Shapeoko - XXL - Anybody running one?

[Dennis Peacock]

Well, I've seriously looked at my finances and it has reflected that I am not going to be able to pay cash for a Stinger II or even a Stinger I CNC setup. So, I'm now looking at the Shapeoko 3 XXL to allow me to get experience with CNC and enable me to do a few things that I could surely use in my shop right now.

I'm looking for feedback......oh, and I'm planning on running VCarve Pro.

My heart is on a Stinger II 4x8, I lowered my desires due to "money" and that dropped me to a Stinger I 2x3 and then I thought and looked more and have had to drop to looking at the Shapeoko 3 XXL.

Thoughts? Experiences?

[Jim Becker]

I think it's a nice machine for the money, Dennis. In fact, it was my original target before I decided to go larger/heavier. Of the small, "kit" CNCs, I found the Shapeoko the most appealing and the XXL provides enough space to do useful work. It's also capable of being pushed for really fine non-ferous metal work...just watch some of Winston Moy's videos on YouTube.

I'm 100% for you getting some kind of CNC into your operation, Dennis...I think the technology is right down your skills ally and that you'll really eat it up. If you need something cut larger once in awhile, we can work something out.

[Jerome Stanek]

Have you looked at this one.

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/showthread.php?25161-FOR-SALE-BENCHTOP-24X32-w-RBK-upgrade

[Dennis Peacock]

Have you looked at this one.

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/showthread.php?25161-FOR-SALE-BENCHTOP-24X32-w-RBK-upgrade

I'll go check it out. Thanks for the link.

[David Buchhauser]

Well, I've seriously looked at my finances and it has reflected that I am not going to be able to pay cash for a Stinger II or even a Stinger I CNC setup. So, I'm now looking at the Shapeoko 3 XXL to allow me to get experience with CNC and enable me to do a few things that I could surely use in my shop right now.

I'm looking for feedback......oh, and I'm planning on running VCarve Pro.

My heart is on a Stinger II 4x8, I lowered my desires due to "money" and that dropped me to a Stinger I 2x3 and then I thought and looked more and have had to drop to looking at the Shapeoko 3 XXL.

Thoughts? Experiences?

Hi Dennis,
Do you have a budget in mind for the acquisition of a new (or used) cnc router? (Including any software purchase required to run it).
Thanks,
David

[Dennis Peacock]

David,
I'm trying to stay around the $3K mark. And for sure to stay under the $4K mark. I know that I can put a CNC to work right now....but money is my problem and not things to make with a CNC. I've almost given up on the idea of putting a CNC in my shop but I know that.....in my heart of hearts....that I really need to put one in my shop. I just need to figure out how (financially).

[Richard Gonzalez]

Look at the Avid CNC (formerly CNC Router Parts) kits, substantially more capable machines (at an admittedly higher price).

I designed and built my own that was comfortably under your $3k price, but I lucked into some bargain materials.

[David Buchhauser]

David,
I'm trying to stay around the $3K mark. And for sure to stay under the $4K mark. I know that I can put a CNC to work right now....but money is my problem and not things to make with a CNC. I've almost given up on the idea of putting a CNC in my shop but I know that.....in my heart of hearts....that I really need to put one in my shop. I just need to figure out how (financially).

Hi Dennis,
That Shapeoko XXL looks like a very capable machine. There was a used one that sold recently for $1000 including some extra bits on the Shapeoko forum.
That might be a good place to look if you are interested in saving some money by purchasing one second hand. Do you already have a computer to use as a dedicated controller? If not - reconditioned ones are pretty inexpensive these days. I just bought this one on Ebay for $205 with free shipping.

I think you can have a pretty nice setup (Shapeoko XXL, VCarve Pro, control computer, router, bits, etc.) and still be right around your $3k target.
David

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-Fast-HP-Windows-10-Pro-Desktop-Computer-PC-Quad-Core-i5-8GB-RAM-250GB-SSD-WiFi/271267412814?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649



https://forum.shapeoko.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=9981&sid=b9f4256c648e5d79539f9b4716ab5b7a

417688


(https://forum.shapeoko.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=9981&sid=b9f4256c648e5d79539f9b4716ab5b7a)

[John Lifer]

I just bought one and in process of putting it together. Decent kit, appears to be well thought out. I DO see the Z axis being the weak spot and the HDZ upgrade with a spindle (about $7-800 additional) is probably in my future once I figure out how to run this thing. BTW, there WAS one on Craig's list down in Little Rock last week. I didn't want to travel 8 hours, so I let it pass. I thought hard about another machine, but it was way smaller machine and more $ at the time.
It was still on FaceB and close to me in Springdale as of early last week.

[Dennis Peacock]

Hi Dennis,
That Shapeoko XXL looks like a very capable machine. There was a used one that sold recently for $1000 including some extra bits on the Shapeoko forum.
That might be a good place to look if you are interested in saving some money by purchasing one second hand. Do you already have a computer to use as a dedicated controller? If not - reconditioned ones are pretty inexpensive these days. I just bought this one on Ebay for $205 with free shipping.

I think you can have a pretty nice setup (Shapeoko XXL, VCarve Pro, control computer, router, bits, etc.) and still be right around your $3k target.
David


David,
Currently, I have everything I need except the CNC machine and VCarve. These are the only 2 pieces I'm lacking at this point.

[Dennis Peacock]

Look at the Avid CNC (formerly CNC Router Parts) kits, substantially more capable machines (at an admittedly higher price).

I designed and built my own that was comfortably under your $3k price, but I lucked into some bargain materials.

I looked at Avid a few times. By the time I put all the items I need in the bucket....I was over the price point of a Stinger I 2x4 machine.

[Greg Parrish]

I looked at Avid a few times. By the time I put all the items I need in the bucket....I was over the price point of a Stinger I 2x4 machine.

that was the same for me. When looking at a parts build the cost ends up way more than the prebuilt models in the 2x3 and 2x4 size I was looking at.

[Biff Phillips]

you might want to check out "CNC router parts" kits too.
The nice thing is that they are expandable at a later time, so if you decide you need a larger footprint, you can reuse a lot of the equipment. You get rack and pinion and a much more rigid machine. I do not personally have one of these, but talked to people that have them, and they are very happy.
I have heard mixed comments about the Shapeoko.. but since I have not seen or used one first hand, I really don't want to repeat comments here.

[David Buchhauser]

you might want to check out "CNC router parts" kits too.
The nice thing is that they are expandable at a later time, so if you decide you need a larger footprint, you can reuse a lot of the equipment. You get rack and pinion and a much more rigid machine. I do not personally have one of these, but talked to people that have them, and they are very happy.
I have heard mixed comments about the Shapeoko.. but since I have not seen or used one first hand, I really don't want to repeat comments here.



Hi Biff,
CNC Router Parts has recently changed their name to Avid CNC. The kits and parts are the same, just a new name. I have a CNC Router Parts Pro4848 that I built from one of there kits. It is a well built machine and I am very pleased with it. I am currently finishing up an Avid CNC Pro4824 machine with ATC spindle that is likewise a nice machine.
David

http://www.cncrouterparts.com/images/PRO4848_Base_800.jpg

[John Lifer]

They appear to be very good machines with a lot of options. He ain't getting one at his price point though...... The smallest will be about double his max.
(without a base)

[Dave Haughs]

For the money the Shapeoko XXL is hard to beat. I ran one for 3 years. They also hold their value. I sold mine plus a base I built for it pretty easily for $1600 after 3 years of use. You can't compare it to a bigger machine, it's not fair. For what it is at its price point its awesome. Their support is great as well. Pair it with v-carve and it's good to go. I did a lot with mine. Only real downside is the speed for larger projects. But you will get that with any machine running a trim router. Some 2.5D carvings can take a long time. The Carbide Motion software to run it though allows you to pause pretty easy. I'd pause and turn the router off and go to bed. Then it would pick right up where it left off when I started it back up. I cut some brass inlays on mine as well.

Bottom line, it's a great machine for the money and used ones pop up all the time. I think it's probably the best place to start, if you don't like it then you can get all or most of your money back out of it. If you do like it and want to upgrade later you can get your money back out of it. :) Win win.

Buy the suck it dust boot as well.

If you are going to run it a lot you might want a second trim router on hand as well. It will burn through brushes over time. Or have brushes on hand.


The downside is this is a downward spiral. The sky is the limit.

[Dennis Peacock]

I found one on CraigsList for one near me. I contacted the seller and it sold yesterday.

[Jim Becker]

I found one on CraigsList for one near me. I contacted the seller and it sold yesterday.

https://qaf05a.sn.files.1drv.com/y4mQnyco8CbktBfOQPpiq1qCZVv7X0EBzwXZ4huUGN2r4MPsGQ BuRyPsvR02MDS02Y901DWWAzJPc_3e3kVITQXQIqiGz7WZysiK MoFCrOzwHPovUtQUHn7kdGcyRMNfC_WnZzFqtkso3_6BeEZ8kM a1WGQ1zBmgOT5yT2ipk7PNDc7VGxGlnZQ3wGHSIBcO4Ed84OVw YHBTeEjO1uIeD9rfw?width=408&height=479&cropmode=none

At least the price for new is reasonable...and you get to put it together, too. :)

[Greg Parrish]

At least the price for new is reasonable...and you get to put it together, too. :)

and it’s usually in stock and ready to ship as opposed to the new Millright unit that is coming. I almost ordered a Shapeoko XL before finding my used Axiom last week. It would have been a little cheaper to go Shapeoko but not a whole lot over a used unit. If you are on Facebook there is a very active Shapeoko users group. Tons of people using them to make all sorts of stuff. Unless you can scrape up more funds I’d jump on the Shapeoko and not look back. You can start using it now and can always upgrade later if you feel the need. Good luck which ever way you go. :)

[bobby milam]

It's always wiser to buy the right CNC for you, the first time. It is cheaper in the long run. That said, I totally understand a budget and there are other expenses that you'll have that you may not have thought about whether it is software, cutting bits, dust collection, etc. The good thing is that no matter which CNC you purchase, they'll all run very similar so the experience you gain with one such as the Shapeoko will be beneficial if you decide later to upgrade. Size might be an issue but quality wise, I have heard nothing bad about the Shapeoko as long as you go in not expecting it to be in the same class as say a Camaster. If they have a forum or facebook group do some researching there and you may find a good used one that way.

[David Buchhauser]

They appear to be very good machines with a lot of options. He ain't getting one at his price point though...... The smallest will be about double his max.
(without a base)

Yes John - twice the price for maybe 3 or 4 times the machine! I own two of them (Avid CNC Router Parts) and they are great! It all depends on your budget.
David

[John Lifer]

Yes John - twice the price for maybe 3 or 4 times the machine! I own two of them (Avid CNC Router Parts) and they are great! It all depends on your budget.
David


Oh, you are way underestimating the Avid machines. Probably 10 times the machine, but if you don't have the $, you do what you can.
Same as lasers. I'd love to have a Trotec or Epilog, but the cheapest one is triple what I paid for my Chinese.....

[David Buchhauser]

Oh, you are way underestimating the Avid machines. Probably 10 times the machine, but if you don't have the $, you do what you can.
Same as lasers. I'd love to have a Trotec or Epilog, but the cheapest one is triple what I paid for my Chinese.....

Hi John,
You are probably right - the Avids are great machines. I have one setup for wood, and the other will be put into service dedicated to high speed aluminum machining. But I also have a smaller "shop built" machine that can still do alot for the $900 or so it cost me in parts to build it.
David

[Jerry Stringer]

I purchased a Shapeoko XXL in Sept 2019 as an addition to my shop to help in making trophy bases. I did a lot of research and the common thread was that the machine itself is outstanding but the instructions on putting it together suck canal water! I also found this to be true from my own experience. I finally got through it and now love the machine! It's definitely heavy duty. Here's a tip . . . don't tighten up any part of the bed and frame until you get it perfectly square. Drove me nuts getting the squareness down! (Order a touch probe with it - it will save you a lot of time when you start using it.) Good luck!

Gosh, It's been a long time since I posted here! Didn't know that ugly photo was gonna pop up! I apologize to everyone who saw it.

[Biff Phillips]

David,
I'm trying to stay around the $3K mark. And for sure to stay under the $4K mark. I know that I can put a CNC to work right now....but money is my problem and not things to make with a CNC. I've almost given up on the idea of putting a CNC in my shop but I know that.....in my heart of hearts....that I really need to put one in my shop. I just need to figure out how (financially).

Ok, so I am hopping back in..
The CNC router part/ Avid CNC 4x4 standard kit is 3100.
A gecko G540 is about 270
mach 3 is $175
Router mount 120
So now we are at $3665.
I am going to assume he has an extra router, old PC with monitor to run Mach 3 on.

For CAM:
Vectric Cut 2d is about 400, Deskproto is about 273 after converting to Euro, Fusion 360 (Which I have never used) is free for hobbyist.. his software choice all depends on what he is doing, probably best to start with Fusion to get a feel for what he wants to do.

So he is under $4000.. And now he has a much better machine than the Shapeko. Dennis has been here a long time, I am pretty sure he if he buys a good CNC, he will use it for the rest of his life.. No offense to the people that like Shapeko, but his budget does allow him to get a better machine. And I don't work for CNC router parts/Avid..

[Dave Haughs]

Ok, so I am hopping back in..
The CNC router part/ Avid CNC 4x4 standard kit is 3100.
A gecko G540 is about 270
mach 3 is $175
Router mount 120
So now we are at $3665.
I am going to assume he has an extra router, old PC with monitor to run Mach 3 on.

For CAM:
Vectric Cut 2d is about 400, Deskproto is about 273 after converting to Euro, Fusion 360 (Which I have never used) is free for hobbyist.. his software choice all depends on what he is doing, probably best to start with Fusion to get a feel for what he wants to do.

So he is under $4000.. And now he has a much better machine than the Shapeko. Dennis has been here a long time, I am pretty sure he if he buys a good CNC, he will use it for the rest of his life.. No offense to the people that like Shapeko, but his budget does allow him to get a better machine. And I don't work for CNC router parts/Avid..

I just had a similar discussion with a friend of mine as he has a Shapeoko 3 XXL and they just released a heavier duty Z axis carrier. We ran the same math and found that by the time he buys that he'd be better off buying the AVID CNC standard kit and selling his Shapeoko. Not sure where he ended up, but my point is I agree with the above statement.

I love the Shapeoko for what it is and I think it's a great starting platform and it's easy to sell used with minimal investment lost. However, if budget allows, it's hard to beat AVID CNC. Far more expandable/customizable.

[Biff Phillips]

removed post since Dennis already has it.

[Jim Becker]

Dennis already has his Shapeoko XXL up and running....

[Biff Phillips]

I just had a similar discussion with a friend of mine as he has a Shapeoko 3 XXL and they just released a heavier duty Z axis carrier. We ran the same math and found that by the time he buys that he'd be better off buying the AVID CNC standard kit and selling his Shapeoko. Not sure where he ended up, but my point is I agree with the above statement.

I love the Shapeoko for what it is and I think it's a great starting platform and it's easy to sell used with minimal investment lost. However, if budget allows, it's hard to beat AVID CNC. Far more expandable/customizable.

Thanks for the response and comment.. I agree :)

[John Lifer]

Ok, so I am hopping back in..
The CNC router part/ Avid CNC 4x4 standard kit is 3100.
A gecko G540 is about 270
mach 3 is $175
Router mount 120
So now we are at $3665.
I am going to assume he has an extra router, old PC with monitor to run Mach 3 on.

For CAM:
Vectric Cut 2d is about 400, Deskproto is about 273 after converting to Euro, Fusion 360 (Which I have never used) is free for hobbyist.. his software choice all depends on what he is doing, probably best to start with Fusion to get a feel for what he wants to do.

So he is under $4000.. And now he has a much better machine than the Shapeko. Dennis has been here a long time, I am pretty sure he if he buys a good CNC, he will use it for the rest of his life.. No offense to the people that like Shapeko, but his budget does allow him to get a better machine. And I don't work for CNC router parts/Avid..

I respectfully DISAGREE.... the base machine is just mechanical. No wiring, no motors, no controller. Add $1600 min for the nema 23 if you want to stay with Avid. That gets you on up to $5000. Got to get it shipped. And it isn't free shipping. Add mach 3, your router mount and you are at $6000 delivered.
Way over the Shapeoko (I'm up to about $3k with mine upgraded Z. )

[David Buchhauser]

I respectfully DISAGREE.... the base machine is just mechanical. No wiring, no motors, no controller. Add $1600 min for the nema 23 if you want to stay with Avid. That gets you on up to $5000. Got to get it shipped. And it isn't free shipping. Add mach 3, your router mount and you are at $6000 delivered.
Way over the Shapeoko (I'm up to about $3k with mine upgraded Z. )

Hi John,

With respect to the actual machine travel in x and y, a more realistic comparison to the XXL would be the Avid CNC Router Parts CRP4824. The XXL specs are 33" x 33" actual travel (1089 square inches of area) and the CRP4824 specs are 49.5" x 25.75" actual travel (1272 square inches of area).

CRP4824 basic machine - $2475 plus $233 shipping
Qty. 4 Nema 23 (425 oz-in) @ $39.90 each = $160
Gecko G540 drive - $280
Mean Well 48V DC power supply - $66
Warp9 ESS (electronic smooth stepper) - $185
Power Supply - 12V DC - $10
Mach3 - $172
Wiring Harness Parts - Approx. $100
(all prices include shipping cost)

Total - $3681

I should mention that the Centroid Acorn controller with CNC12 software could be substituted for the Mach3/Warp9 ESS combo for essentially the same cost. This would provide a modern day control system vastly superior to the Mach3/Mach4 scenario.


I have no personal experience with the Shapeoko machines, but I assume they are pretty simple to put together and are "plug & play" as far as the wiring harness connections.
I have assembled 2 of the CNCRP/Avid machines. They are also pretty simple to assemble, test, and get up and running. Their electronics packages (when purchased from Avid) are "plug & play" as well.

The XXL weights around 150 lbs. The CRP4824 weight is around 320 lbs. (without the optional leg kit). At over twice the weight, I would expect the CRP4824 to be a more substantial machine.
The "build your own" scenario using parts individually purchased may (or may not) be a little bit intimidating to some prospective buyers. But I would have to agree with Biff that it is indeed possible to build a potentially more robust machine for approximately the same cost as he came up with.

David

[John Lifer]

Agreed David, But that wasn't the Avid machine mentioned..... And Yep, it AIN'T plugnplay. You are sourcing various parts and only using the Avid mechanicals.
If I had wanted to do that, there are other options that I could cobble my machine together equal to this at half the price. I am not overly enamored with the Shapeoke machine. It is a decent machine, you DO have to assemble it, but it is ALL in one package and If you can put together simple mechanical parts, you can assemble and use it.
There is a good warranty and very good support. I can, and did email for replacement part, and it arrived in 3 days. No questions asked. I can't go anywhere if I'm wiring machine myself and short out a circuit board..... Carbide will replace.
Just say'n. There are plenty of options. And I CAN sell this machine for about 80% of what I've got in it. Home made machine? nowhere near.

[David Buchhauser]

Hi John,
I think the bottom line here is that in general you get what you pay for - either in dollars spent, time spent, or a combination of the two. There are some machines that come delivered completely "turn-key", others that require some assembly, and still others that are either scratch builds or something like Biff had suggested. Of course most all of them do come with some sort of warranty, with the possible exception of some of the Asian machines ordered directly from overseas. I think it all depends on the builder/buyer's budget, intended use, technical skill level, value placed on time (build vs. buy), and expectation of performance. The main thing is that you feel comfortable with your Shapeoko purchase, are happy with the results it is producing for you, and know that you can sell it any time and recover a good portion of your initial investment.
David

[Biff Phillips]

I respectfully DISAGREE.... the base machine is just mechanical. No wiring, no motors, no controller. Add $1600 min for the nema 23 if you want to stay with Avid. That gets you on up to $5000. Got to get it shipped. And it isn't free shipping. Add mach 3, your router mount and you are at $6000 delivered.
Way over the Shapeoko (I'm up to about $3k with mine upgraded Z. )

You don't need the Avid controller.. That's what the gecko G540 is for.
I already added the cost of Mach3 and the router mount in. You could probably source
a cheaper router mount or even make one if you wanted to save a little there.

Yes, You would have to buy or build legs, but that is not a major expense.
Yes, you would have to pay shipping.. that is obvious. And yes, the shipping is probably more than the Shapeko. Wiring is not a big expense. If you have to buy the steppers, they are roughly $50 each , so yes, I missed that (another $200), but it's still under 4k total.

Avid is still a better setup for someone with a budget of about 4k. Much better machine.
No offense, but why not skip the step of buying a Shapaeko and then later upgrading, and then having to deal with reselling the Shapeako, if you have a 4k budget like the original poster? Of course, if finances mean Shapaeko or nothing, then that changes things.

[David Buchhauser]

No offense, but why not skip the step of buying a Shapaeko and then later upgrading, and then having to deal with reselling the Shapeako, if you have a 4k budget like the original poster?

Biff,
I think the answer is that not everyone may have the technical skills/expertise, inclination, or interest in purchasing and assembling the separate parts to accomplish a "semi-scratch build". There is a lot to be said for buying a cnc router, whether as a complete turn-key machine (think CAMaster) or in semi-kit form (think Avid, Shapeako, etc.) where the complete machine is purchased/supported/warranteed by a single company.
David

[Jim Becker]

And....the OP already has his Shapeoko XXL up and running for a few weeks now...and his budget was under $3K including the Vectric software and other necessary items beyond just the machine.

[David Buchhauser]

And....the OP already has his Shapeoko XXL up and running for a few weeks now...and his budget was under $3K including the Vectric software and other necessary items beyond just the machine.

Hi Jim,
Thanks for the update. I was aware that Dennis had purchased his machine, but some of the others may not have been following the entire thread.
David

[Dennis Peacock]

Yes...I have a machine up and running. Really enjoying it....when I get time to tinker with it. I've been swamped with the day job and with getting this blasted HUGE dining table project finished. As of right now, I got what I paid for...a working CNC to start out with. My plans are to upgrade/add another CNC to my shop in a year or 2. I plan on adding a Stinger I or II...but time and budget will tell.