Lifting spiral pipe for installation

[Tom Dixon]

Now that I have my DC in place it was time to get serious about the spiral pipe. I placed an order for all the spiral pipe and fittings today with Blast Gate Co. and it should ship out Wednesday. Since my ceiling is at 10 feet I need a way to lift it and hold it in place while I assemble the sections. What I'm thinking of doing rather than renting something heavy duty is to purchase a drywall lift and bolt cradles on the lift made of a couple pieces of plywood with a half circle cut out. I've been looking online, mostly Amazon, and reading reviews and I think I've settled on this lift Unihome Drywall Lift 11' (https://www.amazon.com/Unihome-Drywall-Lifter-Construction-Lockable/dp/B07GSWGW7M/ref=pd_sbs_60_3/143-0116783-2718329?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B07GSWGW7M&pd_rd_r=a01d46eb-9684-41c5-81fc-2cf9a5256a00&pd_rd_w=CI1wg&pd_rd_wg=i1jxV&pf_rd_p=d66372fe-68a6-48a3-90ec-41d7f64212be&pf_rd_r=FMRPWV351YZ5KRKEW8ZX&psc=1&refRID=FMRPWV351YZ5KRKEW8ZX) which looks to be the same as this Vosson Drywall Lift 11' (https://www.amazon.com/Vosson-Drywall-Ceiling-Construction-Lockable/dp/B07TCH9PRS/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8)

Before I pull the trigger on this idea I want to consult the SMC hive mind whether this is a silly idea or not or is there some other method of lifting and holding Pipe and fittings that some of you here have used?

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FYI two guys and two ladders is out of the question for me because my ability to get free help is sporadic at best.

[Bill Dufour]

You should be able to buy a used one for about $100 and sell it after for the same price.
Bil lD

[Greg Parrish]

I used 6” PVC and managed to get 10’ sections suspended all by myself but each took lots of effort and wrangling and the drywall lift would have made it much easier. I don’t think it’s silly if you have somewhere to store it and the money to buy it. Of course the used idea makes sense too.

[Jim Finn]

I am a retired sheet metal worker and have hung miles of spiral pipe. What we did was to first install the hangars, even tempooray ones, like a cradle and then just lift the pipe into place. This works doing it alone up to about 14" spiral pipe.

[roger wiegand]

I hang a loop of something (rope, metal strapping, etc) near one end of the pipe, stick one end through the loop, lift the other into position and secure it with a hanger, then go back to the loop end to secure a hanger. Never occurred to me to use anything more elaborate.

[Matt Day]

Exactly as Jim & Tom said. Hang your furthest hanger, slip the far end through, and climb the ladder with the near end and hook it up.

You seem to want to use the most expensive methods!

[Jim Becker]

I suspect I'd use the method that Roger and Jim mentioned...in fact, that's more or less what I did for my own ductwork over the years. I didn't use traditional hangers, but the principle is the same with the "loop of something", which in my case was either one of the heavy 24" wire ties I use to hold mine up or a loop of twine hooked to a screw eye if I needed the support in an intermediate place while putting up the duct. While my ceiling is at 8', I don't see why that would be any different at 10' other than needing a taller, stable step ladder. I did all my work by myself, too...no helpers.

If you do go the drywall lift route, I agree with the "buy used" suggestion so you can leverage the fact that so many others have bought them for one-off projects and the sell them for less than they paid. For new, also look at Harbor Freight.

[John K Jordan]

Exactly as Jim & Tom said. Hang your furthest hanger, slip the far end through, and climb the ladder with the near end and hook it up.

You seem to want to use the most expensive methods!

I also used temporary hangers, for installing hvac ducts, one at the far end that was approximately in the right place.

I bought one of those drywall lifts and it is excellent for lifting and holding all kinds of things as well as sheet goods. I used it to install 4x8' 1/2" ply ceiling in my 24x62' shop after putting up the first piece by myself. One thing - you almost need an empty shop or be prepared to move everything out of the way.

I'm sure I could sell it in a heartbeat now but it's been handy to load to friends and lift and hold an occasional thing.

JKJ

[Frank Pratt]

My trunk lines are 8" 26 gauge spiral & I had no problem hanging them myself from a 9' 8" ceiling. Support methods have been suggested above that will work. Using a lift would probably have doubled the time it took to hang it all. The stuff is just not that heavy & if you have some kind of temporary support on one end then you can secure the other.

[Jim Andrew]

When I put my pipe system up, made sure it was square to the building, then I could just install the U shaped pieces of plywood to hang the pipe, and would cut a pipe to length, fit a fitting to it, then just slide the pipe up and put the parts together. Did a 45 degree offset, and I used a step ladder to set the pipe on to get things right.

[Tom Dixon]

-LOL! You guys sure know how to let the air out of my "buy a new tool" balloon. Yeah, you are right about pre-installing hangers and that will work great for the main trunk which is perpendicular to the truss ceiling joists but I think the lift will really come in handy for the 45 degree angle pipe because I'm going to have to intersect the angle with the joists. They are under drywall so that will involve both some measuring and a stud finder to get the teardrop hanger aligned to the pipe center. Supporting the pipe while figuring that out seems like it will be worth the cost considering how much I'm paying for the pipe and fittings. I ended up ordering one anyway for $144 with free Prime shipping and I will decide when I'm done whether it was useful and worth keeping, or sell it on Craig's List and recover maybe half the cost.

Now as far as pipe cutting goes I'm NOT BUYING this $1,200 saw: Exact Cut V1000 (http://www.exacttools.com/en-us/ventilation-pipe-saws/exact-pipecut-v1000-system)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=-d8DiwNmzVs

[Frank Pratt]

That saw would be great if your installing that stuff all day long. But I found a jig saw with an 18 TPI blade to work very well. Since installing the duct I bought a Milwaukee M18 6" metal cutting saw the would have worked almost as well as the Exact Cut, but for a lot less money.

[Mike Kees]

Tom I hung my suspended leg with cable and cable snuggers from the hvac outfit where I bought my pipe. I purchased all my fittings from spiral manufacturing in Minneapolis and bought the pipe locally. Here in Alberta the pipe was cheaper and the fittings non-existant and or two to three times more money.

[Tom Dixon]

That saw would be great if your installing that stuff all day long. But I found a jig saw with an 18 TPI blade to work very well. Since installing the duct I bought a Milwaukee M18 6" metal cutting saw the would have worked almost as well as the Exact Cut, but for a lot less money.

I bought this Eastwood Mini Metal Saw (https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-mini-metal-saw.html?utm_source=ECI+-+Facebook&utm_medium=DIS00084&fbclid=IwAR1OjdIppd0e83ujLvIbX1gCM8rvhFXCxsDpfxch3 et2l_68GceguN0_4zs) instead for $89. I've been eyeing it for a while for several future projects. My POS B&D jigsaw is very old and was very cheap and I don't trust it to make a straight cut. I have an idea for a roller jig that should make the Eastwood almost as good as the Exact Cut. I'll post some pics if the jig works as planned.

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[Frank Pratt]

I bought this Eastwood Mini Metal Saw (https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-mini-metal-saw.html?utm_source=ECI+-+Facebook&utm_medium=DIS00084&fbclid=IwAR1OjdIppd0e83ujLvIbX1gCM8rvhFXCxsDpfxch3 et2l_68GceguN0_4zs) instead for $89. I've been eyeing it for a while for several future projects. My POS B&D jigsaw is very old and was very cheap and I don't trust it to make a straight cut. I have an idea for a roller jig that should make the Eastwood almost as good as the Exact Cut. I'll post some pics if the jig works as planned.


Just how many cuts will you be making? I really don't see the need for a roller jig & think you'd have to make 100's of cuts to recover the time it will take to make the jig. Sometimes simpler is better.

[Tom Dixon]

Just how many cuts will you be making? I really don't see the need for a roller jig & think you'd have to make 100's of cuts to recover the time it will take to make the jig. Sometimes simpler is better.

4 8" pipe cuts, 22 6" pipe cuts and 3 4" pipe cuts, 29 total.

I like making jigs because I can get repeatable accurate square cuts. I plan to use 12 1" (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07BF2GZ7Y/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1) and 10 2" (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07F5Z2CJV/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) nylon fixed castors I ordered from Amazon for $31 and some scrap plywood I have laying around. Maybe one Saturday to build. I figure after paying close to $800 for Spiral pipe I can afford to be a little bit more careful on getting the cuts right and well worth the time invested. Oh, I'm also a bit of a perfectionist and I approach projects like this a "FUN" and not a chore that just has to done. This is the last shop I'll likely ever build before I retire in about 5 years and I plan to spend a whole lot of hours in it as I grow older. *I* am the most important tool in my shop and Dust collection will be done well as it may be the second most important tool in my shop so that I stay healthy.

[Frank Pratt]

4 8" pipe cuts, 22 6" pipe cuts and 3 4" pipe cuts, 29 total.

I like making jigs because I can get repeatable accurate square cuts. I plan to use 12 1" (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07BF2GZ7Y/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1) and 10 2" (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07F5Z2CJV/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) nylon fixed castors I ordered from Amazon for $31 and some scrap plywood I have laying around. Maybe one Saturday to build. I figure after paying close to $800 for Spiral pipe I can afford to be a little bit more careful on getting the cuts right and well worth the time invested. Oh, I'm also a bit of a perfectionist and I approach projects like this a "FUN" and not a chore that just has to done. This is the last shop I'll likely ever build before I retire in about 5 years and I plan to spend a whole lot of hours in it as I grow older. *I* am the most important tool in my shop and Dust collection will be done well as it may be the second most important tool in my shop so that I stay healthy.

I did all the cutting on one of those plastic tables with the folding legs, which are great general purpose things to have around. The duct was marked with a Sharpie and a piece of heavy poster board wrapped around the duct as a guide. The jig saw worked very well, but that metal cutting saw you have would be so much faster. I totally get why you want to make the jig. Lots of times it's not just the destination, but the journey as well.

[Peter Rawlings]

FWIW, I wanted to do it all to the 'nth level too. By the end of install and still today I realize if the system design is good, some details aren't worth sweating.

I tried the Drywall lift because I had it. Abandoned early on in favor of an oversized loop of cable and lots of up & down ladder. The lift was just too clumsy because of the machines already in shop. The long loops could easily be shortened by a pull on cable clamp.

Easiest and fastest way to cut pipe was with metal abrasive blade in 4 1/2" angle grinder and die grinder to deburr. I tried the caster roller setup and found it clumsy like drywall lift. Marked with sharpie, pulled masking tape around pipe as guide. With some practice I could cut pretty darn straight freehand and in fact now employ the methodology more elsewhere.

Eyehooks and Kwikwires and wire rope were sourced for cheaper on eBay and stockpiled in anticipation of project.

In places where I couldn't hit bottom chord of trusses, I spanned with a jointed, planed and painted 2X4.




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[Peter Rawlings]

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[Frank Pratt]

Easiest and fastest way to cut pipe was with metal abrasive blade in 4 1/2" angle grinder and die grinder to deburr.

That's a very nice installation Peter.

But a metal cutting saw will cut faster than an angle grinder & leave virtually no burr. Just a really quick swipe with a file will take away any sharpness.

[Tom Dixon]

That's a very nice installation Peter.

But a metal cutting saw will cut faster than an angle grinder & leave virtually no burr. Just a really quick swipe with a file will take away any sharpness.

Dito what Frank said. That's a very nice looking installation. In my case however I'll be using 3/8 threaded rod with teardrop hangers. I don't/won't have a place to connect wire anywhere on my ceiling which is why I need a lift of some sort or an extra helper.

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[Andrew Seemann]

I just drew a line with a Sharpie around the pipe where I wanted to cut. Then I secured the pipe and used a Sawzall with a metal blade in it. it worked quite well actually.

[Mike Kees]

I made a pipe wrap from two 14'' long sheets of paper and duct tape. Cut with my jigsaw and pop riveted most of it together.Also used some self tapping screws. A half round file will be your friend as well. Sealed with the aluminum foil tape. Be prepared to make changes as time goes on,machines get moved,new ones follow you home etc. Also no matter how well your system is figured out,something will not quite work the way it is supposed to. The good part is after doing the whole system you have the skills to change things. DAMHIKT. Good luck.

[Matt Day]

Well put Mike. I installed a snap lock system in a very similar fashion, with a sharpie line and jigsaw, just without pop rivets.

As said, you can plan these things as much as you want but it usually doesn’t all go as planned.

[Tom Dixon]

Progress Report
So on Monday I ordered all my spiral pipe and fittings from Blast Gate Co. They shipped it on Wednesday and it arrived yesterday. Woo Hoooo! I unpacked it it today and took a couple photos. I also punched some holes in the wall for the main trunk and return air.

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[Tom Dixon]

Progress Report
So today I had fun making a Jig to cut spiral pipe and got my first piece of the main trunk installed that connects to the DC. I secured the DC to the floor with 1/2" lag screws after getting the pipe connected. I also installed the return air filter vents. Below is a video of the first time trying the jig. I was pleased with the results.


https://youtu.be/nvOXFkhoF2M

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[Mike Kees]

What happens when you change to another pipe diameter ?

[Tom Dixon]

What happens when you change to another pipe diameter ?

The castors should be good for 6" after I cut all the 8" and get the main trunk installed. I will need to trim the height of the 2x6s to lower the saw though. If I planned to do this all the time I would make a more permanent version using T-track so it was adjustable.

[Mike Kees]

Have fun Tom. It was just the first thing that I thought of when I watched your video. This is your journey and you get to decide how and when you reach your destination. I will say that you are really going to like that cyclone, and you will be happy that you went to the extra effort to put it outside of your main shop. I wish I could have done that.

[Greg Parrish]

Looking good Tom. If I’d have had a bigger, more open shop, think metal pipe would be the way I went too. The jig appears to be working well. Could have used that for my 6” pvc as I cut it all free hand which didn’t always match up once I got around the circle. LOL

[Osvaldo Cristo]

I used that cheap small metal hooks screwed on ceiling for a similar application as well to hang all my rain collecting system... I worked alone. It works, it is easy and dirty cheap.

[Jason Roehl]

I just drew a line with a Sharpie around the pipe where I wanted to cut. Then I secured the pipe and used a Sawzall with a metal blade in it. it worked quite well actually.

We just had a whole floor's HVAC system replaced at my place of employment (I'm a maintenance tech). LOTS of spiral pipe, from 24" down to 4". What you described is exactly how the union tin-knockers did it.

[Tom Dixon]

Well, I have to say the drywall lift worked perfectly. I made some progress today. All of the 8" main trunk is hung. I haven't screwed anything together yet in case I need to make fitting adjustments when hanging the 6" pipe.

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[Jim Becker]

Nice idea with the cradles!

[Frank Drackman]

That is pretty slick!