Am I a woodworker?

[Mike Cary]

And now introducing, me...(Pause for applause)

Hello, long time listener, first time caller, big fan. I'm new, I of course became a contributor. I believe that things of value are not free, they require a commitment of money, hard work, or creativity, or any combination.

I am a hobbiest who has been at it for about 15 years, not including a small stint in high school shop. After finishing my last project, a murphy bed for our computer and sewing room, I came to the second most disturbing realization of my life, I don't like this. (The first being, the Beatles really weren't that good). Sure, my wife standing before my magnificent creation and demanding that I accept my reward is always nice. But slapping together some heavy sheet goods with dominos and pocket screws and spraying it down with waterlox has about the same appeal as putting together some Ikea furniture and about as hard on the back.

So I'm re-examining everything. In the past 15 years, this is what I learned. There are different levels of this thing. We have people who build stuff with wood. Their favorite material is construction lumber and just can't figure out why someone would cover such beautiful wood with paint when they stripped an old cabinet they found that was made of CDX. These guys stand back and show off their work to their wives and say "So babe, what ya think? Nice huh, what else should I build" She of course says "very nice" but later that night when getting their reward, it just doesn't seem like she's really into it. These guys are called "husbands" and if they keep it up they can progress to 4s hardwoods from the Borg and reach the level of "Handyman". Their motto, "square and level is over rated".

Then their are the woodworkers. These guys have the "tools" and can work with a combination if sheet goods and wood. They can do almost any method of joinery, as long as there is a power tool and jig that can make them. They get the best rewards. No fake rewards in this category. But there is a slight learning curve and as such, these guys fit into categories for newbie (or as I say, tool collector) to expert. These guys can follow a plan to the letter and punch out some sweet stuff. You know you've reached that top level when you can hide any mistake.

Then there are the craftsman. These guys can communicate with wood. It lives and breathes. They are a master of their tools. Not everything they own plugs in. Some go completely acoustic. There is not many rewards from the significant others in this group. Pieces sometimes takes hundreds of hours. Face it guys, she is just not going to stay excited that long.

I decided that now that I'm over 50 I was willing to sacrifice the reward to bring the fun back into my hobby. I want to progress from proficient woodworker to apprentice craftsman. I enjoy working with wood, but not so much building stuff. I am now a hybrid woodworker, depending much more on hand tools. And here's what I learned. I did it backwards. I should have started with hand tools and worked toward power. With hand tools you learn proper layout, you learn wood (reading grain, movement, hardness), you learn joinery strength, you bring the tool to the wood, you learn the importance of keeping things square. All these things translate into better machining. Machines can often do things for you keeping you quite ignorant of the process. If I could give advice to anyone wanting to get into woodworking, I would say, do some simple projects with handtools first. Take a class, read a good book, and build some bookends.

Anyway, woodworking is fun again. I hope I can contribute to this forum in a constructive manner in the future. I am currently working on a 6 legged hunt board using only a bandsaw, thickness planer and hand tools. So far so good, I'll post it in the project forum when I get it done. I'm pretty sure I will still get a reward when its done, even though it might take a while. Fingers crossed.

Mike

[Jim Becker]

There are many ways to do things and selecting the method and the material that best matches the need is always a good practice. Every project should also be a learning experience...even for someone who's been crafting things for decades!

[Pat Barry]

Could you go into a bit more detail regarding the 'reward' aspect of the project life-cycle please?

[Brian Holcombe]

Fun often depends on perspective. I’m a professional and have worked with a majority of hand tools for years now (years prior to becoming a professional). I’m used to devoting considerable time to stock prep since I work with rough sawn material. The biggest bit of fun I’ve had recently is making ‘perfect’ stock, slabs that stick together.
It literally brought a tear to my eye working with such a machine.
I do plenty of my work, still with a majority of handtools but recognize that craftsmanship is not limited to handmade. In fact the industry definition of hand made is much closer to ‘hand fed’.

[Mike Cary]

Could you go into a bit more detail regarding the 'reward' aspect of the project life-cycle please?

I’m sorry Pat, I just assumed we all did this to get girls? I chose woodworking over famous rock star for this very reason.

[Mike Cary]

Brian, I consider a craftsman to be someone who can make the wood bend to their will, no matter what they use to do it.

Also, A professional works with a different perspective. While it would be great if we all loved what we do, in real life, the over riding goal is to buy those groceries. But hobbies are what you do to escape work, if it’s not fun you seriously need a new one.

[lowell holmes]

I got a girl about 42 years ago. She was nagging me this morning. I didn't mind though.:)

[Brian Holcombe]

Brian, I consider a craftsman to be someone who can make the wood bend to their will, no matter what they use to do it.

Also, A professional works with a different perspective. While it would be great if we all loved what we do, in real life, the over riding goal is to buy those groceries. But hobbies are what you do to escape work, if it’s not fun you seriously need a new one.

Certainly, and not to say I don't enjoy every second of hand tool use, I do, but both are enjoyable and fit different types of enjoyment. Some dread tool setup, but I worked in a machine shop as a kid so I generally very much enjoy tool setup.

Truly, craftsmanship in my eyes is the continuous search for improvement. It's a bit like chasing the horizon as you progress in woodworking you find that even less satisfies that goal while making progress toward it.

[Edwin Santos]

I think you should give the Beatles another chance.

I generally agree with your categories, and applaud you for trying to get to higher ground. I'm right there behind you. Part of my journey has been to focus on becoming more technique focused and less tool focused. Best regards,
Edwin

[Simon MacGowen]

Part of my journey has been to focus on becoming more technique focused and less tool focused. Best regards,
Edwin

When it comes to hand tools, I could think of no better woodworker than Paul Sellers who is encouraging people to focus on techniques rather than tools. He really walks the talk and finishes many of his projects with his basic set of tools. Compare him to many others who would not miss a chance to convince you that you need the latest tools or gadgets to get good results.

It is easy to find out who is tools focused and who is techniques focused: just look at what one does when Christmas is around the corner. Does he tell you what to buy, or does he show you what to make for the festive season?

Simon

[Mark Hennebury]

Brian, I consider a craftsman to be someone who can make the wood bend to their will, no matter what they use to do it.

Also, A professional works with a different perspective. While it would be great if we all loved what we do, in real life, the over riding goal is to buy those groceries. But hobbies are what you do to escape work, if it’s not fun you seriously need a new one.

Grasshopper;

Before you can go forward, you must move back.
First you need to unlearn.

You need to understand the pillars upon which the craft is built;

Materials - Tools - People.

The first two are easy to understand and you can learn them in a few days.

Wood is simple, it has basic cell structure, and various mechanical properties and it is hygroscopic.
Tools are all variations of a chisel approaching the wood cells from various angles.
People: there is the problem.



If you wish to understand wood, take various pieces and spend a day observing, and getting to know the material, describe it in intimate detail, the way it looks, the weight, the smell the color, the feel, the way the light reflects off it, the cell structure. Weigh it, measure it soak it water, dry it out, observe, measure and analyze. Cut it, bend it, break it, split it, saw it, crush it, twist it, To understand the relationship with tools,Cut it in as many different directions as you can, observe and analyze. Once you understand wood structure you will understand joinery.


listen to it and it will educate you.


People are complicated, their brains create reality from a complex mixture of sensory input and historical reference, biases, emotions and expectations, and are not to be trusted.

One must go back to the beginning, to the root, and learn to see, to really see, like a baby that experiences something for the first time, without all of the accumulated baggage of adulthood.

First you need to remove that idea that a craftsman bends wood to his will.

Craftsmanship is about knowledge, understanding and harmony not domination.

If you really wish to progress, you will take a long hard look at you, who you are, what you want and why you want it.

[Frederick Skelly]

Grasshopper;

Before you can forward, you must move back.
First you need to unlearn.

You need to understand the pillars upon which the craft is built;

Materials - Tools - People.

The first two are easy to understand and you can learn them in a few days.

Wood is simple, it has basic cell structure, and various mechanical properties and it is hygroscopic.
Tools are all variations of a chisel approaching the wood cells from various angles.
People: there is the problem.



If you wish to understand wood, take various pieces and spend a day observing, and getting to know the material, describe it in intimate detail, the way it looks, the weight, the smell the color, the feel, the way the light reflects off it, the cell structure. Weigh it, measure it soak it water, dry it out, observe, measure and analyze. Cut it, bend it, break it, split it, saw it, crush it, twist it, To understand the relationship with tools,Cut it in as many different directions as you can, observe and analyze. Once you understand wood structure you will understand joinery.


listen to it and it will educate you.


People are complicated, there brains create reality from a complex mixture of sensory input and historical reference, biases, emotions and expectations, and are not to be trusted.

One must go back to the beginning, to the root, and learn to see, to really see, like a baby that experiences something for the first time, without all of the accumulated baggage of adulthood.

First you need to remove that idea that a craftsman bends wood to his will.

Craftsmanship is about knowledge, understanding and harmony not domination.

If you really wish to progress, you will take a long hard look at you, who you are, what you want and why you want it.

Huh? .........

[Nick Decker]

I'm trying to figure out if that was sarcasm. I hope so.

[Frederick Skelly]

I'm trying to figure out if that was sarcasm. I hope so.

Yup. Sarcasm. Couldn't resist. :D :D :D

[Nick Decker]

Not you, Fred. I was referring to the post previous to yours. :)

[Corey Pelton]

Glad to hear you are getting back into the fun side of things. So far, this has never felt like work, even when I build something at a friends request. It's 100% a hobby for me. I've only been at it a couple years now, but I love it to death. It's a great escape from my day to day (I make animated films, which I love as well). Woodworking can be very technical, but it also has a very artistic side to it. I think that's what draws me in the most. Even the most basic projects have something interesting to solve. I love to put my spin on something, even if it's a "copy" of something I saw online or in a retail store. It still feels like mine when I finish. Each project is a learning process, no matter what. I try to incorporate a different technique each time, just to feel things out, and get an idea of what works best and why. Once I feel I have a decent handle on something, I'll move on to something else that's out of my comfort zone. I've had plenty of failures, but they help me grow. I think that's important.

I'm trying to take things slow, and not rush. I imagine speed will come with time and experience, so no need to rush to the end product.

[Mark Hennebury]

I'm trying to figure out if that was sarcasm. I hope so.


Nick & Frederick,

The “ Grasshopper” part could be maybe be considered sarcasm.

The rest however was solid gold, right from the heart.

I was happy to share the wisdom of my nearly 50 years woodworking condensed into a few a paragraphs in an effort to help the OP on his journey.
If you don’t understand it and would like me to explain it to you, just ask.

I read your posts and I see no such effort on your part, so pray tell me, what was the purpose of them?

[Frederick Skelly]

I was just bein' a wise guy Mark. I agree with everything you said. The way you wrote it just struck me funny, because we almost never hear from you (wish we heard more, because you have so much experience to share), and almost outta nowhere comes a long, somewhat-formally worded treatise written in a philosophical tone. I felt like a a peasant trying to understand the court scientist or something. (Hence the "huh?") It just struck me funny. No offense was intended.

Fred

[Frederick Skelly]

Welcome Mike! We're glad to have you with us.
I do hybrid woodworking too - I love what my hand tools can do for me.
Look forward to hearing more from you in the future.

Fred

[Mark Hennebury]

I was just bein' a wise guy Mark. I agree with everything you said. The way you wrote it just struck me funny, because we almost never hear from you (wish we heard more, because you have so much experience to share), and almost outta nowhere comes a long, somewhat-formally worded treatise written in a philosophical tone. I felt like a a peasant trying to understand the court scientist or something. (Hence the "huh?") It just struck me funny. No offense was intended.

Fred
Fred, nice to meet you, No offense taken, i don't mind a bit of friendly banter from time to time. I maybe just a little overly defensive after a few rude remarks on another thread, and i don't know who's who around here yet.
Peace.

[Phillip Mitchell]

I can dig on more of this. Excellent post.




Grasshopper;

Before you can go forward, you must move back.
First you need to unlearn.

You need to understand the pillars upon which the craft is built;

Materials - Tools - People.

The first two are easy to understand and you can learn them in a few days.

Wood is simple, it has basic cell structure, and various mechanical properties and it is hygroscopic.
Tools are all variations of a chisel approaching the wood cells from various angles.
People: there is the problem.



If you wish to understand wood, take various pieces and spend a day observing, and getting to know the material, describe it in intimate detail, the way it looks, the weight, the smell the color, the feel, the way the light reflects off it, the cell structure. Weigh it, measure it soak it water, dry it out, observe, measure and analyze. Cut it, bend it, break it, split it, saw it, crush it, twist it, To understand the relationship with tools,Cut it in as many different directions as you can, observe and analyze. Once you understand wood structure you will understand joinery.


listen to it and it will educate you.


People are complicated, their brains create reality from a complex mixture of sensory input and historical reference, biases, emotions and expectations, and are not to be trusted.

One must go back to the beginning, to the root, and learn to see, to really see, like a baby that experiences something for the first time, without all of the accumulated baggage of adulthood.

First you need to remove that idea that a craftsman bends wood to his will.

Craftsmanship is about knowledge, understanding and harmony not domination.

If you really wish to progress, you will take a long hard look at you, who you are, what you want and why you want it.

[Edwin Santos]

Grasshopper;

Before you can go forward, you must move back.
First you need to unlearn.


Mark,
Your post took me back to the first lecture I heard from James Krenov when I visited College of the Redwoods in the 90s. He spoke a lot about the philosophies and concepts you are mentioning and it was very inspirational. I remember him talking about laying out dovetails that were musical, not mechanical. I didn't get what that meant until we got to see some of the exquisite work being produced at the school and the musical thing suddenly became clear.
Anyway, all good stuff, thanks
Edwin

[Brian Holcombe]

Wonderful post Mark, gets to the feeling of it very well.

[Dominik Dudkiewicz]

I agree that bending wood to your will is not the hand tool way. One should read the wood, figure out what it wants and doesn't want to do, and then work with it. Bending and forcing the will of wood to your own is the path to the dark side... ;)

[Nick Decker]

Mark, no offense intended. Like Fred said, just a different style than I'm used to. To each his own.

Nick

[Frederick Skelly]

Mark,
Your post took me back to the first lecture I heard from James Krenov when I visited College of the Redwoods in the 90s. He spoke a lot about the philosophies and concepts you are mentioning and it was very inspirational. I remember him talking about laying out dovetails that were musical, not mechanical. I didn't get what that meant until we got to see some of the exquisite work being produced at the school and the musical thing suddenly became clear.
Anyway, all good stuff, thanks
Edwin

YES, that's it! It DID sound like Krenov!

Edwin- you got to hear Krenov lecture? Sir, I'd LOVE to read a post from you about that experience!
Puh-lease?!?!?!

[Mark Hennebury]

Mark, no offense intended. Like Fred said, just a different style than I'm used to. To each his own.

Nick

Hi Nick, nice to meet you. no problem. 380311

[Mark Hennebury]

Mark,
Your post took me back to the first lecture I heard from James Krenov when I visited College of the Redwoods in the 90s. He spoke a lot about the philosophies and concepts you are mentioning and it was very inspirational. I remember him talking about laying out dovetails that were musical, not mechanical. I didn't get what that meant until we got to see some of the exquisite work being produced at the school and the musical thing suddenly became clear.
Anyway, all good stuff, thanks
Edwin

Hi Edwin,

Yes i remember reading his first book when it came out, it was very inspiring. I made a few pieces of furniture in his style to learn what i could. He was a big influence on me.

There are many that help us along the way to become what we are; a distillation of influences of all that we have encountered and interpreted in our own unique way.

[Simon MacGowen]

YES, that's it! It DID sound like Krenov!

Edwin- you got to hear Krenov lecture? Sir, I'd LOVE to read a post from you about that experience!
Puh-lease?!?!?!

Fred,

Got two hours?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdvHGdd0NBU

I used to have a VHS tape on another discussion by Krenov. In that tape, he talked about personal commitment, a trait that several of his followers also promote when they run their own shops (there is an issue in Fine Woodworking dedicated to Krenov). Like most other VHS tapes (concerts, movies, etc) in my collection, the Krenov tape headed to the dump bin when DVDs offer better viewing experience. I have never been to find it again on youtube or any site.

Simon

[Frederick Skelly]

Fred,

Got two hours?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdvHGdd0NBU

I used to have a VHS tape on another discussion by Krenov. Like most other VHS tapes (concerts, movies, etc) in my collection, the Krenov tape headed to the dump bin when DVDs offer better viewing experience. I have never been to find it on youtube or any site.

Simon

Thanks Simon. I'll watch this tonight!
Fred

[Sean Nagle]

Speaking of Paul Sellers. He has a new series of videos where he builds a Nicholson workbench with very few hand tools and no workbench so to speak. Very inspirational.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiCnhVgVD5E&list=PLqyeNiM0BJuWNDgY1FpyxjveO2Y90CvD9

[Jim Tobias]

(The first being, the Beatles really weren't that good).


You lost my attention right here! :)

Jim

[Mike Cary]

I really wasn’t trying to engage in a metaphysical debate. I was just trying to dial back any notion that I may have conveyed that a craftsman can’t use machinery. Obviously they can and do. And while I hope to get very good with hand tools someday, I will never become an expert because I refuse to grow a long gray ponytail.

[Simon MacGowen]

I really wasn’t trying to engage in a metaphysical debate. I was just trying to dial back any notion that I may have conveyed that a craftsman can’t use machinery. Obviously they can and do. And while I hope to get very good with hand tools someday, I will never become an expert because I refuse to grow a long gray ponytail.

I find your post about your personal journey and path perfectly fine. If James Krenov and Tage Frid sat together and talked about woodworking, I don't think they would see eye to eye on everything. Throw in Sam Maloof (who by the way was the most approachable "celebrity" woodworker I've ever come across) and we might have a noisy party, who knows?

Some people would like to "bend" the wood to suit their skills or tastes while others themselves to the wood. I don't think either is an issue if the ultimate goal is to create something that the maker himself or herself is proud of. A perfect dovetail is a perfect dovetail whether you use a Leigh jig or a hand saw (western or Japanese)-- with or without any guide.

Simon

[Simon MacGowen]

Speaking of Paul Sellers. He has a new series of videos where he builds a Nicholson workbench with very few hand tools and no workbench so to speak. Very inspirational.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiCnhVgVD5E&list=PLqyeNiM0BJuWNDgY1FpyxjveO2Y90CvD9

That style of bench is not my cup of tea, but what I really liked about his approach was that he is not telling people to spend $2000 or more on a bench before you can do good work. I have seen many high-end pieces done by people whose benches are pretty primitive in comparison to those "advertised" or shared on social media with all the latest bells and whistles.

Simon

[Mark Hennebury]

I really wasn’t trying to engage in a metaphysical debate. I was just trying to dial back any notion that I may have conveyed that a craftsman can’t use machinery. Obviously they can and do. And while I hope to get very good with hand tools someday, I will never become an expert because I refuse to grow a long gray ponytail.

Mike, that's pretty much a deal breaker, the pony is part of the uniform.

[Ray Newman]

Pony tails??

Around here that is "just so yesterday". "Man Buns" are the in thing now....

[Simon MacGowen]

Pony tails??

Around here that is just so yesterday. "Man Buns" are the in thing now....

Agreed, but not just ANY man buns. It has got to be stylish and craftsman-like, something like this: https://i0.wp.com/therighthairstyles.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/8-braid-into-bun-punk-mens-hairstyle.jpg?w=500&ssl=1

Preferably, handcut, precision knots (joinery) and shellac finish.

Simon

[Mike Cary]

Pony tails??

Around here that is just so yesterday. "Man Buns" are the in thing now....

Yeah, going to be a hard pass on those too. I’m too busy sitting in Starbucks and working on my screenplay to spend that much time on my hair.

[Jim Becker]

...I will never become an expert because I refuse to grow a long gray ponytail.
I sure miss mine some days. (really... )

[John Sanford]

...
And here's what I learned. I did it backwards. I should have started with hand tools and worked toward power. With hand tools you learn proper layout, you learn wood (reading grain, movement, hardness), you learn joinery strength, you bring the tool to the wood, you learn the importance of keeping things square.
...
Mike

Well, maybe not. Here's my question for you Mike. Why did you start working with wood? Was it because one day you said to yourself "hey, I want to make something, ANYTHING, out of wood", or was it because you said to yourself "we need a bookcase, I'll build it, should be interesting." If it was the latter (or similar), then no, you probably didn't do it backwards. The need was for a bookcase, and given your skills and knowledge at the time, you satisfied the need as best you could. Sure, Paul Sellers could probably build two of those bookcases in a quarter of the time using a trained, but angry, beaver. Sellers also has a few years of experience to draw on.... In truth, the only thing that you don't "learn" nearly as much with powertools as you do with handtools is grain. Everything else is still relevant, and one can still learn it.

Had you gone the handtool route for that first project, or first few, the project complexity/effort vs skill gap may very well have been enough to put you off woodworking entirely. May. I don't know you, and who you are today is a different person than you were back when you first started butchering wood. But without the early successes, likely less impressive in hindsight than they may have seemed at the time, to encourage continuing, would you have done so? And would you have had the support to continue?

I don't know that there is a "right way" to get started. There are ways of learning that work better for most people, but certainly not for all, and that doesn't even begin to address the wildly differing resources and needs each potential woodworker brings. The most important thing, at least from the perspective of those who want to see the community of woodworkers grow, is that you DID get started, and continued. That you're having more fun with it now is great.

[Simon MacGowen]

Well said.

Simon

[johnny means]

I think the end product is all that matters. The vision and not the techniques or tools used define a craftsman. CNC machines, tool paths, laser cutters all are just additional arrows in the craftsman's quiver. Keep your hand tools and spend a year meeting a chair, I'll make a set of ten at a price that allows me to share them with the world.

[Ron Citerone]

I think the cool thing about woodworking is that you never stop learning. The more tools and machines you can use properly the better you can solve problems that arise. Learning to properly tune a block plane and sharpen a chisel made me a way better woodworker. I think the passion for learning and improving skills makes a person a woodworker.

[Bill Sutherland]

I notice as I’ve grown older that I value the enjoyment of working with wood more important than building something. I used to feel bad if I wasn’t creating something and most of the time the end result showed my impatience. Now I just enjoy the relationship between the tool, wood and me. I like the smell and the touch of freshly milled lumber and it is very relaxing to me.

[Frederick Skelly]

I think the end product is all that matters. The vision and not the techniques or tools used define a craftsman. CNC machines, tool paths, laser cutters all are just additional arrows in the craftsman's quiver. Keep your hand tools and spend a year meeting a chair, I'll make a set of ten at a price that allows me to share them with the world.

One of the things I like best about this hobby is that there are so many ways and paths. If the end product is what matters most for you, then your approach makes perfect sense. The people I know who share your approach are usually good at design and enjoy that part a lot.

Myself? I like the task of shaping the wood, by machine or hand tool. Sometimes I cut dovetails (by hand) just to see if I can do it better this time than the last. My "designs" really aren't anything new or unique, but I enjoy the build nonetheless.

I'd love to see some of your work if you get a chance to post it!

Fred

[Brian Holcombe]

I think the end product is all that matters. The vision and not the techniques or tools used define a craftsman. CNC machines, tool paths, laser cutters all are just additional arrows in the craftsman's quiver. Keep your hand tools and spend a year meeting a chair, I'll make a set of ten at a price that allows me to share them with the world.

Windsor chair making is a pretty efficient and almost entirely hand tools approach. Definetly a considerable generalization to assume it takes forever. Considering that even advanced makers are charging a competitive price.

By comparison CNC is not always efficient in many circumstances and the pricing provided suggests that. When you start comparing to all available approaches CNC is a choice for certain parts that makes good sense, it's not an end-all-be-all capable of providing an everyday craftsman with true manufacturing capability until it's done at a true manufacturing level and then everything else has to be there as well; considerable scale, investment, etc.

[Mike Cary]

Well, maybe not. Here's my question for you Mike. Why did you start working with wood? Was it because one day you said to yourself "hey, I want to make something, ANYTHING, out of wood", or was it because you said to yourself "we need a bookcase, I'll build it, should be interesting." If it was the latter (or similar), then no, you probably didn't do it backwards. The need was for a bookcase, and given your skills and knowledge at the time, you satisfied the need as best you could. Sure, Paul Sellers could probably build two of those bookcases in a quarter of the time using a trained, but angry, beaver. Sellers also has a few years of experience to draw on.... In truth, the only thing that you don't "learn" nearly as much with powertools as you do with handtools is grain. Everything else is still relevant, and one can still learn it.

Had you gone the handtool route for that first project, or first few, the project complexity/effort vs skill gap may very well have been enough to put you off woodworking entirely. May. I don't know you, and who you are today is a different person than you were back when you first started butchering wood. But without the early successes, likely less impressive in hindsight than they may have seemed at the time, to encourage continuing, would you have done so? And would you have had the support to continue?

I don't know that there is a "right way" to get started. There are ways of learning that work better for most people, but certainly not for all, and that doesn't even begin to address the wildly differing resources and needs each potential woodworker brings. The most important thing, at least from the perspective of those who want to see the community of woodworkers grow, is that you DID get started, and continued. That you're having more fun with it now is great.

I start almost everything I take on for the challenge of it. I have been cursed with an intense curiosity. I try to master everything I do. I could care less about building a bookcase. If I need one I buy it. But a highboy, oh yeah, and I have no need for one of those.

[Frederick Skelly]

But a highboy, oh yeah, and I have no need for one of those.

Me too Mike. I'd like to build one for the sheer challenge. Definitely a bucket list project.
Fred