fumes from oil-based poly floor finishes

[Rob Blaustein]

OK, I've done some homework and read some older threads about different options for finishing hardwood floors, but I have a few questions. We are leaning towards an oil-based poly for new oak floors in a new bedroom suite, to be installed and finished by a pro, but I was wondering about the smell and possible toxicity. So how bad is the smell, how toxic is it (my wife is 8 months pregnant), and how long does it last? Do we need to be out of the house for a few days or can we just stay on the first floor--the new flooring will mostly be confined to the upstairs bedroom/walk in closet, and we can close it off from the rest of the house and open the windows in there. We might have to turn off the heat for the upstairs (forced hot air) so that the returns don't recirculate the fumes. Would we be better off with water-based poly if we want to stay home during this process?

[Dev Emch]

I normally avoid water based poly products. But I do buy a house brand from a flooring supply outfit which is designed for commercial applications. It can hold up to 25 years of commercial traffic. So for homes, short of strapping sandpaper on your feet, this will last a long time. Some of these floor finishes are formulated for floor use and just happen to be water based. The wave of the future. Call your local flooring supply outfits and ask for the top of the line, commercial traffic, water based poly products. Not cheap at about $65 per gallon give or take. But I have not yet had a failure here.

Oil based products will outgass for a while and with it being winter and your wife is expecting, I dont think I would take the chance esp. with the aforementioned info.

Best of luck...

[Barry O'Mahony]

When we had our HW floors installed, they used a commercial water-based poly finish. The installers said that's the standard finish to use these days; it is very durable, and what with alot of places having tough VOC restrictions these days, using oil-based is problematic. it came with a long warranty, FWIW.

[Steve Schoene]

The water borne finishes are a good idea in this situation, but not a panacea. Waterborne means less VOCs, not no VOCs.

I don't have comprehensive knowledge of these finishes, but looking at some specification sheets suggests that some waterborne varnish may have over 50% of the VOC content of oil based varnishes. I looked at Sherwin Williams just because I could find the full specs online. Sherman Williams Wood Classics Oil Poly has about 4 lb./gal. of VOCs, and the Waterborne Poly in the same line has 2.6 lb./gal.

There are floor finishes with considerably fewer VOCs. I saw a Sherwin Williams two part ArmorSeal floor finish that showed only 0.41 lb./gal. So it may take some scouting around since you can't be sure of really low VOCs just by going to waterborne.

I'd still consider a couple of days "getaway". It can't hurt.

[Rob Blaustein]

Thanks for the replies. I will try to found out which water-based finishes the flooring guy uses--I've not talked to him yet since he's subcontracted by my contractor. Maybe I should reconsider our initial choice of an oil-based finish--sounds like water-based might be safer, and it also sounds like the better ones give a good result.

[Travis Porter]

Personal opinion is it takes 2 to 3 coats of water based to equal oil. Having done the oil based poly and oil based stain, the fumes can be horrible. What I did was block off the room, open the window, and have a fan venting out.

For the water based like Parks, they had an additional hardener to be added to it. Came in a little pouch and was supposed to increase the durability and hardness when it was used on floors.

[Dan Larson]

Rob, I would be more concerned about your wife's exposure to VOC's if she were in her first trimester. HOWEVER, why take any unnecessary risks with the health of your future child? Use a water based finish to be sure, and getting out of the house for a few days after the floor finishing would be a smart idea.

Congrats on your impending fatherhood, by the way. That's great news!!!:D

Dan

[Bill Lewis]

Personal opinion is it takes 2 to 3 coats of water based to equal oil.I read this as 2 to 3 coats of water based to equal ONE coat of oil (poly) based. I agree.
After about 2.5 years on our HW floors, the finish is nearly gone in some areas. We do have two dogs (45# and 85#) and they are a bit harder on the finish but I think the installers only applied 2 or 3 coats. We're going to re-apply in the spring, and yes we will use another water based top coat. As many coats as we can.

[Richard Wolf]

Some good info here. One more concern is the oak dust. As good as their equipment is, some people, have a reaction to oak dust, even in a small amounts that may escape. Maybe your wife should leave for a few days.

Richard

[Rob Blaustein]

Some good info here. One more concern is the oak dust. As good as their equipment is, some people, have a reaction to oak dust, even in a small amounts that may escape. Maybe your wife should leave for a few days.

Richard

If they are putting down a new floor, will there be sanding and dust?

[Richard Wolf]

Yes, after the hardwood in installed they will be using large floor sanders to make the floor level in preperation of staining and/or finishing. It is the messiest part of the job.

Richard

[Charlie Plesums]

There are some new type floor sanders that do an excellent job with dust collection...good enough that the rooms don't have to be sealed off. It would be worth choosing a flooring contractor based on that equipment, if you have a choice.

The old sanders with a dust bag are not what I am talking about.

[Walt Pater]

Rob, have you considered pre-finished flooring? My last flooring gig (for an expecting couple) was 3 1/4" Bruce oak strip flooring. Nailed it down and VOILA! The floor was done. Walked away. No dust, no fumes, no hotels, no sock feet for a week, no trying to carry heavy furniture while actually sorta dragging it, nada. Zero. Zip. Floor was done. Poof. The client got it from Lowe's, and with some rebate coupons, as well as a 1k sq ft order, the price uninstalled was a tad higher than $2.50/sqft. I had never used a prefinished product but in this instance it worked out really well for all parties.

[Mike Vermeil]

Rob,

Keep in mind that water and oil based polys will impart different colors to the oak flooring, even if it is stained prior to finishing. Personally, I much prefer the richer, more amber hue that oil based urethane gives to oak, but you might like the almost crystal clear quality of water based. Given the length of time you'll have to live with these floors, I'd make the decision based on which is the best lasting and looking, and if that means your wife visits her sister for a few days, well....

[Bob Johnson2]

Rob
Just a thought. While staying away for a few days may suffice if you leave a window or two open, are you going to do so in Dec/Jan in Boston? I did a couple cabinets a couple weeks ago and it smelled (pretty strong too) for a good week without the windows open. I did crack a couple for a few hours during the day but it didn't do much good. It did get good and cold. I give up on oil based during the winter, the rest will have to wait till spring.

[Mark Singer]

Glitsa is one of the best....it is pretty potent and I really hate the smell ...good stuff though

http://www.glitsa.com/

[Rob Blaustein]

There are some new type floor sanders that do an excellent job with dust collection...good enough that the rooms don't have to be sealed off. It would be worth choosing a flooring contractor based on that equipment, if you have a choice.

The old sanders with a dust bag are not what I am talking about.
Charlie,
I don't really have a choice of floor contractors BUT I could conceivably convince my contractor to rent one of those sanders for a day (or just rent it myself). I saw something like this on some show or maybe an ad in Fine Homebuilding. Do you know of a brand? For some reason I have in my head that Festool makes such a product, but I could be imagining that.


Rob
Just a thought. While staying away for a few days may suffice if you leave a window or two open, are you going to do so in Dec/Jan in Boston? I did a couple cabinets a couple weeks ago and it smelled (pretty strong too) for a good week without the windows open. I did crack a couple for a few hours during the day but it didn't do much good. It did get good and cold. I give up on oil based during the winter, the rest will have to wait till spring.
I think we probably could do keep some windows open because the new flooring will mostly go in an area that can be closed off.


Glitsa is one of the best....it is pretty potent and I really hate the smell ...good stuff though

http://www.glitsa.com/
Mark,
Just went to their site and they seem to have lots of products. Is there one that you've used that you recommend?

In an older post Andy Halterman wrote, "Two good stout finishes I would recommend are BonaKemi Traffic or Basic Coatings StreetShoe. Both are two part waterbased polys and they hold up very well to abusive folks. Glitsa and Synteko are good two part conversion varnishes that also are pretty durable."

Has anyone else used any of these?