Moisture meter - what do you use?

[Tim Einwalter]

Shopping for a moisture meter so I can monitor some wood that I had milled. Looking on Amazon there are a lot of people liking the cheapo Chinese moisture meters. Generally I try to shy away from the cheap tools, but it has me wondering if I really need an expensive meter? What are you guys using?

[Doug Hepler]

Timber check moisture meter link (http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.aspx?p=32548&cat=1,43513,45788). Not fancy but a good solid instrument.

Doug

[J.R. Rutter]

Wagner - it is an older model, but the speed and ease of use makes it simple to spot check incoming lumber.

[Lee Schierer]

I have an older Mini Ligno by Lignomat. It has worked well for many years.

[Jim Andrew]

The cheaper meters are less accurate than more expensive. Think the wood doctor said you need to spend about 300$ if you really want accuracy. Personally I have a mini ligno I purchased on sale from Grizzly.

[Dean Arthur]

I initially bought that $20 General pin type meter on Amazon and I can't understand how it has such good reviews. The pins are incredibly fragile and there seems to be no place to get replacements. It's faulty by design. I did a lot of research afterwards and ended up buying a Lignomat Scanner SD which works wonderfully. The worst you can say is the plastic case feels a bit light but I've used it all over the place since and no issues. American made as well.-- NORMAL --

[William Hodge]

I bought an Extec moisture meter. It couldn't tell the difference between dry wood that had been in the rack in the heated shop for years, and soaking wet wood thrown out in the demolition pile a yearearlier.

The Lignomat moisture meter, for about $110., has been great. I check wood all the time with it. To keep standard conditions, I make sure that the wood is up to shop temperature. By the way, the wood in the rack measured 9%, and the wood in the demolition pile was 22%. As a side benefit, I can check the moisture content of my firewood.

https://www.amazon.com/Lignomat-Moisture-Meter-Mini-Ligno-D/dp/B000VIMGJE/ref=lp_16426581_1_4/130-3233526-9148600?s=power-hand-tools&ie=UTF8&qid=1540766640&sr=1-4

[Jacob Reverb]

I don't use one for WW, but I see a lot of guys are using multimeters for judging the dryness of firewood. Sounds like a way to save money to me, since a wood moisture meter is just a glorified ohmmeter...

See:

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/using-a-multimeter-to-measure-wood-moisture-level.40033/

[Warren Lake]

I guess you cant post without some words, so much for a picture being worth 1000 words



395669

[Bradley Gray]

I have a smaller Delmhorst with built in pins. 30 years old and still ticking.

[Tom M King]

I'm still using a Delmhorst similar to the one Warren posted the picture of, but I bought mine before they were digital. Mine has an analog gauge on it. I have always taken the battery out between uses, so it still works as well as when I bought it. That slide hammer weighs a couple of pounds, and will drive the pins in any wood. If I was buying one today, I'd get a pinless one, but probably still stick with Delmhorst, since it's served so well, for so long.

[Warren Lake]

have over 30 years on that and never taken the battery out. I got that model as that was what they used at one lumber company I was purchasing from. If i did replace a battery it was likely not more than once. Id have to take it out now and see what is in there, normally I have notes on that stuff. I have some other battery stuff that tries to eat batteries in the time it takes me to make a coffee, I might be exaggerating a bit but some tools like my Digital Caliper feel like they run forever this has been one of them. Very reliable used on cabinet wood and firewood as well. Its a bit complicated and you need a heat sensor to check the material temp as well.

[Yonak Hawkins]

Wagner - it is an older model, but the speed and ease of use makes it simple to spot check incoming lumber.

I have a pinless Wagner : MMC 205. It's tricky to use. You have to have a good idea of the density of the lumber for it to be accurate.

[Matthew Curtis]

Wow! Some of them are expensive.

[Jim Becker]

I have a pinless Wagner : MMC 205. It's tricky to use. You have to have a good idea of the density of the lumber for it to be accurate.

Same here...and I guard the little piece of paper with the chart!

[J.R. Rutter]

Same here...and I guard the little piece of paper with the chart!

I put the PDF on my phone :) Oh, and it is the L606 that I have had for 15 years or so.

https://i.imgur.com/WA4hM3Uh.png

[Van Huskey]

I use a Delmhorst J-4. I keep planning to get a remote slide hammer probe for it but just never get around to it.

[Rod Sheridan]

I use a megohmeter on the 500V range and a table of resistance versus moisture content for each species.........Rod.

[Yonak Hawkins]

My problem is there can be different densities within the same species, possibly within the same tree. I sent an Ash sample to the Forest Service lab because it just felt light for Ash. The response I got was, "Fraxinus, Slow Growth / Low Density". I'm having less and less trust in the pinless meters.

[Tom M King]

have over 30 years on that and never taken the battery out. I got that model as that was what they used at one lumber company I was purchasing from. If i did replace a battery it was likely not more than once. Id have to take it out now and see what is in there, normally I have notes on that stuff. I have some other battery stuff that tries to eat batteries in the time it takes me to make a coffee, I might be exaggerating a bit but some tools like my Digital Caliper feel like they run forever this has been one of them. Very reliable used on cabinet wood and firewood as well. Its a bit complicated and you need a heat sensor to check the material temp as well.

I guess mine may be 40 years old, or a little older-forget when I bought it. I take the battery out because sometimes we might be doing something besides working wood, and was worried it might be long enough that the 9v battery would start leaking. The paper chart is still under the clip in the metal lid. I'll try to think to take a picture of it tomorrow. Batteries weren't as good back then as they are now, and I just got in the habit with that after having a few things that battery acid ended up ruining.

[Warren Lake]

likely more accurate to use a stove and take it down and work it out. I remember one lumber company using that method and think they told me its more accurate.

[John K Jordan]

I've had the Wagner 220 for a bunch of years and have been quite happy with it. Not cheap.

It's a pinless meter so it does need a flat spot for a good reading and you do have to know the approximate wood density. It does come with a booklet of wood densities and there are more on their web site.

Do you "really need" and expensive meter? I'm sure you don't. But I also stay away from cheap tools and I've never been sorry.

JKJ

[Rod Sheridan]

No doubt Warren, however I don't need an absolute number, just a relative number.

If the test piece is the same MC as the stock wood in my shop, it's suitably acclimated.

I did use the microwave once to dry a test piece........Regards, Rod.

[John K Jordan]

likely more accurate to use a stove and take it down and work it out. I remember one lumber company using that method and think they told me its more accurate.

The oven dry method is the most accurate method possible. The downsides are it destroys the wood, is a lot of trouble, and takes a long time. It is seldom needed but I use it on occasion.

I posted this a while back on the method. Disregard where the thread wanders off the topic
https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?263169-Moisture-content-by-oven-dry-method

JKJ

[Warren Lake]

thanks John, Ive never done that and its not a thing I need, just mentioned it as ive seen the ovens in offices in the past. I was typically buying top quality materials from top suppliers, material that was stored in doors in new heated buildings so that alone was a good start. When I started I remember one big company that had material in damp unheated storage and going in there in the winter sucked the life out of you, I felt sorry for the wood. Like someone leaving their dog outside in the winter like some lower class thing. Couple of others as well with unheated buildings, never liked any of them. The bring it in at 6-7 percent then store it like crap in cold and damp conditions for some period of time??

I dont put much care on material sitting in the shop as wood experts tell you. Soon as you machine it you are into a new fresh surface and its different wood. Typical for some repeat stuff was one day to drive, pick, drive back, unload and put stuff in the shop. Next day boards were checked for moisture content to make sure there were no wild boards then cuts were laid out and cut over length, ripped over width, then face jointed and planed oversize and left on edge with space between for at least a few days to tension release then machined to final. Best way is for a shop to be 30-40 percent moisture content and at 65-75 degrees, ive never had that luxury. At times crappy shop conditions had to pay attention with door fits taking into account how it will change where it lives after that. Moisture meter I have has worked fine and been reliable and never let me down despite its age.

[John K Jordan]

I was so fortunate to be able to put heat and air in my new shop so the dry wood stays pretty dry. Almost all of my wood is turning stock and as I prefer to turn dry wood this is perfect for me. I cut a lot of green wood into blanks and let them dry before use so a moisture meter comes in handy as a check. But frankly, after a little experience in a conditioned shop you can usually get a rough idea of the moisture by feeling - wet feels cool.

One perhaps interesting thing - I sometimes weigh freshly cut blanks and record the weight to track the drying. It always amazes me how fast smaller wood dries inside a conditioned space. For example, I weighed some dense 2x2 and 3x3 walnut crotch blanks today and they had dropped about 5% over three days.

JKJ


thanks John, Ive never done that and its not a thing I need, just mentioned it as ive seen the ovens in offices in the past. I was typically buying top quality materials from top suppliers, material that was stored in doors in new heated buildings so that alone was a good start. When I started I remember one big company that had material in damp unheated storage and going in there in the winter sucked the life out of you, I felt sorry for the wood. Like someone leaving their dog outside in the winter like some lower class thing. Couple of others as well with unheated buildings, never liked any of them. The bring it in at 6-7 percent then store it like crap in cold and damp conditions for some period of time??

I dont put much care on material sitting in the shop as wood experts tell you. Soon as you machine it you are into a new fresh surface and its different wood. Typical for some repeat stuff was one day to drive, pick, drive back, unload and put stuff in the shop. Next day boards were checked for moisture content to make sure there were no wild boards then cuts were laid out and cut over length, ripped over width, then face jointed and planed oversize and left on edge with space between for at least a few days to tension release then machined to final. Best way is for a shop to be 30-40 percent moisture content and at 65-75 degrees, ive never had that luxury. At times crappy shop conditions had to pay attention with door fits taking into account how it will change where it lives after that. Moisture meter I have has worked fine and been reliable and never let me down despite its age.

[Warren Lake]

wet to drier goes very fast, dried doesnt change like that. Most turners say they love to turn green, shaving shoot off crazy long, tools stay sharp longer and and, why do you prefer to turn dry?

[John K Jordan]

wet to drier goes very fast, dried doesnt change like that. Most turners say they love to turn green, shaving shoot off crazy long, tools stay sharp longer and and, why do you prefer to turn dry?

Yes, most here like to turn green too. It's fun and it's easy, almost too easy to be challenging. I do turn for fun (rather than profit), but I enjoy turning a huge variety of things, some of which are best turned dry. I turn with razor-sharp tools and don't mind sharpening.

I like to turn dry wood for several reasons.

- I like to turn smaller things and I like to use a lot of different types of wood. I once counted over 125 species on my storage shelves, both exotic and domestics. (I love turning smaller things from hard, fine-grained exotics like ebony and domestics like dogwood, the harder the better.) No way I could keep such a variety of wet wood since it would all be firewood after a few months. I process a lot of green wood into smaller turning blanks for my own use and to give away and trade. The dogwood and persimon I'm using now I cut in 2006. Dry woods are like a commodity and can be kept for years, mailed, carried across the country, and it stays in good shape.

- Big bowls are fun but I prefer to turn smaller things. For example I've turned hundreds of "magic" wands which are long thing spindles. It is almost impossible to turn these green since when the diameter gets down to less than 1/4" the shaft starts too warp quickly unless you turn very quickly. I like to take my time and add detail. I've also turned 100s of little finger tops that are better balanced turned dry and round. Things with pieces that fit together are best turned dry.

- I'm the slowest turner in the Southeast and don't get a lot of time to turn. Green pieces are best turned in one "sitting" or I have to go to extremes to keep the partially turned piece from warping for a day or two. I have a number of partially-turned pieces in my shop, some still in spare chucks, that I can pop on the lathe and pick up where I left off weeks or months later.

- I prefer finished pieces that are round. Lidded boxes must be made from dry wood or the lids will get stuck as the wood warps. Turned boxes with threaded lids have to be turned dry. Bowls and platters that sit flat on the table are either turned from dry or rough turned while wet then dried and finished turned - back to turning dry.

There are probably some other reasons I can't think of now (immediate use of certain finishes?) but I need to go out and feed the horses. If you are interested, here are a few pics of things I turn dry:

https://sawmillcreek.org/album.php?albumid=862

https://sawmillcreek.org/album.php?albumid=862&page=2

https://sawmillcreek.org/album.php?albumid=862&page=3

BTW, you might notice a lot of my turnings are in the spindles or turned in the spindle orientation. I share the belief with a bunch of others that unlike green bowl turning, spindle turning better teaches fine tool control that will let you turn anything. The first tool I put in a beginning student's hands is a skew chisel.

JKJ

[Mark Hennebury]

I don't use a moisture meter, but you can get the information you need by observation;

When new lumber arrives at your shop,

Resaw a piece. if it cups it is not at equilibrium. return it.

if it stays flat it is at equilibrium.

Take a thin flat piece lay it on a table ( or cover one side with masking tape) and check it the next day,

if it is cupped it is not at the same moisture content as your shop.

If the edges have cupped up, your shop is dryer then the wood

If the middle is cupped up , then the wood is drier than your shop.

If it stays flat all is in harmony.

[Jared Groebner]

I bought a MMC220 Wagner 10 years ago and again 8 years ago as I thought I'd lost the first lol. Nonetheless if you can afford it, I'd absolutely recommend buying 2 right off the bat if you want to use it long term. If an employee drops one and doesn't tell you, the best and quickest way to check it's accuracy is with a 2nd detector. I've had to send in my detectors now twice over the past 10 years to get re-calibrated.

[Bill McNiel]

I have a Ligno Scanner D which is pinless and reads to a depth of 3/4". Great tool from an American company.

[Curt Harms]

I have an older Mini Ligno by Lignomat. It has worked well for many years.

Same here, LEDs instead of a display. I've never checked it against the oven dry method, never felt the need. I can usually lay hands on a scrap of the same species as what I want to check. If the scrap which has been in the shop for years reads the same as the piece being checked, that's good enough for my purposes. Actual values vary with the season to some extent.