Bandsaw Blade Width

[Mitchell Ristine]

All, I have "new to me" Delta 28-275 (Older 3/4 horse, 14" saw). I would to start resawing on it. Can that machine accept a 3/4 inch blade (the manual seems to say yes)? If so, is there any advantage of a 3/4 over a 1/2?

Also, what is a good brand of blades?

Thanks and happy cutting.

Oh and just for fun, I was making A LOT of cutting boards for this last Christmas. When I finished the last I was all tuckered out and just left the shop. The other day when I got around to finally cleaning, I opened the cabinet to my saw and got the following wonderful surprise:
381924381925

Pretty neat, eh?

[Brian Nguyen]

I looked up the manual for your Delta saw and it does say that it can go up to 3/4": https://www.manualslib.com/manual/37636/Delta-28-275.html?page=12#manual

Btw I think you need to hook up your dust port to a dust collector :)

[Nick Decker]

I would recommend you have a look at a 1/2" Woodslicer blade from Highland Woodworking.

And, as Brian said, a dust collector. That's some very destructive artwork you posted.

[Mike Cary]

A 3/4 inch blade will "fit" so a lot of manuals say you can use one. What they don't say is that you cannot properly tension it. The best width for a 14 inch bandsaw is 3/8". I would never go wider than 1/2".

[Bryan Lisowski]

Although it says you can use a 3/4" blade, I believe it will be hard getting it properly tensioned. I have a 14" grizzly and use 1/2" blade for resawing. The Woodslicer is a good blade to start with.

[glenn bradley]

I’ve landed on a 1/2” for resawing even on my 17” saw.

[Brian Nguyen]

Although it says you can use a 3/4" blade, I believe it will be hard getting it properly tensioned. I have a 14" grizzly and use 1/2" blade for resawing. The Woodslicer is a good blade to start with.


Yep, I agreed. What you can do (according to the manual) versus what you should do to use the bandsaw optimally is usually different. I think for most 14" saw, the sweet spot for resaw blade is 1/2". I use Timberwolf blades on mine.

Also, it's a pain to wrestle the wider blades on and off bandsaws. Tossing a 3/4" blade onto the ground and running for my life as it "SPRRRROING" to life gets old, fast.

[John K Jordan]

All, I have "new to me" Delta 28-275 (Older 3/4 horse, 14" saw). I would to start resawing on it. Can that machine accept a 3/4 inch blade (the manual seems to say yes)? If so, is there any advantage of a 3/4 over a 1/2?


The saw will certainly accept a 3/4" blade. However, based on my own experience I wouldn't do it. The tension mechanism and perhaps even the frame in that saw is not up to tensioning it properly. Years ago I tried on my 14" Delta , even using an upgraded tension spring and a Starrett tension gauge to be sure I had it right. The result was a bent tension bracket. Some people have broken the bracket and otherwise stressed the saw. Others do run 3/4" blades but sometimes run into other problems related to insufficient tension. If you do it, I suggest you get a tension gauge or jig up a free one like this:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?250388-Bandsaw-blade-tension&p=2640833#post2640833
381931

I still have my 14" Delta but mostly use a much beefier 18" bandsaw. Even with that I don't like to run 3/4" blades although the manufacturer "rates" it for 1-3/8". I think the saw makers sometimes overstate the useful blade widths for marketing reasons.

My favorite blade for nearly everything including 12" thick green wood is a properly tensioned 1/2" 3tpi. If I want a finer cut I use a 1/2" blade with more teeth per inch. I often resaw 8-10" wide boards to make thin layers for woodturning glueups.

Some people do prefer a wider blade for resawing. I find a good fence tall and proper alignment do the job with a narrower blade. I once used my 14" saw to resaw a 12' long 2x12 douglas fir plank into four thin boards. I made a tall fence and went slow (with a properly tensioned blade). Some people love carbide blades for resawing but they are too expensive for me.

As for the dust build up inside the cabinet, my own sawdust landscape art went away when I connected good dust collection. My larger saw has a 4" port in the bottom cabinet towards the right and a second pickup just under the lower guides. I rarely have more than a tablespoon of dust in the cabinet.

JKJ

[Edwin Santos]

Hi,
IMO, the issue is not blade width, but blade body thickness. With a saw like yours I would stay with a blade that is .025 or thinner. The thinner bands require less demand on the saw to achieve a given tension. Generally speaking the narrower widths mean thinner bands, but there are exceptions. For example Timberwolf makes a thin body 3/4" blade they call AS-S which I would not hesitate to use on your machine. I think .032 bands would be a little too demanding on your particular saw.

For all practical purposes I see little reason to go beyond 1/2" width.
Edwin

[Edwin Santos]

Tossing a 3/4" blade onto the ground and running for my life as it "SPRRRROING" to life gets old, fast.

Learning how to safely coil and uncoil bandsaw blades in your hands with total control is not difficult. Once you know how, it's a life skill that you'll always know and you will never throw a bandsaw blade again. There are YouTube videos that demonstrate it very well.
Throwing a blade is not good for the user or the blade. Walking out to a grass lawn and back to do it is a total waste of time. I hope this suggestion doesn't offend you.
Edwin,

[Zachary Hoyt]

I used to use a 14" Rockwell and now have an 18" Jet. I always use 1/2" 3 TPI blades for resawing, and for almost everything else. I have resawn cherry 9" wide to make the back for an archtop guitar, and the 1/2" blade did it just fine. Most of my resawing is a bit smaller. I got a 3/4" blade for the saw but only used it a few times, it is thicker and takes a bigger kerf, cuts slower and is harder to tension. I am used to working with 1-1/4" wide band blades for our little sawmill, and even they are not hard to fold up and unfold once you get used to it, though they were scary at first. I wear gloves to work with the bigger blades, but the 1/2" blades are much easier to handle.
Zach

[Mitchell Ristine]

That's some very destructive artwork you posted.

Yep, sure is. I was embarrassed when I opened the cabinet.

[Brian Nguyen]

Learning how to safely coil and uncoil bandsaw blades in your hands with total control is not difficult. Once you know how, it's a life skill that you'll always know and you will never throw a bandsaw blade again. There are YouTube videos that demonstrate it very well.
Throwing a blade is not good for the user or the blade. Walking out to a grass lawn and back to do it is a total waste of time. I hope this suggestion doesn't offend you.
Edwin,


No worries, no offense taken :) Yes, I know the technique to coil and uncoil BS blades--I can do it with my 1/4" and 3/8" blades. But the bigger ones are just a nuisance that I've long decided that the energy and efforts were not close enough to the benefits, so I threw and ran and eventually just decided to get a second bandsaw and left a 1/2" blade permanently on there for good :)

[Lee Schierer]

Hi,
IMO, the issue is not blade width, but blade body thickness. With a saw like yours I would stay with a blade that is .025 or thinner. The thinner bands require less demand on the saw to achieve a given tension.

Edwin

I concur that you can use a 3/4" blade on your 14" saw if the band is thinner. I have a 3/4" blade I use for resawing that is 0.023" thick and it works very well on my 14" Delta BS for resawing. I like the 3/4" blade because it runs straighter than 1/2" blades.

[Edwin Santos]

No worries, no offense taken :) Yes, I know the technique to coil and uncoil BS blades--I can do it with my 1/4" and 3/8" blades. But the bigger ones are just a nuisance that I've long decided that the energy and efforts were not close enough to the benefits, so I threw and ran and eventually just decided to get a second bandsaw and left a 1/2" blade permanently on there for good :)

Well any solution that involves getting another bandsaw is a good solution in my book!

[Carlos Alvarez]

Woodslicer 1/2" blade. I will never use a different blade. I bought a 3/4 also and never use it, because the 1/2 behaves like a 3/4 or 1" as far as stability and cut abilities. I haven't used another blade since I bought these.

[John K Jordan]

Hi,
IMO, the issue is not blade width, but blade body thickness. ..

That's a good point. The tension is in psi, pounds per square inch, the cross sectional area of the blade, width x thickness. For that example for the two blades are 0.016 sq inches for a 1/2"x.032 blade; a 3/4"x.0250 would be about 0.019 sq inches for only 17% more force needed to tension. (if I punched the right number on the calculator)

The 3/4" blades I bought and tried on my 3/4" saw were not thin - I didn't even know that was an option at the time.

The Timberwolf blades (apparently called TPC now, formerly AS-S) do look good from the ad. Have you tried them?

JKJ

[Geoff Crimmins]

I have a 1950s Delta 14" bandsaw with a vintage 1hp motor. I use 3/8" 4 tpi and 3/16" 10 tpi blades on it, which seem to cover everything I need to do. You might get away with a 1/2" 3 tpi blade, but I wouldn't recommend anything wider than that. These saws can't properly tension wider blades. It also takes more energy to bend wider blades around the wheels, leaving less HP for cutting.

--Geoff

[Edwin Santos]

That's a good point. The tension is in psi, pounds per square inch, the cross sectional area of the blade, width x thickness. For that example for the two blades are 0.016 sq inches for a 1/2"x.032 blade; a 3/4"x.0250 would be about 0.019 sq inches for only 17% more force needed to tension. (if I punched the right number on the calculator)

The 3/4" blades I bought and tried on my 3/4" saw were not thin - I didn't even know that was an option at the time.

The Timberwolf blades (apparently called TPC now, formerly AS-S) do look good from the ad. Have you tried them?

JKJ

Hello John,
Yes, I've tried them but it was some time ago. I think I spoke with the owner of Timberwolf and he promoted it as a veneering blade. It's a good blade, I still have it, but further to the thinner band point, I've moved to the Lenox Tri-Master 1/2" 3tpi .025 body which is a phenomenal blade. I also use a variety of carbon steel blades, but always stay with .025 thickness. There's a school of thought that wider blade = more beam strength therefore better. I've been happy enough with the results of 1/2" and 3/8" blades, I'm not sure why I need more beam strength for my particular situation. I tend to think at a certain point, in order to get the additional benefit from a wider blade, you need to also have a more powerful saw like some of the users here who have big 5hp and larger bandsaws that were designed to be able to handle light industrial resawing.

I feel the same way about the tension argument that more is better. I think it is better in certain situations and not better in others. Anyway I went off topic with one man's opinions.

FYI, Iturra's catalog shows some thin body/thin kerf carbon steel blades from Starrett that might be worth a look. I'm not sure on the sizes but maybe they offer a thinner body 3/4" blade.

Edwin

[John K Jordan]

...I've moved to the Lenox Tri-Master 1/2" 3tpi .025 body which is a phenomenal blade.

Yikes, when I checked some sellers the bland for mine would be close to or over $200! I've never bought a carbide-tipped bandsaw blade. Do you have a favorite blade supplier?

[Edwin Santos]

Yikes, when I checked some sellers the bland for mine would be close to or over $200! I've never bought a carbide-tipped bandsaw blade. Do you have a favorite blade supplier?

John,
I purchased mine from Louis Iturra (Iturra Designs) in FLA. Listen, the Tri-Master is a luxury item, and I hesitate to tell anyone they absolutely have to have it. The argument in favor is the fine finish and the long life, especially if you find yourself cutting abrasive exotics. My last one gave me over 10 years. An intermediate step that would get you partway toward the features of a carbide band at a much lower price would be the bi-metal Lenox Diemaster 2 which does come in a 1/2" 4tpi .025 body. I think it would probably run you $40 or so. But listen, I'm a big fan of good old carbon steel blades, either Lenox or Starrett Flexback. The most important thing to me is the quality of welds from the distributor. I've had terrible luck with local sources so I pay the shipping and buy them from Iturra because he seems to take care with the welds.
Edwin

[John K Jordan]

John,
I purchased mine from Louis Iturra (Iturra Designs) in FLA. Listen, the Tri-Master is a luxury item, and I hesitate to tell anyone they absolutely have to have it. The argument in favor is the fine finish and the long life, especially if you find yourself cutting abrasive exotics. My last one gave me over 10 years. An intermediate step that would get you partway toward the features of a carbide band at a much lower price would be the bi-metal Lenox Diemaster 2 which does come in a 1/2" 4tpi .025 body. I think it would probably run you $40 or so. But listen, I'm a big fan of good old carbon steel blades, either Lenox or Starrett Flexback. The most important thing to me is the quality of welds from the distributor. I've had terrible luck with local sources so I pay the shipping and buy them from Iturra because he seems to take care with the welds.
Edwin

Excellent! I might check with Louis - I've bought a lot from him over the years and I've been wanting to try a carbide blade. (I bought my Starrett bandsaw tension gauge from him.) I'm fortunate to have a local industrial gas and welding supply shop in Knoxville (Holston Gas) that also makes bandsaw blades and at a good price, sometimes while you wait. They use Lenox stock and I have never had a problem with the welds.

Mitchel, do you have a bandsaw blade supplier near you? If so, that might be a good way to try a few different blades to see what works best on your saw.

JKJ

[Nick Decker]

Just to clarify, I think both Edwin and JKJ are running saws larger than 14"??

I ask because the OP is running a 14" Delta, which I think would have trouble tensioning a carbide blade. I've tried both Diemaster and Trimaster 1/2" blades in my 14" Rikon (which I believe is a stiffer/stronger saw than the Delta), and it was little more than an expensive experiment.

[John K Jordan]

Just to clarify, I think both Edwin and JKJ are running saws larger than 14"??
I ask because the OP is running a 14" Delta, which I think would have trouble tensioning a carbide blade. I've tried both Diemaster and Trimaster 1/2" blades in my 14" Rikon (which I believe is a stiffer/stronger saw than the Delta), and it was little more than an expensive experiment.

That's a good point to clarify. I have a 14" Delta with a riser block for which I would never buy a carbide blade. The saw I use the most is an 18" Rikon, nothing like the "big iron" of course, but much beefier than the delta. (If the 14" Rikon is made along the lines of the 18" it's probably a pretty good saw. From the ads it looks like most of today's saws are using a similar frame design.)

Just curious, do carbide blades inherently require a higher tension than carbon steel or bimetallic blades of the same size?

If so, I might not even want one for the 18" saw. What I don't usually see discussed is how much force is actually needed to properly tension even a 1/2" blade, according to the gauge. Even the large tensioning wheel is hard to crank for this old guy! The 18" Rikon has a lever for quick detensioning and I'm not sure I could re-tension a larger blade easily. For larger blades that need even more force I worry about the other stresses on the saw such as the bearings and the tires, although the frame seems plenty stout. From what I've read on this forum and others over the years plus looking at other's bandsaws and even from checking my own wood and metal cutting bandsaws, I suspect a lot of people are running their saws with a much lower tension than recommended. Fine if it works but something to consider if there are any problems. Most of the problems I had with my own bandsaws (tracking, bowing, bogging down a smaller motor) went away with better tensioning (and alignment).

[lowell holmes]

I use 1/2" blades on my 14" Jet bandsaw.

[Nick Decker]

"Just curious, do carbide blades inherently require a higher tension than carbon steel or bimetallic blades of the same size?"

John, from what I've learned here and from my own experience, yes. I know that I read a lot more comments from people that love carbide blades on > 17" saws than I do from people with 14" saws, so they might work for you.

I truly enjoy my 14" Rikon, no complaints whatsoever, but I don't have a reliable way to tell you what amount of tension I put on the Trimaster blade. I do know that it was considerably more than what I use on my Woodslicer (KerfMaster, same-same) 1/2" blade. There was more tension, in both the saw and me, than I was comfortable with. The tension also resulted in more difficulty in adjusting the tracking, which only put me more on edge.

Bottom line, for me, was that the carbide didn't give me a cleaner cut and it was noisier and less smooth running. I still have the (like new) 111" blade, if anyone is interested I'd sell it for a reasonable price. With shipping, I paid around $150. Like I said, an expensive experiment.

[Edwin Santos]

Just to clarify, I think both Edwin and JKJ are running saws larger than 14"??

I ask because the OP is running a 14" Delta, which I think would have trouble tensioning a carbide blade. I've tried both Diemaster and Trimaster 1/2" blades in my 14" Rikon (which I believe is a stiffer/stronger saw than the Delta), and it was little more than an expensive experiment.


That's a good point to clarify.

Just curious, do carbide blades inherently require a higher tension than carbon steel or bimetallic blades of the same size?



That's a good point Nick. I think we might have drifted off topic a little and I don't own a 14" Delta so I can't speak from experience with that particular venerable saw. Mine is an Italian 16" saw called Meber. But I do feel Louis Iturra has a lot of expertise with the Delta 14" class if for no other reason than the sheer amount of information in his catalog surrounding the 14" Delta/Jet/Powermatic class of bandsaws, so he may be a good resource for the OP. Also, the sticky thread at the top of this sub-forum here on SMC is full of good information about bandsaw blades.

Regarding the tension needs of a carbide or bimetal blade versus carbon steel, we're on to a controversial subject. According to Lenox, yes, the Tri-Master requires a high tension level, I think 20,000 or 25,000 psi which I know exceeds the tensioning capability of a Delta 14" type saw. Some people go in for the high tension aftermarket springs that Iturra sells in search of more tension capability but there are those who believe such springs put more tension on the saw frame than it was designed to handle, and I'm one of them. Others buy large heavy duty brute bandsaws in search of greater tension (and HP) under the doctrine that more tension is better.

It's not for me to say anyone is wrong, but personally I'm in the camp of using lower tension than others but making very sure my bandsaw is tuned well in terms of cutting parallel to the miter slot/fence, guides adjusted properly, and I get drift free results that are acceptable for the work I do. I've experienced the same thing as Nick where if my tension gets way high, it interferes with tracking action which leads me to believe I'm doing something counter-productive. So in answer to your question, I use the carbide Tri-Master but I do not tension as high as the mfg recommends, in fact I tension it the same as any other blade except I might kick it up a little if I were doing a taller resaw operation. So based on my practices, I would not rule out using one on the Delta 14" so long as it was the .025 body but others would never consider doing the same and the type of work you do would have to necessitate the expense IMO.
There's a lot of mystique around bandsaws.
Edwin

[Nick Decker]

We're in agreement, Edwin. Like I said, I don't have a tension gauge (and the gauge on the saw is basically nonsense). What works for me is just adjusting out the flutter, then another quarter turn or so for good measure. When I did that with the carbide blade I was way beyond what I'm used to, but no way I'm gonna cut anything with the blade fluttering.

John's point about it being physically difficult for an "old man" to crank down that tension knob rings true for me. I even went so far as making a wooden "cheater" knob to help get a grip on it, until I found that that's really not a good idea. :)

[John K Jordan]

[B]"[COLOR=#333333]... but I don't have a reliable way to tell you what amount of tension I put on the Trimaster blade. ...

Did you notice the post on using a digital caliper to accurately measure tension on a blade? (described by John TenEyck)

https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?263290-Bandsaw-Blade-Width&p=2792344#post2792344
and the original:
https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?250388-Bandsaw-blade-tension&p=2640833#post2640833

This method is free if you have a caliper, some clamps, and a calculator. All the tension gauges do is measure the stretch of the steel.

JKJ

[Nick Decker]

Yup, I've seen the references to the caliper method before. After getting comfortable with using the flutter method, I just never felt the need to try it. I think that's part of the "mystery voodoo" part of the bandsaw - there was a point at which things just started to feel and sound right.