Bandsaw for Boatbuilding [Archive] - Sawmill Creek Woodworking Community

John Bailey

11-20-2005, 4:22 AM

I know some of you guys have built boats in your days. I'm getting closer to buying a bandsaw and was wondering what type, size, power, etc... you guys use. I know I need to get the biggest, most powerful bandsaw I can fit in my shop and can afford. My shop is 20x20 with 8.5 ft. ceilings and I like buying good value as opposed to buying cheap or the best. My question is, for those that have built boats, what has worked? My future plans are for an 18 ft. kayak, 16 ft. overnight cruising sailboat, and a 35 ft. sailboat.

Thanks in advance, John

Chris Barton

11-20-2005, 6:00 AM

Hey John,

My Laguna 16HD has been a great band saw so far (1 month old). It has a resaw capacity of 16" and runs on a 4.8hp Baldor motor. So far, most of the use I have put to it has been slicing up logs for lathe projects. It has no problem splitting a 14" diameter chunk of oak. Its little brother the Laguna 14SE has been reviewed by "Wooden Boat" in the context you are interested in:

http://lagunatools.com/images/wooden-boat.pdf

Dave Richards

11-20-2005, 7:31 AM

John, you want something like this. :D
http://www.vintageamerican.com/bandsaws/shipsaw1.jpg

I don't think your ceiling is high enough, though.

I don't think you're going to need a really huge saw. I have a Jet 16" which works fine for me. Even on the 35' boat you won't need reallly huge resaw capacity. Throat capacity is likely to be more important than resaw capacity. Even so, I think the bandsaws in the 16 or 18" sizes will be plenty.

Hey, what's the 35 footer?

John Hart

11-20-2005, 8:06 AM

Hey John,
I have a Delta 16", which has a 6" resaw capabilty. It really works fine for what I need but, there are plenty of times where I wished that I had another couple inches clearance. I'm seriously considering a height extension.

John Bailey

11-20-2005, 8:28 AM

Chris,

I've seen that article. The boats the folks were building that did the article were smaller boats. So, I thought if I could find some who have worked on boats I might get some first hand knowlege. The biggest timbers I'll be working will be 12x8 white oak about 13 ft. long. I don't think I'll need to deal with the 12" side but I'd like to hear from someone who's been there.

Dave,

I really don't want to go bigger than an 18" if I don't have to. I've got lots of study plans and I go back and forth on a choice, just like the tide. Right now I'm looking at George Buehler's Juno and Juna. I was all set on a Paul Gartside design until I read the Buehler book, "Backyard Boatbuilding." Buehler's workboat philosophy fits me much more than the typical yachting philosophy. Love your quote, by the way.

John,

There are plenty of times I'm going to need at least 8" resaw. So, that's going to be the minimum.

Thanks to all, John

Chris Barton

11-20-2005, 9:17 AM

John,

It sounds like what will be most important to you for the projects you have in mind are 1) HP, probably need at least 2, 2) table size and a set of infeed and outfeed tables to help you manage cuts of long tembers. My Laguna 16HD has a 4.8 HP Baldor motor on it and when I was considering this saw I thought the HP rating was probably going to be overkill for what I usually do with a band saw. But, I can now tell you it is such a luxury to have seemingly unlimited power to cut through whatever you are cutting. It's like driving a Jag XKV12, sinful power...

John Bailey

11-20-2005, 9:21 AM

Chris,

What's that in your hands?

John

Chris Barton

11-20-2005, 9:36 AM

catalina 30...

John Bailey

11-20-2005, 9:41 AM

Chris,

You sail that in Nashville?

John

tod evans

11-20-2005, 10:17 AM

please give serious consideration to the minimax 16......for a small saw it`s hard to beat. you can find lotsa reviews on the net and several folks here own one. plus the customer service is second to none! and no i don`t have any finiancial interest. just a satisfied customer. tod

Chris Barton

11-20-2005, 10:49 AM

John,

I could sail in the Nashville area in a Gulf Star 42 or bigger if I wanted. There are several very large (20+ miles long) lakes up here but, that picture is from a few years back when I lived in Mobile, AL. I used to sail in the bay and gulf down there. I miss it...

David Wilson

11-20-2005, 10:54 AM

John, I have the Rikon 10-340 which is an 18" saw with 2HP moter. I am planning on building a kayak or 2 and the rikon will, I believe, fit the bill. Has 12" resaw capability and a huge table. The blade that comes with it is a piece of junk but am having good luck with a lenox blade. The saw is 6'6" tall so it would easily fit in your shop. The saw sells for around a grand which is considerably cheaper than anything comparible.
just my 2 cents worth.

John Bailey

11-20-2005, 1:20 PM

David,

What kind of kayaks are you going to build?

John

Peter Lyon

11-20-2005, 1:47 PM

John,

From your other posts, I get the impression that you do not presently own a tablesaw. If that is correct and I were in your shoes, I would look into buying the most powerful bandsaw that you can fit into your workspace and budget and yet still be able to manuever it around in your shop.

Having built a number of canoes and kayaks myself (cedar strip, plywood and plank built) I know you will be performing a lot of rips. If your lucky like I have been, you'll get some long lengths of lumber (20'+). Having the ability to position the saw so that you can direct the lumber out the door with a shop your size may become crucial.

John Bailey

11-20-2005, 2:00 PM

Peter,

Some of the 18" and 20" saws I've seen weigh in around 600lbs. I've not done much with woodworking machines other than a RAS. I too have thought I'm going to have to move the bandsaw around a times. Is 600lbs. doable with a bandsaw? They seem a bit top heavy for too much moving around.

John

Peter Lyon

11-20-2005, 2:31 PM

John,

It's probably "doable" with the right moble base but your right, bandsaws are inherently top heavy. However, with that said, I successfully move my 17" around the shop. It may depend (in part) on the smoothness of your flooring and how much stuff you need to manuever around.

PS - I'm embarassed to confess that after posting my previous comment, I went back and "carefully" read some of the previous postings and saw where you stated that you don't plan on sawing very long material.

John Bailey

11-20-2005, 3:05 PM

Peter,

While I said the largest timbers I'm going to be working with were 12x8's about 13 ft. long, some of the planking material for the kayak and the 35 footer will be at least 20 ft. So, I'll be dealing with some fairly long material and a mobile bandsaw will be important. My shop has been planned for an open area in the middle, so there won't be too much to go around. It will have a wood floor, so I'll have to make sure it is pretty smooth.

Thanks for your insight.

John

Dan Forman

11-20-2005, 5:07 PM

John---I have the MiniMax 16" bandsaw, and it should not be a problem to move around for you. It has a Johnson bar, and wheels mounted in the base. Unfortuanately, it is a problem for me, only because of my uneven concrete basement floor. It tends to get high-centered easily. With a wood floor, this shouldn't happen. The latest incarnation also has plenty of HP, weigh just over 500 pounds.

Dan

Peter Lyon

11-20-2005, 6:05 PM

John,

The bandsaw that I'm presently using is the Grizzly 0513. This is a 17" unit with 12" of resaw capacity and a 2 hp. motor. I believe it weighs just over 300 lbs. I've been using this saw since I upgraded from a 14" Jet (1hp). I can say that of all the Grizzly products that I've purchased to date, this has performed the best. I've been quite happy with it.

One issue you will need to overcome ripping such long pieces on the bandsaw is proper infeed and outfeed support.

I remember quite well spending the better part of a day setting up one particular ripping "operation". where I was dealing with 20' by myselft. :)

John Hart

11-21-2005, 7:17 AM

Hey John....did you see the used Minimax that just went up in the classified section? Looks like you could save a grand!

David Wilson

11-21-2005, 8:53 AM

John
I am looking at the kayaks from Guillemot.m The 14' great auk to be more spacific.

Dave Richards

11-21-2005, 9:21 AM

Bob Smalser

11-21-2005, 9:48 AM

I know some of you guys have built boats in your days.

One or two.

For resawing, you can't have one too big.

I think this one has the best bang for the buck.....I take my heavy oak and Purpleheart resawing over to a colleague who has one and I love it.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/item.aspx?itemnumber=G0566

http://images.grizzly.com/grizzlycom/pics/jpeg288/G/G0566.jpg

A trouble-free, single phase, 3hp, 21" saw fro 1500 bucks.

Peter Mc Mahon

11-21-2005, 10:33 AM

Hi John. I don't have any advice on which bandsaw to buy, other than a lot of hp and the most solidly built one, but I would recommend being aware of table height. Resaw, bandsaws tend to have a lower table height, and if you are moving around big chunks of oak I would think that you want a low table height. Peter

Jamie Buxton

11-21-2005, 11:04 AM

http://www.vintageamerican.com/bandsaws/shipsaw1.jpg

I've seen one of those in operation in a boatyard. The cool thing about it is that the blade tilts, not the table -- just like the usual table saw. This means that the timber is not trying to slide off the machine if you're making a beveled cut. Even cooler, the angle of the blade can be changed during a cut. If you're cutting the outside of a rib, the correct bevel angle is different at the top of the rib than the bottom.

Dave Richards

11-21-2005, 11:18 AM

The cool thing about it is that the blade tilts, not the table -- just like the usual table saw. This means that the timber is not trying to slide off the machine if you're making a beveled cut. Even cooler, the angle of the blade can be changed during a cut. If you're cutting the outside of a rib, the correct bevel angle is different at the top of the rib than the bottom

It would be nice to have a 14 or 16" saw that could do that.

Kurt Forbes

11-21-2005, 11:37 AM

Unless you are doing alot of home made veneer work I really do not think you will need too much resaw.

My father was a boatbuilder for 20 years working out of our front yard in his little boat yard. He made several boats over 50foot in length and other than the keel I do not remember seeing many large timbers on any of them.
Most boats are made of strips of smaller peices of wood. Hard to get the curves most boats use with big timbers small strips are easier to work with.
You can buy as big a bandsaw as your heart desires but from what you said pretty much any decent bandsaw will work fine.
Dad's bandsaw was a 17" and I never saw him saw a peice anywhear near the max height of the saw.

Bob Smalser

11-21-2005, 11:52 AM

I don't have a large one yet, either, but I use a lot of salvaged oak 8x8 timbers from the local shipyard that my 14" Delta just won't handle.

You can't have too big a bandsaw if you are resawing.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/2595357/91769670.jpg

Here's a ship's saw at the Phila Naval Shipyard circa WWII where my father worked as a shipwright.

The man on the tilt wheel is looking at the bevel marks in degrees marked on this laminated minesweeper frame and cranking the tilt handle to match as the feed men move the frame thru the cut.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/2595357/91556861.jpg

And the gent on the right, mortising a caprail to fit the bulwark stanchions with millwright chisels, is my father.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/2999461/119503519.jpg

Like father, like son. Also mortising with a millwright chisel.

Ken Fitzgerald

11-21-2005, 11:59 AM

Bob....that photo of your Dad is too cool! I have a Life magazine from the 30's that had an article about the ship my Dad was on at the time. There is a photo of my father with other crew members in the article.

John Bailey

11-21-2005, 3:55 PM

John, I tried to find some online illustration of Juno and/or Juna with no success.

It is difficult to decide on a design, isn't it? I'd like to do Oughtred's Grey Seal but I've no room to build anything that large (nor money). I'll likely do one of his open double enders although I can't decide which. Might also do his Wee Rob sailing canoe.

So many boats, so little time...or space...or money. :)

Dave,

If you go to www.georgebuehler.com you'll be able to see a couple of pictures of Juno and study plans of Juna. I talked with George and he said, although they are very similar, Juna is really the improved, and therefore, the better boat. I don't know, I like the lines and the below waterline shape better on the older, Juno. The Grey Seal was one that I considered, but I don't think it would be big enough for cruising. Paul Gartside also has some good boat designs. You're right, so many designs, so little time.

Bob,

The Grizz sure would do the trick. I've looked at that, and it would be on the short list. Your picture of your dad is great. But, what I'd like to know is how you take your pictures, they're always great and professional looking. How's the home/workshop doing.

Dave,

The Guillemot designs are well thought of. I'm looking at a longer, narrower sea kayak that I can use for the open water trips that I guide. I bought plans for the Redfish Spring Run. Hope to get started soon.

Thanks to all, John