The start of a build

[Derek Cohen]

I thought that the build might begin with preparing the panels, since there has been some interest in the past shown in the shorter Hammer K3 sliders. Mine has a 49" long slider and a 31" wide table for the rip fence.


The build is an entry hall table for a wedding present for a niece. Her choice was this mid century modern piece, which will be the basis for the build. My job is to re-invent it somewhat.


https://i.postimg.cc/3xzcRy9f/Jes-Entry-Table.jpg


She wants Jarrah, and I have managed to find something spectacular ... a subtle fiddleback (curly) set of boards that will make a book match (as they are only about 9" wide each).


https://i.postimg.cc/CKNnYw79/Wood1.jpg


https://i.postimg.cc/Hsp3s0mk/Resaw7.jpg


https://i.postimg.cc/4xy5pJmC/Resaw9.jpg


Most imagine that the value of a slider lies with cross-cutting. It certainly is so. However it is the rip using the slider - rather than the rip fence - which is so amazing.


One side of each board was to be ripped on the slider, before being jointed and resawn. Ripping on the slider is such an advantage with life edges. No jigs required. No rip fence to slide against. Just clamp the board on the slider, and run it past the saw blade. The long sliders can complete the rip in one quick pass. It occurred to me that I should take a few photos of ripping to width since the boards are longer than the slider.


Here you can see that it comes up short ...


https://i.postimg.cc/9FJb44Xt/Resaw10.jpg


In actuality, with the blade raised fully, there is a cut of nearly 54" ...


https://i.postimg.cc/DfQBTjtN/Resaw11.jpg


The solution is to use a combination square to register the position of the side of the board at the front, and then slide the board forward and reposition it ...


https://i.postimg.cc/26R7phTm/Resaw12.jpg


... and repeat at the rear ...


https://i.postimg.cc/wBsQb0X0/Resaw13.jpg


The result is a pretty good edge, one that is cleaned up on the jointer in 1 or 2 passes, and then ready for resawing ...


https://i.postimg.cc/XYPg8TCr/Resaw14.jpg


This is the glued panel. It is long enough to make a waterfall two sides and top section (still oversize) ...


https://i.postimg.cc/BbNT1y3Q/Resaw15.jpg


The following photo shows the lower section at the rear. What I wanted to show is the way boards are stored. Since I shall not get back to this build until next weekend, all boards are stickered and clamped using steel square sections.


https://i.postimg.cc/50Bqfykz/Resaw16.jpg


The steel sections are inexpensive galvanised mild steel. These are covered in vinyl duct tape to prevent any marks on the wood and ease in removing glue ...


https://i.postimg.cc/PJdbJHBR/Resaw17.jpg


Done for the day ...


https://i.postimg.cc/CM4HtZ8T/Resaw18.jpg


Enough for the case (top/bottom and sides), which will be through dovetailed with mitred corners, the stock for 4 legs (yet to be turned), and rails for the legs (the legs will be staked mortice-and-tenon) and attached with a sliding dovetail.


Regards from Perth


Derek

[Kris Cook]

Looking forward to seeing the progress. Thanks.

[Patrick Walsh]

Beautiful stock Derek,

What I’d give to add those boards to my collection.

[Doug Garson]

Looking forward to the build also, thanks for sharing. I'm puzzled about the long rip on the slider. Understand how it would work for the second edge but how did you rip the first edge?

[Mel Fulks]

I think the frame around the drawer and the legs would look better with sharper edges. Would show better ,cleaner,
shadows. And I KNOW I will enjoy watching progress.

[Patrick Walsh]

I agree with a sharper edge.

This piece has inspired me a bit Derek.

I started a piece last winter to house one of my dogs that passed last fall. It’s a Krenov type piece. The base is finished but the top case has not even begun although I have a working drawing. As is now it is planned to be miter wrapped using hidden dovetails. I have yet to attempt them to dat and plan to construct the piece from Satin wood lol. I think I will add the chamfered edge as in this piece but also chamfer the doors and drawers to seat perfectly flush with the carcass.

I’m sure you will be done with five project before I finish my single project.


I think the frame around the drawer and the legs would look better with sharper edges. Would show better ,cleaner,
shadows. And I KNOW I will enjoy watching progress.

[Derek Cohen]

Looking forward to the build also, thanks for sharing. I'm puzzled about the long rip on the slider. Understand how it would work for the second edge but how did you rip the first edge?

Doug, exactly the same way - simply slide the board past the blade. That is the advantage of the slider. You can rip without a reference edge. Of course, the longer the slider the longer the rip. Still, I rarely need the capacity of the big sliders as I work with solid wood and not ply.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Derek Cohen]

I think the frame around the drawer and the legs would look better with sharper edges. Would show better ,cleaner,
shadows. And I KNOW I will enjoy watching progress.

Mel, here is a close up of the original table ...

https://i.postimg.cc/VLHhsLHc/ss18-h-chvcon-detail.png

Thoughts?

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Prashun Patel]

Dumb question: where are the pulls located for this case? I like that mitered, inset face frame. The more I look at it, the more I realize I haven't seem much like that, and that it would be deceptively challenging (for me) to make.

I am sure your version will be crisper yet.

[Derek Cohen]

Prashun, indeed, where are the pulls? :)

I discussed this on the hand tool forum a little while ago. The original design appears to use slides and push-it mechanisms. In the end I decided that I would build traditional drawers and add handles. They will be discrete and in the same wood, and so will disappear.

The case is planned to be through dovetailed with mitred ends.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Mark Gibney]

Derek I enjoy that your posts like this one have a magazine level presentation, with good photographs and clear text. Looking forward to the rest of it.

[Paul F Mills]

This is going to be a great looking piece. I am getting ready to build a bedside table that will have a similar drawer/miteres case look.
What is the purpose of clamping the panels with the steel stock? Is it to keep them from warping after you have cut and released stress?

[Doug Garson]

Doug, exactly the same way - simply slide the board past the blade. That is the advantage of the slider. You can rip without a reference edge. Of course, the longer the slider the longer the rip. Still, I rarely need the capacity of the big sliders as I work with solid wood and not ply.

Regards from Perth

Derek
Still not getting it. In your op, you show using a tee square to reference the opposite edge (reference edge) as you move the piece forward to finish the cut, how does that work if the opposite edge is not straight if you started with live edge slabs? I understand that with a slider you don't need a reference edge if you make the cut in one step but you are using a straight edge as your reference to relocate the piece to complete the cut. I would think you would have to use the first cut edge as your reference to relocate the piece to finish the cut.

[Derek Cohen]

Still not getting it.

Doug, it is a matter of using something to measure the position of the board at each end, so that when you silide the board forward, the positioning is maintained.

I use a set of combination squares, each extended to reach from the side of the slider (which is square and a reliable reference) to the edge of the work piece. Make sure you mark this position on the work piece. Do the same at the other end of the board.

When you slide the work piece forward, use the combination square to return the board to the same position. The shape of the side of the workpiece does not matter since you have taken this into account with the combination square.

Regads from Perth

Derek

[Derek Cohen]

...
What is the purpose of clamping the panels with the steel stock? Is it to keep them from warping after you have cut and released stress?

Paul, the cauls are to minimise movement while the boards are waiting to be worked again. This could be a week or more.

All wood moves. And then relaxes. I attempt to ensure that it relaxes in the shape I want it to be. Keep in mind that I observe all the usual precautions for air flow around the boards, etc.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Doug Garson]

Doug, it is a matter of using something to measure the position of the board at each end, so that when you silide the board forward, the positioning is maintained.

I use a set of combination squares, each extended to reach from the side of the slider (which is square and a reliable reference) to the edge of the work piece. Make sure you mark this position on the work piece. Do the same at the other end of the board.

When you slide the work piece forward, use the combination square to return the board to the same position. The shape of the side of the workpiece does not matter since you have taken this into account with the combination square.

Regads from Perth

Derek
OK now I get it one end might be 2" from the edge and the other 2 1/4" and you use 2 tee squares one set for each of those dimensions. Very clever, thanks for clarifying.

[Paul F Mills]

Thanks, Derek

[Mel Fulks]

Derek, somehow I didn't see your post til now. The top and side look OK in close up. Bottom piece looks kinda'
whittled and crude, and I guess that's what got my attention. A "cove and bead " type edge might look good too,and
a little less office-like.

[Derek Cohen]

Mel, those were my thoughts as well. A straight chamfer looks kind of clinical, where as a cove should soften the edge and create a warmer look.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Matt Lau]

This will be lovely. Thanks for sharing, Derek

[Mick Simon]

Derek, I'm going to the Felder open house in Dallas next week. If I return with a receipt for a sliding tablesaw I'm billing you for at least half of it! :D

[andy bessette]

...Here you can see that it comes up short ...The solution is to use a combination square to register the position of the side of the board at the front, and then slide the board forward and reposition it ... and repeat at the rear ...

A better solution is to use a track saw to straighten the edge, rather than work around the limitations of the sliding saw.

[Derek Cohen]

Andy, I do not own a track saw. 98% of the time my slider is long enough. The work around does a terrific job, and takes a couple of minutes to set up and saw. I could easily get around 100" in length. I also have a 4" depth of cut. What can your track and saw get? :)

Regards from Perth

Derek

[andy bessette]

Andy, I do not own a track saw. 98% of the time my slider is long enough. The work around does a terrific job, and takes a couple of minutes to set up and saw. I could easily get around 100" in length. I also have a 4" depth of cut. What can your track and saw get? :)

Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek--the material you picture being ripped appears to be far less than 4" thick, and I have never had to rip anything near that thickness. Nor have I ever owned a sliding saw. Ripping long boards is far easier and quicker using the track saw or table saw (of which I have four). Really think your estimate of "a couple minutes to setup and saw" is a great exaggeration. The cost of an excellent track saw is negligible when compared to that of a sliding saw. Though, if you normally only work with short pieces like the ones pictured, I see why you would not mind the extra time it takes you to do it on the slider on those rare occasions.

[Jim Becker]

Different strokes for different folks... ;) ...literally in this case. :D

[Patrick Walsh]

Lol, Jim that’s pretty darn funny....

You know and not to just be a fan boy or another guy in the slider club.

But you know I also agree the slider is way more easy than the track saw for this task. Or actually the same dam difference if nothing else. Slap the piece down make a couple marks, align the marks with either the track, the blade, a sliding table, the fence whatever and cut. Neither option is the slightest complicated or time consuming and none of it rocket science if you know your way around a shop in the slightest.

I’ll say this, when I relied on a track saw for straight lining rough lumber I often ran in the the issue of my Festool saw “whatever the big one is” not having enough depth of cut. The solution was a handsaw to finish the cut. Sure you could flip but is you screw up well you gotta do it again. The hand saw and block plane and your good to go. Again no big deal either way.

But you know honestly the above is not a big deal but I don’t have the time for all that when I can just throw the piece down on a sliding saw. Clamp it and run it by the blade.

Plus you known that hammer slider is not really all that expensive other than that it’s a Australian Hammer and their exchange rate stinks. Beyond that used slider can be had for fairly short money all said.

I understand a slider is a expense and honestly not everyone has the room nor do they want to make the room. But if the argument is it’s just as easy with a track saw. Well maybe but imop nothing is as easy as throwing on the slider.

Yup I’m a slider fanboy. Can’t imagine building much of anything without one ever again. Could I sure we all can, I just find a slider a indispensable tool for a myriad of task.





Different strokes for different folks... ;) ...literally in this case. :D

[Derek Cohen]

Derek--the material you picture being ripped appears to be far less than 4" thick, and I have never had to rip anything near that thickness. Nor have I ever owned a sliding saw. Ripping long boards is far easier and quicker using the track saw or table saw (of which I have four). Really think your estimate of "a couple minutes to setup and saw" is a great exaggeration. The cost of an excellent track saw is negligible when compared to that of a sliding saw. Though, if you normally only work with short pieces like the ones pictured, I see why you would not mind the extra time it takes you to do it on the slider on those rare occasions.

Hi Andy

It’s a little egocentric of me to expect you to be aware that I only work with rough sawn timbers and never with panels. I do have a circular saw, but find it easier to crosscut to rough size a board on the slider. The boards in the photo started at about 2” thick, but many I get are 4” thick. I was pointing to them.

As Jim, Patrick and others have noted, one of the delights of a slider is the ease of ripping - without using the rip fence. The Hammer K3 I have is a one of this with a shorter slider (49” ... and many have twice this length).

My shop is in one half of a double garage, and I lack the space for anything longer. The size of a sliding saw is deceptive - the slider must travel to the front and rear. Mine just squeezes in at the bench end.

For some time I was under the impression that would limit the length that could be ripped on my shorter slider. The purposes of this post was not simply to illustrate the start of a build, but to demonstrate a technique (which I had not seen anyone else use) to rip a longer board than the slider. In practice, it takes a minute to slide the board forward in the kerf, and position them (using a pair of combination square, or something equivalent - I think I will make a set of wooden versions just for this purpose).

This looks as if there is plenty of space ...

https://i.postimg.cc/76FDZ9tw/11a.jpg

.... until looked from this angle ...

https://i.postimg.cc/xCWpz4Sp/10a.jpg

Perhaps I should get a cut from Felder for helping sell shorter sliders to those who believe that they have limitations? :)

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Patrick Walsh]

I have to say my favorite use for a slider is not ripping but crosscutting.

For instance rails and stiles for door parts. Or anytime you need any to thinks exactly the same length and dead square.

I have no use for a miter saw anymore. I break my rough stock down with a circular saw. Miter saws have so many issues. As many have said they are made for site work as a best case option..

Otherwise I loath the things.


Hi Andy

It’s a little egocentric of me to expect you to be aware that I only work with rough sawn timbers and never with panels. I do have a circular saw, but find it easier to crosscut to rough size a board on the slider. The boards in the photo started at about 2” thick, but many I get are 4” thick. I was pointing to them.

As Jim, Patrick and others have noted, one of the delights of a slider is the ease of ripping - without using the rip fence. The Hammer K3 I have is a one of this with a shorter slider (49” ... and many have twice this length).

My shop is in one half of a double garage, and I lack the space for anything longer. The size of a sliding saw is deceptive - the slider must travel to the front and rear. Mine just squeezes in at the bench end.

For some time I was under the impression that would limit the length that could be ripped on my shorter slider. The purposes of this post was not simply to illustrate the start of a build, but to demonstrate a technique (which I had not seen anyone else use) to rip a longer board than the slider. In practice, it takes a minute to slide the board forward in the kerf, and position them (using a pair of combination square, or something equivalent - I think I will make a set of wooden versions just for this purpose).

This looks as if there is plenty of space ...

https://i.postimg.cc/76FDZ9tw/11a.jpg

.... until looked from this angle ...

https://i.postimg.cc/xCWpz4Sp/10a.jpg

Perhaps I should get a cut from Felder for helping sell shorter sliders to those who believe that they have limitations? :)

Regards from Perth

Derek

[andy bessette]

Totally understand about limited space; for a number of years I worked out of a single-car garage on an ancient 8" Sears tilt-table saw (3rd photo).

By some of the other comments it seems I was misunderstood to be dissing the sliding saw because I mentioned one of its limitations--that was not my intent.
My principal table saw has a combination carbide blade and the Laguna sliding table added; first photo shows the slide mounted with the table stored under the saw's extension/router table. 2nd photo shows my ripping and dado setup.

https://i.postimg.cc/ZR0bfb5B/shop-1.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/hjhm9qFM/shop-2.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://i.postimg.cc/V65k4qJh/sears-saw-1.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[Steve Fish]

Ok maybe a dumb question but would a long crosscut sled work in the slider groove to gain another foot or so of capacity?
Anyway, I’m looking forward to the rest of this build. Thanks for taking the time to document it.

[Derek Cohen]

Steve, not a dumb suggestion. I have a “kit” from Felder, which consists of an insert for the groove, to which a ply table is added. This creates a table on a table, with the upper table able to increase the distance of the slide. I have not made it up yet because I view it primarily for sheet goods, which I rarely use (also, there is the method described here). Adding a table will reduce blade height, which would affect breaking down the rough sawn timber I begin with.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Becker]

Ok maybe a dumb question but would a long crosscut sled work in the slider groove to gain another foot or so of capacity?
That is a valid method that some folks with short-sliders use to increase wagon-based ripping capacity. But the OP is kinda doing that without the sled if you visualize what he describes.

Edit...and now I see he addressed that, too. :)

[Steve Fish]

Thanks for the explanation, I’m not familiar with these machines so I find it interesting to see the different methods and the reasoning behind them. Even if it’s just ripping some lumber

[Tom Bender]

Steve
That's an inspirational question. On my traditional TS I use a (one sided) crosscut sled. It is 3/16" thick plywood so it does not take away much depth. But it is only about 24" square and has no clamping capability so ripping on it is limited to short wide pieces. If I make a long sled and configure for clamping or an adjustable fence on it I will be able to do more.

Derek
Thanks for the thread, yours are always enjoyable and educational. BTW yur editor missed a typo back there

Tom