How many different planer knives do you have that don't have a microbevel?

[Robin Dobbie]

I'm curious how many planer knives do not have a microbevel? When I look closely, I now notice the sets from different makers for my one planer have a microbevel.

Why do I ask? With my utter lack of knowledge and experience, I thought it would be a good idea to attempt to sharpen planer knives. My goal with this is just to get good enough results that I don't have, or can at least reduce tearout. When I first got the planer I didn't get as much tearout, now I get an uncomfortable amount.

I saw a video about how to make a fixture to hold both a planer knife and a water stone at just the right angle to each other so that you can reliably hit the knife at just the right angle. I made mine for the primary bevel which at the time I thought was all it had. As suggested by the video creator, I was using light pressure with a 1000 stone. When I realized I wasn't really getting anywhere after 30 minutes of that, I noticed the microbevel.

Here's one I haven't started on yet. If I look at it with the light just right it's pretty obvious.

https://i.imgur.com/i8wpoEm.jpg


I reduced the angle of the stone, but it's still slow going. Maybe a lower-grit stone would have been a good idea? Or is it because planer steel is so tough?

[Ron Citerone]

What kind of planer? Benchtop or floor model?

If bench top the blades may be able to be flipped and then replaced pretty cheaply.

[Robin Dobbie]

Oh yeah it's a benchtop and they're two-sided, but I have three sets of dull ones.

I watched this (https://youtu.be/pUoEPgcqUFc?t=13m37s) video and he started off at 4000 grit and just spent a few seconds before moving on to 8000 grit. I feel deja vu from watching various people's card scraper videos and them spending just a few seconds at a far higher grit and getting perfect results right away. And then I try and it takes forever to get mediocre results. I feel like a total farktard given the video is titled "Fast and Easy" and that's absolutely not what I'm experiencing. I'm genuinely surprised how long it's taking to get any material removed considering I'm at 1000 grit and I've spent a HECK of a lot longer than he did.

[Ron Citerone]

To the Top.

I would think someone here has tried sharpening them. I didn't use mine enough to sweat buying new ones but if you can get it to work it would be great. So I send it up to the top of the page and hope you get some help.

[Robin Dobbie]

I think what is happening is I'm clogging the grit of the stone. The video I watched showed the stone going on dry. When I look at the stone really close, I can see tiny shiny dark areas. But mostly it doesn't look that bad. But I think as flat as these are, that little bit of clogging is raising the grit up enough that not enough abrasion is happening. I'm coming from only ever having used one two-sided 220/320 grit diamond plate. This is only the second time I've used water stones. In my life. For me, even 1000 grit is "fine" and I think I just wasn't keeping it clean enough given how much material I need to remove to plow through the microbevel.

To do this with more water involved I'll have to wrap the rear of the stone in something, lower the guide to compensate for the thickness of the materials, and go from there. The video maker suggested this in the video, but made it sound unnecessary. I would have thought at higher grits would have been more necessary, but what do I know.

[lowell holmes]

I put a microbevel on chisels and hand planes, but never on a jointer. I assume a planer is a jointer.

[Robin Dobbie]

I put a microbevel on chisels and hand planes, but never on a jointer.

Why not on a jointer?

Well I spent another hour and a half trying to get rid of the microbevel. I figured instead of changing the angle, I'd apply more vigor. Well, with the yellow shapton I ended up polishing a mirror finish on the half of the knife that the stone was hitting. In that 3/64th of an inch or whatever, I could see my own eyelashes. Is that... supposed to happen?

I pulled out my two-sided diamond plate that's 325 on one side 220 on the other. I used the 320 side for about 15 or 20 minutes. I really don't know how long. It did get rid of the polish right away, so I know it was doing something. But, I could still see what looked like about the same amount of evidence of the bevel after what felt like forever. I switched sides and went to town with the 220 side, not something I thought I'd have to do. I was applying maybe 3 or 4lb of pressure for another 30 minutes. I could still see the bevel. I gave up for the night. How tough is this farking steel?!

Just to be clear how small an amount of steel I was trying to remove, here's a shot from the other day before I started anything. This shows the other blade resting on the blade to be sharpened and the angle guide.

https://i.imgur.com/235BQnO.jpg

[Randy Heinemann]

I have recently acquired the Deulen sharpening jig to sharpen my planer knives. I've only sharpened once and have not yet put those blades back in the planer. The process is very simple with the jig on a dead flat surface with sandpaper.

My planer knives do have a micro-bevel. I actually didn't realize this either until I got the jig and sharpened them. The jig maintained the micro-bevel.

If you go to youtube you will find videos from others who have made jigs and some about the Deulen jig.

As for payback on the cost of the jig, that should happen quickly if I can even just get one sharpening and re-use for each set of 2-edged blades. Just waiting for the new set of blades to get dull before putting the re-sharpened knives back in.

[Peter Christensen]

Robin is there any chance those are carbide tipped blades?

[Robin Dobbie]

I have recently acquired the Deulen sharpening jig to sharpen my planer knives. I've only sharpened once and have not yet put those blades back in the planer. The process is very simple with the jig on a dead flat surface with sandpaper.

Hmm that's interesting. I looks like it just does everything at 45 degrees. I suppose that could work. I mean obviously it does, they've been selling those for a while. And I remember reading about hand planes that bevel angle doesn't matter, so long as it's 2 degrees less than the bedding angle. I don't know what the equivalent would be on a planer.

When you were done using the jig, what was your indicator for sharpness? Did you do a shaving or paper test or something similar?


Robin is there any chance those are carbide tipped blades?

No, they're just steel. I must be a wimp.

[Peter Christensen]

Or they were very dull.

[Andrew Hughes]

I was grinding my jointer knifes with a tormek. And I also found Hss steel to be a lot tougher then my chisels or plane blades. M2 and T1.
I found that Diamond stones loose their sharpness very quickly up against tool steel and carbide. I used up my junky smith diamond hone on carbide tipped planer knifes I had in my Dewalt.
For the most part Ive also found that if a jointer or planer knife is worth sharpening it's just better to send it to someone who does it with the proper machines.
Here's a pic of the fixture I used for the Dewalt knifes.

[Robin Dobbie]

Or they were very dull.

I don't doubt that they were at least a bit dull, but I don't believe pre-existing sharpness was affecting how long it was taking to remove material.



I was grinding my jointer knifes with a tormek. And I also found Hss steel to be a lot tougher then my chisels or plane blades. M2 and T1.
I found that Diamond stones loose their sharpness very quickly up against tool steel and carbide. I used up my junky smith diamond hone on carbide tipped planer knifes I had in my Dewalt.
For the most part Ive also found that if a jointer or planer knife is worth sharpening it's just better to send it to someone who does it with the proper machines.
Here's a pic of the fixture I used for the Dewalt knifes.

I'd heard that good quality plane and chisel steel was intentionally a bit softer so it would be easy to hone. These planer knives are sold as disposable, so honing isn't something most people are likely to do. And they've certainly lasted a while.

I was looking at the Dan Deulen jig, and the sandpaper he sells to go along with it starts at 120 and tops out at 400. I have to say, in my experience with this blade, that makes a heck of a lot more sense than 1000, not to mention 4000 to 8000. If I was creating a polished surface with a 1000 grit shapton, I think it's safe to say that might be too high to start with.

To maintain a semblance of balance, I'll do one side of the other blade the same way I've done this one. Then, I'll change up the jig to finish the knifes at say 43 degrees. A bit of a compromise between the 41-ish it's set to now and a full-on 45 degrees.

[Andrew Hughes]

I keep four grits of wet dry paper glued down to a granite surface plate. 200-600. I have found them handy for all sorta of needs. But I don't like the edge i get from the paper on my jointer knifes.The paper has a way of shaping the edge right were it counts like the end of a apple seed. For a pocket knife or a chisel that ok but not so much a machine knife that need clearance between the cutting angle and wood.
I have confirmed this because I have a set of shaptons with a diamond reference plate. The stones are the last word for the shape of the edge.
Honing the edge from a sharping service is a really good skill to have.
43 degrees sounds perfect:)

[Robin Dobbie]

...I don't like the edge i get from the paper on my jointer knifes.The paper has a way of shaping the edge right were it counts

That's what the creator of the video that inspired me to try this said in his video. I wonder if it makes a difference what kind of adhesive is used? I've seen quite a few people use no adhesive, and others use spray rubber cement. I could see either method causing problems, but so many people report success with it for hand plane irons. Although I don't know if there's an easily removable adhesive that's hard, and replacing the glass or tile every time could be pricey. On one hand tile is cheap, on the other finding perfectly flat tile isn't the easiest thing, either.

I just spent another 30 minutes getting the second blade to about where I had the first one last night. Starting at 220 saved a lot of time. It only aggressively bites right at first, then it starts gliding. It looks as coarse as it did the day I got it. The end I'm using doesn't appear to be any smoother than the rest of it, so I don't think I'm damaging the diamonds. I am keeping the cutting area wet. I do have tape wrapped around the other end so I'm not abrading the angle guide. Of course the tape has to stay dry.

[lowell holmes]

I had forgotten, but I have a Deulen jig. I like it, it does what it's supposed to do.

[Randy Heinemann]

For Robin's question about the Deulen jig: At this point, I have no true indication they are again sharp. However, any tiny nicks in the edges were gone when I was done and I didn't even use all 6 grits. I started with 150 grit and went to the 400 grit; so 4 of the 6. I have more than one set of knives and the new set I put in hasn't dulled enough for me to put the re-sharpened set back in so I really don't know for sure. Just followed the instructions in the YouTube video. It did maintain the existing micro-bevel.

[Dan Hahr]

You should not be worrying about matching the primary bevel angle. Whatever the angle of the micro-bevel is, set it to match it and just sharpen long enough to remove any nicks in the edge and create a bit of a burr on the back side of the knives. The microbevel is not necessary; but if it is there, it allows you to start at a higher angle and not have to remove so much metal.

Also, The Duelen jig only has two slots in it. Blades are not exactly the same, and if you expect your stone or flat surface to hit three blades equally in the same plane at the same time, you are going to get frustrated. Sharpen two blades at one time and do it at a slightly blunter angle than the main bevel so that you are only hitting the edge. If you have large nicks, this will take longer, but nowhere near as long as reshaping the original bevel. And quit wasting time with such fine abrasives. If I have tiny nicks, I start out with a full sheet of 9x11 sandpaper in 150 grit (plain ole' aluminum oxide wood paper) on granite and I sharpen for only a few minutes until it gets dull. Sandpaper is cheap. I don't move on until I feel a good burr on the back side the whole length of the blade. I then move to 220, then to wet or dry paper in 320, 400, 600, 800, and not much further unless I'm sharpening chisels or plane blades. I rotate the knives and keep the pressure over the new one to keep the wear even. I spend way more time changing sand paper than actually sharpening, except maybe with the first grit.

I'd have 3 or 4 sets done in 30 minutes. The blunter angle means a slightly less sharp knife, but a tougher edge. I really don't think a degree or two makes any noticeable difference. The angle's in the drawing are exaggerated to show what I mean, 1 or 2 degrees off the main bevel is fine.
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Dan