Shop layout and Dust collectioin

[Larry Blighton]

So I have been thinking about dust collection. I guess you could say that I have never really had any. I have always pretty much hauled my tools to the driveway, did my thing and then cleaned up afterwards.
I am really wanting to be able to set some of my tools up and leave them and not make an absolute mess working in the garage with the doors closed.


I am including a diagram of what I think my shop layout will be. Because I am limited on room and will not be able to use the entire garage I thought that I would just go with a shop vac w/Dust deputy cyclone attachment for my dust collection needs. However I am not sure that this Shop Vac dust collection system will have enough suction to accommodate the tools that I already have.


I am looking for shop layout and dust collection recommendation based on the layout. Please bear in mind that I am working on both a space and money budget. If you think a different shop layout will help with my dust collection set up please let me know. (Band saw, Drum sander, router, dust collection will all be on wheels and can easily be moved around)


Here are a couple of the ones that I have looked at to give you an idea, trying to get the best bang for my buck without braking the bank.
HF 70 Gallon 2 HP Heavy Duty High Flow High Capacity Dust Collector (possible changing the upper bag to pleated filter) $209
Shop Fox W1666 2 HP 1550 CFM $423.98


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[Tom Dixon]

This Grizzly G0548ZP (https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-2-HP-Canister-Dust-Collector-with-Aluminum-Impeller-Polar-Bear-Series/G0548ZP) is 100 bucks more over the Shop Fox 2HP but you will thank yourself for getting the canister filter and it has a slightly higher 1700 CFM. I have the earlier version in all Green I bought over 8 years ago and it has worked great for me. I just acquired a 5HP G0442 Cyclone DC this summer for the shop I built 2 years ago but I'm going to keep the 2HP unit around in case I ever downsize or need something I can move to a new tool that is not yet plumbed to the cyclone.

One thing I know is that whatever you think your layout should be today you will probably change your mind as you acquire more or different tools over time. For me, keeping my dust collection mobile during the growing and refining my tool preferences helped me immensely in planning for the shop layout I have now that I finally have decided to plumb with spiral pipe and a true cyclone DC.

[Larry Blighton]

Thanks Tom, Yea that Grizzly looks nice and I have already decided that whatever DC I get will either have or be upgraded to the pleated filter.

I totally understand about the shop layout changing as my shop grows, but right now this is what I have to work with until I either build a shed or purchase a ready build one for the other things that are taking up floor space.

[Matt Day]

It sounds as though you plan to move the dust collector to the tool? As in, no ductwork attached the to walls/ceiling?

[Jim Dwight]

I use a Rigid shop vac, 10 amp, pulling through a dust deputy for the smaller tools currently including the CMS. But it worked poorly with my SawStop PCS so I added a HF 2hp DC pulling through a super dust deputy and discharging outside. So I have no filter on the DC. I don't really heat or cool the shop significantly so it isn't conditioned air I am dealing with. The primary benefit of the cyclones is to reduce or eliminate filter cleaning. My shop vac has the quasi HEPA filter.

I could not see your figure but I would start with the shop vac and see how well it does for you. I don't think most if not all DCs will work well with little hoses like my track saw and sanders use. So my theory is you need the shop vac regardless. Oneida makes a couple unique DCs with low airflow but high suction that might work but you drop to a low eough airflow it isn't clearly enough for the big tools - even for the 5 hp model. And the 5 hp one is expensive.

The HF 2hp is under $200 with coupon. Adding the super dust deputy is an equivalent amount but even together they compare pretty well to the DCs you are looking at. If you want to discharge inside you would also need a cartridge filter.

[David Utterback]

You may want to keep your collector mobile as others have recommended. If not, it could be placed near the exterior door so an overhead drop for the center assembly will not interfere with the garage door when opening.

[Larry Blighton]

So I have not really decided yet if I am going to leave the dust collector on the mobile base or attach it to the wall.

I have however purchased a dust collector. I did quite a bit of thinking when it came to purchasing the dust collector. I decided to try and get the most bang for my buck and decided to get the

Harbor Freight 2 HP 1550 CFM Heavy Duty High Flow High Capacity Dust Collector
Adding a MERV 15 (.5 micron) canister
Add a 12 in. Diameter Rikon impeller
Add Dust Deputy Cyclone to make it 2 stage

I was able to do all of the upgrades (filter cartridge and impeller) plus add the Dust Deputy Cyclone for less then $750

Here are some of the ones that I compared it with. (price and advertised performance)

(I used comparison before Dust Deputy added: Cost $540)
Jet $549.99
1 HP 650 CFM Dust Collector
2-Micron Canister Kit
9.5 in. Diameter impeller

(I used comparison after Dust Deputy added)
Jet $749.99
1.5 HP 1100 CFM Dust Collector with Vortex Cone
2-Micron Canister Kit
11 in. Diameter impeller

(I used comparison after Dust Deputy added)
Jet $799.99
2 HP 1200 CFM Dust Collector with Vortex Cone
2-Micron Canister Kit
12 in. Diameter impeller

[Jim Dwight]

Congratulations. I have my 2hp HF attached to the wall with 5 inch metal snap lock piping running to my table saw where I disconnect the saw to run a flexible hose to my jointer and planner. The jointer and planner used to be wheeled to the driveway and I swept up afterwards. They still will need to be in the driveway for large boards but no sweeping is nice. I wondered how well the HF would pull through around 20 feet of metal duct and then a flex hose that extends to another 20 feet. It works well. Seems to get almost everything from the planner. I have a couple wyes and blast gates and some more pipe but I haven't done the other run yet. I probably will but the current setup works for now.

To get mine on the wall, I just screwed a piece of plywood that already had the bolts to mount the blower on it to the wall using 3 inch screws into the studs. I put it up near the 8 foot ceiling but leaving a few inches for cooling. The super dust deputy hangs off the blower and is also held up by a wooden box that collects the dust. It has a plexiglass window so I can see when it gets full. I took the smaller inlet off the blower and put a 6 inch on it so it connected to the cyclone better. This arrangement takes up about 18x18 inches in the corner of my shop. Up high, a little more space is used for the 6 inch exhaust to go out the side wall of the shop.

[Larry Blighton]

I have been really thinking about mounting my dust collector to the wall. I have an area above my compressor the filter and bag should be able to mount which would only leave the cyclone sitting on the floor. I have a plan to leave my table saw in one place.

I am not sure if I want to run the pipe on the ceiling down or run along the floor. What does everyone think?

[Jim Becker]

I agree with keeping the collector mobile for now based on your description of things as well as that any kind of shop vac will not do the job with the majority tools you show. One other thing...the CFM values stated on these mass market dust collectors are not "real life" numbers. A 4" hose can't pass more than about 400-450 CFM or so because that's all the air that can physically fit in the space at the air movement velocity typically provided by the blowers. (Dust collectors work by moving air, not "suction", per se) That's "adequate" for collecting from a single tool via a short hose. None of these machines are capable of reaching the stated high CFM numbers even with "ideal" ductwork sizing. Avoid the little 1hp units if you can.

[Larry Blighton]

Jim, I totally agree about the CFM's which is why I listed them as advertised parameters. I am still debating about leaving it mobile or mounting to the wall.

[Larry Blighton]

Ok have a question, My table saw will be located close to the middle of my shop. If I mount my dust collector on the wall which would be better, to run the piping along the ceiling and down or to run it along the floor to the table saw? Will I lose anything with the longer run of PVC attached to the ceiling vice a shorter run of flex hose? I know that running it along the floor does make it a trip hazard.

[Mike Kees]

Larry my bet is the ceiling run with PVC will have less loss than a floor run of flex hose. Just guessing the lengths you are talking about are close to the same... like not 90 feet versus 30.

[Larry Blighton]

The ceiling run will probable be some where around 25-30 ft of ridged pvc or approx. 15 or so ft of flex.

Another question I have a oneida cyclone 4 in. kit that comes with the 15 gallon barrel. The base of the cyclone is like 16 in. diameter and kinda has a flair to it. I am thinking that I want a larger barrel.

Would it be an issue if there is actually a small lip under the edge of the cyclone. I understand that this lip might catch some of the chips but will it affect the function.

What my cyclone looks like
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The barrel I want to use.
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[Jim Becker]

Larry, there's no issue with using a larger drum, but you must have an absolute seal between the cyclone and the barrel...not even the tiniest of leaks. The attachment method used with the original bin insures that because it's based on the clamping ring pulling things together very tightly and completely air sealed. The fact that the "bin top" is molded as part of the cyclone you have is where the challenge is going to come from because it's a different size than your alternative barrel.

[Jim Dwight]

flex hose is equivelent in loss to 3 or more times longer straight pipe. If you want maximum airflow you have to limit it's length. But I find that my HF 2 hp DC can support a pretty long flex hose going to my planner and still collect chips well. The run to my table saw is straight metal pipe until the end where there is about a foot of 4 inch flex - and another piece similar size inside the saw.

[Larry Blighton]

Ok so I made alittle headway on the shop this weekend. I was able to get pretty much all of the pipe and fitting to run the system for free so I decided to mount the dust collector on the wall. This will also free up some floor space. So I started with the canister filter and bag housing (not sure exactly what this is called). To save room I was able to mount this in the corner over where I currently have the air compressor and will still have room to leave the compressor there is I want. Purchased the canister filter from Wynn Environmental.
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I am going to put a cyclone seperator on my system and had decided to use a blue 55g barrel however when I went to go get the barrel he did not have any left. I was able to pick up this 60g black pickle barrel. There are a couple of things I like about this barrel over the other one. The sides are thicker and is actually has a ring that screws down to make the barrel air tight.
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I was also able to get my used (new to me) air cleaner hung. Purchased the inner filters from Wynn Environmental.
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[Larry Blighton]

Ok so over the last couple days a had alittle time to work on my DC system. I filter and motor have been mounted (meed to add some safety straps to the motor), the cyclone is complete (went with a 60g pickle barrel instead of the blue barrel because the cyclone fit it perfect)

Really the only thing left is to connect everything and start running the piping.
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[Ron Selzer]

As long as you get a good seal it will work just fine.

[Larry Blighton]

Ok so I made alittle headway on the shop over the last 4 or 5 days. I was able to get pretty much all of the pipe and fittings to run the system for free so I decided to mount the dust collector on the wall. This will also free up some floor space. So I started with the canister filter and bag housing (not sure exactly what this is called). To save room I was able to mount this in the corner over where I currently have the air compressor and will still have room to leave the compressor there is I want.

I am going to put a cyclone seperator on my system and had decided to use a blue 55g barrel however when I went to go get the barrel he did not have any left. I was able to pick up this 60g black pickle barrel. There are a couple of things I like about this barrel over the other one. The sides are thicker and is actually has a ring that screws down to make the barrel air tight and did not require any modification to the Dust Deputy.
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I was also able to get my used (new to me) air cleaner hung.
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[Larry Blighton]

I was going to build a remote on/off switch for my Dust collector this weekend but ran out of time. I did however purchase all of the parts and pieces, so hopefully it will happen this week.
I was however able to get alot of the pipe hung for the Dust collection system. (I did not glue anything, just friction fit with 2 small screws to help hold together and HVAC aluminium tape for air tightness)

I was able to squeeze in a straight run of almost 20" going into the cyclone to help with the air turbulence going into the cyclone.
Drop #1 will be split after the gate valve with a 4" to 2.5" wye, (with another gate valve on the 4" side) this will allow me to use it for both my drum sander and small ported hand tools at the workbench off the same drop. (Because this drop is close to the garage door I can roll the Drum sander outside if needed due to the excess amount of dust created by the drum sander.)
Drop #2 will be hooked up to my band saw.
Drop #3 will have a split after the gate valve with a 4" to 2.5" wye because my router table has both 4" and 2.5" dust ports.
Drop #4 will either have a long hose attached for shop cleanup or be extended to the floor to be used as for a shop sweep.
Drop #5 will run to the center of the garage and drop down for the table saw and miter saw station.
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[Larry Blighton]

Larry, there's no issue with using a larger drum, but you must have an absolute seal between the cyclone and the barrel...not even the tiniest of leaks. The attachment method used with the original bin insures that because it's based on the clamping ring pulling things together very tightly and completely air sealed. The fact that the "bin top" is molded as part of the cyclone you have is where the challenge is going to come from because it's a different size than your alternative barrel.

Thought that I would show how the Cyclone went together. The original cyclone came with the cyclone body, 15g barrel and clamping ring. I wanted to increase my barrel size. I was going to use a 55g blue barrel with clamping ring and affix the cyclone body to the top. When I went to get the barrel they were out, which forced mt to rethink my plan. I found this 60g black pickle barrel and it was actually easier to use then the original blue barrel in my plan.

The barrel came with a two part top (a lid and ring) kinda like the ring and lid on a mason jar. <br>
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Here is what the barrel mouth looks like.
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The lid inserted into the barrel so I cut out the center leaving about a 1.5" lip.
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This allowed the molded cyclone body to sit on the remaining lip of the lid (This is where I placed the gasket that came with the cyclone).
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The ring then slips over the cyclone body and tightens down.
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It seems to work great, there are no leaks to my knowledge and it does not crush when the DC is turned on.

[Larry Blighton]

Ok so not much has changed over the last few days, I ended up just putting a clear bag under my filter for now. I decided that I wanted to put a remote switch on the Dust collection system, however when searching for one the all seemed to be either up to 1.5 HP or 3 HP and above. I have the HF Dust collector that is advertised as a 2 HP even though it is closer to 1.75 HP. Even though I has seen some review where people used some of the commercially sold 1.5 HP remote switches with success, I also saw were some had burned them out. I decided that I would just build my own.


So now I have it hooked up to a remote switch for approx $45.

[Jim Dwight]

I cannot see the pictures but why not just enlarge the opening to the barrel? I don't think it will hurt cyclone performance except if a significant amount of debris collects at the lip but it's pretty easy to cut plastic and metal with a jigsaw.