Drilling 1/4" hole, 4" deep, into end grain of 3/4" hardwood

[BrianD King]

Hello,

I have a project coming up for 250 cheese boards. To install the integrated wire slicer/handle, I have to drill 1/4" holes, 4" deep, right smack into the center of the end grain in a specific location. 250 times on 250 different boards! Board dimensions are approx 5.75" w X 12" long X 3/4" thick. Obviously a relatively high degree of precision matters.

And I don't have a drill press! (A 4'x8' CNC is the foundation of my shop, so I've been able to get away without having a drill press. I considered some sort of jig that would allow me to drill into end grain on the CNC, but the 4" depth is a problem....)

Before I plunk down the significant $ for a drill press with more than 4" of spindle travel, I am wondering if there's any other clever way to do this reliably and repeatably?? I don't trust myself to drill straight for 4" without some serious guide/jig.

Thanks!
Brian

[jack forsberg]

Why not just cut a slot In the bottom of your board 4 inches long and then cover with the slot wider to encapsulate a 1/4 “ hole 4 inches long with the Percision of your CNC . Nosing bit would be ideal

[Kevin Jenness]

You can get drill bushings (and aircraft drill bits) from McMaster Carr to make a simple jig for a hand-held drill.

[Art Moore]

Ah, cheese boards. I have (2) sets of 6-inch brad point bits that I found at a tool outlet store years ago. First I put a drill stop at the 4 inch mark, chuck it up in my cordless drill, then use it with a self-centering dowel jig. When it bottoms out on the dowel jig I remove the jig, clamp the board vertical in a cabinet maker's front vise, and finish drilling to the proper depth. The hole is deep enough after removing the jig to keep the bit aligned as you finish it. Go slow, and clean out the chips every 3/4 inch or so.

Hope this helps.

[John K Jordan]

Depends on how precise you need them.

Woodturners drill fairly deep holes in end grain all the time. If not careful, it is easy for the bit to follow the grain and go off at an angle. It's easy to see this on the lathe but harder when the work is stationary. (For woodturning the bit is usually still and advanced into the rotating wood.)

A couple of things I find work best.

Always start the hole with a spotting bit or a center drill (made for metalworking). These are both short and stout and immediately get off. If the work will allow, I use one a little larger than the intended hole (easy with woodturning since the end can usually be trimmed away afterwards).

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Second, I drill the first part of the hole with a screw machine bit, for example https://www.amazon.com/Cleveland-C70368-Heavy-Duty-Machine-Uncoated/dp/B0026GM3CY. These are much shorter and therefor less flexible than the standard "jobbers" length drill bits. I generally use a higher speed until the hole is deep enough that the chips need clearing. Once a precise hole is started a couple of inches the longer bit will be unlikely to follow the grain. I've drilled 3/8" holes about 8" deep this way.

Sharp sharp sharp helps a lot. You might also experiment with brad point vs other types of bit grinds. I usually use standard grinds but some have reported better success with others. Note that some cheap bits are not even ground with the points in exactly centered! A good drill press would help a lot. Christmas is getting close... I have also used my (manual) milling machine to drill.

All this sounds like a lot of work for 200 pieces. Maybe you don't need the type of precision this can give you.

JKJ

[Zachary Hoyt]

For affordable precision on a job like this a Shopsmith is great. I use mine for horizontal drilling all the time when making banjos. You could easily clamp two boards to the table to make an L shaped fence and the table can be adjusted up and down and for tilt. I am not sure if the older 10ER shopsmiths will drill that deep, but I am quite confident that the Mark V on up will do it. On Craigslist the 10ER can often be had around here in the $100-200 range and the Mark V in the $300-500 range depending what accessories you want. I paid $400 for mine with a lot of attachments and sold off the ones I didn't need for $450 or so on eBay over a month or so, but I was watching for a good deal for several months.
Zach

[john bateman]

Is there some reason a doweling jig won't work?

[BrianD King]

Appreciate the ideas in this thread. I am hoping to make this process as quick and repeatable as possible. My hesitation with a doweling jig is that I have to attach, detach, and reattach the jig every time. I guess I could build a jig around the dowel jig to automatically align the jig to my piece so I am not fiddling with lining up the bushing every time, but I'd much rather move the workpiece in and out of a jig than have to move the jig. By contrast, using a large floor standing drill press with a vice/jig all set up just once, I could simply insert the piece, drill, remove, etc. with no fiddling....But that's a large, expensive machine that I am trying to avoid.

I guess I could get a less expensive and smaller benchtop drill press with enough clearance to drill into the end grain of my cheeseboards, and then I'd at least have quick 3"ish holes that I could finish off by hand with a drill stop. With 3" of guide hole depth, I probably can't screw up a 4" hole too much :)

Now the Shopsmith...that's interesting and tempting. I rarely use my Sawstop cabinet saw. I could sell it and replace it with a Shopsmith! Seems like mixed reviews though...

[Lee Schierer]

I guess I could get a less expensive and smaller benchtop drill press with enough clearance to drill into the end grain of my cheeseboards, and then I'd at least have quick 3"ish holes that I could finish off by hand with a drill stop. With 3" of guide hole depth, I probably can't screw up a 4" hole too much :)

I was just going to ask how deep of a hole you could precisely drill with your CNC and suggest that you drill a starter hole and then finish it by hand while the CNC drills the next hole. 3" should be more than enough for you to hand drill the remaining inch of hole without wandering off center. I would use a brad point bit.

[lowell holmes]

Never ever let the opportunity to tell SWMBO, honey I need this in order to make this for you.:rolleyes:

[Zachary Hoyt]

My Shopsmith makes a good horizontal drill and disk sander and an okay lathe, but it would be a dreadful table saw. Any cheap worksite saw would be better, in my opinion. I sold my table saw accessories without ever using them. I have a Delta contractor saw that I use, after burning out 3 old Craftsman direct drive table saws in about as many years.
Zach

[BrianD King]

I was just going to ask how deep of a hole you could precisely drill with your CNC and suggest that you drill a starter hole and then finish it by hand while the CNC drills the next hole. 3" should be more than enough for you to hand drill the remaining inch of hole without wandering off center. I would use a brad point bit.

I doubt I could get more than 1.25" of depth with a carbide router bit, and the spindle spins too fast for a regular drill bit.

[William A Johnston]

Just finishing up 15 cheese slicer boards for Christmas presents. I used a Jessem doweling jig. Worked great but if I had 250 to do I'd definitely get a drill press. Just put my first coat of mineral oil on this morning.

[BrianD King]

Just finishing up 15 cheese slicer boards for Christmas presents. I used a Jessem doweling jig. Worked great but if I had 250 to do I'd definitely get a drill press. Just put my first coat of mineral oil on this morning.

Those look great! Where did you get the wire cutters? I found cheeseslicing.com as a source.

Yeah, 250 of them will try my patience. Fortunately I can spread out production over 5 months. Otherwise I would lose my mind as a one man shop!

[William A Johnston]

I also got them at cheese slicer.com. I do boards as a hobby. I don't have a drill press. Looks like another tool.

[Randy Viellenave]

I made something like this for poking holes in cribbage boards, should work for a cheese slicer too. The nice thing is you can get it aligned perfectly, then put stops and a clamp on it to make sure it doesn't move around.

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[William A Johnston]

That's a cool jig. Thinking outside the box

[Bruce Page]

I wish you luck. I never had any success drilling that deep into end grain without the drill wandering significantly off center. You might get there by drilling from both ends but I still think it will be hit or miss depending on the grain. JMHO

[Edwin Santos]

Lee Valley sells some excellent drilling bushings that screw into a serrated sleeve that you tap into a pre drilled hole.
I can envision a jig where you have one or two of these drill bushings installed in a fence on one side of a base where you lay down each board, held down with one or two toggle clamps, and then drill away with a hand held drill and an aircraft bit through the guide bushings.
Flip open the toggle clamps, replace the workpiece with the next one, and do it. again.
The reason for two bushings is to keep your bit straight despite the long hole depth.
The jig might take $20 in parts plus the bushings and drill bit. The bit will get dull, so may you need a second one on hand. Do you have a method of sharpening a drill bit?
Anyway I think it can be done. I wish I had the skills in Sketchup to draw what I am trying to describe here. Hope it helps.
Edwin

[Bill Dufour]

I saw a horizontal dowelling machine for under $100. Since biscuits came out their price has nosedived. this had pneumatic clamping and travel. You could get a custom? bit made in 1/4" diameter. You might consider using a gun drill with air blast to complete the depth after drilling 3" with cnc. Drilling a deep hole straight is what gun drills are made for.
Bil lD.

[BrianD King]

I wish you luck. I never had any success drilling that deep into end grain without the drill wandering significantly off center. You might get there by drilling from both ends but I still think it will be hit or miss depending on the grain. JMHO

Even if you peck drill taking, say, 1/2" depth bites at a time?

[John K Jordan]

Even if you peck drill taking, say, 1/2" depth bites at a time?

Yes, still a problem if the bit is relatively long and a little flexible and the wood type and grain are working against you and the hole gets started badly. The bit can get deflected a tiny bit at the end grain surface, the reason for starting with a center drill. Once the bit starts deflecting it will continue and probably get worse as it gets deeper. On the lathe you can immediately tell if the drill is deflecting - since the bit is still and the work rotating, a deflecting bit (and often the rotating piece) will start visibly vibrating. When the bit rotates and the work is still the bit just bends as it drills and I usually can't tell until after the hole is drilled.

When the bit is deflected as the hole is started I can sometimes get a straight hole if I increase the speed and stop the bit advancement for a little while. This lets the spring of the bit push it towards true center and the sharp edges of the flute will cut into the opposite side of the hole until the bit is centered. When centered again then I continue, taking tiny bites, say about a bit diameter's depth at a time (baby it!) and stop each time to let the bit recenter. What a pain.

If after starting with a center drill, you use a stiff screw machine bit to drill a straight hole for the first inch or so, the chances of a straight hole for the rest of the depth are much better since that first straight section acts like a guide. Still have to drill slowly.

A rigid metal bit guide would probably solve the whole problem but I've never had one.

JKJ

[Keith Westfall]

Do you have a lathe? If so, I would make a jig that would set on the 'ways' which would put the board right at the right level. Then with a couple of alignment strips of wood to keep it straight. Then just lay the board on it an push it into the drill bit in the chuck.

Note: Not that I have tried this, but with your job at hand, I probably would!

[Bruce Page]

Brian, can you post a picture/sketch of what you're wanting to do? There might be better options.

[Frederick Skelly]

Do you have a lathe? If so, I would make a jig that would set on the 'ways' which would put the board right at the right level. Then with a couple of alignment strips of wood to keep it straight. Then just lay the board on it an push it into the drill bit in the chuck.

Note: Not that I have tried this, but with your job at hand, I probably would!

I was sitting here thinking "Gee, I wonder if I should look for a horizontal drilling machine?" And then, your clever idea reminded me that I already own one. Thank you Keith!

[John K Jordan]

Do you have a lathe? If so, I would make a jig that would set on the 'ways' which would put the board right at the right level. Then with a couple of alignment strips of wood to keep it straight. Then just lay the board on it an push it into the drill bit in the chuck.
Note: Not that I have tried this, but with your job at hand, I probably would!

That could save buying a drill press and make it easy to keep the part aligned. But keep in mind if drilling into end grain this method has the same potential problems with getting precisely straight holes.

[Jerome Stanek]

I would make a jig at the end of my cnc and peck drill them

[BrianD King]

I would make a jig at the end of my cnc and peck drill them

With what bit? My spindle's slowest speed is 9000 rpm, which is too fast for a drill bit. And I've never seen a 1/4" bit with more than 1.25" depth of cut.


Brian, can you post a picture/sketch of what you're wanting to do? There might be better options.

Here's the rough instruction image from the company that sells the wire cheese slicers. It's a basic 1/4" wide, 4" deep hole into the edge grain near the corner. People buy gazillions of these hardware pieces from this company, so it must work...

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Do you have a lathe? If so, I would make a jig that would set on the 'ways' which would put the board right at the right level. Then with a couple of alignment strips of wood to keep it straight. Then just lay the board on it an push it into the drill bit in the chuck.

Note: Not that I have tried this, but with your job at hand, I probably would!

I don't have a lathe :confused:

[ChrisA Edwards]

Maybe a dowel jig that clamps and allows any centering or offset adjustment, might have to clamp piece of scrap on one side if you don't want the hole centered. A Dowel jig will get you 2" into the wood accurately, and that should be enough shoulder support between the dowel jig and the wood to allow the drill not to deviate as you go deeper.

As regards the drill bit, I'd start with a Brad bit, but if you can't find one long enough to complete the full depth, I'd switch to a Jobber bit ( I think this is what they are called) for metal and wood. You can get these in common diameters about a foot long at the big box stores.

This is the Milescraft JointPro Dowel Jig, about $60 online. All you would do for you project is to rotate the board 90 degrees so you are drilling into the end. And if you look at the guide block, there are two sets, used for when drilling two pieces that will mate accordingly. I'd get longer screws for the guide block and double up the top and bottom guide blocks to give yourself a longer guide surface.



https://www.milescraft.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/1311_A1-webo.jpg

[Bruce Page]

Here's the rough instruction image from the company that sells the wire cheese slicers. It's a basic 1/4" wide, 4" deep hole into the edge grain near the corner. People buy gazillions of these hardware pieces from this company, so it must work...

Brian, I was envisioning something different, I don’t think dead nuts accuracy is required in this case. As a one time machinist my brain sometimes goes to the extreme when someone says “relatively high degree of precision matters” I would run a few test pieces using a brad point drill and see how perpendicular they come out. If necessary, you may be able to tweak the ¼” rod to line up the wire with the slot.

[Jerome Stanek]

With what bit? My spindle's slowest speed is 9000 rpm, which is too fast for a drill bit. And I've never seen a 1/4" bit with more than 1.25" depth of cut.



Here's the rough instruction image from the company that sells the wire cheese slicers. It's a basic 1/4" wide, 4" deep hole into the edge grain near the corner. People buy gazillions of these hardware pieces from this company, so it must work...

398914



I don't have a lathe :confused:


If you peck drill you can go deeper the chips will come out when your bit retracts.

[lowell holmes]

There are several at this site.

https://www.google.com/search?q=dowelling+jig&rlz=1C1UCRO_enUS813US813&oq=dowelling+&aqs=chrome.0.0j69i57j0l4.10943j1j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8