Critique this platform bed (with drawers) that I designed to be knocked-down

[Dan Friedrichs]

I’d like to build a king-sized bed frame as a wedding present for a family member. I’ve never built a bed frame, before, so I built myself a queen-sized “prototype” to make sure the joinery works as I want. I’d like to hear comments on the design and execution – PLEASE mercilessly critique, as I want the one I build as a gift to be good-quality.

Here's the sketchup model:

https://i.imgur.com/TroWQXq.jpg

I like the foam mattresses that are popular, these days, and with those, box springs are nothing but a cheap, squeaky spacer, and are completely unnecessary. That said, without a box spring, a mattress is usually quite low to the ground in most bed frames. If the frame is tall enough to put the mattress at “regular” height, there is a weird appearance of it floating off the ground. So I filled that empty space with some drawers (not yet installed, in these pictures).

Making a platform bed with drawers is complicated by the need to break it down for transport. I think I’ve devised some solutions for this, but maybe better options exist.

So here are the pieces. There are 2 mid-rails to support the slats (2 are probably unnecessary for the queen, but will be needed for the king, I think). I don’t like bed bolts, so corner joinery is 2x 8x40mm Dominos plus one of these (http://www.leevalley.com/us/hardware/page.aspx?p=50302&cat=3,43715,43730&ap=1)brackets at each corner. The mid-rails also have 2x dominos, but no other hardware.

https://i.imgur.com/XxzYgQ5.jpg


Since Lee Valley sells those brackets for this purpose, I tend to believe they are sufficient (even without the Dominos, which I assume are bearing most of the weight, anyways), but the corner joinery still feels "iffy" to me. What do you folks think?

https://i.imgur.com/80LDceI.jpg

The first 20” on each side rail is just a fake panel – I think most people would have a nightstand sitting there, so a drawer wouldn’t be functional.

Once all 4 rails are coupled, the Blum tandem slides are installed. One screw holds the front to the faceframe, and one holds the rear support bracket. I put threaded metal inserts into all screw locations, so they can be removed and reinstalled repeatedly, as the bed is moved. So the process of disassembly is simply to unclip the drawers from the Blum slides, and remove 2 screws per slide (to remove the slide and rear bracket). Put all the slides, brackets, and screws into a drawer, and move to new location.

https://i.imgur.com/fgXe0YB.jpg

Also notice that the mid-rails have legs that reach down to the floor to take some of the weight.

Finally, 3/4" plywood slats lay on top to support the mattress. All 4 of the rails have felt glued to the tops, to minimize wood-on-wood movement noises.

https://i.imgur.com/VtOnrKI.jpg

Thoughts? What can I do better, next time? I was shooting for a modern, more minimalist look, but fear I make some parts a little too thin. The 4 main posts are 2.5"x2", to give some context.

To reiterate, drawers (with walnut fronts) will go in the open areas at the bottom :) I just haven't gotten them built, yet.

[Jamie Buxton]

I don't see much that ensures the bed is square. That is, if you're looking straight down at the bed, it is supposed to be a rectangle, but it can move to become a parallelogram. If it does, the drawers will not close properly; they'll hit on one side but not the other.

[Brian Holcombe]

I’d like to see a much heavier center support, those two supports are made in the right approach but they may deflect side to side if they're overburdened.

Have a look at commercial made versions of this type of bed, good quality ones have big 8/4 supports running down the center for the drawers and the mattress above. Keep in mind for newly weds, it won't be long before they have kids bouncing up and down on the bed and the drawers will become fully loaded within minutes of arrival.

I agree with Jamie's comments as well, it should be made strong against racking. It seems like a bed would never endure racking forces...right up until you decide to reposition it in the room and crack the joinery. If you push one corner and it pulls out of square, then in my opinion it's not strong enough against racking.

[Jim Becker]

In general, I think your design is sound. The mid-support pieces actually MUST reach the floor to properly support things, particularly with the larger King size arrangement, so I'm glad you included that.

----

Jaimie, I get what you are saying but there is limited ability to enforce that. In this particular design, however, since there's space available between the drawer area and the headboard, he could put in some corner bracing to help with square at least at that end. This is a challenge for most beds, IMHO...

[Dan Friedrichs]

Jim - curious why you say the mid-supports must have legs. I figured they would help, but lacking them, wouldn't the load transfer to the corner posts? I figured the webframe design of the mid-supports would keep them very stiff. Just curious what you thoughts were.

Regarding squareness: I imagine the mattress enforces that, to some extent. A wide board in the middle might be useful, though.

[Brian Holcombe]

Dan, sorry I edited my post above to reflect my thoughts more completely.

[johnny means]

Wedding gift makes me think family raising, which makes me think about child proofing. I wonder about your outer frames when a two year old climbs into a fully extended drawer. Is the joinery on the outside frames up to the task of years of stress.

[Nick Schepis]

Novice here, but it would appear to me that the racking/squaring issue could be resolved by running the slats at a 45 degree angle and fastening them in place. Yes? No?

[Michael Rector]

I’ve purchased several and made a few more platform beds and in all cases the slats were pinned in some way to the side rails to not only keep it square but to keep the sides from bowing outwards and dropping slats.

I’d also beef up the center feet. I had a queen bed with simple 3/4 feet attached to the slats and my dogs would play under the bed and my German Shepherd would knock them sideways and break them off.

[Sam Puhalovich]

Daniel ... I built 4 LOFT beds for my grand kids. A PRIMARY design element was that the beds had to come APART readily for transportation ... or ... to be used as ordinary furniture. I spent a lot of time looking for corner hardware that would readily come together-and-apart with the bed being assembled 5' up-in-the-air ... then be RIGID for everything to hold together. The brackets from Leigh-Valley look very accommodating for dis-assembly ... but, then you have these metal brackets sticking-out that will be a handling nuisance to protect from 'injuring' other parts. ALSO; the bed will be undoubtedly used by adults for a primary marital function. I don't see that those brackets will be rigid-enough to keep the bed from rocking. I ended-up using bed bolts. I used 2 dowels at each end for the quick alignment ... the dominos will suffice for that ... I imbeded a nut in the foot-and-head boards ... and imbeded the bolts in the side-rails. Two of the sets have survived two re-locations without a scratch ... or any complaint about the bolts. After-all ... how often are you expecting that the bed will be moved. I agree with the comments on the center supports and the need to attain 'squareness'. The center supports need to touch the floor to be effective.

[Keith Weber]

I have a bed similar in overall look to that one, but it has a solid plywood platform, properly supported, instead of slats. It would solve your racking issue and give more strength to the bed. Modern mattresses don't really need springy slats underneath like they did a couple of decades ago.

[Peter Kuhlman]

If the bed goes on carpet then it would really help if the center supports and legs had some type of smooth slide surface. My wife would routinely rearrange the bedroom furniture and moving the bed was a common job. Very tough to slide a loaded bed on carpet or any flooring for that matter.
I have thought about building a similar bed and to solve the racking I was going to use plywood sheet material instead of slats as Keith suggested.
Nice looking bed design!

[Phil Mueller]

Dan, you are correct in the assertion that the foundation is nothing more than a plywood box covered by a nice material. For foam mattresses, they are referred to as “foundations” as there are no springs involved. In fact, a traditional box spring is discouraged by foam mattress manufacturers, because it risks a spring coming through the material into the mattress. And as springs fail in the box spring, it can cause sag in the mattress. Anyway, mattress warranties will be subject to the foundation. The multiple slat design you show is enough support, however, manufacturers would prefer a solid surface (any smooth surface piece of plywood is fine). Just FYI.

[James Biddle]

Couple of things on your construction (some items are already covered)...


1. I don't understand how the Dominos will work with the corner hardware. Doesn't that hardware attach by sliding one section down over the other? If so, the domino's will have to be elongated to accommodate that slide and will be useless for anything other than side to side location. I'd look towards the domino connectors with dowels to make it strong and able to be taken apart.

2. I think the bottom section of the side rails are under designed and provide no functionality since they're not anchored at the ends. I'd duplicate the top rail design and connection, maybe use a dowel and connector in both the top and bottom of the side rails.

3. All of the outside parts should be made of the same material and finished to cover the reveal.

4. If you're going through the trouble to add center supports, make them of a truss design instead of a web to gain the strength. Connect the webs to the headboard and footboard in the same method as the side rails.

5. Make the center support such that it can easily adjusted up and down to be set at assembly. Use a large foot that can be easily slid without catching or marring when the bed is positioned.

6. Make the slats such that they will be held in position side to side and easily removed. An rail attached to the sides with dovetails, dowels or dominos would work. I would rotate the rail you have now 90 degrees and screw the face into the side rails for added strength.

7. Even though it would be seldom seen, I would make the headboard support the same as the footboard. It's just aesthetics, but I like the idea of building 2 identical sections instead of two unique sections. It also allows to to pick the best boards for the front at assembly.

8. I like the slats versus solid top to allow moisture to evaporate from the mattress. I built a solid top once and should have added holes. If you feel more support is needed (I don't), change the spacing on the slats.

9. A successful mattress warranty claim is a mythical creature, don't design the bed hoping to capture it.

Good Luck!

[Dan Friedrichs]

Thank you all for the feedback.

A solid plywood sheet would certainly work, but would weigh quite a bit and be hard to move - I figured the slats make transport much easier.

Sounds like the general feedback is that everything should be a little heftier? I can get behind that.

I'm mostly wondering if there are other ways to achieve this design (platform bed with drawers) that I haven't considered. It seems like such a waste of space to not fill the space under the mattress with storage, yet, that makes disassembly very difficult.

[Dan Friedrichs]

1. I don't understand how the Dominos will work with the corner hardware. Doesn't that hardware attach by sliding one section down over the other? If so, the domino's will have to be elongated to accommodate that slide and will be useless for anything other than side to side location. I'd look towards the domino connectors with dowels to make it strong and able to be taken apart.

The hardware doesn't slide - goes straight together and is pulled tight with a bolt. So the dominos slide straight in, and the bolt/hardware snugs everything tight.



2. I think the bottom section of the side rails are under designed and provide no functionality since they're not anchored at the ends. I'd duplicate the top rail design and connection, maybe use a dowel and connector in both the top and bottom of the side rails.

I see what you're saying. The bottom section is only to support the drawer slides, though. My thought was that the top section of the rail would support the mattress, and the bottom "faceframe" supports the drawer slides?



3. All of the outside parts should be made of the same material and finished to cover the reveal.
Yes, will do! Drawers will have false fronts that overlay the entire faceframe.



6. Make the slats such that they will be held in position side to side and easily removed. An rail attached to the sides with dovetails, dowels or dominos would work. I would rotate the rail you have now 90 degrees and screw the face into the side rails for added strength.

I'm confused about what you're thinking, here. The walnut portion of the side rails is "T" shaped (a vertical rail on the far outside, and a horizontal portion that the slat are supported on). Is that what you're thinking?


Thanks for the feedback! Much appreciated!

[Jim Becker]

Jim - curious why you say the mid-supports must have legs. I figured they would help, but lacking them, wouldn't the load transfer to the corner posts? I figured the webframe design of the mid-supports would keep them very stiff. Just curious what you thoughts were.

Regarding squareness: I imagine the mattress enforces that, to some extent. A wide board in the middle might be useful, though.
If you look at pretty much any commercial King sized bed frame setup, you'll likely see at least one center leg that gets to the floor. I'm sure it's possible to engineer the weight transfer out to the edges, but given the size of a King sized bed and the weight and, um...force...it needs to support over time, I'd personally not eschew a center support to the floor.

[Peter Christensen]

One minor thing that isn't structural is dust in the drawers. Because there isn't anything to prevent dust, fluff and whatnot from working its way down from above, the contents of the drawers catch it. Dust panels above the drawers are a good idea.

[Michael Rector]

Thank you all for the feedback.

A solid plywood sheet would certainly work, but would weigh quite a bit and be hard to move - I figured the slats make transport much easier.



All manufacturers will tell you not to use a solid sheet support because it doesn't allow the mattress to breathe, slats are the way to go.

[Dan Friedrichs]

One minor thing that isn't structural is dust in the drawers. Because there isn't anything to prevent dust, fluff and whatnot from working its way down from above, the contents of the drawers catch it. Dust panels above the drawers are a good idea.

Hmm...good point. I'm not sure if there is any way to include that without making it much more difficult to knock down...

[Jim Becker]

Without a solid platform, you'd need to do dust frames as part of the drawer assemblies if you want to incorporate them. You might lose a tiny bit of depth that way, but it's possible.

[Peter Christensen]

Hmm...good point. I'm not sure if there is any way to include that without making it much more difficult to knock down...

Slats over the drawers cold be replaced with a plywood panel and screwed to the frame. Plywood over the centre areas can have holes for venting. You get the dust and racking racking solved and the remaining areas still have slats for some breathing.

Or you make a couple dust panels of 1/4" plywood that sit under the slats, attaching to the inner and outer rails.

[Phil Mueller]

James, I understand where you’re coming from, warranty claims are difficult (I guess by design). However, I’ve helped numerous customers submit successful claims with several high end foam manufacturers. I’ve never been denied on a reasonable claim. It’s always helpful if the retailer gets involved...we have a bit more clout. Anyway, I should also note, on many claim forms they ask if there is a center support, so from that standpoint, I would add one.

[Ted Calver]

At least a few of the memory foam mattress companies suggest either a solid platform or closely (2") spaced slats. I would think some 3/16" paneling or other thin plywood on top of your slats would do the trick as dust covers and still be easy to move. I'm designing a king and considering T-slats with no middle post. We have never liked the middle post since it interferes with under bed storage (sliding bins) and makes the bed more difficult to move around. I saw the T-slat idea in a Charles Neil video. It's worth a shot.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdNcmLRMKgQ

[Jamie Buxton]

...I'm mostly wondering if there are other ways to achieve this design (platform bed with drawers) that I haven't considered...

Okay, since you asked, I'll tell you my current approach to chest beds.. I've built seven of them in the past thirty years, and my architecture has slowly evolved to what I lay out below.

A key thought is that I want my furniture to outlive me. That means it may get disassembled and assembled by guys from a housemoving truck, or by a homeowner whose entire tool set is a hammer and a crescent wrench. (Don't laugh. Most people actually live like that!) This in turn means that the assembly and disassembly must very simple. If at all possible, it should be tool-free. If tools must be used, they must be very easy to understand and use. Tricky tweaky assembly is a no-no. Loose parts which might get lost in the moving truck aren't a good idea.

I use four major subassemblies: a headboard, a footboard, and two platform halves. Each platform half contains drawers and the associated slides. It is essentially a short chest of drawers. It has interior walls, which carry weight to the floor, and which provide a place to fasten the slides. The headboard and footboard connect to the platform halves, and hold them together. The drawing shows a modern-ish style of bed with a footboard which is below the mattress level, but you can use the same architecture with a taller footboard. All the weight of the mattress and the sleepers rests on the platform halves, which carry it down to the floor. The headboard and footboard do not carry any weight. In fact, in this particular design, the footboard doesn't even go down to the floor.

Each platform half is small enough to carry through a house, and even up stairs. The photo at the bottom of this post is a California King, which is 84"x72", and it went right through the house.

It takes precision construction to get drawers to run easily and close properly. And it takes sturdy casework that doesn't move to ensure proper operation for decades to come. In this bed architecture, all the precision is inside a platform half. It is unchanged and unaffected when the bed is disassembled.

Here's the major subassemblies:
382421

Here's a photo of a complete chest bed:
382422

And here's a tool-free assembly mechanism. In this case, it is clipping a footboard on to a platform. This is a trunk latch I bought from McMaster-Carr. It is hidden behind a drawer front, which you see at the bottom of the pic.
382424

[Phil Mueller]

Hi Michael, I won’t argue the point, but I sell these for a living. No high end foam manufacturer has ever indicated to me that a solid sheet is unadvisable. It is basically what every foundation is. A solid sheet of material, covered with fabric.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Jamie, very nice! Do the platform halves have flat bottoms, and just sit directly in contact with the floor?

I'm inclined to try your approach, as I think it solves many of the issues that I'm concerned about...

[Jim Becker]

That's a very elegant design, Jamie. Thanks for sharing it! Clearly, it can be adapted to a variety of different styles, too...that last photo with the curves is intriguing!

[Jamie Buxton]

Jamie, very nice! Do the platform halves have flat bottoms, and just sit directly in contact with the floor?

I'm inclined to try your approach, as I think it solves many of the issues that I'm concerned about...

What touches the floor is just the edges of plywood panels. I guess you could add bottoms if you want, but I don't see it as necessary.

[johnny means]

If you look at pretty much any commercial King sized bed frame setup, you'll likely see at least one center leg that gets to the floor. I'm sure it's possible to engineer the weight transfer out to the edges, but given the size of a King sized bed and the weight and, um...force...it needs to support over time, I'd personally not eschew a center support to the floor.
The reason for this is that most commercial king size set-ups consist of two box springs, leaving a seam in the melee. We've all seen how flimsy box springs are generally constructed, so the added support is necessary.

[mreza Salav]

Dan, I have made a few beds and used that hardware to attach rails to head/foot board. I think one weak point in yours is going to be at the connection of rails to head/foot board and the racking (think of head/foot board moving back and forth). I'd use two of those connectors instead of only one at each joint. When the kids hold on to the foot board and start moving it back and forth you'll notice it quite a bit.
Also, I'd add more legs in the middle.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Dan, I have made a few beds and used that hardware to attach rails to head/foot board. I think one weak point in yours is going to be at the connection of rails to head/foot board and the racking (think of head/foot board moving back and forth). I'd use two of those connectors instead of only one at each joint. When the kids hold on to the foot board and start moving it back and forth you'll notice it quite a bit.
Also, I'd add more legs in the middle.

Thanks for the feedback. Yes, I guess it would be easy and inexpensive to use 2 brackets at each corner. Given that they assemble with just a single screw, it's almost no additional assembly burden, either.

Have you generally put tennons (or Dominos or whatever) at the corners, as well, or just used the brackets, alone?

[mreza Salav]

I have only the brackets and I doubt Dominos will help with the racking. My rails are about 6" and don't have room to add another bracket; but they don't hold the weight of mattress. The mattress sits on a platform.

[Jim Becker]

The reason for this is that most commercial king size set-ups consist of two box springs, leaving a seam in the melee. We've all seen how flimsy box springs are generally constructed, so the added support is necessary.
Even if it's a platform without the two Twin-XL foundations, a center support is still pretty much needed because of the distance and nature of a King size bed and what it needs to support. But yes, the twin-XL foundations are necessary because unlike the mattress, they don't bend real well so getting them up stairs, etc., would be nearly impossible if there was one King-sized foundation.

[Ted Calver]

... a center support is still pretty much needed because of the distance and nature of a King size bed and what it needs to support....

Jim, looks like you don't think the T-slat idea linked @ #24 would do the job. I wish an engineer type would offer a comment on load bearing/deflection from such a technique. To me it looks like the equivalent of a 1"x3" standing on edge every 8"-12" or so would stand up to plenty of abuse.

[Jim Becker]

Ted, I didn't watch the video at the time, but just paged through the frames to see what gives. I suspect those slats do indeed add a lot of rigidity. I guess I'm somewhat conservative around this, however, and would likely still use a center support with a post for a King-sized bed just to be sure there would be no sagging in the future. I've had enough trouble with mattresses themselves not holding up (pardon the expression) for anything close to expected lifetime and the back-aches to reinforce my concern, so making sure the bed structure doesn't contribute to that further is something I'm keen on. That said, Charles' idea could even be taken further with even stronger tee-slats (wider vertical member) or even something like a small i-beam/joist type setup. I'd have to think about that.

[Ted Calver]

I hear you, Jim and I'm sorry for the thread drift. The real reason for trying to eliminate the center post is that the wife and I both suffer from GERD and have the head of the bed up on blocks about three inches to help out. The resultant wracking has not been kind to our present bed and the missus says the bed looks funny slanted like that. I'm trying to figure out a way to keep the bed frame horizontal/perpendicular while achieving the desired slant to the mattress. It would be easier without the center post.

[Jim Becker]

Ted, I do understand. You may be able to source a foam wedge that's long enough to give you the elevation you need at the head without raising the actual bed. And...it's going to be a lot less expensive than an adjustable bed... :)

We now return you to your regularly schedule thread on bed design. :D

[Brian Holcombe]

The trouble with the ladder type setup is not that it won't be a good bridge, it's that it wont resist deflecting by bending right or left. It's like putting weight on the edge of a piece of sheetmetal.

[Dan Rude]

You might want to rethink your design and use bed bolts. Another Forum linked this Charles Neal Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJC0Mz1B6aM He also, suggests using a I beam designed slats. He shows how to fix the nut in position, using Bondo. Dan