Embarrassed to have to ask, Hand Saws

[ChrisA Edwards]

I'm a power tools kind of guy, but there are times when one of my motorized saws will not be suitable for the cut that needs to be made.

So I'm looking for a good hand saw, Tenon Saw?

It's getting near Xmas, so this might be the opportunity to put one of these on my Santa list.

I have no idea on what to get, saw type, brand, TPI, etc., etc..

I used a Lie-Nielsen hand saw, a couple of years ago at a hand tool woodworking class where we made a lot of different wood joints, finishing up with Dovetail joints.

I don't see this saw getting a lot of use, but I'd like to get something of quality, but hopefully less than $200.

Thanks

[David Bassett]

... I don't see this saw getting a lot of use, but I'd like to get something of quality, but hopefully less than $200. ....

If you can live with the non-traditional appearance, the Veritas saws are incredible values. As to which size, that depends on what you're using them for. The depth of cut on their smallest dovetail saw is a little greater than some of the more expensive saws, so it might be enough as a single saw. Their carcass saw is a little larger and might be a good compromise, big enough for most joint cuts and small enough to still be nimble. The call their largest back saw a Tenon saw. It's not too nimble, and I certainly not want to use one for dovetails. (Or you could maybe get their set of three, only $239 with free shipping right now.)

[Frederick Skelly]

We're in a renaissance for hand tools. There are SOOO many good, capable saws these days. I have not tried the Lee Valley tenon saw, but have both of their others (carcass and dovetail) and I like them. LINK (https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/hand-tools/saws/back/71370-veritas-rip-and-crosscut-tenon-saws) Lie Neilsen makes good, affordable stuff. Or you can go with Boutique makers, but from what I've seen, they are over your $200 budget.

Edit: Looks like David and I were typing the same sugestion at same time!

[David Eisenhauer]

A back saw in the 14"-16" length range, 3"+ of cutting capacity underneath the back, around .020 - .025 thick saw plate and approx. 10 - 12 ppi filed rip will be of good use for all general hand saw cutting tasks that will not be affected by the limitations of a back on the saw. That pretty much defines a "tenon" saw. If you want to go new as opposed to refurbishing an older saw, the Veritas is certainly amongst the lower priced saws available and does not get any serious knocks that I have ever noticed. That saw is usually recommended for someone to "try out hand sawing" with and not spend lots of $ on (new cost $70?, not sure here). Moving up in the price category, the LN (around $175 if memory serves) saws seem to be well made and have been called somewhat of a "best bang for your buck" saw in the higher priced saw category. There are boutique saws (Bad Axe, Ron Bontz, etc) that cost more and all have very good reviews. I believe Bad Axe has a section on their web site that describes selecting which saw (one of theirs) to get for which application and other technical info on saws that may help you with which type to get. This is one of those "how much do you want to pay" things, but I believe that most of the saws mentioned will hold a very decent resale value if you decide that a back saw is not for you. If you create a knife wall for a back saw to follow, the power tools don't always get turned on automatically.

[Zac wingert]

I think you might be over thinking it. The more you spend, the more of a specialized tool you are gonna get. If you’re not a hand tool person, you should get a Japanese saw. Ryoba - cross cut teeth on one side and rip teeth on the other. $30 to $80 and you’ll be set. You’ll be surprised how much you use it. And really this is not a bargain tool, it is capable of doing very high quality work, once you know how to use it. Can’t go wrong.

[Jay Champagne]

I have a couple of inexpensive Japanese type saws and find that it's the tool I reach for when I need to hand cut/ finish or tune a cut.

[Frank Drackman]

I would follow Zac's advice.


I think you might be over thinking it. The more you spend, the more of a specialized tool you are gonna get. If you’re not a hand tool person, you should get a Japanese saw. Ryoba - cross cut teeth on one side and rip teeth on the other. $30 to $80 and you’ll be set. You’ll be surprised how much you use it. And really this is not a bargain tool, it is capable of doing very high quality work, once you know how to use it. Can’t go wrong.

[Carl Beckett]

I would follow Zac's advice.

Agree.

For many years I had two of these (although one was a different brand). A coarse pitch and a fine pitch. I would use the coarse pitch any time I needed to just lop something off. The fine pitch when needing precise cut, or even dovetailing. Since then I have switched to the LV dovetail saw which I prefer. Any of those back pull saw brands would work just fine for general use, and you might find one on sale for around $35.

To this day I have not spent $200 on a hand saw. Wait - my wife did get me a super nice LN tenon saw for xmas a couple years back. It has mostly sat on the shelf.

[Jim Becker]

A few small hand saws are essential "accessory tools" for even the most die-hard machine woodworking including when CNC is in play! (Mine actually live on custom brackets right next to my CNC machine in my shop. :) ) There are just some tasks that are best done with these tools for both efficiency and safety. I have a couple of nice ones I bought years ago, but if I were buying today under the same parameters as you state, I'd probably get the "modern" Veritas saws or some Japanese pull saws...or both...to fill the need. Don't forget a flush trim saw, too.

[Prashun Patel]

What type of cut are you looking to make?

The irony of the tenon saw is I rarely use mine for tenons. it's too tall and unwieldy to be used that easily at first, IMHO.

I also think Ryobas are a bad first choice. The lack of a spine makes them harder to control on joinery cuts. To get the most out of them, IMHO, you need to alter how you approach the cut and place your piece.

If you are primarily a power tool guy, then IMHO a good first choice is a Kataba or Dozuki japanese saw or a Western Carcass or coarse tooth dovetail saw. Any of these will be delicate enough to use on a lot of joinery that might be too small to cut with your power tools. The Dozuki is really great for small work. The carcass is better for general cross cutting. The other two are in the middle.

The 'rip' saw is something I'd get after you get conversant with a cross cut saw.

[Robert Hazelwood]

I have to second the notion for a mid sized ryoba. I really like the Gyokucho brand- sharp, affordable, but very durable. I've had no trouble sawing very hard woods with it- no issues with teeth breaking.

They have a bit more set to them than a boutique western saw does. Not much more, and I don't really find it a problem. If you aren't super skilled with handsaws then the level of set is probably ideal. But if you want to reduce the set, you can stone the teeth a bit- look up one of Stanley Covington's old posts for more details.

[Derek Cohen]

I'm a power tools kind of guy, but there are times when one of my motorized saws will not be suitable for the cut that needs to be made.

So I'm looking for a good hand saw, Tenon Saw?

It's getting near Xmas, so this might be the opportunity to put one of these on my Santa list.

I have no idea on what to get, saw type, brand, TPI, etc., etc..

I used a Lie-Nielsen hand saw, a couple of years ago at a hand tool woodworking class where we made a lot of different wood joints, finishing up with Dovetail joints.

I don't see this saw getting a lot of use, but I'd like to get something of quality, but hopefully less than $200.

Thanks

Chris, what do you want with a handsaw? Cut dovetails? Get a dovetail saw - Veritas (cheaper) or LN (more), both excellent, both reliable. These are all 10" in length. The Veritas is easier for the first timer as the teeth have a more relaxed rake, while the LN cuts faster, but you need to know what you are doing. Tenons? Get a tenon saw, preferably 14" in length and 11 tpi. LN make a good one. Or the Gramercy. I have this one and love it.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Brian Holcombe]

Gyokucho 372 for dovetailing and a middle size ryoba will likely do everything you need to do wrt handsawing. I bought the 372 for students because it was inexpensive, that was years ago now and I use it a lot!

[johnny means]

Another vote for a ryoba. That and one of those inexpensive little Irwin detail saws is what I've settled on after 20 odd years of woodworking. Tenons, dovetails, doorjamb, flush trimming, plunge cuts, I can't think of any straight cuts we've these two wouldn't get the job done cleanly.
Plus, if you'r not going full neander, the throw away blades makes life real easy.

[Derek Cohen]

I have used both Western and Eastern saw for decades. It is relevant to weigh up the slightly greater effort in pushing a saw, along with the longer life of a Western saw blade (for occasional use, a new blade will remain sharp for some years) vs the ease of a pull cut but allied with fragile teeth (in inexperienced hands).

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Tom Bender]

There is no one saw for all cuts and high priced saws are only marginally better than mid priced ones especially in less experienced hands. Spend your $200 on a few inexpensive saws. Later you can get better ones, one each Christmas.