Old Table Saws

[Reg Mitchell]

If you had your choice of a Tanniwitz or and Oliver, say the 260 and a J model Tannie which would it be.
Reason : I have just found out there is a guy around here that has a big warehous of the things, he buys out companies going out of the furnitur bussiness and he has some of about everything.:eek:

[John Miliunas]

Reg, I have little doubt that it won't be near me but, where is "around here"???:) :cool:

[Reg Mitchell]

I live in Tennessee. I have a phone number to the guy, maybe if i throw some bussiness his way i can get a break on the saw i deside to buy.....but i need some input from you guys.

[Cecil Arnold]

I'm sure Dev has some definite ideas that he will share.

[Reg Mitchell]

OK wheres Dev...not sure i know him I am not that long a resident here...but I like it, pretty good info.;)

[John Miliunas]

Reg, his name is Dev Emch. Drop him a Private Message, referncing this thread. His knowledge of old iron is absolutely incredible and can probably rattle off model numbers of stuff he'd recommend!:D That's NOT to take away from some of our other members who are also inclined towards some of the older pieces but, you'll get the full skinny on something from Dev! Plus, he really enjoys talking and actually teaching us about the various pieces of heavy equipment out there. :) :cool:

[Dev Emch]

Oh, I can take it any more...... all these mentally difficult questions....

Should I get an Oliver or a Tanny... Hmmmmmm. The modern, large format saw was invented by these companies and, sorry to say this, these models are all inbred. They often hired folks back and forth between companies and they freely borrowed each others ideas. So to say that one company is better than another is hard to do. We are not comparing a yugo to lexus here. More like comparing differing models of lexus.

First of all, I am not a fan of late model tannywitz saws because many had sheet metal bases whereas the others and eary models of tannewitz had cast iron to the floor bases. This is a minor complaint. If an early model, tilting arbor tanny came my way, I would find it easy to adopt it.

In looking for working saws, beware that some had tilting tops and not tilting arbors. For a first saw, you should avoid the tilting tops. Most old iron guys who have tilting tops have them for collector sake and not use sake.

The oliver 260 is most likely the trickest oliver ever made. With its slip rings, dual motors, twin arbor mouted turret, etc., this is an engineering wonder. But I personally dont like dual arbor machines. I own an oliver 88 which in some ways looks like a grade school student designed the outer asthetic. For technical reasons including the addition of a european sliding table, I prefer the 88. I dont have a euro table on mine yet, but I keep this option open.

The tanny on the other hand is very much similar to an oliver 88. But quite a few have sheet metal bases. Nonetheless, many folks find the tanny superior to the oliver. I have never personally run a tanny in the bush so I cannot attest to this. But I have heard it from numerous folks.

But how much better would it be if any at all? Not Much. I would venture to say that if you pick any saw of this size, desgin style and layout, you will never never never return to what your using now. Be that an oliver 232, 270, 370, 88 or 260. A similar argument can be made for greenlee, oliver, whitney, tanniwitz, northfield, etc. I kinda like the whitney as a overall, general purpose saw be that a 77 or the later 177 model. Its been said that a whitney has many similarties to the tanny.

The problem with oliver is that oliver has a cult following. Its like the grateful dead. Take a new, goth rock group and rename it the grateful dead and see how many of the original fans stick around. That is the problem with the blue oliver today and what the old oliver owners did not understand when the naming rights were sold.

So what you should do is go to this warehouse and inspect *ALL* of the machines in this group and test drive them if possible. Raise and lower the blade, set up the fence, do a mitre cut, etc. The proof is in the pudding. Check out fit and finish even though the finish may be messed up right now. Many older machines were painted with a floor brush by huck finn's buddies!

At the end, if you prefer the tanny, then buy it. Else, if you like the oliver 260 or the whitney better, than buy that one. What I can tell you is that there is more iron in one tanny trunion than in an entire powermatic or unisaw mounting system!

Be on the lookout for excessivly load noise or vibration. Being an older machine, it may also be in need of work (i.e. work a reduced price).

Best of luck....

[martyphee]

Oliver and Tany are both great machines, but if you can find a 260 that would be my choice. Awesome machine.

http://www.owwm.com/PhotoIndex/detail.asp?id=499

[Sparky Paessler]

I live in Tennessee. I have a phone number to the guy, maybe if i throw some bussiness his way i can get a break on the saw i deside to buy.....but i need some input from you guys.

Hey Reg would that be Upper East Tennessee. There use to be a warehouse of old machines in Elizabethton TN. Don't know if it is still there.

[Reg Mitchell]

Well Dev,
Thanks for the advice guess i just as well go and look. I really am looking to buy a good sturdy saw. I will let you know what i end up buying and why i bought it. Again Thanks for the info.
Reg:D

[Reg Mitchell]

Hey Sparky,
YEP you hit the nail on the head.
I worked as a machinest for a few years and now work in QC. One of the guys i work with use to do some work for "Charles" and he found out i was looking for a good saw. He told me the company name and the owner and i called him up, really nice guy. Told me to call a day ahead of time and come on over and he would let me tour the place and see what i wanted.
Might be an idea to do some tradeing with him and maybe start rebuilding some of the neglected ones and sell a few. ;)
Reg

[Dev Emch]

As Marty said, the 260 is an awsome machine. I think if you lined up a row of these large format saws from Oliver, Tanny, Whitney, Northfield, etc., and told me to pick just one, I would have a very very very very very very very very and did I say VERY hard time choosing the right one.:D The dislikes or cons if you really wish to call them that are so minor. What become more of an issue if feel. Like putting on a suit, how does it feel in your hands? How does the saw make you feel? Do you have a warm and fuzzy? And that is something I cannot help you with.

If you go there, ask this guy if he has any really old machines by John White of Dover, NH? In particular, I would be interested in snagging a John White jointer with the gothic access door and the two front mounted table handles. Consider any condition as I wish to restore to show room myself.

[lou sansone]

there is a nice oliver 260D on eb_y right now. you might want to look at it
lou

[Mike Cutler]

there is a nice oliver 260D on eb_y right now. you might want to look at it
lou

I am going to have to have a major garage/shop wiring upgrade. I really want one of those.

[CPeter James]

Dev,

Did you see the picture of David Lamb's collection of John White tools on the back cover of this month's FWW. I have been in his shop and they are quite impressive.

CPeter

[Reg Mitchell]

Thanks Lou I saw it and sent him an e-mail saying l'de take it at his asking price and didn't get a reply back not sure what it went for. The weild sorta had me concerned a bit.:)

[lou sansone]

Thanks Lou I saw it and sent him an e-mail saying l'de take it at his asking price and didn't get a reply back not sure what it went for. The weild sorta had me concerned a bit.:)

hi reg

that was ME you sent the email to! I was selling the saw and it did sell to a great buyer. The weld is fine... don't worry about it. It was repaired at least 20 years ago by an expert in cast iron welding. excellent weld and very accurate repair. The saw has run ever since working just fine. The oliver went for a reasonable price IMHO. Other than that one repair the saw was flawless, especially the top. most are screwed up and this was mint. all of the etchings were clearly there as if it was brand new. There is nothing like the direct drive saws. Even with a slightly warped 16" blade on it, I easily balanced a 3/4" flat washer on edge with the saw running !!
happy iron hunting

lou

[Roy Wall]

Oliver and Tany are both great machines, but if you can find a 260 that would be my choice. Awesome machine.

http://www.owwm.com/PhotoIndex/detail.asp?id=499

Hey guys,

Is that basically two miter guages that slide in a slot to "clamp" the wood?? Then use the slider to do the cut???

That's pretty slick!!

[lou sansone]

Hey guys,

Is that basically two miter guages that slide in a slot to "clamp" the wood?? Then use the slider to do the cut???

That's pretty slick!!

no I don't think that is what doug is suggesting. doug is just showing the various guages that he got with the saw. the miter guage works just like a normal miter gauge and the quadrant gauge is used to hold the cross cut piece at what ever angle you want on the slider. The slider also locks and then you can use the miter guage as it normally would be or you can add a second guage and lock them together with a special clamp made to couple them together to form a sled.

lou

[Dev Emch]

Yes, I did see David Lamb's toy collection. There are a number of photos posted from his shop on the owwm site www.owwm.com under the John White of Dover listing.

I do like this improved buzz planer (aka jointer). Its hard to keep in trim unless your a jointer guru but after dialing it in the first time, its easy. What I like about this design is the single piece body, the gothic design access door, the independent table suspension and the front mounted control wheels. It is a babbit bearing machine so you need to know how to feed babbit bearings. Properly maintained, babbit does just about as well as ball bearings. You need to go to class 7 bearings to really outperform a good babbit bearing.

[Reg Mitchell]

Well Lou I would have liked to have had it :) but it is my first endever into old machines and, not saying i didn't trust you, but it was me that was a bit leary, sorry. I did however find a very nice Oliver 232 at a good price. I will keep looking though and maybe later i might be able to find a good deal on a RAS for the shop next. :) I kinda like the older stuff, seems built much better. Built to last and not just for a quick build and fast buck.

[lou sansone]

hi reg

roger the concern on the weld. one should always be concerned about such things. You will find that in general with older machines that some type of repair on some part has been done. If I had droped the machine myself and then fixed it I would be the most cautious about a fresh weld. If the machine was fixed many years ago and you can see that the job was decent, and the machine is still running fine then you are probably going to be fine with it. I agree with you, that in a perfect world one wants to find perfect machines without any problems. You can sometimes find them..my MOAK 36" Band saw is in that class.. just perfect. But you have to look long and hard for them. You will most likely have to pay top dollar for them as well. One bit of advise I would give you is to stay away from furniture factory machines. they have been used too hard and will require complete rebuild most of the time. small cabinet shops and pattern shops are the place you want to look. I would also tend to shy away from goverment auctions unless you can actually inspect the machine in person.

happy hunting
lou

[Frankie Hunt]

Hey Reg or Sparky, Could you send me some info on the fellow in Elizabethton? I would like to upgrade a tool or two next year. I saw an older Powermatic model 72 in Gray about 3 months ago. I bet it is still for sale if you are interested. I went to look at an older shaper I found in the Trading Post. While there I spied the saw off in a corner with stuff piled on it. It was pretty rough, with no fence. I couldnt tell if it was 3 phase or not. He said he would take $700 for it. I passed on the Delta shaper. I didn't think it was quite worth the asking price. Frankie