wood counter tops

[Günter VögelBerg]

I have a friend who has an airbnb cabin. They want to replace the formica countertops with wood. I said I advise against doing this in a kitchen, but that if they really want I would help them find the best way to do it, I suggested end grain butcher block, but said it would need to be oiled somewhat regularly and would be more work. I showed her a table top I made out of knotty alder with tinted epoxy to fill the cracks and she really likes that look. I said I fear that the alder is too soft and maple or oak would be a better choice. Am I right here? Is face grain alder suitable for a counter if finished properly?

Then, what types of finish would be suitable? I figure a two-part resin-type finish would probably be best. I see there are quite a few on the market with costs all over the place. Can anyone recommend one?

I don't really seek out paid woodworking jobs but I have done a few and I like the idea of doing this one. I think it sounds fun, but I want to make sure I can do it right. Plus, it will give me a reason to use (and will likely pay for) my new Domino XL.

[jack duren]

Alder is too soft. It will dent easily. Maple is fine. I'm not much for epoxy and can't get the brand of my phone as its iPhone locked till I can get it to KC to pull my photos off it. We use the epoxy for restaurants but use a semi gloss over it so it's not so glossy...

[Patrick Kane]

How large is the counter you are making? I’ve made end grain pieces in the 6-7’ range, but they are a little finicky once you get over 3-4’. Of all wood surfaces, that is the hardest to produce and most luxurious. Seems a bit over kill for a cabin, but perhaps this is a high end cabin.

All wood species will dent if subjected to mishandling. Sure, oak is harder on the janka scale, but I can dent oak pretty easily by ham-handing a heavy piece of cookware. If you choose wood as your main counter surface, I think you just need to accept the wear. It’s a cabin, I assume it’s rustic?

For finishing, I’ve used Waterlox original on a few and general finishes endurovar. Both seemed to have worked well enough. I would pick something that is easily repairable in place. It’s only a matter of time before a guest damages it.

[Jim Becker]

Maple would be my choice if it must be wood. I'd try and talk them into an alternative material for the surfaces around the sink if at all possible...soapstone, granite, composite that looks like stone, concrete, etc.

[Jeff Monson]

I have done a butcher block maple counter top in a lake house. I sprayed it with Waterlox for the finish and used a undermount sink that was sealed well from underneath. It has been 7 years and still looks great. NO cutting on it, make sure to supply lots of cutting boards and put up a sign if its in a rental unit.

[Matt Day]

I will never use butcher block again. I installed it in a shop space and that stuff moved and cupped way too much for me.

One tip would be to make sure your cabinets do not have a flat top, since the butcher block needs air to breathe on both sides. If they do, cut a hole in it.

[jack duren]

I will never use butcher block again. I installed it in a shop space and that stuff moved and cupped way too much for me.

One tip would be to make sure your cabinets do not have a flat top, since the butcher block needs air to breathe on both sides. If they do, cut a hole in it.

Sounds funny. Is your shop acclimated year around? I have a hickory butcher block for a work table but have no problems. It's acclimated and bolted down. ..

[jack duren]

Is Waterlox water proof?

[Prashun Patel]

For a rental unit, I would not use wood, except maybe on the island (if there is one).

If forced to do it, I would do edge-grain (quartersawn)

I have a cherry edge-grain bar top at home and it looks fine 10 years later. I finished it in Waterlox.

[Günter VögelBerg]

It is rustic, but it is a fairly high-end rental, like several hundred a night. It is right outside one of the national parks here.

I love waterlox and use it on almost everything, but I was leaning more towards something like behlen rockhard.

[Greg Funk]

I have a maple top in my shop. I used a water based finish from Target Coatings. It's held up well although I don't use the sink very often. Unless the counter was small I prefer face grain to end grain for a counter top.

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[Richard Coers]

I'd assume renters would see the wood countertops and think chopping block. As long as the owner doesn't mind knife marks everywhere. Personally, not for me, not even in my house. Never a fan of wood around water. How repairable is Behlen Rockford? Won't it chip if the top is used like a chopping block?

[Jak Kelly]

If it is an AIRBNB I'd go with the other suggestions of solid surfacing. You can often find reminiscent solid surface tops or "oopsy" ones at a very discounted price.
No way I'd leave options to chance like leaving plenty of cutting boards laying around, as they will probably just use those as coasters..........

[Matt Day]

Sounds funny. Is your shop acclimated year around? I have a hickory butcher block for a work table but have no problems. It's acclimated and bolted down. ..

It was for someone else’s shop. Brand new fancy conditioned building with indoor golf simulator and workout/rec room upstairs.

BB was from a name brand place too, finished per their instructions. Not worth the hassle with all the other solid surface options IMO.

[Tony Latham]

We have a large kitchen island topped with cherry. I finished it with several coats of Minwax oil-based polyurethane.

I think it's gorgeous and certainly durable.

T

[Rob Charles]

The lumber liquidators & similar butcher counter tops slabs are relatively cost effective & easy/cheap to swap out if needed. I have had good luck with Behlen's salad bowl finish. Easy to use but requires occasional scraping & reapplications. Compared to the expense of solid & stone surfaces, your friend could install several wood counter tops & still be money ahead. Short term/AirBnB renters will certainly eventually harm any counter top your friend will install. It is the nature of way too many STR/VR renters. AirBnB does not have a good reputation in backing the property owner in damage claim situations. Goos luck on the project which ever way you al go.

[Ron Citerone]

IMO, as much as I love wood, I think other counter top choices make more sense. I really think there are other options that don't compromise the Cottage/cabin style.

In my modest Bay cottage, my wife and kids always say while I am remodeling, less wood.

There are so many ways to incorporate wood into a cabin besides counter tops.

My 2 pennies..........worth what your paid, LOL

[Lee Schierer]

The problem with wood countertops in a rental is that visitors will use the countertop as a cutting board and it will get scarred up when people chop or cut food on it.

[julian abram]

This is a 7/4 cherry island countertop I built for our kitchen remodel 2 years ago. Finished with several coats of Waterlox on both top and bottom. It still looks great, shows almost no wear. Not sure about wood tops in a Airbnb, better chance for abuse. About $400 in materials as I recall.

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[Mel Fulks]

That finish product must be quite something , as you obviously have been unable to remove those drip rings from that
black marble !! Oh well....
Beautiful grain and color. Well done!

[Michael A. Tyree]

Waterlox question on waterproof- It is a great varnish but not waterproof as is a spar varnish to some degree. I have it on my wide board oak floors and it's my favorite all time varnish but still not waterproof. Wife uses Orange Glo on it and looks like the day I put it on in 2005. It alos is a VG finish for Wormy chestnut as it darkens in a way that brings out the woods best face.
A wooden counter in a rental is flat out asking for trouble! People don't respect such things enough that it will haunt you for choosing it. Even if it's not rented maintenance comes as part of the reality.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I did one from ash last winter, my customer really wanted what you see, I really suggested granite. She won, so 7 coats of satin Cabot water based poly (the best poly I've found), and she got this slab. It's holding up spectacularly, and she loves it. The completed pic is hiding from me, but you can see the finished wood better in this anyhow. I would do it again for a careful customer.


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[Ellen Benkin]

I agree with several earlier posts. Based on my experience with renters -- longer stays than B&B -- I would NEVER give them a chance to ruin a countertop with either water or knives. It's not theirs and they don't know or care to take care of it. Better to be safe or expect to "renew" it frequently.

Ellen

[mark mcfarlane]

The problem with wood countertops in a rental is that visitors will use the countertop as a cutting board and it will get scarred up when people chop or cut food on it.

+1. I believe wood countertops will get cut on and destroyed in a rental, regardless of the nightly price.

If it has to be wood, I'd look at Grizzly's maple butcher block (https://www.grizzly.com/search?q=(categoryid:360100)) bench tops. I have heavily used one for 3 years, no cracks or splits but I have planed/sanded it once. It dings, as any workbench top will, but its pretty darn hard. You'll probably want to scratch sand and add a thicker film finish.

Grizzly had the best price on pre-fab maple counter tops when I looked 3 years ago.

[Günter VögelBerg]

So this is what I am wondering...who puts their food directly on the counter to cut it? Do people think this is sanitary? It has never occured to me that this is a thing people do.

[Gustav Gabor]

Sadly, many see a wooden counter top as just a large cutting board, and use it as such. The nice, new look will be hacked up in no-time in a rental.


So this is what I am wondering...who puts their food directly on the counter to cut it? Do people think this is sanitary? It has never occured to me that this is a thing people do.

[mark mcfarlane]

So this is what I am wondering...who puts their food directly on the counter to cut it? Do people think this is sanitary? It has never occured to me that this is a thing people do.

The other likely risk is somewhat placing a hot pot on the wood countertop. People do crazy things, sometimes without thinking, sometimes people (like me) just space out and do something stupid.

[David Zaret]

in our house, we have a number of rooms with countertops - the laundry room has 8/4 walnut, and upstairs on a few "wet bars" we have 8/4 sapele. all three have under mount sinks. the kitchen has quartzite. for these "auxiliary" rooms/counters, wood is perfect - the walnut is finished with seal-a-cell and arm-r-seal, and the sapele is finished with waterlox original. both are absolutely beautiful, functional, and perfectly suitable for non-kitchen-related work.

if this house was meant to be rented, i probably wouldn't use wood on any horizontal surface. we don't baby our counters, but people are uncaring idiots.

i also wouldn't use a non-site-repairable film finish on a wood counter. the arm-r-seal and waterlox can be easily re-applied onsite.

one final thing - in the case of under mount sinks in wood counters, you expose a lot of end grain that has obvious potential to get wet. what i do is soak that end grain with epoxy, and then go through the normal sanding/finishing process. the epoxy stabilizes and locks the end grain so that no fluids can soak in.

here's a shot of part of the walnut top, with my funky backsplash:

walnut countertop (https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/#B0b5GNi8frFD2V;7DD87DF4-E374-47F0-BC99-67FFC3AC78D3)

[Prashun Patel]

That walnut countertop and backsplash are so whimsical. Would love to see the rest of the room!

[Jim Becker]

So this is what I am wondering...who puts their food directly on the counter to cut it? Do people think this is sanitary? It has never occured to me that this is a thing people do.
Do not underestimate the ability of humans to do things that might not be good choices, especially when the end result doesn't affect something they own themselves. Even in our own home, it took a lot of coaching to get my daughters, especially the older, to understand that the island top isn't a cutting board, despite looking like one. In rental properties, regardless if they are long term or short term, people are going to do what people do and a rental owner has to keep that up-front in their thinking to mitigate maintenance and repair costs over time. In this case, continual abuse could actually make the property less desirable as a rental as a knackered-up counter could be off-putting.

[Doug Dawson]

Do not underestimate the ability of humans to do things that might not be good choices, especially when the end result doesn't affect something they own themselves. Even in our own home, it took a lot of coaching to get my daughters, especially the older, to understand that the island top isn't a cutting board, despite looking like one. In rental properties, regardless if they are long term or short term, people are going to do what people do and a rental owner has to keep that up-front in their thinking to mitigate maintenance and repair costs over time. In this case, continual abuse could actually make the property less desirable as a rental as a knackered-up counter could be off-putting.

From the annals of neurology, there is something deep down in the reptilian part of the brain that makes people just _want_ to use a wooden countertop as a cutting board. It's uncanny, and can be thrilling to watch, if it wasn't so unnerving. If you're installing a wooden countertop, particularly with users having no conception of consequences, you are fighting Mother Nature, and She always wins.

[Jim Becker]

THAT was well stated, Doug!!!

[Jeff Duncan]

Well I'll throw one more opinion in for the heck of it. I like wood counters.... heck I'm a woodworker, it's only natural. Wood is a great material for counters, it looks great, is easily repairable, and depending on species and how you find it, it can be inexpensive. I'm always shocked to hear about people cutting on them, but apparently the other posters have more experience with that than I. If there's a sink in it then I'd lean towards a poly base or other film finish. It doesn't have to be some indestructible finish, if it gets worn over the years you can simply refinish. Mine is over 15 years old with a farmers sink in it.... so lots of end grain. End grain looks as good as the day I installed it and it was a water based poly by Target. Only problem areas I have are around the faucet, (single hole and my fault for rushing and not finishing the holes), and under the dish rack, places that are wet constantly. Unfortunately I can't touch mine up as its stained mahogany, so I have to pull the whole thing to redo..... one day;)

If it does not have a sink installed then you can get by with an oil finish. Much easier to maintain and you don't have to worry about hot pans.

Either way I like wood tops and am always amazed at how many woodworkers are afraid to use wood:rolleyes: No its not as durable as granite, but it's a heck of a lot better than laminate or plastic IMHO.

anyway good luck with whatever you choose!
JeffD

[Ole Anderson]

Probably not a good choice for a rental. If you follow Pure Living for Life, you know Jesse made a kitchenette counter top out of doug fir scraps. Went with a dulled epoxy top. Actually looks pretty good, interesting to see how it wears, and if it stays flat.

[Erik Loza]

We have solid walnut countertops in both guest and master baths. I was against the idea from the start but my wife was in love with it, so you know how that goes... Carpenter-friend she wanted to send some business towards when we were doing our major remodel in 2012. They were (I believed) finished with Parks Super Glaze. The master bath one has been needing to be totally refinished for a while. Just been too busy to want to tackle. The constant water exposure in the backsplash areas has pretty much dissolved the finish.

Erik