Hollow form collars/lids

[Jenny Trice]

I recently took a hollow form to our club's monthly instant gallery. It is a squatty shape and I made a collar and ball on top (rather than a finial). I glued the assembly together. When standing at the instant gallery table, one of the club members was trying very hard to get the 'lid' to come off, to which I responded, it doesn't come off. He came back with, 'it isn't much of a box if you can't take the lid off'. Ok, point taken, but it wasn't intended to be a box. I know the reality was that he wanted to stick his finger inside, as we all like to do :-)

So, my question to this forum is, should collars and finials always be removable from hollow forms? Can't wait to hear your answers!

[Edward Weingarden]

I glue the collars to my hollow forms as they're meant to remain on. I can image that someone could put a finger in the opening, lift by the collar, and the HF goes to ground. As far as finials go, I haven't done too many. I guess they could be part of a removable top, or permanently affixed, depending on the design. I'm interested to see other feedback on the finials.

[Chris A Lawrence]

Can you post a pic of the hollow form so we can see what you are describing? I have been playing around with pewter collars that have threaded finials. I rough cast the pewter and turned it on the lathe with wood turning tools.

[John Beaver]

I think collars should be attached. The biggest issue with attaching a finial is it makes it much more complicated to transport / ship.
If you want to keep fingers out, make the hole on the collar too small for a finger.

[Jenny Trice]

Here is the one that drew the comments. Apologies for the poor picture. I just took one for the purpose of this conversation. It is about 6 inches in diameter and maybe 5.5 inches high.401733

[Chris A Lawrence]

It probably drew that comment because it looks more like a lid. The reason i say that is it does not follow or compliment the curve at the top of the hollow form. Just a suggestion next time cut a lip in the top so the collar can sink into the hollow form and be flush with the top. This is a box i made to give you an example.

[Jenny Trice]

Thanks Chris. I will work toward the flush collar. The one in my pic is my first collar that I have ever done. It is actually recessed but not enough to make the transition smooth. Did you glue yours in and then finish turning or is it a tight enough fit, or did you do the pieces separately?

[Chris A Lawrence]

that one is a lid. I turned the bottom first. Then worked on the lid. I did the top side first holding the wood with a 2 1/8 recess 1/8 inch deep and drilled a 3/4 inch hole where the knob goes. I flipped it and used the 3/4 hole with some pin jaws to shape the bottom with constant test fits until it was a good fit.

[CHARLES D Richards]

401761Chris,
if the bottom is out of slightly green wood, do you let it dry before you turn a lid. Would it be best to wait till then to cut the lip in the bottom. It seems if the walls are thin for the bottom and it's unbalanced when dry it would be hard to turn the lip after drying. I have a walnut hollow form that I blew the top out of and would like to turn a lid for it but at this point it does not have a lip. Wall thickness is 3/16-1/4". The vessel was turned about 3 days ago. Trying to decide whether to put it back on the lathe now or wait.

sorry, Jenny, hope this isn't hi-jacking your thread


401760

[Chris A Lawrence]

You would need to dry it but a 1/4 inches thick you will not have much to work with to get the warp out. All my boxes i have made i did with kiln dried wood. If you do it while its still green the lid will end up not fitting. Personally i would write that up as a learning experience finish sand it and level out the base once it dries and warps. To me that looks nice enough that i wouldn't modify it.

[CHARLES D Richards]

You would need to dry it but a 1/4 inches thick you will not have much to work with to get the warp out. All my boxes i have made i did with kiln dried wood. If you do it while its still green the lid will end up not fitting. Personally i would write that up as a learning experience finish sand it and level out the base once it dries and warps. To me that looks nice enough that i wouldn't modify it.

sounds like good advice Chris, thanks

[Richard Coers]

When a collar and a ball look like a lid and a handle, everyone will try to take it off. It's what people do.

[Jenny Trice]

This piece was twice turned so it was dry and the collar/lid fit. I just chose to glue it because it was not intended to be a box.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

As a box turner, I can't see why one would make something as nice as that and not have us peek inside........ It's a beautiful piece. Why do you want to have it 1 piece?

[daryl moses]

As a box turner, I can't see why one would make something as nice as that and not have us peek inside........ It's a beautiful piece. Why do you want to have it 1 piece?
I agree with Kyle. It is a very nice piece and having a removable lid isn't that hard to do.
I've turned quite a few hollow forms, urns etc and they are either open at the top or have removable lids. It never occured to me to have the lids permanently attached.

[Jenny Trice]

No real reason to glue it except that I didn't think of it as a box and didn't want the relatively rough inside to distract from the outside. The 'lid' actually fit nicely when I glued it in :) Next time I will think about it longer before getting the glue bottle out. Thanks for the comments.