Wood looking Sign for Lake House Extira?

[Bill George]

My wife got me into a project, so does stand up well for a outside sign?
https://miratecextira.com/extira-exterior-panels/

I know its not PVC or the $350 a panel stuff that Pros use but it seems to be pretty tough stuff and says it carves or routs well. 5 Year Exterior Warranty. My local Menards store carries it in 3/4 inch thick sheets for about $80.

[Mel Fulks]

I started useing it years ago when it first became available. Holds up well ,good stuff for cornice end caps and such. It's
real heavy ,and the dust is pretty dark and dirty. Georgia Pacific had same type stuff for a while. They stopped making it
and denied they ever did make it. Strange people.

[Jim Becker]

I haven't used it for signs, but am about to use it for some architectural trim reproductions for a client. We chose it because of the exterior rating for these painted pieces and because it will cut well on the CNC. I suspect it will be fine for your application once finished...but yea...heavy.

[Bill George]

I haven't used it for signs, but am about to use it for some architectural trim reproductions for a client. We chose it because of the exterior rating for these painted pieces and because it will cut well on the CNC. I suspect it will be fine for your application once finished...but yea...heavy.

Yeah 99 Lbs for a 4x8x 3/4 inch sheet and must use oil based primer sealer. Wonder what happens if you do not paint does it look like just a dark wood? ... at least for a while anyway.

[Mel Fulks]

Unpainted it would quickly look like an old clip-board. You could paint some striations with a darker color , used to be
seen often .

[Mel Fulks]

I used acrylic primer . Don't remember reading about using oil base. Seems strange , I would call a rep

[Bill George]

I used acrylic primer . Don't remember reading about using oil base. Seems strange , I would call a rep

Its in a PDF file "Using Extira for Signs" states it pretty clearly. Even names approved manufacturers.

[Mel Fulks]

Bill, thanks for info. Just seems strange ,there are so many things that would be also used vertically . But they only call for
it on signs. And most horizontal stuff takes more of a beating with sun and rain.
I finally remembered the name of the Georgia Pacific product. Fiberstrate. They mailed info and a small piece of it to
just about every shop in US. It was written up in the trade magazines. But they said they didn't make it and never heard
of it. We did eventually buy two whole units. But it took a long time to get somebody who would pledge to "find it".

[John_ Smith]

Bill, how big is your sign going to be ? what purpose will it serve ?
in my very personal opinion, a "Lake House" stirs up images of a
nice get-away in the woods on a lake. It should reflect the natural
surroundings in any kind of identification or signage.
which means, no plastics or manmade materials.
all natural wood that has been handcrafted by the owners.
jus my Dos Centavos

.

.

[Scott Shepherd]

I don't know what size and shape you are planning on or what the mounting will be. I used it many years ago on a number of outdoor signs. I didn't find their claims to be accurate. Left untreated, it swells up just like MDF when it gets wet, and when mounting larger sheets, the sun would bow it pretty strongly. We used it on some 4' x 8' vertical signs so the posts were mounted 44" on center and on the 48" width, they would bow a good 2" when the sun hit them.

I wasn't impressed with it.

[Bill George]

The lake house owners are interested in one thing.... cheap. I offered to use some wood from their property and it was a no go. My wife bless her heart told them since they were friends with us, Bill would do for "free" so they jumped at that of course..... offering to pay a "fair price" for the wood. ;) .

Scott in all the reviews I have read on that product, yours is it first negative one. Are you sure your talking about the same thing? This is not exterior grade OSB.

From the Website Made with the same proprietary TEC™ process used to make MiraTEC, Extira is a revolutionary product for exterior applications that performs better than wood or MDF. Extira panels may look like MDF, but they don’t perform like it. Different ingredients and a patented and proprietary manufacturing process lead to a superior performance.
Extira is easy to work with; can be carved, routed and machined. Resists moisture, rot, and termites. Twice as strong as MDF, Extira is made to be used outside.

[Mel Fulks]

Scott, good info on the Exterra. The smooth outside is obviously not the same as the inside. I do think that that finding
the right primer or "coating" would hold it. As good as MDO is there is no warranty for edges left exposed to weather.
I think a frame around it would keep it flat.

[John_ Smith]

I am thinking that Extira is an offshoot of the old MEDEX.
anyone that goes back that far can remember what a fiasco that was.

if the homeowner wants cheap and free, I would give them just that.

.

.

[Scott Shepherd]

Scott in all the reviews I have read on that product, yours is it first negative one. Are you sure your talking about the same thing? This is not exterior grade OSB.

From the Website Made with the same proprietary TEC™ process used to make MiraTEC, Extira is a revolutionary product for exterior applications that performs better than wood or MDF. Extira panels may look like MDF, but they don’t perform like it. Different ingredients and a patented and proprietary manufacturing process lead to a superior performance.
Extira is easy to work with; can be carved, routed and machined. Resists moisture, rot, and termites. Twice as strong as MDF, Extira is made to be used outside.

Bill, I'm 100% positive it was extira. I still have a couple of small signs I made with it somewhere around here. It was marketed to be the new best product for making signs. I left 1/2 a sheet of it sitting outside against our building for about a year. I can assure you that it was anything but happy with that treatment. All the edges swelled up like MDF. I think it was 3/4" thick and the edges probably swelled to 1". We made a number of signs with it. It's so heavy it's not funny and it's just MDF with waterproof glue (more or less) and that means it has no grain to hold any shape. Paint it a dark color and sit it in the sun and watch it pull it towards the sun. It's not a very stable product.

It'll look great when you do it. You'll be happy with it. However, once it's installed, be prepared for it to move around.

We stopped using it because of all the issues. I'm in the sign business, it's what I do for a living and I can honestly say that I've never talked to another sign company or been asked by another sign company to use it in the last 7-8 years, so I'm not sure who all these "sign makers" are that are thrilled with it or using it all the time but they aren't around here or on any sign forum I've ever been part of. I think that's the marketing team at work.

Is it okay to make a free sign out of for a friend? Sure. Would I use it for a good customer? I wouldn't in my business.

[Ross Moshinsky]

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Veranda-HP-3-4-in-x-48-in-x-8-ft-White-Reversible-PVC-Trim-Sheet-H190AWS13/206822526

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Veranda-1-2-in-x-48-in-x-96-in-Cellular-White-PVC-Panel-HDSHSM124808/301950563

It's got a bit lower density than the "premium" PVC, but it's not that different and the 3/4" price is very competitive.

[Bill George]

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Veranda-HP-3-4-in-x-48-in-x-8-ft-White-Reversible-PVC-Trim-Sheet-H190AWS13/206822526

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Veranda-1-2-in-x-48-in-x-96-in-Cellular-White-PVC-Panel-HDSHSM124808/301950563

It's got a bit lower density than the "premium" PVC, but it's not that different and the 3/4" price is very competitive.


Interesting but no where does it list the weight? I have my sign already started but this stuff might be ok for a future project.
It would be a interesting media for a gingerbread project for a builder or custom art / sign.

[Kevin L. Waldron]

Scott

Probably need to check facts.....https://miratecextira.com/the-tec-process/

[Bill George]

Scott

Probably need to check facts.....https://miratecextira.com/the-tec-process/

Its not even close to MDF or MDO, totally different product. I wonder if Scott got the same stuff? I used just plain old pine board and painted the heck out of it. When done carving, I used spar varnish to coat. I usually do not mess around with these little jobs, but this is a honey do one. The spar varnish even multicoated should last a full 2 years!

PS I have requested a sample.

[Mel Fulks]

Bill, I hope the spar varnish works for you, let us know. My experience has always been that good paint doesn't save
woods that don't have good exterior ratings. I would like to know why. But I haven't tried the spar varnish. Light
canvas glued to any wood before painting does work.

[Scott Shepherd]

Scott

Probably need to check facts.....https://miratecextira.com/the-tec-process/

No need to check any website, I, for one person on this thread, have used the product repeatedly over a several year period because of all the hype. I know what it is, I know how it performs, I know we do not use it to make signs from. As mentioned, do as you wish. I'm just giving you professional experience from a guy who makes signs for a living. The fact is that Extira isn't carried as a sign material by any of the leading sign substrate suppliers. I've been going to sign trade shows for more than 10 years, never once since Extira there, or a sign made from it. Never once seen a wholesale sign supplier offering signs made from Extira.

If you think that it's just my opinion that says it's not a great product for signs, then listen to the industry who doesn't use it.

Want to use it? Go right ahead. Doesn't matter to me, it's not my customer and I get nothing from telling you my personal experience with it.

[Neal Schlee]

I use it for exterior signs, it machines well. After routing I seal all exposed areas with 3-4 coats of Spar Varnish cut 1:1 with mineral spirits. Then prime and paint.

Have some signs up for 10 plus years, no complaints. This in Alaska, very harsh climate.

Neal

[Bill George]

I use it for exterior signs, it machines well. After routing I seal all exposed areas with 3-4 coats of Spar Varnish cut 1:1 with mineral spirits. Then prime and paint.

Have some signs up for 10 plus years, no complaints. This in Alaska, very harsh climate.

Neal

From what I read online it its got a water-repellent built in thats oil based. Your example shows that a oil based Spar Varnish is more that likely the coating for a sign. I was under the impression that a lot of sign makers use a foam or plastic material that may be 100% weatherproof. Scott can verify or not.

[Bill George]

Got my free sample kit today with spec sheet and sales sheet, nice piece 8x8 x 3/4 inches and a some round coasters like things about 1/2 inch thick. Caution for exterior use Must be primed and painted or like Neal above several coats of oil based spar varnish and then paint. I have some other shop things going on right now, but I will try to router engrave the 8x8 inch piece and set outside for a while. The coasters I might try lasering and then spar varnish.

[Scott Shepherd]

If I have to put 4 coats of varnish, then primer, then paint, I’m not using it. It’s not cost effective for those of us not in extreme environments like Neil. If that gets him long life in Alaska, then hats off to him for figuring that out.

You can use sign foam, 1 coat of primer, 1 coat of paint, 2 if you wish. Lasts a long, long time. Outside rated PVC lasts a long time too.

[Mel Fulks]

I'm in the same town as Scott. My project has been up 12 years and has not needed repainting. Full sun and rain exposure
and painted white. It's pierced imbricated panels used as deck railing. The top rail is 4 or 5 inches wide with drip edges.
Does not keep the panel dry. Scott ,you are welcone to come over and see it.

[Scott Shepherd]

I'm in the same town as Scott. My project has been up 12 years and has not needed repainting. Full sun and rain exposure
and painted white. It's pierced imbricated panels used as deck railing. The top rail is 4 or 5 inches wide with drip edges.
Does not keep the panel dry. Scott ,you are welcone to come over and see it.

I think you are misunderstanding what I'm saying about it. I have said, "Left untreated it swells up". That's a fact. Leave some outside for a while and report back. I have said "It's not a practical solution for signs". I stand by that. I have said you can make signs from it, HOWEVER, it's not PRACTICAL. Having to seal and put multiple coats of products on it just to get it to the same point other products are already at doesn't make since from a business standpoint. If I can chose from two products, one that I can put 10 hours work in and one that I can put 5 hours work in and both last the same amount of time outdoors, then why would I ever pick the 10 hour method? The sign industry as a whole, agrees with me. Does that mean you can't make something out of it? Nope. It just means it's not practical.

I stand by my other statements as well, if it's a larger panel, it will pull towards the sun rather strongly. I've seen it bow several inches over 4 ft.

He asked for opinions, I've given mine. You might disagree, that's fine, but this is by no means some super sign material. It's just not, and the sign industry agrees by their lack of willingness to use it widespread.

[Art Mann]

I don't know about carving Extira but I can say it is used widely on new houses for things like front porch column wraps and it appears to hold up well. I think most of it is painted with latex, despite what the manufacturer may recommend. If it were me, I would use premium PVC sheets. I don't do big signs but small ones - say 24 by 36 - look great for many years without repainting.

[Jim Becker]

Art, I actually just cut a bunch of architectural reproductions...corbels and balusters...out of Extrra for a client and agree it's really useful for that kind of thing. I know they will be sealed and finished properly, too. Like you and Scott, however, I favor HDU or PVC for sign work. All those iterations of sealing, etc., wouldn't make sense for anyone making a living doing signs. A one-off by someone doing it personally, perhaps...but not as a business.

[Mel Fulks]

I can't help but wonder if Scott was sent regular mdf. I don't think mine was marked on the edges. We've all seen
warehouse clean-ups.

[Scott Shepherd]

I can't help but wonder if Scott was sent regular mdf. I don't think mine was marked on the edges. We've all seen
warehouse clean-ups.

I didn't get one sheet, we used it numerous times. I'm not sure why my experience with it is constantly being discounted. Try it yourself. Sorry for trying to offer my years of experience working with outdoor sign materials and being in the sign industry.

I'm also not dumb enough to not understand the difference in Extira and MDF. Us it all you want.

Let me modify my statement.....

Extira is awesome. Use it everywhere you can.

Problem solved.

[Mel Fulks]

Scott,you are clearly a bright bulb and a great help here. None of my theories on the product discount your knowledge.
But I don't discount mine either. "Bad batch" is always a possibility ,too.

[Scott Shepherd]

"Bad batch" is always a possibility ,too.

Never said the material was defective. Said it wasn't a practical sign making material for the majority of things in the sign mainstream. It's very heavy, a quality not liked when having hang signs.

Go hang a 4' x 8' with sun exposure on it and report back on how it acts. Let one get hit by property sprinkler systems and then baked by the sun. It'll bow so bad it'll just about pull the screws out of itself.

[Mel Fulks]

Jim ,I don't think the sealing has to be extreme. And only extreme treatment I've seen In this thread is in Alaska. That's where
they use dogs with extreme fir.
MDO mfgs say edges need to be treated. But I've seen plenty that are not treated. Mfgs want it ALL treated. I see
no reason to think EXTERA needs more treatment than MDO. An easy extreme treatment would be Titebond 2 brushed
on edges ,press down strip of canvas , let dry ,trim with utility knife. It will make ordinary ply wood as weatherproof as
MDO.