Rabbet Plane advise

[Allen (AJ) Breese]

I'm looking for input, advise & other ideas for this task with out breaking the bank. I'm wanting a rabbet plane to cut shallow 1/32 - 1/16 deep rabbets when cutting dove tails. I really don't want to spend the big dollars on a Veritas skewed rabbet plane for all I'm going to use it for. I have been looking at used Stanley 78's & the other brands also Record 778's. Then I thought maybe get the inlay kit & fence for my router plane, I know this is more steps but I can use these for other task as well.

Thank you
AJ Breese

[Nicholas Lawrence]

I have never done that for dovetails (there is some clever name for it I think). No reason the Stanley 78 can’t cut them for you though. I would clamp something on the backside to avoid blowout.

[Andrew Seemann]

I'm not sure how a #78 will do with your dovetailing task (actually, I'm a little vague on how you are going to use it, and where the rabbet is), but a #78 is a handy plane to have in general, and they sometimes aren't too expensive to pick up. Make sure you get the spur and all the parts to the fence and check that the casting is good. They are rather fragile.

[Ray Newman]

Of the two you mentioned, I had a Record 778. When I purchased it, the deciding factor was the fence had two bars to hold it in place and was easier to lock down. From what I've read on the various boards and hear from Fellow Woodworkers, seems that the Record 778 is/was a better tool.

[Richard Line]

An alternative to the rabbet for dove tails is to use blue tape. Put 1 or 2 layers on near what will be the base line, then mark the base line with your marking gauge, making sure you cut all the way through the tape. Then peel off the tape above the base line and you have the edge to work from. I've tried both the rabbet and the tape and the tape is a bit easier/quicker. Both work. Check Derick's web sight for more on the blue tape.

A rabbet plane is handy to have around, I use my 78 and wood rabbet planes often, but they do take some practice to get the good results and feel confident using them.

[Allen (AJ) Breese]

Thanks! Good idea I will give it try.

[ken hatch]

I'm looking for input, advise & other ideas for this task with out breaking the bank. I'm wanting a rabbet plane to cut shallow 1/32 - 1/16 deep rabbets when cutting dove tails. I really don't want to spend the big dollars on a Veritas skewed rabbet plane for all I'm going to use it for. I have been looking at used Stanley 78's & the other brands also Record 778's. Then I thought maybe get the inlay kit & fence for my router plane, I know this is more steps but I can use these for other task as well.

Thank you
AJ Breese

Allen,

One of the names for cutting the rabbet is "the 140" trick. Allen Peters used the technique with a Stanley 140 block plane. If you have a "snipes bill" it is real easy to cut the rabbet with a unfenced rabbet plane and they are dirt cheap. Well under a $100 USD new.

ken

[Richard Jones]

If you want to do the shelf thing, just saw and chisel and clean it up with your router plane and a large base. No need for a fence. I think the step is unnecessary, but I have done it that way. Are you having trouble marking the pins?

[Ray Newman]

As I was not 100% per cent sure I knew of "The 140 Trick", I found it on-line -- http://imaokguy.blogspot.com/2017/10/alan-peters-140-trick.html

[Allen (AJ) Breese]

Funny I was just looking at that!

[ken hatch]

Funny I was just looking at that!

I seem to remember that:),

ken

[Derek Cohen]

I'm looking for input, advise & other ideas for this task with out breaking the bank. I'm wanting a rabbet plane to cut shallow 1/32 - 1/16 deep rabbets when cutting dove tails. I really don't want to spend the big dollars on a Veritas skewed rabbet plane for all I'm going to use it for. I have been looking at used Stanley 78's & the other brands also Record 778's. Then I thought maybe get the inlay kit & fence for my router plane, I know this is more steps but I can use these for other task as well.

Thank you
AJ Breese

AJ, kit is not a rebate/rabbet plane you are seeking but a block plane with a skewed blade. This method (of creating a shallow rebate for aligning a dovetail) was popularised by Rob Cosman, who was taught it by late Alan Peters, the amazing English furniture designer/maker. The plane he used was the Stanley #140 skew block plane. Rob Cosman used the LN version.

Here is Chris Schwarz using it (look carefully at the end of the tail board, and you can see that his plane spelched the corner) ...


http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/The140TrickisDead_html_m10f37b55.jpg

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/The140TrickisDead_html_4cfa74dc.jpg

Recently I posted a method using blue tape that does away with planing. The blue tape adds a fence against which one can register the tail board against the pin board. After marking out, simply peel away the tape. The article is here: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/The140TrickisDead.html


http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/The140TrickisDead_html_146c950c.jpg

The fence acts in the same way as the "#140 trick", except that it may be peeled away afterwards and there is no altering of the dimensions to the board ...

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/The140TrickisDead_html_25c7a597.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[brian zawatsky]

I'll vouch for Derek's blue tape method being superior to the shallow rabbet, I have tried both and I'm sticking with the tape. (Sorry, couldn't resist the opportunity to throw a cheap pun in there) Quicker, easier, cleaner, no risk of spelching like in CS's photo above.

[Andrew Seemann]

Never seen that bit about planing a rabbet to register the board to mark out a dovetail. Weird. It seems like an awful lot of extra work just to draw a few lines on the end of a board. It. also seems like it just adds to the things that can go wrong with your project, more risk for not a lot of extra help. If you did want layout assistance that blue tape thing seems more than adequate.

[Graham Haydon]

Allen

You're getting down to the fine details of how you want to approach your dovetailing. If you want to try it, why not give a 78/778 a go. A good tool to have, it might work for you, it might not. Although I don't use this method, I would recommend only making a very shallow rebate, less risk of breakout. Derek's option is a worthwhile option too if you want to experiment. I would not bother for 99% of the time with tape or a rebate but it's nice to know these methods exist should the need arise.

[Osvaldo Cristo]

I'm looking for input, advise & other ideas for this task with out breaking the bank. I'm wanting a rabbet plane to cut shallow 1/32 - 1/16 deep rabbets when cutting dove tails. I really don't want to spend the big dollars on a Veritas skewed rabbet plane for all I'm going to use it for. I have been looking at used Stanley 78's & the other brands also Record 778's. Then I thought maybe get the inlay kit & fence for my router plane, I know this is more steps but I can use these for other task as well.

Thank you
AJ Breese

I think a sharp marking gauge or knife plus a router plane would be a fast and cleaner solution. Router planes are cheaper and there is resources in the internet taught how to make them with just a few bucks.

Good luck in your searches!

[Kevin Hampshire]

Since I’ve never tried it, I can’t comment on Derek’s blue tape trick.

I have used variations of CS rabbet plane trick and have had really good luck with it.



I do love using my router planes at every chance, but for me, the router plane wouldn’t be optimum for this task.



Lastly, the rabbet is across the grain. I use one of multiple skew rabbets for this rebate.

Why would a straight blade Stanley 78 be a good choice for going across the grain?

[Ted Phillips]

I've tried both methods (the 140 trick and blue tape). Setting up the rebate is just too much work. The tape is quick and effective and gets the job done without any extra fussing.

[James Waldron]

Blue tape don't rust!!! :D

[steven c newman]

Haven't found a need for either.....I just mark and go...

[brian zawatsky]

Lastly, the rabbet is across the grain. I use one of multiple skew rabbets for this rebate.

Why would a straight blade Stanley 78 be a good choice for going across the grain?

Kevin I was thinking this same thing myself. The 78 & 778 are great for narrow rabbets in long grain, but the cross grain situation presented here calls for a skewed blade for sure. Not to beat a dead horse but a roll of 3M painter's tape is a lot less expensive than a vintage Stanley 140 with all its parts, and even more so the Lie Nielsen modern version of the same tool.

Now I ought to cease and desist; I would be loathe to be accused of talking another woodworker out of buying a new tool :D

[Tom M King]

If you get a 78 or 778, for whatever reason, make sure the nicker is with it. I bought a 778 new, and it's been one of my most used planes. Stanley used to sell replacement nickers, but I'm not sure that they still do. The nicker will allow you to make a clean rabbet cross grain, or at least, clean on the shoulder.