Stupid Frame and Panel Question

[David Eisenhauer]

I use an amount of frame and panel construction in my projects and wonder what width dado you run to seat a 1/4" panel in. I have always gone with a 1/4" dado, but occasionally run into a slight misalignment issue where the panel is off to one side of the dado at one of the two ends of the seating frame (usually legs) member. I then slightly trim the offending side of the dado at an angle to allow the panel to seat. Do you run a 1/4" for a 1/4" panel or use a 5/16" dado?

[lowell holmes]

Why don't you experiment on the joint and make your mind up?
You might do three or four samples.

[David Eisenhauer]

I should do that. I was just wondering if I was way out of norm in thinking about 5/16". Thanks for the thought Lowell.

[glenn bradley]

This may vary with the profile of your raise. If there is a clean 1/4" 'tongue' with enough 'land' to fit I run a 1/4" wide x 3/8" deep groove and use space balls or silicone rubber to assure centering throughout the seasons.

[Brian Holcombe]

Better to cure the misalignment by adding a haunch to the joint and placing the mortise in the groove.

[David Eisenhauer]

Yeah Glenn, I'm thinking I just need to pay better attention on my layout and avoid the misalignment in the first place. It occurs occasionally when I make up narrower rails to fatter legs and have an offset of the edges of the rails to the legs.

[steven c newman]

Whatever a Stanley #12 cutter is for width....as that is what I use in my Stanley #45. (just checked....0.250" wide)

Panels I have been using are 5mm.

[David Eisenhauer]

I need to think about that one Brian. I believe that it could be that the tennon on the rail end is slightly off and kicks the whole rail over slightly where it meets the mortise in the leg. There is no give in the fairly flexible panel right at the end where it enters the dado in the rail next to the leg. This sort of goes back to your "precision setup" argument in that it works better when the layout is exactly dead-on centered so that it does not matter if a piece gets rotated/flipped end for end, etc. I end up chopping the dados in the legs by hand (after using a mortise gauge to mark them out) because the leg dados (panel receivers) are usually in the middle run of the legs and a plow won't work. I plow the dados in the upper and lower rails after marking them out with a mortise gauge without any issue, so the most likely spot for error must be the tenon fab being off some, which kicks the rail out at the end. Answer - better execution rather than 5/16" dados for a not-very-often-error anyway. So my shiny, never used 5/16" plow iron will not be entering the game.

[Jim Koepke]

I end up chopping the dados in the legs by hand (after using a mortise gauge to mark them out) because the leg dados (panel receivers) are usually in the middle run of the legs and a plow won't work.

Depending on your plow plane there is a way to make it work:

https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?196104

With a little outside the box set up it is not difficult to make stopped rabbets, grooves or dados with a plow plane.

jtk

[Steve Voigt]

Hi Dave, I agree that it is better to track down the source of misalignment, and then if all else fails fix it on an ad hoc basis (as you're already doing), than to intentionally build such a large amount of slop into your work. With that said, I would not make a .250" groove for a .250" panel; better to have the groove 1/64 to 1/32 oversize. This will take care of any minor misalignments. If you have 1/16 misalignment, that is a problem that needs fixing.

Also, just a tiny vocab note, so we're all on the same page: a groove in a rail or stile is just a groove. A dado is a cross grain groove. No biggie; just wanted to mention it in case anyone was confused.

[David Eisenhauer]

Jim - I actully use the plow or the 45 to score or cut out a shallow groove for the panel mortise chisel to ride in, but have never tried to cut the whole groove by extending the blade. Steve - Indeed it is. Don't know why I called it a mortise when t is a groove. Apparently, my 5/16" plow blade is not going to be used until I use "fat" 1/4" panels.