An introduction and table saw question

[Marcus Ward]

Hi, I'm new here, but from the looks of the place I will be spending a lot of time here. I've been a woodworker off and on since my high school days and am comfortable with most aspects of the craft. My wife and I just bought a house and are planning on furnishing it mission style. Since we're not rich, I'll be building the pieces rather than buying them. This serves 2 purposes, one, I get nice furniture, and 2, I finally get to build a wood shop like I've always wanted to do.

My father in law sold me his new unused craftsman table saw #24884. It's okay, I realize you guys use a lot nicer stuff. One concern I have is that the track for the miter tool and other accessories has a couple of ears along its length, keeping the tools in the track but not allowing me to use more conventional accesories. What should I do about this (besides get rid of the saw and get a better one). Can I just file them off? How would you guys approach this? Thanks in advance for your wisdom and hospitality.

Marcus

[Jim Hager]

Welcome to the creek Marcus. You will like it here. You will fit in just fine as the most of the rest of us are just poor folks too.

I have not had much experience with a craftsman table saw but is what you are mentioning the t-slot in which the mitre guage washer goes into in order to hold the mitre guage head if it is off the table?? If that is the case leave it alone because the standard mitre guage and other accessories should fit it fine unless it is one of their saws they made with non-standard slots. If that is the case if you get off the shelf accessory items it will probably have to be from Sears. I hate it when they do that, don't you.

[Alan Turner]

Welcome Marcus. Sorry I can't help you with the TS question, but others here will. Personally,if it is as Jim said, I find those washers to be a PITA and usually just remove them.

[Matt Crew]

Welcome to the Creek Marcus.
I'm not sure about the TS myself either, but I'm confident one of these fine citizens of the woodworking arts will be able to answer your question.
Don't feel bad about not having expensive equipment, most of us are in the same situation, but I can assure you that the information you receive here is invaluable.

[Marcus Ward]

I guess it's kind of hard to explain because as I do some reading I realize there is an industry standard that is a good t-slot, and then there is this. It's like a normal slot except for 2 1" sections where there are little ears that overhang the slot. Near as I can tell, a normal (untslotted) miter tool won't work in the slot because it'll hit these ears. I'd like to use a tenon jig, but I am afraid to buy one thinking it'll entail buying a new table saw to use it with. Maybe I am just not looking at this thing properly, or I need to get a special kind of accessory, or I have to go shopping at sears. When I go to their website it has certain attachments that 'aren't for aluminum table topped saws' which this one is. I imagine I'm going to have to just make do (be creative).

[Dave Falkenstein]

I guess it's kind of hard to explain because as I do some reading I realize there is an industry standard that is a good t-slot, and then there is this. It's like a normal slot except for 2 1" sections where there are little ears that overhang the slot. Near as I can tell, a normal (untslotted) miter tool won't work in the slot because it'll hit these ears. I'd like to use a tenon jig, but I am afraid to buy one thinking it'll entail buying a new table saw to use it with. Maybe I am just not looking at this thing properly, or I need to get a special kind of accessory, or I have to go shopping at sears. When I go to their website it has certain attachments that 'aren't for aluminum table topped saws' which this one is. I imagine I'm going to have to just make do (be creative).

Can you post a photo of the slot problem?

[John Bailey]

Marcus,

Welcome to the "Creek." You're gonna love it here. I can't help with the table saw question either. I don't have a table saw. I think you'll get plenty of good advice, but it would help if you can post a picture. In fact often you'll be advised on this site that if there's not a picture, it doesn't exist.;) So, my advice would be to post a picture, or realize there is no problem.

Welcome to the "Creek."

John

[Larry Reimer]

Marcus, have you considered buidling your own cut-off sled (or two)? Then you can mill the runners to fit your slot and use the cut-off sled as a base for your other attachments. I sure wouldn't hesitate to grind or file a couple of ears that overhang the slot if that would make the slot "standard".

[lou sansone]

hi marcus
welcome to the creek.. you will find a nice variety of folks here that we can all learn something from.

lou

[Bill Simmeth]

Hi Marcus and welcome! I went to the Sears website and looked at pictures of your saw. I can see the issue you are posting about. It looks to me like this was done intentionally by Sears to restrict the type of accessories that could be used with this saw -- as a safety measure, perhaps. The saw is a bit limited in capability given the universal motor and the aluminum table with 20" depth and I think Sears wants to limit what's done with it in its "stock" configuration.

You might consider building the saw into a workbench to increase the work surface and thereby increasing the overall stability. Having done this, I might then consider milling off the ears so the miter slots are "standard".

[Guy Germaine]

Welcome Marcus. You mentioned that you would like to use a tenoning jig on your saw. I don't know what your fence looks like on that saw, but I made one to fit my Beise, as I didn't have the cash handy to buy one. This one works great, and I'm sure you could modify the design to work with your fence. BTW...It's not pretty, but it works! :D

http://www.fototime.com/224075C70B46BD8/standard.jpg

[tod evans]

welcome marcus, guy has given you good advice; build your own jig, might as well start now `cause you`ll be building lots of jigs in order to furnish you house.. good luck, tod

[Jim Dannels]

Hi Marcus: Welcome to the Forum.
I am relatively new to the hobby,myself.
This is a great forum, with lots of helpful people.
I would be willing to bet, that while many here have awesome equipment.
They started with something less.
I started with a Delta Bench saw that like yours had the T Slot miter channels. Still keep it around for those jobs where I need to take a portable saw to a job. And now am using a BT3100.
The T channel may be problematic for off the shelf accessories.
But half the fun of woodworking is making jigs and fixtures to do the difficult to nearly impossible.
You can make your crosscut sleds etc by simply ignoring the t section of the channel when making runners and simply running the runners to the bottom of the channel.
In short use what you have, untill you discover it simply won`t do the jobs you need to do. By then you would have a better idea of what you need.
We would all like to have one of those Cast Iron monsters but not at the expense of a second mortgage:) so must save for that.

[Frank Hagan]

You may find that in addition to the 'ears' that Sears has added to the top of the miter groove, they have a non-standard width of the miter groove as well. At least my old Sears contractor's saw did. I was able to use a tenonning jig by creating narrower miter bars, but that was certainly a hassle.

A shop built jig, like the one pictured here, is probably the way to go. Its also cheaper than spending $100 on a commercial jig.

Good luck with the furniture projects! I found quite a few inexpensive plans that look like they are within my capability on the http://www.plansnow.com site ... they are the "outlet" for the ShopNotes family of magazines and have a ton of plans for both shop made jigs and Mission / Arts and Crafts furniture.

[Rob Horton]

Marcus

Welcome tothe Creek! Looks like you have a craftsman table saw much like my first one. Hate to say this but after much contemplation, I ended up buying a better saw. I tried to find resources to build my own replacement top, special fixtures, etc - all just to use standard jigs and fixtures.

The reason I ended up buying a better saw was that I thought to myself - how much time and effort am I willing to put into essentially building the saw that I need vs. just buying what I need and then being able to use the standard stuff right away. But that's just my humble opinion.

Anyway, I ended up buying a better saw, not a really fancy one, but one with standard stuff. I got a floor model Delta saw from Lowes. Its been a real workhorse for me. Not a great saw, just a good solid saw. It cuts square and has standard slots.

So that's my two cents. Shop for good deal. You'll be better off for it in the long run.

[Marcus Ward]

Fellas, thanks so much for all the input. Yes, Rob, a new table saw is definitely on the list, but it's the long list instead of the short list, too much stuff is in front of it in order of importance. Would a delta TS300 be a bad saw? I'm on a tight budget these days. Anyhow, this is for later, for the now, I really like Guy's idea. It'll work perfect for my situation. My slots are non standard width as Frank mentioned. It's 5/8 or thereabouts. Here is a pic of the particular issue:

http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=3974

Thanks everyone for making me feel so welcome. I am looking forward to learning and sharing much around here.

A little about the situation. My wife and I recently bought a house, a little old farmhouse on 2 acres that has a 1200sq ft detached garage. The guy who built it had his body shop in there. It's got plugs every 4 feet on the walls and ceiling, gas heat, air conditioning, insulation, huge exhaust fan, concrete floors with drains, etc. It's pretty much man cave heaven. As soon as we get all the household items (moved but not placed due to ongoing work inside the house) out of there I'm going to set up shop proper. I'm not really a professional bike racer, that's my little joke. I'm a substitute teacher (lost my 'real' job last year) and my wife lets me get away with this. All summer I race mountain bikes with my wife so I like to joke that I'm a pro sponsored by my wife. It's a good life.

Thank you everone for your input.

Marcus

Here's a pic of myself last summer.

http://www.f-64.org/racing2.jpg

[Rob Horton]

Marcus; the TS300 is exactly the one I bought from Lowes. Got the floor model for about $220 I think. Would I do it again, you may ask? Yep, for that price I sure would.

I know what you mean about the budget (as proof, see what I paid for my saw). So if you can make do with what you have until what you want turns into what you can afford, then that's always the best option ;)

[Rob Horton]

Marcus I just noticed that you're a fellow Missourian. We live around 2 1/2 hours away from you. A double-welcome the creek! :D

[Marcus Ward]

Ah yeah I know exactly where Warrenton is, I used to live in St. Charles. I'll be driving through there to see my folks for christmas.

I figure I can live with the table saw I have for a while, I need a planer worse. I have 2 amish sawmills within 5 miles of my house. I can buy roughsawn oak for the price of finish sawn pine. Maybe I can sell my body to science fiction.... ;)

[Bart Leetch]

Marcus

I had a opertunity to use one of these saws. To say I hated the miter slots would be an understatement. But I did make a nice cabinet for my own contractors saw. I would recommend for you to use this saw only long enough to be able to afford a good contractors saw also build a nice base cabinet for your new contractors saw as a very first project. I wondered why I didn't build one first it is such an improvement to the saw & provides storage for the saw blades & push stick & push shoes & router stuff for the router table I had in the left wing. A big plus was the casters to be able to move it around.

[Corey Hallagan]

I agree with Bart, use the saw until you can upgrade it. I started with an 8 inch benchtop craftsman and used it until it begged for me to lay it to rest :) I am sure there are other tools you want to pick up for the time being. Sinceyou have a tsaw you can use for the time being, save your money and buy the best tools you can afford that you feel you need whether it is a router, Bandsaw, jointer etc. Get at least good enough that you wont out grow the needs in the next 10 years. Welcome to the forum, be safe and have fun!

Corey

[Marcus Ward]

Well fellas, I agree with the advice. Buy the best stuff you can afford. I have got THE LIST and I'm figuring out ways to pay for these toys err ahem, tools. The main things on the list right now are a new table saw and a planer. Oh and a tenoning jig. I'll build a router table and I think that will get me pretty far down the road. I really appreciate all the input and advice, it's invaluable. The interesting things I've read on here already have made a big impact on my ideas. I used to be a very bad offender of no guard on the table saw but after seeing what happened the young lady's fingers on her shaper... I've once again vowed to be safe.

When I was in high school we had the opportunity to take woodworking every year, and I did. I had a great teacher named Mr. Muench. Don Muench. He was an old ex-hippy surfer guy who somehow ended up teaching shop and made a profound impact on my life not just in woodworking, but in my person as a whole. Later in life I realized what an impact he made on me but I found out he'd died of a heart attack and I never got a chance to thank him. It's amazing what comes along with a little knowledge about woodworking. I wish he were here today so I could say thanks.

Marcus