Decisions, decisions... A 12" or 16" jointer?

[Craig Day]

I'm looking to upgrade my 6" jointer to a 12" or 16" jointer. I'm aware the wider, the better. Space in the shop for either size is not an issue. The only real issue I'm having is stomaching the cost of a 16" vs a 12". I've been trying to keep my eye open for used equipment, but 12s and 16s are harder to come by. I have a 20" planer to accompany this.

So my question to all of you is: how often do you really need 16"?

I could frequently use a jointer in the 8-12" range... I"m not sure I've come across something I've built where I absolutely needed a 16 (I'll hand plane stuff here and there as needed if it gets too wide for my tools). Of course as my tool capacity expands I tend to build bigger things. What sort of things is everyone building that make use of a 16" jointer?

And for reference, I much prefer buying rough stock and milling it. I live relatively close to a fabulous hardwood supplier where I can buy most of it rough and mill myself... much cheaper than buying their S2S or S4S stuff.

On a last note... I struggled for a bit with buying the 36" vs 52" rip fence on my sawstop. I ultimately went with 52". Of course I read all of the threads with people that rarely use more than 36" rip capacity... I'm extremely happy I went with the 52" rip fence. I have ripped beyond 36" so frequently that it surprises me. The last time was just a few days ago when cutting a 44" x 40" backer for a vanity mirror (christmas gift). This sort of experience has me thinking I'd be just as happy with a 16" jointer as I suddenly found more uses for it. But gosh.. the price... buy once, cry once?

[Matt Day]

From one Day to another....

I’m on my 3rd jointer, a Northfield 12LD that I restored. Bought it for $600 from a school auction. I can see a 16” jointer sometime in the future, but the 12” is fine for now. For bigger machines like these used is the way to go IMO. Cost of new is tough to stomach.

Personally I don’t use/can’t find wider lumber than 12”. If I need to joint something really wild it will likely be a slab and i’ll Make a slab flattening jig for the router.

Listing your location could help us find used ones in your area.

[David Kumm]

In the old jointer world, 16" is more common than 12" but also more desired so priced a little higher. The old Oliver 166 and Porter 300 had guards that could swing out of the way so you can joint boards wider than the bed by running them through twice. Not perfect but close enough to get through the planer on both sides. Any old jointer ( Northfield, Yates, Newman etc ) with a Surty guard will do the same thing. Condition of tables and motor are the big deals as most are direct drive. Take whatever is in the best condition. Flat tables are more important than size- although I have a 12" Oliver in storage because I prefer the 16" Porter. Dave

[Andrew Hughes]

I have a 12 inch Oliver that takes care of all of my builds. I don’t usually resaw anything over 10 inches so most of the time I keep my fence about 10 inches on the jointer for facing. I save the rest of the knives for edges.
Good luck on your quest.

[Mike Kees]

I just bought a 16'' Paoloni jointer. I was looking at a 12'' Cantek but the seller wanted 3500,found the Paoloni for 2400. Save 1100 and end up with more capacity,took about 1/2 second to make that decision. What I have found is that I skew wood at times with weird grain etc . I would of been happy with 12'' but am very glad I ended up with 16''. Mike.

[Patrick Kane]

I started with a 6" then went to an 8" and finally to a 12" in about 12-16 months. I think i had the DJ-20 for all of 3 months. At the time i had zero money to pay for tools an was building commissions to save up, so i dont regret the way i did things, but it was a PITA and inefficient use of energy and time. I dont think i would ever recommend someone buy a 8" machine. I dont know who came up with that capacity, but i dont think they ever woodworked a day in their life. I think the first or second board i put over the beds of the DJ-20 was 8.5" wide. Insert a flashback of me rolling my eyes for that moment. I ran that machine without a guard from day 2 until its last day in my shop. I think 12" is a very nice class of machine. They usually weigh around 1000lbs, so are stable. Bed length is 7-8' long, which covers most of your longest jointing needs. 80% of my lumber is 12" or under. Keep in mind though, even though the machine has 12" long knives or cutterhead, you cant really joint a true 12" wide rough cut board. I dont know you from Adam, but i think most people would be satisfied with a 12" machine of whatever make. I had a grizzly ultimate 12" for 3-4 years. 12" machines arent common, but you can usually get them in single phase, which may or may not be important to you.

After years of using the 12", i began to yearn for a 16". Maybe it was just my luck with my wholesaler, but i kept collecting 12.5-15" boards that i would use last of all, because they required no guard, hand planing etc. Call me whatever you want, but 12" of exposed cutterhead is slightly unsettling. Finding a 16" in single phase will be a challenge. Grizzly ultimate 16s pop up from time to time, and I think the powermatic might have had the option of a 5-7.5hp single phase. I know i missed out on one months ago for $2500 in the midwest with a 7.5hp single phase baldor. A local shop friend has a DJ-42, that i played around with for awhile. I feel like the 12 to 16 isnt as extreme as the 8 to 12, but still theres a considerable jump up. Yes, it is 4" of capacity, but man, theres just a lot more machine there. listen to Dave and Darcy and the others, because they have been around dozens of different makes and models, but i dont know if you can buy a poorly made 16" machine despite who's name is on the tag. They almost all have 96"+ bed lengths, significantly better designed rack and pinion fences, huge cutterheads, and are probably all the machine you would ever need. I have boards that are 18-20, and a few that are 22-24". Despite what people say, boards over 8" do actually exist and they arent that rare. I was intensely looking for a 16" months ago. I can tell you they are probably going to run you $3,000 for a decent condition 15-25 year old euro make. Even then, most sellers want closer to $4. I ended up buying some generic italian 19.75" machine. I cant imagine needing or wanting more machine than this. At some point, you cant use a wider machine. I am physically incapable of handling a 8-10' long 8/4 board that is wider than 18-20". I can pick up a bigger board, but i cannot effectively run it over a machine by myself.

Hopefully those opinions are helpful. I make a lot of counters, bars, and table tops. I mill about 3,000ish bdft a year as a hobbyist. My needs might vary if i only made chairs or small boxes, and cut my parts out of boards ahead of time. I can tell you given the option of jointing and gluing four 6" wide boards or two 12" wide boards to make a panel what choice i would make. Processing and working with wide material is awesome.

[Bill Space]

How old are you? If you are young(er) and can afford it, buy the most capacity you can. That is if you figure you will use the tool for a long time. My purchases seem to be lifetime purchases. Everything comes in and nothing leaves for some reason.

We can not predict the future, but we can be sure it is possible to do less on a bigger machine, but certainly cannot do more on a smaller machine. Not easily anyway.

I would buy the 16" jointer over the 12" if I were in a similar position and planned for it to be my last jointer. I went from a 6" to an 8", and now lust for a 12". My guess is if you get the 12" you will later lust for the 16"

That's the way life works for me anyway...

[Jim Becker]

No question...if you have the space and the funds, the larger unit is going to give you the most options long-term. I wish for 16"/410mm from time to time as my J/P is "only" 13.68"/350mm...

[Don Jarvie]

Keep an eye on the auction sites. I picked up my 16 inch Jointer there. Unfortunately I’m going to sell it soon. It’s too big for my shop and I’m doing more turning than flat work now.

[Tim M Tuttle]

I was at the Grizzly store in Springfield the other day and came across their 16" jointer. We had a moment.

[Jeff Heath]

With jointers, bigger is always better, condition being the same. I have always restored my own machines, and jointers are one of the easiest machines to restore, but I still kick myself daily for selling my 24" jointer. I haven't been able to find another 24"er, or 30"er, in 4 years, that wasn't priced out of this world.

Get the 16"er. A friend of mine is selling a restored 16" Newman jointer right now, and for relatively cheap money. It's listed on the Facebook page for "Fans of OWWM", and is at a steal of a price for what the machine is. Newman machines are just about as good as it gets. You can PM me for contact info if you're not already a member of that group. I do not know where you are geographically located, as that will certainly play in to the equation.

Flattening wide boards is a nice time saver, and capacity is everything. You'll start finding larger, wider stock if you have the capacity to handle it. I own my own sawmill, and have a shed full of wide slabs that are too big for my 16" jointer.

[David Kumm]

Also, if you have space and are moving towards larger machines, three phase is the way to go. Either suck it up and buy a rotary converter or plan on a vfd for certain machines. A jointer is a good candidate for a VFD as is a dust collector, saw, and planer ( assuming the table doesn't run on a second motor ). Dave

[Mike Cutler]

If you have the space,and can swing the $$$$, 16", definitely.
You might not work much with stock 16" wide, but the ability to skew an 8" to 10" board across the cutter head can come in handy.

I've never seen a post where someone commented that they bought to big of a jointer, or planer.;)

[Darcy Warner]

Get a 30" except now I still lost after a 36"

[Jim Andrew]

I really wanted to buy a 16" jointer, but settled for a 12" G0609 with a Byrd cutter head. It is really a nice jointer, and instead of flat jointing the really wide boards I rip them down the center, joint flat, then plane, and finally glue them back together.

[Jeff Duncan]

I have a 16" b/c I didn't have the space for bigger when I bought it. I also buy all my stock rough and while it's not everyday I need more than 16", (well actually 410mm), it's not rare by any stretch either. So of course my advice is go as big as is practical for you.

good luck,
JeffD

[Patrick Kane]

I’m also voting to go for 16”, because you will rarely rarely need more, but generally, 8s are double the price of 6s, and 12s are double the price of 12s, and 16s are quite a bit more than 12s. So while we can all say to get 16”—except Darcy with 36”—it is usually going to cost you another $2000ish. For the life of me I could not find a 16” SCMI for under $3800 across the country. You should be able to nab a good 12” used for under $2000. Depending how risk averse you are, I would give a hard look towards some of the ‘off brand’ machines. I feel like people don’t value the Eastern Europe makes, Griggio, Paolini, Casolini, etc at the same level as SCMI. At that size, I’d buy on condition, price, and cutterhead over age or make.

[Warren Lake]

you said how often do you need it? what kind of work do you do? Like all of these posts you need what you need to do the work you do. I could have never made a living with a six inch jointer, the 8 worked for a while till a repeat job where I needed 9" material. I did it on the 8 till the wife of one the old guys i knew asked me to buy his SCM.

[Nick Lazz]

If space is an issue, have you considered a combo machine? Not sure what you have for a planer but the combo machine would obviously negate the need for that and potentially open up more room for you.
I have the Hammer A3-31 (12” J/P) I have definitely needed more capacity at times and will likely upgrade once more to the bigger machine. 90% of the time the 12” is plenty...but would love the 16”.
I’m taking delivery of a Festool Domino df700 XL....so I’ll probably wait a little while before I make any more big tool purchases. ;)

[Bill Dufour]

If your planer is not at least 16" I am not seeing much advantage here. Depends on where you live and how often do you see boards more then 12" wide for sale. I suppose it also depends on how strong you are. Can you really lift and safely control a ten foot long board that is only 12" wide. Even in California old growth redwood is too expensive for most projects.

[Darcy Warner]

If your planer is not at least 16" I am not seeing much advantage here. Depends on where you live and how often do you see boards more then 12" wide for sale. I suppose it also depends on how strong you are. Can you really lift and safely control a ten foot long board that is only 12" wide. Even in California old growth redwood is too expensive for most projects.

I just got a batch of hard maple in that were 14 and 16 wide. I use a large jointer for flattening wide glue ups more than just facing wide stock.

[Ben Zara]

12 is nice but if you can afford a 16 then why not? I use a hammer 41A and for the money it is a nice 16 inch jointer.

[Bill Dufour]

I just got a batch of hard maple in that were 14 and 16 wide. I use a large jointer for flattening wide glue ups more than just facing wide stock.

But we do not even known what continent the Op lives on. He may live where trees never get over 6" diameter, like northern Scandinavia or the Baltic countries. There is a reason Baltic birch is plywood and seldom stick lumber. When I hear Baltic Birch I always think plywood, never lumber.
Bill D

[Bill Orbine]

Get the 16 inch. You're thinking about it....so might as well.

[Jim Becker]

If your planer is not at least 16" I am not seeing much advantage here. Depends on where you live and how often do you see boards more then 12" wide for sale. I suppose it also depends on how strong you are. Can you really lift and safely control a ten foot long board that is only 12" wide. Even in California old growth redwood is too expensive for most projects.
A wide jointer isn't just for wide boards. There are many other operations where one might benefit from the more generous machine, including finessing highly figured material through to minimize tear-out, working with a wider glued up construction and cleaning the edges of an odd shaped construction. Most folks also do not try and flatten/straighten really long boards, either, because of the material handling you mention, regardless of the width of the machine. Best practice is always to work with the shortest pieces for a particular purpose, outside of "skimming" material to "see what you got". It's rare that a component needs to be uber-long...even 6-8' isn't necessary for the majority of projects so breaking down lumber first after skimming takes care of the material handling thing.

[peter gagliardi]

You have the space.
So, you will always be able to use the 12” jointer that is built into the 16” machine.

Not so, the other way around........

[Randy Heinemann]

Didn't read the rest of the posts so sorry if this duplicates them. I have an 8" jointer and have found that, only once in the 6 years I've owned it, I could have used one a little wider and then only about 9". Generally I don't have access to hardwood boards that are wider than 8". Most are around 6" - 7 1/2" (or less than that). The move to an 8" jointer, though, was a game changer for me. I now can flatten all but a rare board on the jointer before thicknessing and that was not possible very often with a 6" jointer. So, if you feel you need a 16", go for it. It would be a great tool. I just find I don't need anything more than 8" (which I'm sure costs a bit less than even a 12").

[J.R. Rutter]

A wide jointer isn't just for wide boards. There are many other operations where one might benefit from the more generous machine, including finessing highly figured material through to minimize tear-out, working with a wider glued up construction and cleaning the edges of an odd shaped construction. Most folks also do not try and flatten/straighten really long boards, either, because of the material handling you mention, regardless of the width of the machine. Best practice is always to work with the shortest pieces for a particular purpose, outside of "skimming" material to "see what you got". It's rare that a component needs to be uber-long...even 6-8' isn't necessary for the majority of projects so breaking down lumber first after skimming takes care of the material handling thing.

Exactly. The first time you have some panels that went wonky after glue-up, you will be happy for the extra width. Honestly, my 410mm jointer sits gathering dust most of the time, because I do not generally get rough stock and typically shove everything through the moulder to S4S. But being able to skew a tricky piece across, or tune up a long and heavy timber once in a while makes it worth having in the tool quiver.

[Darcy Warner]

I must be in the minority, I will SLR skip planed material, glue up the panel, flatten one side then plane to thickness.

Way less time involved in that, plus I can be pretty lazy worrying about how flat I can keep the glue up.

[Jim Becker]

I must be in the minority, I will SLR skip planed material, glue up the panel, flatten one side then plane to thickness.

Way less time involved in that, plus I can be pretty lazy worrying about how flat I can keep the glue up.
Yea, but you have a bunch of "giant tools" available. :) :D

[Mike Kees]

Has anyone else noticed we lost the O.P. again...:)

[Mike Weaver]

Yea, but you have a bunch of "giant tools" available. :) :D

..that I wouldn't mind having either Jim! ;-)
.

[Jeff Bartley]

Hopefully he'll come back, I sent him a PM with an offer for a 16" jointer! Craig: if you see this check your messages.

[Craig Day]

I’m in the Seattle area. I’m not too far from an amazing exotic hardwood dealer (Edensaw Woods)... so I have no problem getting very wide boards.

[Ken Grant]

I must be in the minority, I will SLR skip planed material, glue up the panel, flatten one side then plane to thickness.

Way less time involved in that, plus I can be pretty lazy worrying about how flat I can keep the glue up.

This is what I do for panels also, except I have to edge joint as I do not have a SLR yet. I have a 16 inch Porter 300 and wish it was wider.

[Craig Day]

I buckled and bought a Grizzly G0609X. I couldn’t resist after they miraculously came back in stock in Washington. I’ll keep my eye out for a reasonably priced 16” and jump on it when I get the chance.

I must say this machine is quite nice. Very little adjustments and I’m getting dead flat boards. Far quieter than my PM 54A.

I appreciate all of the excellent feedback in this thread!

[Patrick Kane]

Before the tariffs, that machine was an absolute steal. I remember it being around $2300-2400, and that always amazed me for a 12" jointer with spiral head. However, i was always under the impression the price was too good to be true. I think Darrell Peart would like to dump his in a deep body o water. Sounds like it is working for you, which is all that matters.

[Jim Andrew]

My G0609 works perfectly, can't imagine using it for a boat anchor. Only trouble I have had is a set screw came loose on the motor pulley, and it has gotten slightly out of adjustment once, and I have had mine for several years, and ran miles of wood over it.