First class and planes

[Jamie Derudder]

Just got done with my first class. And onto the next soon.


i took a class where started with white oak thick logs. split them and used froes to rip boards. Riving.we planned the boards down. The goal was a Viking toolchest. Now I’m more of a blacksmith so the next step the metal wasn’t to complicated. However it’s got it hooks in me!

now for class picked up a scrub plane and # 4 plane.

what planes would you suggest next in order? What beginner tools would you say make sure to get for this in particular ?

rabbet plane ( I borrowed one)
#7 plane
jack plane
foreplane over a #7 plane

[Andrew Seemann]

Definitely jack plane next. Very handy and usually readily available used pretty inexpensively. Good for basic flattening and can be used for edge jointing in a pinch. Actually having a couple or more is nice, then you can have one with a cambered blade for heavy cuts, and one with a flatter blade and a finer mouth for edge jointing or more refined flattening. Some folks prefer a single low angle jack with multiple blades for this, but for me, that isn't compatible with my patience level and it costs more than multiple standard angle planes.

After that, I'd say block plane, then maybe a longer plane like a fore or jointer.

Warning, plane acquisition can be habit forming. Below is only one cabinet.

411911

[Jim Koepke]

Howdy Jamie and welcome to the Creek.

What plane comes next depends on a few things.

Are you planning on buying new or used?

How big are the pieces on which you intend to be working?

The jack plane gains its moniker from being a 'jack of all trades'. It is very versatile. If you are riving a lot of wood, it can be fitted with a cambered blade to be used as a scrub plane. For stock in the 3 to 4' range it can be used like a jointer. A jointer would have a straighter edge. A #5 with a blade very slightly cambered or no camber blade makes a nice long smoother. Set the mouth tight and the chip breaker close.

If you are buying used, #5 planes are rather common and can be purchased relatively inexpensively. Buying a used #7 requires a bit of luck to be in the right place at the right time. It does happen. One came to be for less than $25. It required a lot of work:

https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?114373

It is now a nice usable plane.

If you are looking for used, check the pawn shops, antique shops and other second hand stores.

jtk

[ken hatch]

Just got done with my first class. And onto the next soon.


i took a class where started with white oak thick logs. split them and used froes to rip boards. Riving.we planned the boards down. The goal was a Viking toolchest. Now I’m more of a blacksmith so the next step the metal wasn’t to complicated. However it’s got it hooks in me!

now for class picked up a scrub plane and # 4 plane.

what planes would you suggest next in order? What beginner tools would you say make sure to get for this in particular ?

rabbet plane ( I borrowed one)
#7 plane
jack plane
foreplane over a #7 plane

Jamie,

Living in the desert allows me to have a lot of tools. That said, my true working tool kit is pretty small because I use machines to prep my stock. Planes, a #4 and a #5 Jack (cambered iron), a few wide paring chisels, a half dozen or so bench chisels. a rabbit, a plow, a router, and a #140 block plane. Too many squares of all kinds along with marking knives and bevels and way too many saws. I will not go into stones but will say I've never met a stone I didn't love.

Depending on what you want to do, make stuff or play with tools. If it is make stuff buy good new and go to work. If you enjoy playing with tools you can find all kinds of used tools to spend your time and money on. In the end the cost is about the same either way.

ken

[Jamie Derudder]

I have from smithing acquired a kick on new tools.


So I really like what I read and will probably be going for Lee valley tools. However we all know lifestyle creep exists so will be spreading it out as that’s important too.

pics from class! My hands still hurt though ..

[Warren Mickley]

Welcome to the forum, Jamie.

The traditional kit for this work is four wooden planes:

Jack plane 16" with cambered iron for rough work
Trying plane 22" for truing the surface.
Jointer plane 30" for making edge joints and refining
Smooth plane for cleaning up finished work

Metal planes can be substituted for all of these and a kit of #5, #7, an either #3 or #4 will work. The jack plane and the trying plane are used for the bulk of planing, however, and since they are more comfortable and less tiring to use than the metal planes, wooden are preferred.

I recommend avoiding the bevel up planes; these were designed by people who did not know how to use planes. Not for serious work.

[Frederick Skelly]

I recommend avoiding the bevel up planes; these were designed by people who did not know how to use planes. Not for serious work.

Uh oh. Incoming!

[William Fretwell]

Jamie a jack plane would be next, immensely useful tool. Your boards are shorter than a #7 but that would be next.
I have a bevel up jack and #7. They can be very frustrating but occasionally do a better job than bevel down for some woods. I would stick to regular for now.
Wooden planes are shocking in how light and fast they work, I have a couple and love them but tuning takes more time, no simple knob to twist. A wooden #7 would save some money (mine cost $10) and it’s just to fine tune an edge or a top, not the grunt work.

[Jamie Derudder]

Been searching and found Jim Bode, is there any other sites that have drops on woodworking tools like this? Obviously ebay..anything else?

[Jim Koepke]

Been searching and found Jim Bode, is there any other sites that have drops on woodworking tools like this? Obviously ebay..anything else?

Hi Jamie,

Maybe it is my age that has me wondering what you mean by "have drops on."

Patrick Leach has a monthly email list of tools for sale. Even when no tool purchase are being considered his list is one of my must reads for the educational value.

Start here:

http://www.supertool.com

To sign up for the monthly list click on > Old Tools < in the links across the lower part of the page.

For information on Stanley planes, click on > Patrick's Blood & Gore <.

jtk

[Jamie Derudder]

Drop on: internet lingo for sites you shop on that randomly will put up items that you are in search of ..

You have to beat everyone else if you are in search of something. It’s a clever business strategy really as ( in the case of Jim bode..etcetc) as it keeps you checking out the site. Tons of internet merchants do it especially as the items go up in collectibility/need.

[steven c newman]

Might look at timetestedtools.....Don Wilwol is a member here....

[Jamie Derudder]

Picked up a few , found a couple of older ones for about $40 a 3 and 6, picked up a 5/7 for more. Have some projects to refurb these.

Anyone know if taking a 2x72 belts/ scrotchbrite belt to these is a good decision. It should give it a nice satin look.. but the patina will be gone. Will this make these instant rust ?

(I live in phoenix)

[William Fretwell]

First I would try a rust remover with fine wire wool on non painted surfaces. If you have to flatten the bottoms tape a large sheet of sand paper to a flat granite surface and do a figure of 8. Wipe clean surfaces with Johnson’s paste wax to protect from rust. A Peter Sellers rag in a can for the bottom during use and after will stop rust, not likely where you live!

[lowell holmes]

I think you need at least one draw knife for rough shaping.

https://www.woodcraft.com/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=draw+knives&button=search&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=%5BADL%5D%20%5BNon-Brand%5D%20Tools%20%26%20Accessories%20-%20General%20Tools%20%26%20Accessories%20(Broad)&utm_term=%2Bdraw%20%2Bknife&utm_content=Knives%20-%20Draw&adlclid=ADL-2e6b7617-69d6-48c9-a2e3-f27dbc56136d

[Jim Koepke]

I think you need at least one draw knife for rough shaping.

https://www.woodcraft.com/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=draw+knives&button=search&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=%5BADL%5D%20%5BNon-Brand%5D%20Tools%20%26%20Accessories%20-%20General%20Tools%20%26%20Accessories%20(Broad)&utm_term=%2Bdraw%20%2Bknife&utm_content=Knives%20-%20Draw&adlclid=ADL-2e6b7617-69d6-48c9-a2e3-f27dbc56136d

Me thinks you meant to post this in a different thread.

jtk

[Jim Koepke]

Picked up a few , found a couple of older ones for about $40 a 3 and 6, picked up a 5/7 for more. Have some projects to refurb these.

Anyone know if taking a 2x72 belts/ scrotchbrite belt to these is a good decision. It should give it a nice satin look.. but the patina will be gone. Will this make these instant rust ?

(I live in phoenix)

Jamie,

To help with your question it would be helpful to have images.

If the planes are not terribly rusted, it might be fine to leave them as is. The instant rusting or 'flash' rusting happens often after a chemical clean or drying in an oven.

Of course, if you want your planes to look like new, then finding a way to shine them up is another story.

Very few of my many planes have been treated to abrasive cosmetics unless the sole needs to be worked. At one time my enthusiasm for sole lapping was a bit stronger. Now it is only done to remove rust or if there are problems which can be traced to a non-flat sole.

The Neanderthal wisdom/FAQs has a lot of information from various sources you may find helpful and informative:

https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?103805

Here is an old post of mine:

https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?114373

jtk

[lowell holmes]

Not really, they are both part of the same tool bench. At least they are in my shop.

[lowell holmes]

I have these irons and breakers in my Bedrock Planes.
A 604, 605, and 607.

http://hocktools.com/products/bl.html

[Jim Koepke]

I have these irons and breakers in my Bedrock Planes.
A 604, 605, and 607.

http://hocktools.com/products/bl.html

Same here only in Stanley/Bailey planes. Most of my planes are equiped with Stanley blades from various years. The Hock blades are very good blades. The Stanley blades if not pitted and turned to junk can hold their own.

jtk

[Jamie Derudder]

412749412750

I started with 3 planes .. about average cost of $40

i went with a 603, 606 and found this even rustier and pitted bedrock 605 than above.

i went with white vinegar to baking soda, then used stripper for the jappaning.
i went with a 2x72 on a glass back flat platen with ceramic 120/400 belts to a scotch brite belt.

so about half way there. Awaiting new jappaning to arrive and got to do small parts tonight.

Thinking I may go fully in and just replace the blades with Lee valley

[Jim Koepke]

Thinking I may go fully in and just replace the blades with Lee valley

You will save yourself some effort and possible troubles by getting chip breakers with the new blades.

It sounds like you are off to a good start. Pictures of your progress are always enjoyed by others. Especially pictures of your finished planes.

jtk

[Jamie Derudder]

I ended up using old belts yesterday in the above, but this morning felt I had to many machining marks.

so did one more grinding , but 1/10 of the time with the nice belts in 120/400 and switched from fine to medium for scotch brite. Basically got all the scratches going the same way.

That will be the the end of it as grinding can be addictive and it will never be perfect.

The last was the bedford it’s pitting was really bad.. 603,606 and 605.

before new belts.

412755412756412757412758

[Jamie Derudder]

After in comparison to my lee valley, some character marks but that’s okay. I tried to remove the least amount of material as possible.

412759

[Andrew Seemann]

Nothing wrong with character marks. Scratches, dings, and patina give your planes more street cred.

I always look suspiciously at woodworkers whose tools always look like the pictures in the catalog, almost like they have never been used. . . . .

[Jamie Derudder]

So my japanning landed from Pontytool, they were out so I had to do the waiting game started tonight !

Does anyone know for a fact if it’s 4 layers. I read that ... somewhere and couldn’t find it

[ken hatch]

Same here only in Stanley/Bailey planes. Most of my planes are equiped with Stanley blades from various years. The Hock blades are very good blades. The Stanley blades if not pitted and turned to junk can hold their own.

jtk

I agree, my preference is the Stanley OEM cutter if saveable. If not, if forget who makes them, a Japanese replacement iron which is also thin. Then third if neither of the other two options work a thicker O1 Hock or Veritas blade.

ken