New Bench Top

[Kevin Herman]

Hi everyone, long-time reader, first-time poster.

I built a workbench about 1-1/2 years ago according to Chris Schwarz's two-day workbench video. At the time, I improvised the top by laminating together four 8'x2' pieces of 3/4" plywood. The bench has worked fine, but isn't really flat. Also, it's a little big for the space I have, which is alongside my house, underneath the roof overhang. The base is made of DF and hasn't had any problem due to wood movement despite the wet weather here in Hawai'i.

I'm thinking about redoing the top, making it out of DF and reducing the size to probably 6' x 18". I might put a tool well on the back 6", since the base is 24" wide and I'd rather not alter it if I don't have to. If the tool well isn't useful, I'll just remove it.

I have an Eclipse face vise that I'm going to flush mount near the left leg and a Veritas twin screw that I'm going to shorten to 18" and continue to use as a tail vise. I'll probably have to drill clearance holes through the right stretcher for the vise screws, but I don't anticipate any problem with that.

I guess there's not really a question in there, but just looking for any feedback or suggestions before I get started. Thanks!

[Kevin Herman]

Forgot to mention. I'll probably make the top out of two laminates that will be 9" wide. That way I can experiment with a split top if I decide I want to try that. Initial plan is for a single continuous 18" top, but I'll probably just clamp the two pieces together and lag screw them into the stretchers from below. The current top is lag screwed down and doesn't move at all. Any thoughts as to whether the gap between the two laminates will be a problem if the 9" wide pieces aren't actually glued together?

[David Eisenhauer]

I would slot the lag bolt holes on the bottom of the stretchers for making up the top to the stretchers. Two 9" slabs butted up together can't hurt anything by trying it out, but a split top with two 9" slabs may be a little narrow when working on one 9" side only. I have two 12" slabs for my split top with a 4" gap between for sliding tool trays and chisel racks to sit in and I wonder if I would be satisfied with a 9" wide slab only. I tend to use one slab for joinery work (sawing at the bench hooks, mortising and cleaning up tenons). The other 12" wide slab is used more for planning plus holding the leg vise on. I guess if your split gap is a narrow type and your two slabs are in plane you will not really be stuck with 9" to work on. Try it, can't hurt to see what happens.

[ken hatch]

Hi everyone, long-time reader, first-time poster.

I built a workbench about 1-1/2 years ago according to Chris Schwarz's two-day workbench video. At the time, I improvised the top by laminating together four 8'x2' pieces of 3/4" plywood. The bench has worked fine, but isn't really flat. Also, it's a little big for the space I have, which is alongside my house, underneath the roof overhang. The base is made of DF and hasn't had any problem due to wood movement despite the wet weather here in Hawai'i.

I'm thinking about redoing the top, making it out of DF and reducing the size to probably 6' x 18". I might put a tool well on the back 6", since the base is 24" wide and I'd rather not alter it if I don't have to. If the tool well isn't useful, I'll just remove it.

I have an Eclipse face vise that I'm going to flush mount near the left leg and a Veritas twin screw that I'm going to shorten to 18" and continue to use as a tail vise. I'll probably have to drill clearance holes through the right stretcher for the vise screws, but I don't anticipate any problem with that.

I guess there's not really a question in there, but just looking for any feedback or suggestions before I get started. Thanks!


I would slot the lag bolt holes on the bottom of the stretchers for making up the top to the stretchers. Two 9" slabs butted up together can't hurt anything by trying it out, but a split top with two 9" slabs may be a little narrow when working on one 9" side only. I have two 12" slabs for my split top with a 4" gap between for sliding tool trays and chisel racks to sit in and I wonder if I would be satisfied with a 9" wide slab only. I tend to use one slab for joinery work (sawing at the bench hooks, mortising and cleaning up tenons). The other 12" wide slab is used more for planning plus holding the leg vise on. I guess if your split gap is a narrow type and your two slabs are in plane you will not really be stuck with 9" to work on. Try it, can't hurt to see what happens.

Kevin,

I've found 11" is about the minimum for a working slab width. I agree with David that if you are planing on the two slabs being co-planer and the gap is narrow then two 9" slabs should work. Something to think about, the two slabs do not need to be symmetrical. I've found asymmetrical slabs work very well with the front slab being 12"-15" and the back slab being only 6" to 10" wide. You are wise to keep the base 24" wide much less than that and the bench will become "tippy" wider and it becomes hard to work across.

Truth is it doesn't take much to hold the slab to the base if the base is rigid. The slabs on my Moravian benches are fixed by four 5/8" dowels that protrude about 1" above the base so the slab is easy to remove. No screws or lag bolts needed.

ken

[Don Dorn]

Interesting, I also did the Schwarz two day bench. I'm most impressed with the leg system, but for the top, I did go with his suggestion and laminated to 1.5 inch Birch counter tops. It's now two years old and fortunately is still flat. While I kept two rows of dog holes, I did skip anything located over a leg to prevent blind holes. So far, so good.

[Edward Dyas]

Hi everyone, long-time reader, first-time poster.

I built a workbench about 1-1/2 years ago according to Chris Schwarz's two-day workbench video. At the time, I improvised the top by laminating together four 8'x2' pieces of 3/4" plywood. The bench has worked fine, but isn't really flat. Also, it's a little big for the space I have, which is alongside my house, underneath the roof overhang. The base is made of DF and hasn't had any problem due to wood movement despite the wet weather here in Hawai'i.

I'm thinking about redoing the top, making it out of DF and reducing the size to probably 6' x 18". I might put a tool well on the back 6", since the base is 24" wide and I'd rather not alter it if I don't have to. If the tool well isn't useful, I'll just remove it.

I have an Eclipse face vise that I'm going to flush mount near the left leg and a Veritas twin screw that I'm going to shorten to 18" and continue to use as a tail vise. I'll probably have to drill clearance holes through the right stretcher for the vise screws, but I don't anticipate any problem with that.

I guess there's not really a question in there, but just looking for any feedback or suggestions before I get started. Thanks!Is it really necessary to make the top 3" thick. For most applications a single 3/4" sheet of plywood has met my needs.

[ken hatch]

Is it really necessary to make the top 3" thick. For most applications a single 3/4" sheet of plywood has met my needs.

Edward,

You are correct 3" or greater slabs can be over kill, great for the hoot factor but on a well designed bench unnecessary. I will kinda dissagree on the use of sheat goods for a slab on a hand tool working bench, solid wood works better. Of course as always YMMV.

ken

[Jeff Bartley]

Kevin,
I would investigate why your current bench is not flat. Is the base twisted? Winding sticks across the tops of the legs would tell you.
I use two slabs, both just under 12" with a 2 1/2" gap. I cut grooves into the the slabs at the gap and slid panels in for a tool tray.
Best,
Jeff

[lowell holmes]

See these sites

https://www.google.com/search?q=workbench+top&oq=workbench+top&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.12366j1j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ACYBGNSS7UXORX0gF0whsFq9p8D40qunjw%3A 1570708437942&ei=1RufXfv9OISCsQW2haPwDQ&q=butcher+block+workbench+top+lowes&oq=workbench+top+lowes&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0j0i22i30.46542.50357..55437...0.2..0.71.38 5.6......0....1..gws-wiz.......0i71j0i67j0i20i263.HpI8F9ljq80

[Kevin Herman]

The top isn't flat because it's made of relatively inexpensive plywood that has a number of substantial dings in relative high-use areas. I guess maybe it's less an issue of flatness, than just being a little bumpy. Planing the plywood just leads to a mess of different veneer layers. I didn't really know what I was doing when I built this bench (not that I necessarily do now), but it has done its job. Also, as I said, it's a little long for the space. Really, I just want a new benchtop. The base is solid, so making a new top isn't such a big deal. I'm about 2/3 of the way finished.

Update on the layout. So, I'm creating 3 laminates that will ultimately make up the top. A 9", 6" and 3". That way I can experiment with putting the tool tray in the middle, at the back, or between asymmetric slabs. I think I will ultimately put it at the back. Just seems to make the most sense given the positioning of my bench and the way I usually work.

[Tom Bussey]

From experience I Like my bench top that I work on to be at least 13 inches wide. if you do a split to of some kind make the front 12-13 and the back halt 6-7 or whatever wide. I know I am happier with a wider front. The picture is of my old bench but my new one is similar. I just made it right and left handed.

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[Tom Bender]

So some of us missed the part about this being an outdoor bench under a roof in a warm but rainy climate. Not at all surprising that plywood is not performing well. I think you are on a much better path now.

An outdoor workspace in Hawaii sounds excellent. We're all very jealous.

[Kevin Herman]

So I've glued together the two 9" thick pieces. For now, they are screwed down to the stretchers as one continuous 18" slab. Still needs to be flattened. Then I'll install the Veritas twin screw vise on the face and build the tool tray. I plan to use it for a while and then decide if I want to add a tail vise. If I do, I like the look of the HNT Gordon tail vise. Seems like a fairly easy install. Also, if I decide I want to experiment with a split top, I can unscrew the back slab and trade places with the tool tray. Agree that 9" might be a little thin for a workspace, but with the ability to flip the tool tray for a flat top, it might not be an issue. I thought about doing a 12" slab and a 6" slab, but even at 9" it was getting a little too heavy to move easily and I wanted to keep it manageable in case I need to break it down and move it elsewhere.

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[Kevin Herman]

The bench is functional and structurally "done." At the moment, I have the two nine-inch pieces separated by a tool tray, but I can see that I do not really like this set up. With one side of the bench against the wall, I think it makes more sense to have the uninterrupted 18" and the tool tray/boxes at the back.

I mounted my Veritas twin screw to the left face of the vise. I think my alignment is a little off, but I'm probably going to remake the chop anyway. Also, I think I need to "beef up" the rear jaw, since it extends below the benchtop. I'm thinking of just adding 1 or 2 pieces of 8/4 material behind it.

[David Eisenhauer]

Outstanding Kevin. Sounds like you are sliding into home base. I feel that a split top is better utilized in a free-standing configuration as opposed to against a wall and I like your idea of the 18" working width with tray against the wall. The photo in your previous post looks very familiar to me as I too built my base first and used it for helping assemble the "two by on edge" top slabs.

[Kevin Herman]

Re-mounted the twin screw vise today, with the new chop. The screw-to-screw distance is 24", so the chop is pretty massive, about 36". It takes up roughly 1/2 of the front of the bench, which is maybe problematic. I'm not sure yet.

I had forgotten how painful installing the chain cover for this thing is. Does anyone have any tricks to share? Or, maybe even better, an alternative?

I'm planning to work with it for a little while and see how I like it, but there's a chance I'll go back to the Eclipse face vise, which would take up a lot less room.

[Kevin Herman]

Here are some pictures of the nearly finished bench. You can see there is a gap between the two sections of the top. I'm trying to close it, but no luck so far. I've tried planing down the high points of that section, but now I have gaps in the opposite area. I tried using a lag bolt below to pull the two together, but no luck. Two strategies I still have in mind before giving up and gluing:
1. Drill holes in the back side and use 3-4 lag screws to pull it together.
2. Use end caps on both sides with lag screws to hold the sides together.

Any votes one way or the other?

419099419100419101419102

[Jim Koepke]

An outside of the box solution might be to plow a groove for the full length and drop in a fitted lamination.

jtk

[ken hatch]

Kevin,

I can think of three fixes in addition to just starting all over. Do what Jim suggests, open the grove and fill with a lamination. Fill the grove with fast set epoxy(you can even make it chic by mixing the epoxy with colored powder). The third would be to split the slabs so the grove is wide enough to hold chisels and saws and maybe even a planing stop.

My pick would be to leave it alone and use the bench to build a new bench. You would be surprised how useful, once a new and improved bench is built, the old bench can be for your wife to use in the back garden.

Just one more question, do you love the twin screw vise?

ken

[Marinus Loewensteijn]

I would be incined to turn the gap into a 2-1/2" ~ 3" tool tray with a thick piece of ply screwed underneath to keep the two pieces more or less aligned. Handy for holding small stuff e.g. a chisel, pencils, a ruler.

[Kevin Herman]

I'm not sure I need to start over! I'm actually pretty happy with how it's going. It's just a tiny gap and I'm confident I can (at least mostly) close it. I'm not a big believer in a bench needing to be flat/perfect to NASA tolerances. I could definitely work on this bench as is, but I'd to close this gap, mainly because it's annoying to look at. I like the idea of using the split-top lamination to close the gap. I'll see how that goes.

I don't love the twin screw vise. I think it's a little over complicated and I don't think it's lack of racking provides that much of an advantage over a regular Record-style face vise. My Eclipse rarely racked and other conveniences it provided (quick release) more than made up for it.

So, why did I use the twin screw again? I had it as an end vise previously and it was underutilized, largely because of flaws in my previous bench (plywood top mated with mahogany end cap/end vise rear jaw). I want to see how it functions as a face vise. Based on limited use so far, I can see that it holds long pieces against the front of the bench top with supreme stability.

I'm planning to install the Veritas inset vise as a wagon vise. I realize it's going to get a little crowded up top, but I look at this all as an experiment. Once I get a last few things fixed up, I want to get back to making furniture and I can revisit the bench down the road.

Hopefully, in 2-3 years we will move to a house with a spot for a dedicated workshop. There's only so much I can do in my little outdoor nook. Especially now that we are entering Ho'oilo, the wet season.

[Kevin Herman]

I took some of the above advice and today made an inset for the gap in the style of the gap stop from Benchcrafted's split top Roubo plans. I routed out two 12" long recesses in a 2x4, about 1/4" deep and then glued a 1x4 over it. To preserve room at the back for a tool tray, which I still want, I removed about 2" from the back laminate, keeping the full depth at about 18".

I'm going to glue some wedges to the underside of the gap stop just offset from where it rests on the stretchers. Then, sliding it in either direction will raise it slightly so that it can be used as a planing stop. The wedges don't need to be too high, maybe 1/2". I like the fact that I can pull the middle section out for clamping too.

Revisiting the twin screw vise... I think that thing's days are numbered. I find it largely more aggravating than it's worth. My trusty Eclipse is staring up at me longingly from the ground. If anyone really loves the Veritas twin screw, I'd love to hear what I'm missing. Thanks again, everyone.

[Kevin Herman]

Not sure if anyone is still following this, but I enjoy talking to myself anyway. I switched out the twin screw for the Eclipse today. Much happier already. Having the bench top being so much smaller now, the Veritas was taking up way too much room. I have the face vise to the far left and I'll put the inset vise on the far right, and it will leave me plenty of room in the middle for working. I had to remake my gap stop after switching the vises, because one of my tool slots was directly over the vise screw. Also putting my planing stop in just to the right of the vise. I think most benches install them to the left of the vise, but I don't have room on this bench. On my old bench it was to the left of the vise, but I always felt like the vise was in the way when I was planing. The only downside I can see is that you can't plane a board that is quite as long, but I almost never plane something over 4'.

[ken hatch]

Not sure if anyone is still following this, but I enjoy talking to myself anyway. I switched out the twin screw for the Eclipse today. Much happier already. Having the bench top being so much smaller now, the Veritas was taking up way too much room. I have the face vise to the far left and I'll put the inset vise on the far right, and it will leave me plenty of room in the middle for working. I had to remake my gap stop after switching the vises, because one of my tool slots was directly over the vise screw. Also putting my planing stop in just to the right of the vise. I think most benches install them to the left of the vise, but I don't have room on this bench. On my old bench it was to the left of the vise, but I always felt like the vise was in the way when I was planing. The only downside I can see is that you can't plane a board that is quite as long, but I almost never plane something over 4'.

Kevin,

Good move with changing out the twin screw. Having it in the face vise position left you no room to work.

ken

[Kevin Herman]

Kind of neglected this thread, but here are some pictures of the finished bench, in use.

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[Frederick Skelly]

Looks very functional!