Continental Divide?

[Jim Koepke]

Many know the name of a popular mayonnaise, Hellmanns is an eastern name for what is called Best Foods in the west.

There are a few other brands also using different names in various parts of the U.S. (Dryer's and Edy's ice cream)

But until today it never occurred that butter is packaged different across the country. According > http://nowiknow.com/i-cant-believe-its-all-butter/ < in the east butter is in long thinner cubes than what is sold in the west, known as 'Western Stubbies.'

As the site says, "Now I know."

jtk

[Perry Hilbert Jr]

I grew up near a large commercial cannery. They would process and can almost any vegetable grown in the mid Atlantic. Starting around the beginning of July and running two shifts a day through October or November. They slapped whatever paper label the customer wanted. What ever supermarket chain or major brand had contracted for their product. Even Green Giant and others. Lots of off brands for little independent stores etc. Same stuff coming off the line, same size cans, just changed labels.

One regional difference, I have noticed. American cheese here is almost always white. In fact the adjective White is usually associated with American cheese by locals. Seems back in the 1930's, it was a misdemeanor to add coloring to cheese in Pennsylvania. American cheese was and is naturally white in color. Folks still call it "White American" and get a little miffed, if a store only has the yellow American cheese.

[Jim Koepke]

Here in the west the 'white' pasteurized processed cheese is sold as 'Swiss Cheese' without the holes.

jtk

[mike stenson]

Here in the west the 'white' pasteurized processed cheese is sold as 'Swiss Cheese' without the holes.

jtk

In AZ it's just white american

[John K Jordan]

But until today it never occurred that butter is packaged different across the country. ...

As the site says, "Now I know."


Actually now you know what that web site author knows, which isn't everything. We buy both the short sticks and the long sticks at the local grocery store in Tennessee.

It's frightening, but maybe you can't believe everything you read on the internet. [gasp!]
But who and what can you trust? Oh, I know, every single word a politician or lawyer or reporter or car salesman or blogger or panhandller says.

JKJ

[Bryan Lisowski]

This brings back memories, I grew up in Colorado and the only mayonnaise I would eat was best foods. When I moved back east, it took convincing that Hellmens was the same. I will eat most generic brands of food, I will not eat any other mayo.

[Stan Calow]

I have a hard time believing, as the article asserts, that there was no butter manufactured west of the Rockies in the '60s and earlier.

[Jim Koepke]

I have a hard time believing, as the article asserts, that there was no butter manufactured west of the Rockies in the '60s and earlier.

The article didn't say, "there was no butter manufactured west of the Rockies."

It said,
So, almost no butter was made west of the Rockies.

By the time western dairy production ramped up, there weren’t a lot of Elgin-making butter printers left.

The article also stated this was in the 1960s. The population of the west coast didn't really take off until the 1960s. Before this if demand was beyond production the butter was likely brought in from dairies in the east.

The aerospace industry came to the west coast and it started jumping and a growing.

jtk

[Stephen Tashiro]

But until today it never occurred that butter is packaged different across the country.


Nowadays, margarine is called "butter". I prefer margarine to real butter.

[Aaron Rosenthal]

Nowadays, margarine is called "butter". I prefer margarine to real butter.
Are you sure?
I’m not sure how different truth in advertising laws are in New Mexico vs. Canada, but calling margarine “butter” might be a real no-no almost everywhere.
As to your preference for your spread, I politely disagree on health matters alone.
But, everyone in our 2 great countries has their choice.
That’s what keeps Canada great.

[Dan Hunkele]

How do you fit that squatty thing in your butter dish? ;)

[Bill Dufour]

USA Fedederal law does not allow margarine to be called butter. Same reason the fast food places call it a shake not a milk shake. To call it a milk shake it has to have some percentage of real milk in it. Not some drypowder starch added to water. I believe Cheese has to be 51% milk so I notice the latest fast food commercials "burger king?" refers to it as "cheddar" the word "cheese" is never used in the ad. I belive the only proper legal name for the stuff is, processed amercian cheese food product.
A loaf of bread has to weigh one pound ,or more by federal law. Does butter have to be at least one pound as well?
Bil lD
Bill

[Bob Grier]

I thought tillamook factory in Tillamook, Oregon produced dairy products including butter from the 1800s to present day. I remember touring the factory in the 50s.

[Bob Glenn]

Yup, been there too.

[Bill Dufour]

The largest dairy in the world is in California 15,000 cows. Founded by the youngest Gallo brother, Joseph. His older brothers took over dads winery after he killed himself and turned it into the largest winery in the world. They cut little brother out of the inheritance claiming the winery had no value when they inherited.
Can you say wine and cheese? a court order made him change it from Gallo Dairy to Joseph farms so as not to confuse it with Gallo wine company.
Bill D.

[Stephen Tashiro]

Are you sure?
I’m not sure how different truth in advertising laws are in New Mexico vs. Canada, but calling margarine “butter” might be a real no-no almost everywhere.


In NM, the speech of the common citizen does not obey truth-in-advertising laws. I'm referring to the fact that people use the word "butter" to refer to products that are actually margarine. In the display cases of stores the multitude of margarines sold under the brand names such as Smart Spread, Blue Bonnet etc. greatly outnumbers the few offerings of genuine butter.

As to the shape of slabs of butter, it would be easy for people who use margarine to enter the conversation and confuse the issue.

[Doug Garson]

I thought tillamook factory in Tillamook, Oregon produced dairy products including butter from the 1800s to present day. I remember touring the factory in the 50s.
We visited there last fall, interesting factoid "Cheese-making was a minor part of Tillamook County’s dairy industry until 1894, when cheesemakers Harry Ogden and T.S. Townsend induced Canadian immigrant Peter McIntosh to settle in Tillamook County. McIntosh had learned the art of cheese-making in his home province of Ontario."

[John K Jordan]

OT, but when I think of cheese the picture burned into my mind is of endless rows of stacks of thousands upon thousands of 82lb wheels of Parmigiano Reggiano in a huge warehouse in Italy. THAT's cheese.

425866 425867

JKJ

[Jim Koepke]

425867
JKJ

Yummmmmmm!

jtk

[Nicholas Lawrence]

I prefer margarine to real butter.

For some questions in life there is no wrong answer. This is not one of those questions.

[Jon Nuckles]

A loaf of bread has to weigh one pound ,or more by federal law. Does butter have to be at least one pound as well?
Bil lD
Bill

Hi Bill,

I did not find a law requiring butter to be at least a pound, but there is a federal law that prohibits retail sale of colored margarine in weights over one pound. 21 U.S.C. Sec 347(b)(2). The butter lobby has traditionally been stronger than the margarine folks, so I doubt there is a minimum butter weight.

Where did you find a federal law requiring bread to weigh one pound or more? The only thing I could find on bread weights came from the Code of Federal Regulations (21 CFR Sec. 136.3):

Definitions.

For purposes of this part, the following definitions apply:

(a) The word bread when used in the name of the food means the unit weighs one-half pound or more after cooling.

(b) The words rolls and buns when used in the name of the food mean the unit weighs less than one-half pound after cooling.

This is just a definition for purposes of interpreting the rest of the regulations, but it obviously anticipates breads with weights below one pound. I found several state laws, perhaps outdated, that required bread to be sold at certain standard weights, but those usually seemed to allow weights under a pound as well. I found a Supreme Court case from about a hundred years ago interpreting one of the state laws on weights, but it does not create any federal minimum weight standard.

Regards, Jon (who didn't enjoy practicing law, but apparently missed doing legal research!)

[Rick Potter]

My folks ran a small store in Ohio during the 50's. The Margarine, at the time called Oleo, or OleoMargarine, came with a little tube of yellow coloring, which you mixed into it at home.

I remember my dad telling me that Wisconsin (The Dairy State) had gotten the Feds to pass laws against Oleo that was colored yellow. It was a big deal at the time.

We ate the Oleo at home, because it was cheap. I still remember it leaving a coating on the roof of my mouth. Not like what we call Margarin now.

[Kev Williams]

OT, but when I think of cheese the picture burned into my mind is of endless rows of stacks of thousands upon thousands of 82lb wheels of Parmigiano Reggiano in a huge warehouse in Italy. THAT's cheese.

425867

JKJ
I count 22 cheeses per column, x82lb = 1804lbs of cheese each column, by what, 50 rows? that's over 45 tons of cheese!

Know what amazes me more than all that cheese? ---- That those wood shelves and whatever they're attached to are holding it all up!

[Frank Pratt]

For some questions in life there is no wrong answer. This is not one of those questions.

Haha! Yep.

[Frank Pratt]

When I was a kid it was illegal to color margerine. Each pound of margerine came with a small packet of coloring that you could mix in, but we never bothered. One day my sister was making sandwiches & grabbed the lard instead of margerine. They look the same, but certainly don't taste the same.

[Bill Dufour]

Hi Bill,

I did not find a law requiring butter to be at least a pound, but there is a federal law that prohibits retail sale of colored margarine in weights over one pound. 21 U.S.C. Sec 347(b)(2). The butter lobby has traditionally been stronger than the margarine folks, so I doubt there is a minimum butter weight.

Where did you find a federal law requiring bread to weigh one pound or more? The only thing I could find on bread weights came from the Code of Federal Regulations (21 CFR Sec. 136.3):

Definitions.

For purposes of this part, the following definitions apply:

(a) The word bread when used in the name of the food means the unit weighs one-half pound or more after cooling.

(b) The words rolls and buns when used in the name of the food mean the unit weighs less than one-half pound after cooling.

This is just a definition for purposes of interpreting the rest of the regulations, but it obviously anticipates breads with weights below one pound. I found several state laws, perhaps outdated, that required bread to be sold at certain standard weights, but those usually seemed to allow weights under a pound as well. I found a Supreme Court case from about a hundred years ago interpreting one of the state laws on weights, but it does not create any federal minimum weight standard.

Regards, Jon (who didn't enjoy practicing law, but apparently missed doing legal research!)


My Mom told this law appeared during the depression in California because baker started to make smaller loaves so people could afford them and thought they were getting a full loaf for the new price.

[Bert Kemp]

The differences between butter and margarine
The most important difference between the two is that butter is derived from dairy and is rich in saturated fats, whereas margarine is made from plant oils. It used to contain a lot of trans fats, but as mentioned above, manufacturers have now started phasing these out.Jan 8, 2020

[Mike Cutler]

I have a hard time believing, as the article asserts, that there was no butter manufactured west of the Rockies in the '60s and earlier.

And rightfully so!
I grew up in SoCal in the 60's and I promise you there were some big dairy operations in LA County. Getting butter was never a problem. They made it by the rail cars full.

[Jon Nuckles]

My Mom told this law appeared during the depression in California because baker started to make smaller loaves so people could afford them and thought they were getting a full loaf for the new price.

I saw several references to state laws regarding bread weights. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if California had one. Just not a federal law that I could find.

[Myk Rian]

Nowadays, margarine is called "butter". I prefer margarine to real butter.
Margarine was developed as a cattle feed supplement. It's 1 molecule away from being a plastic. At least that is what I learned, before the internet.
The cattle didn't like it, so they feed it to us.
Remember the Parkay ads?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7-vau8DiU0


In Mi, butter is in sticks, like a large pen blank, 4 in a block. Or an uncut block.
We stop at a grocery store in Glennie to pick up some Amish butter, when we get up that way.

[Bruce Wrenn]

The largest dairy in the world is in California 15,000 cows. Founded by the youngest Gallo brother, Joseph. His older brothers took over dads winery after he killed himself and turned it into the largest winery in the world. They cut little brother out of the inheritance claiming the winery had no value when they inherited.
Can you say wine and cheese? a court order made him change it from Gallo Dairy to Joseph farms so as not to confuse it with Gallo wine company.
Bill D.

The largest grower of alfalfa in California is a dairy in Saudia Arabia. Because of the government, they get unlimited amounts of water with which to grow crops. Alfalfa is grown, baled and shipped by container ship to Saudie, where they "feed lot " dairy cows with American grown alfalfa. Ships from the middle east bring oil to US ports, steam up the river to where it's fresh water, stock up for the return trip home, where water is used in industrial processing.