Lie Nielsen vs. Veritas Shoulder Plane?

[Steve Mathews]

I just purchased a number of Lie Nielsen hand tools and for the most part the quality is satisfactory. However, the #42 Medium Shoulder Plane is a bit disappointing. There are a number of sharp machined edges and points. They of course can be filed down but for a premium tool that shouldn't be necessary. Any quality machined parts should not have sharp edges unless that was the intention. Is the Veritas Shoulder Plane more refined in this respect?

[Mike Henderson]

I much prefer the LV shoulder plane. I have the LV medium and had a Record, which is the same design as the LN shoulder plane. The LV fits my hand MUCH better.

Mike

[glenn bradley]

It's a "feel" thing. The LN feels like a hand full of unrelated hardware to me but, the LV falls right into my hand. Others have reported the opposite.

380562 . 380561

[Chet R Parks]

Steve, Mike is 100% correct. I have both of the LV and LN medium and small shoulder planes. LV puts a lot more thought into their products and the LV shoulder plane is much more comfortable to use.
Chet

[Steve Mathews]

Looks like all thumbs up on the LV medium shoulder plane. Any thoughts on their PM-V11 blade? Are there other LV hand tools that similarly perform better? I was planning to purchase mostly LN tools but after the shoulder plane disappointment it might be wise to spend more time considering other options.

[Tony Wilkins]

Looks like all thumbs up on the LV medium shoulder plane. Any thoughts on their PM-V11 blade? Are there other LV hand tools that similarly perform better? I was planning to purchase mostly LN tools but after the shoulder plane disappointment it might be wise to spend more time considering other options.

I think PMV11 is always a good choice. As far as LV vs LN, I’ve gone with LN for bench planes and LV for joinery planes for the most part. The design philosophy of each company is different. LN seeks to improve old tool designs (mostly Stanley) whereas as LV seeks to innovate from a wide variety of old tool designs and emphasize a modern understanding of ergonomics.

[Mike Henderson]

Looks like all thumbs up on the LV medium shoulder plane. Any thoughts on their PM-V11 blade? Are there other LV hand tools that similarly perform better? I was planning to purchase mostly LN tools but after the shoulder plane disappointment it might be wise to spend more time considering other options.

The PM-V11 blade is very good and recommended. Sharpens easily and stays sharp longer than plain carbon steel or A2 steel.

Mike

[Jim Koepke]

Looks like all thumbs up on the LV medium shoulder plane. Any thoughts on their PM-V11 blade? Are there other LV hand tools that similarly perform better? I was planning to purchase mostly LN tools but after the shoulder plane disappointment it might be wise to spend more time considering other options.

One of my common refrains is for people to get a tool in their hands if at all possible. What one person sees as an over sharp edge another may see as being that way to better register in a corner.

Another consideration between the LV and LN approaches to making tools is LN pretty much sticks to designs of yesteryear. LV innovates with new styles and mechanical features. The do learn from previous designs, but will change or add to a design as a new product goes through the manufacturing process.

Of course wouldn't you know we finally got our taxes finished which let me spend a little money this weekend. Most of it was spent on LV's website. One of the spokeshaves was ordered with the PM-V11 blade.

jtk

[Steve Mathews]

... What one person sees as an over sharp edge another may see as being that way to better register in a corner.
...

jtk
My earlier comment was based on common machine shop practices. Edges sharp enough to cut flesh, as they were on my new LN shoulder plane, should never be considered quality finished work or best practice. Moving on, I look forward to getting a LV shoulder plane in my hands.

[Rob Luter]

I have the LV medium. It’s been a fine tool and fits my hand very well. Fit and finish are exceptional.

[Todd Stock]

Owned the mediums from both LV and LN; kept the LN and a student went home with the LV. Tough to improve on things that have seen a few centuries of design optimization and settled into an apex configuration, but I do agree that someone should take a whack at it from time to time. That said, most of the work of limbing the two 40' white pines that came down last Friday in the nor'easter got done with axes, despite a couple Stihls in the garage, so I may be a little bit of a Luddite when it comes to that sort of thing (or an axe is just faster for the job ;-) ).

[Tony Zaffuto]

OK, I have a small Preston (9/16"), a medium LV and a large LN. I use the large LN more than the other two, and far more than I ever thought I would. I also find I like it better, pulling towards me, rather than pushing. Just my opinion.

[Robert Engel]

Yeah to those considering, IMO Veritas has it over LN with respect to design and ease of use.

Couple things I really like about Veritas: the side adjusting set screws, and the ergonomics are far better in my hands.

I think its more the Stanley design, not LN. IMO LN needs to tweek the design.

[Ted Phillips]

I guess I'm a contrarian here. I've used both planes and greatly prefer the Lie Nielsen shoulder plane. Everybody is right, it is a personal choice - it comes down to how the tool feels in your hand. I guess I just like the more traditional styling of the LN model. Both tools are extremely high quality.

TedP

[Don Dorn]

I have the small LV and Large LN. Really don't use either very much, but as has been said, the LV fits the hand for forward motion. I have found the LN also works well, but I pull it as opposed to pushing it. For me, fits much better that way and works very well.

[Steven Mikes]

Haven't tried any other, but I love my LV shoulder plane. The finger hole and brass knob on top make getting a good grip and stable operation very easy from any angle. I got the O2 blade, gets razor sharp and haven't found it to dully very quickly.

[Prashun Patel]

That finger hole is great; just don't stick your finger in too far, or you'll guillotine yourself if the cheek is tall enough. DAMHIKT...

[Hasin Haroon]

I have the Veritas large and medium and they are both quite excellent. The set screws make installing and adjusting the blade a lot easier too. Don't have the Lie Nielsen so I can't speak to it's user friendliness, but I do have other Lie Nielsen tools and they are all great. Sounds like your plane slipped through the QC cracks, as they usually finish their tools to a high standard.

[Patrick Chase]

I think its more the Stanley design, not LN. IMO LN needs to tweek the design.

I also prefer the Veritas shoulder planes, but at the same time those classic Stanley designs were very highly evolved to in response to the needs of a clientele that still contained a fair number of hand-tool-using professionals.

In general when I find myself disliking one of Stanley's classic products I try to ask if perhaps I'm missing something in my own technique.

[Todd Stock]

Are you saying that the LN shoulder planes are based on Stanley designs?

[Jim Koepke]

Are you saying that the LN shoulder planes are based on Stanley designs?

My recollection is they are based on Preston model shoulder planes.

jtk

[Derek Cohen]

My recollection is they are based on Preston model shoulder planes.

jtk

To be more precise, they are based on the Record version, which comes from the Preston design.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Todd Stock]

That is my recollection. While the Stanley bullnose and shoulder planes are common tools often found in Maine boatbuilder's tool kits, they were not the inspiration for any of the LN shoulder planes as suggested earlier in the thread. The large LN is a nicer version of the Record 073, which I owned for a few decades, with the small and medium shoulder planes modeled on what would appear to me to be the 041 and 042. Obviously, all have Preston DNA, just as the Clifton shoulders do. Both the LN and LV planes have the heft that settles a shoulder plane for use, as opposed to the Stanley tools, which are a bit easier to use overhead, but never have felt very purposeful for bench work.

[Larry Frank]

I have the Veritas Medium Shoulder Plane. I like the feel I my hand and the brass knob that fits in between your thumb and first finger. It makes it much more ergonomic. I have arthritis in my hands and this tool makes it easier for me.

[Sanjeev Agarwal]

I have not used the LV shoulder planes but have the LN medium and large shoulder planes. The large has much nicer balance and heft and is much more easier to hold and use. The medium is a bit tippy. It could just be the width which makes such a difference between the two planes with identical design.