others. If that is a 90 frame, 9 hp packs a lot of wires and is impossible to replace. Most 90 frame motors you can buy are 5 hp at most. Nice shaper so take care of the motor as it will be the weak link. Dave

EDIT. I see the other plate lists a 112 frame. Makes me feel much better as that is a more appropriate size frame. Almost like the machine was built and then changed by special order. Definitely for the better.

[Jared Sankovich]

SCM does the same thing with their motors. The 50 hz motor is rated 20% higher while other Euro motors are rated the same at 50 or 60hz. Others are rated the same at 50/60. To speed up a motor and increase hp, the volts to hz ratio must remain the same so the motors like that on the Casolin or SCMI must be wound differently . I do know they tend to burn out or have bearing issues so I would look the motor over and replace the bearings if needed. I have motors almost 100 years old and have rewound more Italian motors than any others. If that is a 90 frame, 9 hp packs a lot of wires and is impossible to replace. Most 90 frame motors you can buy are 5 hp at most. Nice shaper so take care of the motor as it will be the weak link. Dave

EDIT. I see the other plate lists a 112 frame. Makes me feel much better as that is a more appropriate size frame. Almost like the machine was built and then changed by special order. Definitely for the better.

Thanks, I was aware of the Italian motor rewind/heat/tiny frame issues, but I hadn't thought about it here..lol

A quick check showed up to 4kw in the 112 frame was relatively easy to source..... here's hoping this motor lives a long happy life.

It seems the consensus is its 6.6kw/9hp. I will say that I don't think I'll need more shaper at this point. I kind of want to get pick up a pair of 300mm tenon heads just to see how it does, and maybe free up some space where my millburry is now.

[brent stanley]

Thanks, I was aware of the Italian motor rewind/heat/tiny frame issues, but I hadn't thought about it here..lol

A quick check showed up to 4kw in the 112 frame was relatively easy to source..... here's hoping this motor lives a long happy life.

It seems the consensus is its 6.6kw/9hp. I will say that I don't think I'll need more shaper at this point. I kind of want to get pick up a pair of 300mm tenon heads just to see how it does, and maybe free up some space where my millburry is now.

Darn near 6" depth of cut on 300mm tenon discs. Do that in a thick mahogany door and you'll be flogging all 9 of those ponies. :)

[Jared Sankovich]

Darn near 6" depth of cut on 300mm tenon discs. Do that in a thick mahogany door and you'll be flogging all 9 of those ponies. :)

I miss riding motorcycles and want to feel the wind in my face again...lol

[brent stanley]

I miss riding motorcycles and want to feel the wind in my face again...lol

Mine are 250mm and they push your hair back when you crank them up!

B

[Jared Sankovich]

Since I rarely use the sliding tables on my other shapers I'm not in a rush, but does anyone have any suggestions on fixing this table way? It appears to be glued on and delaminated in one section.
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[peter gagliardi]

I believe Patrick had to do similar to his T75 during restoration. I think an epoxy or superglue type product would do.

[Patrick Walsh]

This stuff is unreal. Not inexpensive but what is that’s any good.

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[Jared Sankovich]

I believe Patrick had to do similar to his T75 during restoration. I think an epoxy or superglue type product would do.




This stuff is unreal. Not inexpensive but what is that’s any good.

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Fantastic Thanks. I was thinking something like loctite black max might work. I'll get that aa330 ordered tomorrow.

[Patrick Walsh]

Google it first and watch a couple videos.

It’s like the fast cap CA glue and two parts. You dont have much time to do your work so you gotta have your system dialed. But it’s bomb proof.

I found it when I contacted Martin to ask what they use. To this day Martin still uses the same glued on hardened steel ways as on my saw for 1974.

Is sure what you gluing is metal on metal?






Fantastic Thanks. I was thinking something like loctite black max might work. I'll get that aa330 ordered tomorrow.

[Jared Sankovich]

Google it first and watch a couple videos.

It’s like the fast cap CA glue and two parts. You dont have much time to do your work so you gotta have your system dialed. But it’s bomb proof.

I found it when I contacted Martin to ask what they use. To this day Martin still uses the same glued on hardened steel ways as on my saw for 1974.

Is sure what you gluing is metal on metal?

The ways are steel, they seem more like spring steel than hardened and ground though.


https://youtu.be/txxjhFIlVW0

[Patrick Walsh]

Same thing just not as beefy.

It’s metal though so this stuff still work.

I’d remove the piece in full. Then clean spotless both the loos piece and machine side. Like spotless as anything left behind will result in the way no seating prefects flat.

I don’t know about casolin or your machine but Martin used copper wire I think 14g to space the two ways at the v groove. If you change this or dot. Glue it back on exact it could affect the calibration done at the factory of the sliding table. Also if there is wear in the ways “a grove worn” the bearing or wheel may no longer travel in it or it could hop in and out of the groove if glued back on crooked.

None of it’s a big deal but just get your system for gluing foaled first. I used wood 45% cauls I made in the ts. I then clamped them like every 3” or something stupid.

[Jared Sankovich]

Looks like I need new steel. Its .045" thick x .350" wide. Soft enough the balls wore a slight groove in them. Off to search for suitable replacements.

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[Patrick Walsh]

Oh boy your really committed and getting into this.

I just love getting a good machine fever ;)

[Jared Sankovich]

Oh boy your really committed and getting into this.

I just love getting a good machine fever ;)

Lol.. Just looking to fix some previous owner issues. Looks like McMaster has something close .042x.375 wear resistant spring steel (60 Rockwell)
https://www.mcmaster.com/9075k414

[Patrick Walsh]

Doesn’t look flat in both sides.

Is yours?


Lol.. Just looking to fix some previous owner issues. Looks like McMaster has something close .042x.375 wear resistant spring steel (60 Rockwell)
https://www.mcmaster.com/9075k414

[Jared Sankovich]

Doesn’t look flat in both sides.

Is yours?

Generally, but it certainly not ground. Im not sure I believe the graphic on McMaster is a 100% accurate representation of the profile. I'd expect it to be flat.

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[Jared Sankovich]

It's my fault but ordering from McMaster on a phone leaves something to be desired.. thought I ordered the aa330 with the activator.. nope.

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[Erik Loza]

Crazy: That's literally the first time I've ever seen a metal guideway de-laminate like that. I have no idea what type of adhesive they use but we routinely serviced 30+ year-old saws back in my Italian days. Plenty of rusted guideways but never seen one peel off like that. I wonder if this machine got sprayed with a solvent or something? Jared, thanks for sharing progress pics. Fascinating stuff.

Erik

[Jared Sankovich]

Crazy: That's literally the first time I've ever seen a metal guideway de-laminate like that. I have no idea what type of adhesive they use but we routinely serviced 30+ year-old saws back in my Italian days. Plenty of rusted guideways but never seen one peel off like that. I wonder if this machine got sprayed with a solvent or something? Jared, thanks for sharing progress pics. Fascinating stuff.

Erik

I wiped down the residue with an acetone soaked rag and it didn't soften, so I'm not sure what the issue was. Either way it's a relatively straightforward fix. Hopefully the hardened steel and loctite helps the longevity this time.

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[Jared Sankovich]

The slider is a slider again

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https://youtu.be/r6i09rvDPDA

[brent stanley]

Very nice, good repair!

[Patrick Walsh]

It’s such a satisfying feeling when it’s all back together and the dial indicator saiz you did a good job....

[Jared Sankovich]

My power source finally showed up.

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[Darcy Warner]

New? Used? I really like the Fujis, they are a bit more complex if you want to start playing with settings.

[Jared Sankovich]

New? Used? I really like the Fujis, they are a bit more complex if you want to start playing with settings.

It's new, Marshall Wolff was a bit slower shipping (to be expected). This is the 5th fuji for me, I really like them as well. Oddly this one didnt come with the full thickness manual like the others.

[Darcy Warner]

It's new, Marshall Wolff was a bit slower shipping (to be expected). This is the 5th fuji for me, I'm a fan as well. Oddly this one didnt come with the full thickness manual like the others.

There in stock stuff is low, and if they don't have it, its usually a week until they get it and then ship it out.

[Jared Sankovich]

Has anyone successfully used the direct brake on a euro motor with a vfd. I'm sure I could program the vfd to energize a contactor for the brake, but I'm not really sure there is a benefit over the dynamic braking just using the vfd.

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Any thoughts?

Also it would appear to me that I can run 120v to this spindle lock solenoid to gain functionality.
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[Darcy Warner]

I am not sure on that with a vfd. Most of these machines have an interlock with that brake. Can't turn machine on with brake switched off. Being 110v its probably run off the control transformer in the machine.

[Jared Sankovich]

I am not sure on that with a vfd. Most of these machines have an interlock with that brake. Can't turn machine on with brake switched off. Being 110v its probably run off the control transformer in the machine.

I should have picked up a rpc from AR during their 25% off sale.. though I'd still have odd spindle speeds at 60hz.

I think I'll just open up the brake clearance gap and leave it disconnected.

I think I could still feed the solenoid from the control transformer and program some interlock logic into the vfd. Though I'm pretty quick on the stop button when I forget the lock in engaged on one of my other shapers....
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