How to make these chairs?

[Mark Gibney]

A client says she would like some chairs that look like the ones in the this photo.

386192

I am trying to work out how the legs and back rest are attached to the seat.
I imagine the legs are made as two laminated U's, and crisscross each other right under the seat, and are screwed into the seat. What do you think?

The backs - are they wedge mortised in? Or as these are somewhat production process chairs would they use a different method? In case it matters, it looks like the seat grain runs front to back.

And while you're here, how are the table legs attached to the top?

thanks, Mark

[Glen Gunderson]

Just did a reverse image search, and that's an Axis table and chairs by Copeland furniture. Here's a page for the chair with a bunch of different shots:

https://www.copelandfurniture.com/dining-rooms/chairs/axis-chair.html

Here's a view of the underside, it looks like it's just attached by blocks, so you'd probably want to improve on that:

https://www.copelandfurniture.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/a/x/axischairdetail.jpg

[Wayne Lomman]

At the very least you are going to need mortise and tenon joints to attach legs to seats and legs to table top. The seats and table top are quite thick to give more timber to joint into. There is clever use of shaping and profiling to give the illusion of thin material. In times past, through and wedged tenons would be the way to do it. I would still do it this way but you will have to find out from the customer if this appearance is acceptable. If not, good luck....

I am a bit concerned about how the back attaches to the seat. It will be supported by short grain behind the tenons. The shaping/thickening at the base of the backrest will be critical as this allows you to move the mortise further from the back edge of the seat. Use two tenons side by side in each half of the backrest so that the short grain is better supported.

You will also need to use a high strength timber for this job and a really good glue. What you are building is a spindle chair without any stringers between the legs. They won't be too bad to do. As usual with chairs, it is a ton of machining with a bit of assembly to finish off. I would stay away from laminating frames etc. It will be too much work and not a great look. Cheers

[johnny means]

https://www.copelandfurniture.com/copeland-furniture-factory-tour

mortise and tenon

[Robert Pugmire]

could one dovetail that in like the tage frid stool?

[Mark Gibney]

Amazing to me that you all found such specific material to answer my questions, so thank you.

The embedded video of Copeland Furniture showing their chair making is well worth the few minutes spent looking at it. They use over 20,000 bd ft of lumber a week! It's incredible to see the speed at which they make chairs compared to how long it takes me.

Wayne - if you check back in - do you think my idea of laminated legs is too IKEA-ish to be attractive?
And too much work? - I think chairs are always a lot of work regardless.

[Wayne Lomman]

Laminated legs are OK. However, I think in this case it will be difficult to engineer them to do what you want. You would have to find a way to combine the straight outer edge of the leg with the required inner curve to create the u-shape. Even then, they will not look like the picture.

You are correct that chairs are a lot of work. To me this means choosing what to expend your effort on. You will get the look of this suite better by putting your time into good joints.

The other consideration with this suite is that it is a design from a mass production factory. You will need to do something a bit special to set it apart from the cookie cutter stuff. Try timber selection, carving or whatever so your customer feels they are getting value. It's actually better to get new techniques rather than designs from the mass production places. Try telling a customer that... Cheers

[Dave Richards]

It's interesting that the wedge behind the leg appears to only tough the leg just above where the curve starts. There's a gap between that point and the underside of the seat.

[Jamie Buxton]

There's something that bothers me in the Copeland pics. The boards that form the back aren't visually balanced -- not even remotely. One is mostly rift, and the other is mostly plainsawn. I'd take the time to balance the two. I might go to the trouble of resawing thicker stock to do a real book match. If you don't have that resaw capability, you can at least select the two boards more carefully than Copeland did.

[Mark Gibney]

Jamie that jumped out at me too. I pointed it out to my client, and interestingly she said "what do you mean? oh, that? That wouldn't bother me".

But you're right, I would try to make them more sympathetic to each other.

[lowell holmes]

you could attach the legs and then drill two holes in the joint side. Then peg the legs with dowel pins.
Just a thought. I would consider a vertical pin into the seat bottom as well. Just a thought . . . .

[Bob Falk]

[QUOTE=Glen Gunderson;2815032]Just did a reverse image search, and that's an Axis table and chairs by Copeland furniture. Here's a page for the chair with a bunch of different shots:

Glen, how do you do a reverse image search? thanks, bob

[Glen Gunderson]

Glen, how do you do a reverse image search? thanks, bob


Go to https://images.google.com/ and click on the camera icon in the search bar. Then you can either paste the URL of the image (if it's already online and publicly accessible) or you can upload the image file. Then it'll analyze the image and return other pages that use that same image and/or visually similar ones. It's not 100% effective, but you can usually find out more info about something if all you have is the picture.

[Keith Weber]

When I look at those chairs, I just picture a really... uh... rotund person sitting on it and see the legs splaying out and the person ending up on the floor with the legs splayed out in the shape of an X under their butt.

[Robert Engel]

I would use mortise & tenons. Thru tenons for legs into seats w/ wedges.

Typical of many people, they see something that appeals to the eye, but its our job as furniture builders to point out the flaws.

I would explain to the client its a poor design, but doable only if you put in leg stretchers and tell them you do not screw chairs together.

The added cost of joinery may nix the whole project......

[Alan Schwabacher]

Copeland didn't, but what if you make pairs of legs as a bent lamination, then fix them to the bottom of the seat? If the diagonally opposing legs were connected, you could use a half-lap under the center of the seat, and there would be very little stress on the seat to leg joint.

I personally don't see an aesthetic benefit to leaving out stretchers that so simply and efficiently add strength.

[Peter Christensen]

Look like a justification for a Domino. :)

[Wayne Lomman]

I would use mortise & tenons. Thru tenons for legs into seats w/ wedges.

Typical of many people, they see something that appeals to the eye, but its our job as furniture builders to point out the flaws.

I would explain to the client its a poor design, but doable only if you put in leg stretchers and tell them you do not screw chairs together.

The added cost of joinery may nix the whole project......

Robert, I have to respectfully disagree. While most customers only see the style, it is our job as furniture makers to provide solutions. No-one wants to know how hard it is, just can you do it. It is also not a good strategy to be negative and point out flaws in the work of others even if it is a mass production mob.

The most successful approach is to take on board the customer requirements and come up with a solution that provides real and saleable points of difference that justify the hand built price tag. Cheers

[lowell holmes]

On second thought, I would probably experiment with mortise and tenon joints with through pegs.

If you ever wanted to adjust the legs, the peg could be drilled out.