Milling 25 Year Old Logs

[Mark Blatter]

A friend has 10 - 12 walnut logs from a tree that was cut down in his MIL's yard some 25 years ago. The logs have been stored in a garage the entire time and I am told they are in good shape, meaning no bugs or rot. The logs range from 8" to 12" in diameter, and run about 10' long. Question is, is it worth having these things milled?

There are a couple of local guys that will run them for about $200 if we deliver to them or double that if they bring their equipment to us. I am thinking that we could end up with about 1200 board feet of 4/4 walnut, but I could be way off in my guessing.

Thoughts on if it is worth doing it? Any problems or things to look for with wood that old?

Thanks in advance.

[John K Jordan]

I'd saw a little off each end of each log and check for checks/cracks before deciding. At the same time check for powder post beatle holes (and if possible check around the logs for frass before they are moved. I've seen old black walnut eaten up with PPB but they are likely clean if they were kept indoors the entire time.

JKJ



A friend has 10 - 12 walnut logs from a tree that was cut down in his MIL's yard some 25 years ago. The logs have been stored in a garage the entire time and I am told they are in good shape, meaning no bugs or rot. The logs range from 8" to 12" in diameter, and run about 10' long. Question is, is it worth having these things milled?

There are a couple of local guys that will run them for about $200 if we deliver to them or double that if they bring their equipment to us. I am thinking that we could end up with about 1200 board feet of 4/4 walnut, but I could be way off in my guessing.

Thoughts on if it is worth doing it? Any problems or things to look for with wood that old?

Thanks in advance.

[John TenEyck]

If you have 12 logs that avg. 10" in diameter and 10 ft long, the Doyle scale says there is 270 BF total, and that will include sapwood. http://www.woodweb.com/cgi-bin/calculators/calc.pl

John

[Jamie Buxton]

If you cut a little off each end of the logs like John suggests, also look to see how much heartwood you have. Young walnuts are notorious for having a lot of sapwood.

[Scott T Smith]

Ditto the advice above about cutting an inch off of the end of the logs. Inspect for the following:

1 - any bug damage in the sapwood.
2 - is the pith off-center more than 10%?
3 - Is the width of sapwood more than 20% of the width of the log?

If the answer to any of the above is “yes”, you will probably be wasting your $ to mill the logs.

[Frederick Skelly]

Ditto the advice above about cutting an inch off of the end of the logs. Inspect for the following:

1 - any bug damage in the sapwood.
2 - is the pith off-center more than 10%?
3 - Is the width of sapwood more than 20% of the width of the log?

If the answer to any of the above is “yes”, you will probably be wasting your $ to mill the logs.

May I ask an off-topic dumb-guy question? Why is it a bad thing pith is off center too much? Does it mean there is less usable wood, or that the wood has too much stress in it, or something else entirely?

Thanks guys,
Fred

[Mark Blatter]

May I ask an off-topic dumb-guy question? Why is it a bad thing pith is off center too much? Does it mean there is less usable wood, or that the wood has too much stress in it, or something else entirely?

Thanks guys,
Fred

Great question Fred. I was wondering the same thing, but presuming it would just produce too little usable wood.

Love to know the answer.

[Andrew Hughes]

Pith off center means stress and tension in the log. One side the grain will be in compression the other side the grain is pulled. This is why limbs are terrible for resawing but good for bowls .
Feel free to correct me Scott.
Good Luck everyone

[Frederick Skelly]

Thanks Andrew!

[Tom Hogard]

The Doyle Scale penalizes smaller logs, and certainly is not accurate as to the yield when using a bandsaw. A dozen 10"x10' logs could yield 500 bf, but nothing near 1200. For bandsaws, if you can find it, the most accurate scale I have found is the International 1/8" Scale. Their 1/4" scale is much more common. It is based on 4/4 (1") lumber, clean edges, and a 1/4" kerf. A bandsaw has a thinner kerf (less loss), and if you mill with live edges or thicker boards, the yield will be increased.

For example; a 10" dia. x 10' log on the Doyle Scale is 23 bf, on the Scribner Scale is 30 bf, International 1/4" Scale is 35 bf, and International 1/8" Scale is 40. Doyle is the 'standard' in this area for buying and selling logs. IMO, that is because the largest buyers of logs are commercial mills and dealing with small logs is less efficient in a production environment. They all get squared up but smaller logs will yield less lumber after the opening steps. Move log size up to 24" and the variation between Doyle and International 1/8" is only 12% (250 vs. 285).

[Mark Daily]

Are you planning on using it or selling it? FWIW, 4/4 walnut is selling for $11.99/bf in Phoenix at Woodworkers Source.

[Tom Hogard]

Wood prices, in the retail market, are highly variable. At our local HD store, walnut boards are over $20 p/bf (a 1x6x8' is $83.27). Now, that is a really nicely packaged board; plastic-wrapped, FAS, SLR, kiln-dried, planed. The same quality board at another retail location routinely sells for $#5.99 p/bf (if not on sale), but you don't get the plastic wrap. If you need a really good walnut board on a Sunday evening... you'll pay HD's price.

Although it is tempting to compare the cost of milling our own wood to the price displayed in the stores, it is not an accurate comparison. It is highly unlikely that those 10"x10' walnut logs will yield 100% FAS lumber, and it is green, includes sapwood, and rough-sawn. Further thoughts: http://live-edge-blog.tomthesawyer.net/the-cost-of-lumber/

[Mark Blatter]

Are you planning on using it or selling it? FWIW, 4/4 walnut is selling for $11.99/bf in Phoenix at Woodworkers Source.

I would either use it for myself, or make something for my friend. Having something that was made from grandma or great grandma's own tree would likely be more special than just bought wood.

I am buying walnut from any of my suppliers for around $5 - 6 per board foot. That was either #1 or select, I don't recall which.

Glad I asked about yield since I was so far off.

[Scott T Smith]

Pith off center means stress and tension in the log. One side the grain will be in compression the other side the grain is pulled. This is why limbs are terrible for resawing but good for bowls .
Feel free to correct me Scott.
Good Luck everyone

Andrew - you hit the nail on the head!

Logs with piths that are significantly off center tend to yield a lot of lumber that has to be discarded. Internal stresses in the lumber cause it to continue to move every time it is machined - even after drying.

[david privett]

if you can find someone to cut them reasonably ,wood that has been sitting that long might not move as much as one might think, it is a gamble but it is walnut and it is not the cheapest wood around. bring them to s.e. tn. I'll cut them.

[Richard Coers]

If you are saying that you have 10-12 logs from a single tree, you are asking about cutting branches. Branches are never cut for commercial purposes because of the reaction wood mentioned earlier. I'm not saying you won't get some wood to maybe make jewelry boxes, but it will be questionable. Incredibly hard to imagine that if there is bark on those limbs, that there won't be powder post beetles in the sapwood. There will likely be a lot of sapwood with a small core of dark heart wood. Seems like a risky venture to me.

[Carl Beckett]

I would either use it for myself, or make something for my friend. Having something that was made from grandma or great grandma's own tree would likely be more special than just bought wood.



I have made a number of pieces from trees that have come from family/friends. Indeed, they become more cherished by everyone because of the connection to the source of the wood.

Unless outrageous $$, I would do it not for the savings, but for the connection/heritage of where the wood came from.