Abranet abrasive discs

[Rick Potter]

I have been using Mirka Abranet discs on my 5" orbital sander lately. I am very pleased with the way they work, but it seems to me the labeling on the discs is slightly different than normal sandpaper.

For example, I find that the net discs marked 80 grit seem to work like a normal 100 grit disc, and 120 grit is more like a a 150/180 grit paper. I find that 120 grit discs will finish sand red oak very nicely, and am not going any finer on my kitchen cabs. I pre sand to the same thickness with my drum sander before assembling, then RO sand with 80 and 120 mesh, and that seems just fine on my red oak.

Even though the net discs sand smoother, they also seem to sand pretty quickly compared to paper. Of course, I may just keep the paper on the sander too long.

Anyone else notice this, or am I just imagining it?


PS: Just got some 80 grit Diablo abrasive net discs from HD today. They include an intermediate pad in each box. Got a box of ten with the pad, and an extra ten for $15. It was the last box they had with the free extras.

[Wojciech Tryc]

I have been using Mirka Abranet discs on my 5" orbital sander lately. I am very pleased with the way they work, but it seems to me the labeling on the discs is slightly different than normal sandpaper.

For example, I find that the net discs marked 80 grit seem to work like a normal 100 grit disc, and 120 grit is more like a a 150/180 grit paper. I find that 120 grit discs will finish sand red oak very nicely, and am not going any finer on my kitchen cabs. I pre sand to the same thickness with my drum sander before assembling, then RO sand with 80 and 120 mesh, and that seems just fine on my red oak.

Even though the net discs sand smoother, they also seem to sand pretty quickly compared to paper. Of course, I may just keep the paper on the sander too long.

Anyone else notice this, or am I just imagining it?


PS: Just got some 80 grit Diablo abrasive net discs from HD today. They include an intermediate pad in each box. Got a box of ten with the pad, and an extra ten for $15. It was the last box they had with the free extras.
I would be interested in seeing a comparison of Diablo to Abranet.

[Paul F Franklin]

The abranet disks follow the FEPA standard (P60, P100, etc), while you may be used to the US CAMI standards (no letter P in front of grit).
The FEPA grits are a little coarser than corresponding number in the CAMI standard. For example, a P100 disk would fall in between the US CAMI 80 and 100. Going by that, a FEPA disk should seem *coarser* than a CAMI disk.

Now that is opposite of what you are observing, so the different systems don't explain what you are seeing. I recently switched to using the abranet disks myself, but I haven't used them enough to get a sense of how they compare to my non-abranet disks. It will be interesting to see what other folks have observed.

[Jim Tobias]

Rick,
I switched to the Mirka Abranet discs awhile back. I can't really tell a difference in grit, but they do seem to sand quicker(get a smooth finish) to me. It may just be me because I really think the dust collection is superior to normal sandpaper. No clogging either. If you ever need a super smooth finish or need to buff out a finish, the Mirka Abralon pads(sponge like pads) are great. I use them to sand up to 1000 grit before using Tried and True Varnish Oil and Beeswax finish and it works great for me. Takes less coats and dries faster.

Jim

[Nick Decker]

I don't recall noticing a difference in grits, but it's been so long since I used "regular" sandpaper I might have forgotten.

Jim T., I wasn't aware of the Abralon pads you mentioned, will have to take a look. Thanks.

[Martin Wasner]

Anyone else notice this, or am I just imagining it?



Every manufacturer and spec within that will sand differently than another. We use abranet on the benches with a vacuum. It's expensive, does a good job, and tears way too easily, lifespan is okay.

Our normal abrasive is a 3M cloth backed that's about 60% of the cost. It's durable, lasts a long time, leaves a good scratch. But, there's no holes for collection so it's limited to the downdraft table and a few things on the benches where a pneumatic sander is used.

I really like the abranet belts for a handheld belt sander. Except when there's glue involved. It passed through and builds up on the idler and drive wheel. That's no bueno.

[Rick Potter]

Paul, interesting about the two standards. I looked, and the Mirka disc says P120 on the back, while the Diablo says Grit-120. Made in Switzerland. The Diablo's feel a little more coarse.

For me what I like best is the more uniform abrasive size on each disc, where normal pads seem to have less uniformity, which gives scratches. Cheap normal sanding discs are not in the same league with name brands.

I use the net discs with intermediate pads, on my $99 Festool sander, as well as a Milwaukee and a PC. All of them have really great dust pickup. I have a simple small shop vac with a bag for dust collection and it works great. I agree with all who have mentioned that the dust pickup is much better with the net discs.

Woj., Sorry, I finished the sanding for these doors, and am staining now. It will probably be a while before I do much sanding again. I will try to quickie test the two brands a bit, but perhaps someone else could be in a position to do a real test.

[Van Huskey]

Rick, could it be the more uniform grit is producing a more uniform scratch which in turn leads you to believe it is working like a finer grit?

I have been using Abranet for years so I may have forgotten but I don't remember ever thinking there was any significant difference as I started and finished at the same grits as usual.

[Dave Cav]

I've never used the Abranet stuff; usually I use Mikra discs on my Dynabrades. I saw some of the Diablo discs at HD the other day and got a pack of 80 grit, but haven't used them yet. Looking forward to how they work on my next project.

[Rick Potter]

Van, yes, that is a better way of saying what I was trying to say. No expert, but it seems the better uniformity of the abrasive is not scratching as much, therefore I only used two finish grits, and stopped at 120 because it is very smooth at that point.

Remember, it has all been previously sanded to 150 grit, several passes, with the drum sander before assembly. It's midnight, and I just ran out to check that 150 was correct. It is. Interesting that the 120 abrasive discs sand much smoother than the drums 150. I pulled out an extra sanded stile that I had left over, and compared the drums 150 to the disc's 120. The disc's 120 is noticeably smoother, and I only spent a couple minutes on each sanding of a cab door.

Again, I am using red oak, so it does not need to be finished as smooth as maple because of the more open grain. In the past with sandpaper discs I would have to go at least one step further...at least 180 on Oak, maybe 220.

Tomorrow I stain, and really find out how it looks.

[Rick Potter]

Well the stain has dried two days now, and I am very happy with the way they turned out. I could only find a couple little pigtails, and this is on the backside, where I was not as careful as the front, which gets done tomorrow.

Wednesday and thursday are supposed to be 78 and 80. That will be the days I spray the finish. Only problem is getting set up to spray 18 doors at once. Takes a lot of sawhorsies, and room where trees won't shed on them.

[Tim Bueler]

2 saw horses and one extension ladder laid flat between them will hold a lot of smaller doors.

[Jim Becker]

I'm finding the idea of the Abranet/mesh abrasives to be very interesting. For those who have been using them regularly, how is their life-span compared to more "conventional" abrasives. (I use Festool sanders for reference)

[Van Huskey]

I'm finding the idea of the Abranet/mesh abrasives to be very interesting. For those who have been using them regularly, how is their life-span compared to more "conventional" abrasives. (I use Festool sanders for reference)

IME they last longer than Festool or Klingspor abrasive discs but it is certainly not multiple times but enough t make them more cost effective. Festool makes Granat net now but I have yet to use it, I have a sample pack but haven't had occasion to try it out yet. They are very similarly priced at least at retail but the Mirka stuff can be found at a discount.

[Nick Decker]

Same here. They last longer than Granat, but not forever.

Martin W. (I think) posted that they tear too easily, though I've never had that happen.

Dust collection is excellent. I never see dust at all, except when I pull an old disc off, I sometimes see a tiny "puff" of dust that gets caught in the hook/loop.

[Prashun Patel]

They def. last longer. I haven't noticed a difference in the quality of the finish - only the durability.

One caveat: they transmit more heat to the backing pad of the ROS, so invest in Abranet interface pads.

[Van Huskey]

Martin W. (I think) posted that they tear too easily, though I've never had that happen.

Keep in mind Martin has a commercial cabinet shop and is likely more brutal on discs.

As Prashun brought up you need to use an interface pad or you will ruin the hooks on the backer very quickly. The good thing is since Festool now has net abrasives you can get the perfectly matching pad from them, the Mirka version does not align with all the holes on the newest iteration of the Festool hole arrangement.

[Nick Decker]

Thanks for the tip on the Festool pads, Van. Just ordered a couple.

I've been using one of the Mirka pads. Yes, the holes don't line up perfectly, but close enough. I also cut a hole out to line up with the center hole, which I've heard is where most of the suck happens.

(And yes, I'm aware of Martin's commercial brutality. :))

[Paul F Franklin]

I've only been using them for maybe 6 months. I find the abrasive does seem to last longer than conventional disks. I do like the better dust collection. I haven't had any trouble with the disk tearing in the middle, but it does seem easy to tear them at the edges when sanding other than flat surfaces. For example, I was sanding some window casing, and you know how it's not unusual for there to be little splinters or roughness along the sharp edges from the molding process. The mesh on the edge of the sanding disk would catch on the rough areas and tear fairly easily. I started using conventional 120 grit for the first pass, and then switch to the abranet for the higher grits. That solved the tearing problem.

[Peter Rawlings]

Mirka makes more than one mesh disc abrasive. My distributor sells me Mirka Autonet. Evidently targeted at autobody industry, I'm told abrasive is the same, not sure about net itself. Supposedly less $$. They seem really tough and I was surprised to read about tearing. I don't think I've had one tear. It's a little hard to tell when they're worn when compared to stearated paper, but even if I use more of them the dust collection is so superior I'd pay more for that quality alone. I have boxes of Mirka paper discs I look for ways to use up...hand sanding etc. I finish up with 150 most of the time on bare wood. 240 is as high as I go unless sanding finish.

[Martin Wasner]

I'm finding the idea of the Abranet/mesh abrasives to be very interesting. For those who have been using them regularly, how is their life-span compared to more "conventional" abrasives. (I use Festool sanders for reference)

Longer than paper. Shorter than cloth backed

[Martin Wasner]

They tear for me when you're sanding face frames, and you're coming into another section of the frame. If you don't have the pressure just right, it snags and tears. With an adhesive backed abrasive, you kinda roll the edge up a bit to avoid that. Abranet, that isn't happening.

[Peter Rawlings]

They tear for me when you're sanding face frames, and you're coming into another section of the frame. If you don't have the pressure just right, it snags and tears. With an adhesive backed abrasive, you kinda roll the edge up a bit to avoid that. Abranet, that isn't happening.

I know exactly what you're talking about. I've crinkled up discs sanding frames, but not torn. I wonder if the net is different for Autonet? Balance of sanders on things like face frames, especially narrow stiles and rails, has been my biggest hurdle moving into dust collection on sanders. Collection hose is a PIA to deal with, but I wouldn't go back.

[Prashun Patel]

I would estimate that my 100 and 150 grits last about 3x normal sandpaper I've used in the past, but only twice as long as the Indasa Rhynogrips I normally buy. I don't buy much Abranet because the economics are better with the Rhynogrip stuff. I keep waiting for the price to go up because it's so durable and the grit appears to last well.

[Jim Tobias]

I use the Abranet on Festool sanders with adapter pads. No real issues with tearing unless you butt up against a sharp edge. It does seem to last longer, but as others have said, the improved dust collection is a major factor in and of itself.
Also, Festool and now Klingspor are making a "net" sandpaper...….there is a reason these established companies are following suit. Satisfied customers, repeat sales and $'s.

Jim

[Rick Potter]

Well, I finished up the staining, and sprayed those kitchen cabinet doors today. I have to say they came out pretty darn good. I am very impressed with the Mirka net discs. As I mentioned, they are red oak finished with a 120 Mirka, using my $99 Festool sander. You would need a finer grit for maple or cherry, but 120 worked great on the oak.

Haven't tried the new Diablo net discs yet. I will try to compare them with the Mirka after Christmas. Busy, busy.

[Van Huskey]

Well, I finished up the staining, and sprayed those kitchen cabinet doors today. I have to say they came out pretty darn good. I am very impressed with the Mirka net discs. As I mentioned, they are red oak finished with a 120 Mirka, using my $99 Festool sander. You would need a finer grit for maple or cherry, but 120 worked great on the oak.

Haven't tried the new Diablo net discs yet. I will try to compare them with the Mirka after Christmas. Busy, busy.

The Diablo discs are less expensive than the Klingspor, Festool or Mirka net abrasives, I wonder where they are made and if the backer pad has Festool holee, if it has a bunch of holes to make them truly universal the backer pad makes the packs quite inexpensive. They seem to only make the 5".

[Greg Parrish]

I’ll let you know later this morning. Just got my festool sander and have a bunch of the mesh diablo on hand. Hang tight.

[Greg Parrish]

Not a match but mesh should work with festool pads. The diablo holes appear to be a smaller diameter pattern.

399268

399269

399270

399271

[Nick Decker]

Greg, it'll help if you cut out a hole in the center of the Diablo pad, to match the center hole on the sander.

[Greg Parrish]

Greg, it'll help if you cut out a hole in the center of the Diablo pad, to match the center hole on the sander.

Nick, the outer ring of holes doesn’t match up so no point. Notice how close the festool holes are to the edge versus the pad. The festool hole diameter is nearly an inch larger.

[Leo Graywacz]

I find the opposite. When I use the 150s it seems like it's a 120. I use the Abranet when I am sanding finishes. The dust pickup with the Ceros is fantastic.

[Nick Decker]

Nick, the outer ring of holes doesn’t match up so no point. Notice how close the festool holes are to the edge versus the pad. The festool hole diameter is nearly an inch larger.

I haven't used the Diablo mesh, but I see what you're saying about the outer holes. With the pad for the Mirka Abranet, the outer holes don't line up perfectly, but you can get partial coverage.

Either way, suction also comes through that larger center hole, which is why I cut a hole there. Better to have some suck as opposed to none at all, no?

Like I said, I ordered a couple of the new Festool pads that Van mentioned. They should give me full suction on whatever mesh is used.

[Jim Becker]

Greg, it'll help if you cut out a hole in the center of the Diablo pad, to match the center hole on the sander.

I agree 100%...it's part of the 'secret sauce' for sander dust extraction in the Festool system. Not having that center hole will seriously degrade extraction performance which in turn will not keep the abrasive as clean.

[Greg Parrish]

Yep, I’ll order a couple of pads too so I can use the mesh I already have. :)



I haven't used the Diablo mesh, but I see what you're saying about the outer holes. With the pad for the Mirka Abranet, the outer holes don't line up perfectly, but you can get partial coverage.

Either way, suction also comes through that larger center hole, which is why I cut a hole there. Better to have some suck as opposed to none at all, no?

Like I said, I ordered a couple of the new Festool pads that Van mentioned. They should give me full suction on whatever mesh is used.

[Nick Decker]

My Festool pads just arrived this morning, quicker than I expected. Everything lines up perfectly, of course. Unleash the holes!

[Nick Decker]

Hadn't thought of that, Jim, but it makes sense. Thanks.

(Also hadn't thought to use a drill to jack up my car. Was that the right link? :))

[Tom Bender]

What I really like about Abranet is the lack of holes. The holes are a nuisance when sanding shapes as opposed to flat surfaces. And they last longer. But it's the lack of holes that puts them on the top of my list.