Is a 12" jointer needed?

[Travis Conner]

Thinking of buying either the powermatic or the grizzly 12" parallogram jointer. I do have a planer also, so will the planer take out any cuping in the face of the board then just use the jointer on the sides? I've always wondered why they typically only make 6 or 8" jointer and I thought maybe they just use them on the side of the boards so they can be run through a table saw.

[Frank Drackman]

No, they are used in the opposite order. One face gets flattened on the jointer, then one edge so that it is flat & 90 degrees to the flattened face. Next to either the tablesaw to make the opposite edge parallel to the first edge or the planer to make the opposite face parallel to the first face.

[Bob Andre]

Travis, A jointer is used to produce two flat reference faces at 90 degrees to each other. Then you can go to planer for face and saw for edge. The planer will want to match the board relative to the down side due to high pressure and your cup will remain. It wont take out cup, twist or anything elseJoint one face then one edge from the new face and you are good to go with a square flat result. I work only with rough lumber, have a Grizzly 12" parallelogram jointer that I put a Byrd head in. A bit underpowered but otherwise fine.

[Jared Sankovich]

A 12" is better than a 8".. a 16" is better than a 12" and so on.

[Alex Zeller]

The bigger the jointer usually means a longer bed. A longer bed means it's much easier to flatten longer boards. Once you get over 12" they tend to start to get massive and require a large shop.

[Dave Cav]

I got a 12" some years to replace a Grizzly long bed helical head 8" which worked just fine. The 12" is MUCH more useful, IMO. I got the 12" from an architectural millwork shop that had just purchased a 30" and already had a 24", and didn't need the "little" one any more.

[Andrew Hughes]

I don’t think Travis needs a 12 inch.
Woodworkers that need a 12 don’t ask that question

Good Luck

[Darcy Warner]

I don’t think Travis needs a 12 inch.
Woodworkers that need a 12 don’t ask that question

Good Luck

Right, we just get a 30" and skip all those steps. Lol

[Richard Coers]

If you only do a couple wide boards for a project, and you are a hobbyist, you can make a sled and flatten stock on a bench top planer. If you will run 200 bd ft of wide stock, sell your work, then you need the jointer.

[Jared Sankovich]

Right, we just get a 30" and skip all those steps. Lol

I see no fault in that logic

[mike stenson]

Right, we just get a 30" and skip all those steps. Lol

Or a jack plane.

[Bob Deroeck]

Following up on what Richard wrote, you can joint a 12" board on an 8" jointer, then use a shim board led to plane the rough side of the board on your planer. Once that side is smooth, smooth the other side with your planer. I agree with Richard that this is fine if you just have a few boards wider than 8" to joint. If you have lots of 8"+ wide boards to joint, you'll want a 12" jointer. As a hobbyest, I use this technique with my 8" jointer and it works fine.

[Derek Arita]

I have a 12" J/P. First I get a face flat on the jointer, then I put that flat face against the fence and joint an edge to make it 90* to the face. Now I can go to the table saw, put that 90* edge against the fence, flat face down and machine the other edge 90*. After that I go to the planer, flat face down and plane the other side parallel to the flat face.
I use lots of 8" boards, so the 12" cutter means I don't have to feed the board perfectly straight thru the J/P. On narrower boards, I'll actually run boards thru at slight angles, so that I get full use of the blades. I had an 8" jointer and would never go back, unless I had to.

[Darcy Warner]

Or a jack plane.

Too much like work. I got my 7 and 8 out once, that was enough.

[Jeff Monson]

Its always nice to have a jointer with the same width capacity as your planer. It just keeps the width of the stock you can mill pretty straight forward and simple. Makes choosing lumber easier also, if you have 12" capacity on both sides that is the max width I would consider buying.

[mike stenson]

Too much like work. I got my 7 and 8 out once, that was enough.

It'll flatten/square any width board though ;) So no, a 12" jointer absolutely isn't needed.

[Scott Bernstein]

I assume the OP is a hobby wookworker...I think many of us (myself included) start with a 6" jointer. They are small, affordable, and require only 120V. I started with a grizzly helical head 6" jointer, which I grew out of after just a couple of projects. I did end up using it for several years. It was always challenging to use larger stock with only a 6" wide jointer, but there are various techniques and jigs to get by. I eventually ended up upgrading to a European 16" jointer-planer combo machine. I am extremely happy with it and it does not take up nearly as much space as separate machines, nor a standard American style jointer, of equal capacity. The beds on my combo machine are much longer than my old 6" machine but much shorter than a "full-size" 16" stand-alone jointer. If I need to mill longer pieces, I can attach the removable bed extensions, which work great. The major downside to these big machines is the cost, size, and weight. Plus you need a large dust collector to match...planing and jointing 10-12" or bigger lumber creates an awful lot of chips.

[Phillip Mitchell]

Travis is getting quite the woodworking education as of late :D I’m still waiting for a thread on the justification of a Domino

[Phillip Mitchell]

And yes, if you have to ask about needing a bigger jointer then you don’t really need one. It becomes apparent very quickly when you need a bigger one...

[Brian W Evans]

Travis,

I've had a 6" and an 8". Both worked OK but I skipped the 12" and went straight to a 16" for my current jointer. The main reason for upgrading was that I got tired of shopping for <8" wide boards or dealing with work-arounds. The 16" will handle any width lumber I'm ever likely to get, and lets me skew narrower pieces to reduce tear-out. That said, if I had come across a used 20" or wider, I might have gone for it.

Of course, wider also means more mass and likely more power - both good things in a woodworking machine, IMO.

You could consider a J/P combo machine which, if you sold your planer, might be roughly in the ballpark of a 12" parallelogram. This way you would have a planer that exactly matches the width of your jointer and also more space in your shop.

[Jim Becker]

I'm a proponent of having wide jointing capacity, preferably to match the width of thicknessing. It's one reason I like J/P combos. I like wide boards and want to be able to flatten them appropriately.

[Ben Rivel]

I'm a proponent of having wide jointing capacity, preferably to match the width of thicknessing. It's one reason I like J/P combos. I like wide boards and want to be able to flatten them appropriately.
Thats what I was thinking! Pickup a J/P combo like the Hammer A3-31 or A3-41 and get the best of both worlds!

[Ron Selzer]

What brand/model is your J/P?
wanting to get a larger jointer, the more I look the more confused I get
starting looking at 8", then 12" then 12 J/P, now you say you have a 16"
only want to buy one more, started with a 4", have had a 6" for over 30 years
trying to figure out what I want
Thanks
Ron

[Randy Heinemann]

Since I bought my 8” helical head jointer I have found only one situation I needed a wider bed for. Depends on what you make. If you’re doing a lot of table tops maybe a 12” would be worthwhile. Otherwise I found that, for the few times I need a 12”, I can find a place to reasonably flatten and/or thickness the wood for me. A jointer is needed to flatten one side and for edge jointing. The planer is used to thickness after flattening one side. Sometimes you can flatten the first side with light passes till flat. Also you could build a sled to flatten on a planer. Research on YouTube. .

[Derek Arita]

You need a hand plane. For convenience and everything else, we want a 16" J/P. I get the largest and best machines I can afford and have space for. I would imagine it's the same for most of us.

[Jim Andrew]

When I was shopping for jointers, bought the G0609 Grizzly, parallelogram 12" jointer, and checked the catalog, and it is no longer listed. The new G0834 is considerably more expensive. My choice would have been to go for a 16", but they were about double what the 12" was, so just figured I could "get by".

[Alex Zeller]

When I was shopping for jointers, bought the G0609 Grizzly, parallelogram 12" jointer, and checked the catalog, and it is no longer listed. The new G0834 is considerably more expensive. My choice would have been to go for a 16", but they were about double what the 12" was, so just figured I could "get by".

I just saw a G0609X sell at auction for $2600+ (with buyer's premium and loading charge). It was a 12 year old jointer that looked in great shape. I was thinking that must of been close to the price of it new.

[Jim Andrew]

Paid about that for mine, including the Byrd cutterhead. Thing is, it is a little more than half of a G0834. Mine has been excellent, so guess it was a good buy.

[Brian W Evans]

What brand/model is your J/P?
wanting to get a larger jointer, the more I look the more confused I get
starting looking at 8", then 12" then 12 J/P, now you say you have a 16"
only want to buy one more, started with a 4", have had a 6" for over 30 years
trying to figure out what I want
Thanks
Ron

Ron,

Not sure if you were talking to me, but I have a Minimax FS41C (https://www.scmgroup.com/en_US/scmwood/products/joinery-machines.c884/planer-thicknessers-jointer-planers.893/minimax-fs-41c.668). If I had it to do over again (and had the money), I'd have stepped up to the FS41ES. You're talking a lot more money to do that, though.

I'm very happy with this machine and I don't hesitate to recommend it. I got the Tersa cutterhead (standard) instead of the carbide/segmented head and I really like the Tersa system.

[Mark e Kessler]

I have never worked in a placed or owned anything less than a 12” and now have a 16” which is an ok compromise for me, I build small to medium size (king bed, is that medium?) furniture. I don’t know how long you plan on doing this but buy the biggest that you can afford and buy quality new or used. I have questioned some of high dollar quality tool purchases in the past thinking I over did it but if you are in it for life hobby or professional as soon as its paid for and some time passes I can’t even remember spending the money and I have a machine for 20-30 years or longer, if I want to sell it for whatever reason it sells quick and for top dollar. I sold a 25 year old scm 12” j/p that I had for 20ish yrs in one week for $3200 which I think is pretty good, it was beat to death I ran a lot of work through it.

Also lots of debate here, my preference would be Helical head on a combo j/p (thats what I have), or straight knife on jointer, helical on planer, or straight knife on jointer, maybe straight on planer if I had a wide belt.

[Mike Kees]

Travis at the rate you are posting you will have drained all of our collected wisdom in about 3.498 more days.... Do you need a 12" jointer ? Short answer ,maybe ,maybe not.What are you building ? How big is the wood you buy ? S4s,skip planed,or rough ? This is wood working, for every tool or way of doing something there is a workaround or 2nd or 3rd or fourth way of doing it. If you were doing this for a living ,using wide stock a lot then yeah a 12" or even 16" jointer makes sense. If this is a hobby and you use bigger stock and have more than enough money sure. Like others have posted hand planes,planer sleds etc.will also get the job done. If you do not have a jointer an 8" would be a very good starting point,that would be hard to outgrow unless you have sources of nice wide wood. The Jointer/planer option is also a great way to have jointing capacity the same as planing capacity. Good luck.

[Ron Selzer]

thanks for the info
ron

[Tom Bussey]

I have to agree with Andrew Hughes, Woodworkers that need a 12 inch jointer, don’t ask that question.

And I must be less fortunate than most because I try to pick out the best surface of a board to flatten. I have tried several times to joint the edge straight and square next but grain direction always seems to be wrong and there is no mistaking that sound when cutting against the grain on a jointer so I just go to the planner for the other side and and back to the jointer for edge work.

[Justin Rapp]

I went from a 6" straight blade jointer to a 6" helical jointer because of the cost of an 8" as about $600 more and i could use the common method of jointing a 6" board and than using a sled and putting it through my planer. Ironically, I am working on a project now and purchased and they are rough cut at 7/8" They are almost flat so I am only taking off 1/16 on my jointer and 1/16 on the opposite face to get them to 3/4. I have a few boards that i need drawer fronts that are 6 1/2" and 2 more that are 9". I don't want to risk the wood by using the 'sled' method. In this case, a 12" jointer would be great.

[Jared Sankovich]

Met a cabinet maker yesterday that didn't have a jointer. He ordered his doors, and only did euro style cabinets.

[Myles Moran]

I have an 8". So far I have purchased 1 board that has been too wide for it, so I ripped off the edge I didn't like so much to make it narrow enough to fit. I lost a whopping 1" of width, which was mostly gonna be scrap from that board anyway.

I have, however, run a crap load of boards in that 6"+ range that would have sucked on a 6" jointer.

I'll agree with the people that say to go with a 8" from the start. It's a great machine and I'll live with it's limitations. I'd love a 12" or a 16" or something crazy like that, but I don't have money for that, and I'm pretty sure my wife would strangle me if I tried to get something that big into our basement.

[michael dilday]

Following up on what Richard wrote, you can joint a 12" board on an 8" jointer, then use a shim board led to plane the rough side of the board on your planer. Once that side is smooth, smooth the other side with your planer. I agree with Richard that this is fine if you just have a few boards wider than 8" to joint. If you have lots of 8"+ wide boards to joint, you'll want a 12" jointer. As a hobbyest, I use this technique with my 8" jointer and it works fine.

That is a great technique Bob.

[michael dilday]

I have the Jet JJP-12 Jointer / Planer combo. It is fairly compact but plenty capable for a small shop. It has paid for itself many times over with the savings in lumber. I think 8" would be the minimum for anyone and 12" is ideal. And unless you are buying planed lumber and paying the $ for it a jointer is a necessity.

[Curt Harms]

I see no fault in that logic

I might -- getting a 30" jointer down Bilco door type steps into a basement shop would provide a challenge. Not impossible, but certainly a challenge :)

[Tom Bender]

I might -- getting a 30" jointer down Bilco door type steps into a basement shop would provide a challenge. Not impossible, but certainly a challenge :)

Easy peasy, remove the steps, fill the hole with sand, place the planer on the sand, shovel the sand out underneath.

[Travis Conner]

Who makes a 12" jointer besides grizzly and powermatic?

[Jim Becker]

Euro manufacturers are one source as is "old iron. Many folks, however, have adopted Euro style jointer/planer combo machines because they provide matched larger capacities for both flattening/straightening and thicknessing in a single machine with a reasonable footprint. I've used one since the mid-2000s and it's been key part of my workflow since I tend to embrace wider material "a lot". My machine is SCM/Minimax, but companies like Felder/Hammer are popular and even Grizzly has J/P combos. Common objections from some folks are shorter beds for jointing and changeover time, but honestly, unless someone is routinely and constantly working with long stock to final dimension the former isn't an issue at all and as to change-over...60 seconds for me and I avoid having to do that a lot by...planning workflow.

[Justin Rapp]

Euro manufacturers are one source as is "old iron. Many folks, however, have adopted Euro style jointer/planer combo machines because they provide matched larger capacities for both flattening/straightening and thicknessing in a single machine with a reasonable footprint. I've used one since the mid-2000s and it's been key part of my workflow since I tend to embrace wider material "a lot". My machine is SCM/Minimax, but companies like Felder/Hammer are popular and even Grizzly has J/P combos. Common objections from some folks are shorter beds for jointing and changeover time, but honestly, unless someone is routinely and constantly working with long stock to final dimension the former isn't an issue at all and as to change-over...60 seconds for me and I avoid having to do that a lot by...planning workflow.

Laguna also makes a 12" jointer that looks really nice.

[Randall J Cox]

I don’t think Travis needs a 12 inch.
Woodworkers that need a 12 don’t ask that question

Good Luck
Agree, I've playing at woodworking for over 35 years, made do with a used 6" Sears jointer for 25 years, then about 10 years ago, upgraded to a nice used Powermatic 60 8". What a difference! Love it. Don't think I've ever had the need for a 12" jointer (although I'd love to have one - actually don't have room for one). Randy Good luck with what ever you buy. If you can afford a 12", go for it.

[Paul F Franklin]

FWIW, King Canada offers several 12" jointers as well as a 12" combo J/P