Anybody tried out the new Arkansas water stones?

[John C Cox]

Hey guys,

I saw these new Arkansas water stones by RH Preyda in Woodcraft today. Anybody tried them out? Opinions? Where do they shake out vs the Japanese stone spectrum? Slow/fast, hard/soft?

[Patrick Chase]

I saw these new Arkansas water stones by RH Preyda in Woodcraft today. Anybody tried them out? Opinions? Where do they shake out vs the Japanese stone spectrum? Slow/fast, hard/soft?

All of the products on their site are natural Arkansas stones, so all of them consist of Silica abrasives. Silica is softer then basically every carbide other than Ferrite (Iron Carbide) so you would probably want to stick to low-alloy steels if you go that route.

[John C Cox]

For whatever reason - I couldn't find these on their site... These are clearly man made - they are colored specific colors for the different grits.. Apparently it's some sort of sized and graded novaculite which is then held together with some sort of binder and/or sintering...

[David Bassett]

... water stones by RH Preyda in Woodcraft ....

I guess I'm curious too, but my first thought when I saw those in the flyer was "Why?". It's not like they're (significantly) cheaper than the water stones that are well known & understood standards.

[David Bassett]

All of the products on their site are natural Arkansas stones, so all of them consist of Silica abrasives. Silica is softer then basically every carbide other than Ferrite (Iron Carbide) so you would probably want to stick to low-alloy steels if you go that route.

The Woodcraft site's description says these are synthesized from Novaculite recovered from waste of processing traditional Arkansas stones. IIRC- David Weaver, on a different site, is quite the proponent of the quality Novaculite stones. Something about giving a better finish due to smoother less angular scratches.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

First of all, this thread is like waving a bottle of single barrel estate rum in front of a recovering alcoholic. Darn you! I had stopped buying stones. Now my curiosity is up. I took the chance to google them and found this very long video. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yp-nYqjltfg
They sure don't appear to be taking off much metal, and that 3k sure did look soft. I like a muddy slurry, but not when it isn't taking any metal off. Also, go to 15:19 in the video and he says there is something in the stone he is hitting. ??? I asked him to clarify what that was. Awaiting reply.

Looks like they range from just under $50 to just over $70. Let me sleep on it, but I might try one for the team.

RH Preyda sells a translucent stone that sure looks pretty in pictures but I have never tried it. As for these new stones- it's smart marketing: take the offcuts and the slurry from cutting, grind and filter it, and make expensive stones out of it. Seems their marketing department is a little creative- check out this statement from their website about their translucent Arkansas stone- "Prized by craftsmen worldwide, RH Preyda Bench Stone is the only known substance that can sharpen a blade and polish it as well"

[John C Cox]

David,

That guy is sharpening D2 on an Arkansas stone....
He posted a follow up where he used a different (lighter) technique and it did a lot better....

But I am not real sure that Arkansas is the right stone for D2... There is almost no stone that is "right" for connventional D2....

I have a feeling that he is having a problem pulling the carbides out of the matrix rather than sharpening them... I think you posted similar things about A2 on true Washita stones..

[Patrick Chase]

That guy is sharpening D2 on an Arkansas stone....
He posted a follow up where he used a different (lighter) technique and it did a lot better....


Assuming you're referring to David Weaver, he's pretty consistent in his advocacy of plain high-carbon steels, so his choices of steel and honing media are compatible in that sense. He's well aware of the "carbide pull-out" issue (I've discussed it with him many times).

[John C Cox]

Somehow I thought David posted that - but I see it was Malcom...

Same feedback - the guy in the video is sharpening an Ontario Knife D2 blade... I am not surprised he didn't get a good sharp edge off that stone when "honing"..... He changed technique in the 2nd video from honing to "playing with the burr" - and seemed to get a better edge on paper... My guess is that this edge would not hold up particularly well in the field (you know.. Real life hard use like toe picking, opening cardboard boxes, peeling apples, and scraping glue off other knives. ;) ;) )

[Malcolm Schweizer]

Somehow I thought David posted that - but I see it was Malcom...

Same feedback - the guy in the video is sharpening an Ontario Knife D2 blade... I am not surprised he didn't get a good sharp edge off that stone when "honing"..... He changed technique in the 2nd video from honing to "playing with the burr" - and seemed to get a better edge on paper... My guess is that this edge would not hold up particularly well in the field (you know.. Real life hard use like toe picking, opening cardboard boxes, peeling apples, and scraping glue off other knives. ;) ;) )

I held my tongue on his technique because I didn't want to go off topic. I'm only going to say that my knife sharpening technique is a little different. By the way, he did respond and said the 3k was cutting fast, and that the contamination in the stone was probably something from his hand that got stuck on the stone. I'm still thinking about trying one out, but while searching for these stones I found their Translucent stones can be ordered in large sizes like 3" x 12", which would be awesome for sharpening machetes. Thanks, OP for making me a "stoner" again. I had kicked the habbit. Now I'm back to looking for stones, even though I already have enough to build a full-scale model of the Great Wall of China. :-)

[Patrick Chase]

But I am not real sure that Arkansas is the right stone for D2... There is almost no stone that is "right" for connventional D2....



Same feedback - the guy in the video is sharpening an Ontario Knife D2 blade... I am not surprised he didn't get a good sharp edge off that stone when "honing"..... He changed technique in the 2nd video from honing to "playing with the burr" - and seemed to get a better edge on paper... My guess is that this edge would not hold up particularly well in the field (you know.. Real life hard use like toe picking, opening cardboard boxes, peeling apples, and scraping glue off other knives. ;) ;) )

D2 isn't *that* bad. The principal carbide-forming alloyant is Chromium, with only ~1% V. It has very coarse grain structure in non-PM variants, but those huge carbides are softer than alumina.

Soft waterstones (ones that shed grit fast enough to keep up with the rate at which the steel wears out the abrasive) have no real problem with D2.

[John C Cox]

A translucent Arkansas on a machete! You are a better man than I. I usually stop with the medium cut file on mine. ;)

[Malcolm Schweizer]

A translucent Arkansas on a machete! You are a better man than I. I usually stop with the medium cut file on mine. ;)

Gotta get em this sharp:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B1Q8B03Lmus

Edit: He uses a few “sentence enhancers” in this video.

[John C Cox]

That's one sharp machete! Granted they are a whole lot easier to cut green than brown... Still - My machete won't do that...

[Malcolm Schweizer]

That's one sharp machete! Granted they are a whole lot easier to cut green than brown... Still - My machete won't do that...

I hate to admit it, but neither will mine. They are VERY hard to cut when green. That is like slicing a 2x4 in half in one wack. A brown one like you buy in the states is the inner portion without the outer shell- like comparing cutting a pecan in the husk and just the brown shell part. This video started a challenge for me. So far I can get about half way through. The machete he is using is much thinner than mine, which may help.

[Patrick Chase]

Gotta get em this sharp:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B1Q8B03Lmus

Did you mean to post that to the "personal protective equipment" thread instead? :-)

[Malcolm Schweizer]

I just want to thank John for making me a stoner again. Thanks to this post, I started longing for an Arkansas stone. I ended up getting a Dan’s Black 12x3” on feeBay. I will be sending John Cox my lawyer’s bill for the divorce that is sure to happen soon after wifey finds out. ;-)

[Patrick Chase]

I just want to thank John for making me a stoner again. Thanks to this post, I started longing for an Arkansas stone. I ended up getting a Dan’s Black 12x3” on feeBay. I will be sending John Cox my lawyer’s bill for the divorce that is sure to happen soon after wifey finds out. ;-)

If you're still married after that Cho10k then this should be no problem whatsoever.

[Malcolm Schweizer]

If you're still married after that Cho10k then this should be no problem whatsoever.

Haha! It was supposed to be "the last one." I am anxious to try the two side by side. For me it's just fun experimenting and trying new things, but the main reason for this stone is for my machete, and for machetes that people pay me to sharpen. They are hard on water stones. I was also sold on the 12" length.

[Ryan Mooney]

FYI - it turns out RH Preyda appears to be the inheritor of Halls ProEdge. Unsure on the details but it looks like it was maybe a buy out, if anyone can ferret out the actual details that would be interesting. Some of the marketing overlaps "The Arkansas stone is the only stone on the market that actually polishes as it sharpens" for instance carried over in various forms.

[John C Cox]

You owe it to yourself my friend after all you went through in the storms there on the USVI... I will not begrudge you a sharpening stone after going 6 months without power.... ;)

[Warren West]

FYI - it turns out RH Preyda appears to be the inheritor of Halls ProEdge Indeed. The RH in RH Preyda is an acknowledgement to Richard Hall who Preyda purchased the operation from.

Arkansas stones are great, but I don't see them being great when ground up into a powder and made into a waterstone. As such it's an inferior abrasive compared to the garnet in coticule or the ao in "normal" synthetic waterstones.

The thing that makes Arkansas stones great is how the natural ones are constructed that gives them the decent cut, low wear and nice finish. I think making a powder out of them takes away at least tow of those three things.

Team one of these up with a vulcan stone and you've got a losing pair.

[Patrick Chase]

Haha! It was supposed to be "the last one." I am anxious to try the two side by side. For me it's just fun experimenting and trying new things, but the main reason for this stone is for my machete, and for machetes that people pay me to sharpen. They are hard on water stones. I was also sold on the 12" length.

Well, that is sort of the fatal flaw with the Cho10K and its ilk - they're far too expensive to waste on mere sharpening.

If you need to convince your spouse that it could be worse then just conspicuously leave your browser open to some high-end purveyor of JNats. Or maybe to fast cars or Tinder.

[John C Cox]

Yeah - you need a cheap hobby like golf or boats... ;)