Lamello Tenso

[Scott Bernstein]

Well, I couldn't find many posts on the Lamello Zeta p2 connectors so I thought I'd share my experience. Just a hobby woodworker, fortunate enough to be able to acquire whatever tools I think are useful and efficient... I have a domino joiner already which I have used for many years and have recently purchased the very pricey Lamello Zeta p2 machine, which makes the special t-slot biscuit grooves for their various connectors. The domino of course is excellent, but for edge glue-ups the lamello seems to be really excellent. I have used the "tenso" biscuit connectors on a couple projects now for edge glue-ups and the huge improvement over regular biscuits or festool domino's is that the Lamello tenso connectors are self-clamping. Make the biscuit slots, insert the connectors, glue, and snap together. The edges come together perfectly and no need to spend time clamping! Anyone else have similar experience, hints/tips?

SB

[David Zaret]

we have the Zeta - it's invaluable for certain aspects of casework building. i do high-end kitchens, most with applied side panels, tucked behind face frames... wrapped columns in the island, etc. the Zeta (both tensos and clamex) have been terrific for fitting in the shop, removing, wrapping and moving panels, and then reassembling at the job site. another particularly good use for the zeta connectors is on long miters. sometimes i build long mitered columns to wrap corners, and with the clamex connectors, i can rip or shape the miters, throw in a couple of clamexes, glue and join, without any clamps. i used to run 40 clamps down a long miter, now i need none.

i do find myself aware of the connector cost - one job i did recently was entirely knock-down (the customer literally came and fork-lifted a pallet of cabinet parts out of the shop), and i used ~400 connectors. even at bulk, these things are expensive, and i had to consider the cost in the job price.

i keep finding new uses for the zeta, but it doesn't replace the biscuit jointer. i still use that, and the domino, extensively, and often i mix them - i'll use the domino for precise alignment, and a couple of tensos for clamping pressure. for slab glue-ups, or for aligning face frames to carcasses, i still use biscuits. it's not an either-or, the zeta is just another tool with a specific function. for me, in my shop, the tool is worth every dime. ...but it's a lot of dimes.

[Erik Loza]

Felder has somewhat of a partnership with them. I have a pop-up display of theirs in the Dallas showroom and we offer a CNC tooling package for their various systems. Personally, I don't have any shops who use them on the regular but they are really awesome fasteners and I'm kind of surprised there isn't more interest. Please anyone post pics if you have done projects with them. Would be curious to see.

Erik

[Brad Shipton]

I use these as well. Other than typical cabinets, I have used them for installing face frames that span multiple boxes. Below is an example of a built-in for a mudroom. I am working on a kitchen project using them as well. The tenso connectors are nice, but the clamex allow for a little more flexibility for adjustment when installing. The cost of the Zeta P2 machine and the connectors do turn off quite a few I think. The last batch of connectors I ordered ended up costing about $1.65 (CAD) per connector. That added up on a kitchen project.

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[Erik Loza]

Brad, those are nice. Thanks for sharing. I think cost is the biggest challenge on these.

Erik

[johnny means]

When I worked in exhibits, trade show booths and such, we used coffin locks by the hundreds. These could be an interesting alternative at a fraction of the cost.

[Scott Bernstein]

They are quite expensive. But using knockdown connectors has added some additional flexibility to my furniture projects. I am finishing up on a large stand-alone cabinet for our living room. Frame & panel construction, approx 7 feet tall, 20" deep, and a little over 3 feet wide. If it was all glued together in one piece it would be very hard to move it upstairs into it's final resting place. I used the festool knockdown connectors to connect the back panel to the two sides and used the Lamello tenso connectors to attach the solid wood edge banding onto the 6 plywood shelves - saved an awful lot of time not having to clamp all those panels. I know there are cheaper ways to accomplish the same thing, but none as quick and painless. Fun too.

[Larry Edgerton]

I have been contemplating one to save some time, but as I live in the middle of nowhere have not had a chance to go hands on. Couple of questions......

All the videos are in particleboard which I never use. How does it perform in plywood and solid wood?

How strong is the Clamex Joint? Compared to???

[David Zaret]

i pretty much only use it on solid wood (hardwood) and VC plywood. works great. you have to plunge somewhat slowly, and be particularly careful not to move the machine at the end of the cut, as the blade "wiggles" to create the groove for the connectors. fundamentally, the zeta feels and acts like a biscuit cutter.

for strength, the connectors "pull" the joint tight. the tensos pull ~30 lbs each, i believe... and the clamex, you use an allen key to pull the joint tight. it's not as beefy as the festool connectors, which are threaded, and metal-on-metal, but there's plenty of pull to pull a joint together and get glue squeeze out.

also, the little plastic/fiberglass connectors stick with PVA glue. so, if you wish, you can put a drop of glue in the slot, slide the connector in, and it'll stay as the glue dries. i almost never do this, but sometimes it's nice to keep the connector for sliding around if you are planning on leaving the join unglued and use the connectors for knock-down pieces.

[Kevin Jenness]

I have used the Clamex S connectors (screw-in) and have watched a couple videos on the P and Tenso, The Tenso seem to allow some sideways movemen during assembly, but as I recall the Clamex S have barbs on the stubs that limit sideways adjustment to about .5mm increments- is this true also for the Clamex P connectors?

[David Zaret]

there is a little play. i think there really needs to be, they would be nearly impossible if they had "domino" tolerances. i don't know the amount, but there's definitely a bit of play in both directions.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

The Tenso is not a knock down connection, correct?

[Brad Shipton]

Larry, I have built boxes (no space to drag in box) using Clamex connectors, and strength wise they seem fine if you follow the spacing suggestions. Like many other EU companies, they have test data in their catalog. I pasted a a snip of the recommended capacity for the Clamex below. They have tested other configurations as well.

For adjustment, I find you can move the Clamex a 1 - 2mm in either direction. The play comes from the fit between the plastic parts. I cannot see a way to make anymore play in these either due to the way the blades cuts the slot. To make adjustments with the clamex, you simply force into place and then tighten the hex. On the other hand, the tenso snaps into place, and you are pretty much cooked. I like testing the fit parts, so I find I use the clamex more. The downside of the clamex is the 6mm hole for the hex key. I find most times a small 6mm hole can be allowed for in most applications and they do sell 6mm plugs in various colors.

I have used the Zeta P2 in both solid and hardwood. The basic blade is the same diameter as the standard lamello, but the tips are wider so when it moves up/down, it makes a deeper groove for the connectors. The blade cuts about the same as a standard lamello. The up/down movement is very small, and I have never found a problem in cherry. I do find I have to cut fairly slow in hardwoods to make sure the machine does not torque during the plunge and move sideways.

The tenso is a one time application. Click, and done. It is not removable. Those connectors are much less expensive since they do not have a metal hex that drives up the cost. You need three parts for these. The insert to make the male connector clicks in very easily so long as you have their little plastic insert tool (cheap).

For anyone with a CNC, the Lamello cabineo is hands down the best option if you want to build on site or do not have all the fancy case clamps.

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[Reinis Kanders]

Who sells Lamello stuff in the continental US? I briefly googled, but did not see much.

Thanks.

[Kevin Jenness]

Colonial Saw in RI.

[David Zaret]

The Tenso is not a knock down connection, correct?

the tenso can be attached, pulled apart, and re-attached, so i would consider that at least a form of a knock-down connector.

[Larry Edgerton]

Larry, I have built boxes (no space to drag in box) using Clamex connectors, and strength wise they seem fine if you follow the spacing suggestions. Like many other EU companies, they have test data in their catalog. I pasted a a snip of the recommended capacity for the Clamex below. They have tested other configurations as well.

For adjustment, I find you can move the Clamex a 1 - 2mm in either direction. The play comes from the fit between the plastic parts. I cannot see a way to make anymore play in these either due to the way the blades cuts the slot. To make adjustments with the clamex, you simply force into place and then tighten the hex. On the other hand, the tenso snaps into place, and you are pretty much cooked. I like testing the fit parts, so I find I use the clamex more. The downside of the clamex is the 6mm hole for the hex key. I find most times a small 6mm hole can be allowed for in most applications and they do sell 6mm plugs in various colors.

I have used the Zeta P2 in both solid and hardwood. The basic blade is the same diameter as the standard lamello, but the tips are wider so when it moves up/down, it makes a deeper groove for the connectors. The blade cuts about the same as a standard lamello. The up/down movement is very small, and I have never found a problem in cherry. I do find I have to cut fairly slow in hardwoods to make sure the machine does not torque during the plunge and move sideways.

The tenso is a one time application. Click, and done. It is not removable. Those connectors are much less expensive since they do not have a metal hex that drives up the cost. You need three parts for these. The insert to make the male connector clicks in very easily so long as you have their little plastic insert tool (cheap).

For anyone with a CNC, the Lamello cabineo is hands down the best option if you want to build on site or do not have all the fancy case clamps.

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Thanks, but I was looking for how they hold up in the real world. For example I make traditional cabinets and the uppers are always one piece, but was wondering how they would work for the dividers. The dividers are carrying half the weight of the shelves and contents, so what would you say to that? Really need to get my hands on one. Would hate for it to be another Domino, sitting under the bench in a pretty box and seldom used.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Would hate for it to be another Domino, sitting under the bench in a pretty box and seldom used.

Glad to know mine isn't the only one!

[Steve Rozmiarek]

the tenso can be attached, pulled apart, and re-attached, so i would consider that at least a form of a knock-down connector.

Thank you David, I meant can they be taken back apart, knock down was the wrong term.

[Brad Shipton]

Larry, i am not sure how much day to day use you would find for this. Locating the connectors in the middle of a panel is about as fussy as dowels. If you have two surfaces to index from, then these connectors works just as easily as the domino. When I have made boxes with dividers, my CNC drills pilot holes to locate the slots. The Zeta P2 has holes for 5mm locator pins that fit in the holes drilled by the CNC. If your goal is to build faster, and are happy with dados, dowels, or something along those lines, I doubt this will be something you like. I work by myself 99% of the time, so when I have large boxes, knock down is important. Below you will see an example pantry unit before the face frames are installed. The circled divider was connected to the other cabinets parts using Clamex connectors. Was there other solutions, for sure, but my shop is too small and moving the completed unit would not work for me. Strength wise, I do not think there will be a problem with dividers. I have a few boxes in an engineering office and they are stacked full of 6" stacks of 24"x36" drawings. Never a problem. As far as racking, I would say a cabinet built using these would suffer the same type of failure as cabinets with the traditional RTA connectors. I am a small shop, so I think you need to talk to someone that uses the device more. I have only went thru a 1000 or so of these connectors, so someone from Colonial Saw would be a better person for you. One of the guys regularly posts on the woodweb when people are looking for solutions to odd applications.

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I have never been able to take apart a tenso connector without destroying the panels, but would be curious to see a jig if someone is. They are intended as clamping elements, so once the male plastic tines engage the female they are very tight. There are videos and links below showing the actual connector in use.

https://www.lamello.com/product/p-system-verbinder/tenso-p-14/
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[Larry Edgerton]

Thanks Brad. The other use I had in mind is attaching face frames to the case. I always used biscuits and clamped, but since the changes mandated in paints a couple of years ago the paint gets hard a lot slower and have been having issues. Hate kreg screws and they are not always an option anyway but this would eliminate the need for clamps if it works for that application.

Also, I too am getting old and although in the past I have always made boxes as big as possible, I have to face the fact that I am not superman any more. I recently picked up some cabinetwork on the fourth floor of a house, and separate boxes with a one piece face frame sounds much easier. Everything I get lately is inset, so the need for precision is great. Have you used to attach face frames?

Thanks. Larry

[Erik Loza]

I have a contact at Colonial Saw who supplies us with the Lamello stuff. PM if you'd like his name.

Erik

[Larry Edgerton]

Actually Eric as soon as I wrap up the kitchen I am on I am heading to Spring Branch to help my buddy Corky Bell. So will be in your neighborhood.

[David Zaret]

larry, i build high-end, inset furniture and cabinets, and routinely use the lamello connectors to do exactly as you're describing - attach the face frame to a carcass, or to miter-wrap the face frame to finished panels, etc. prior to the lamello, i used my domino, or biscuits, and clamps/glue.... the lamello has taken the clamping out of the equation.

[Erik Loza]

Actually Eric as soon as I wrap up the kitchen I am on I am heading to Spring Branch to help my buddy Corky Bell. So will be in your neighborhood.

As in, Corky Bell of the motorsports world?

Erik

[Larry Edgerton]

As in, Corky Bell of the motorsports world?

Erik


Ya, he is a buddy of mine, we worked on a couple of projects together. I was down last winter, but right after I left Mary [his wife] had a stairs accident and passed away. He's a little down and I always love the conversations with him that range all over the map. Besides, its time for a roadtrip and its warm down there!