Min Max s45

[Brian Byers]

Hi guys I just hit you up with bandsaw advice a few days ago. I've got a call into the owner of a min max s45. As I've searched forums the past week I've heard people bring up the min max saws. Saws that are pretty much unobtainable to anyone who makes less then $90,000 ! Year. I've been looking at bandsaws in the $1500 to $2000 range. I don't know the asking price of the s45 yet.i called on it a while ago and woke the owner up. I can see the saw was made in Italy. In his ad He said he replaced the 1.5 motor with a 3.6 motor. It looks to have ceramic guides of some sort. I see that the s45 was mentioned 6 years ago in these forums. Back then people commented that it was a good saw but not as good as a mm16. I heard some comments about the saw being hard to get parts for. I don't want to even think about getting this saw without jthe wisdom of the creek. At what price should I jump on that saw, if any. I don't want problems. I'm going through the refinancing process now. I should have enough money in my hands soon to buy a good new saw. I don't want to jump on this saw for $500-$1000 if you guys think I'd have a much better saw for $1500 new. Thanks guys

[Peter Kelly]

Jump on it. Parts are easily available as SCM still makes this saw in-house and the design has not changed much. https://www.scmgroup.com/en_US/scmwood/products/joinery-machines.c884/band-saws.895/minimax-s-45n.675

Certainly nicer than any new 18" bandsaw saw you'll find in the $1,500 range these days.

[Matthew Hills]

Was this discussion from 2012 (https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?188538-New-to-SMC-and-MiniMax-S45-Question) what you had seen here?

When I was shopping bandsaws in 2012/13, I had seen a couple of local listings in the $650-750 for the older models (green, ~10" resaw, smaller motors).

If you can try it out and it runs well, I'd think it could be a good choice. (Ideally, try a cut representative of what you really want to do with the saw)

Some features will probably not show as well as currently offered saws (E.g., Laguna 18bx / Rikon 10-342 or 347 / Grizzly G0514X ):
- Guides were the euro-style guides (not ceramic), but these are generally fine.
- Fence is pretty basic (if still with the saw)
- tension knob on the top... *sigh*

Do be aware that carbide blades in these sizes will run $175-250.

Matt

[Brian Byers]

The owner of the saw wants $1200 for the saw. I haven't refinanced the house yet so that's to much for me. I also noticed that Carter doesn't make guide kits for min max saws. I love the Carter guides and I want them on the bandsaw I end up with. Thanks for your input

[Matthew Hills]

I'd recommend saving the ad and watching to see how long it remains unsold.
What was the motor he put on it? Was it an older or newer model? (I would've thought older given the original motor spec that he replaced, so presumably less resaw height)

Re: guides...
Minimax shipped their MM16 saws with carter guides for a year or two. That is what mine has. They are okay, but do require allen wrenches to adjust. I've heard some people prefer the euro-style guards, and minimax has gone back to those on their current saws.

Matt

[Brian Byers]

The saw does look older. It's in the tools by owner section of Craigslist for Redding Ca. I think he said 3 or 3.6 hp.motor. guides looked to be European. Somebody said that they not all ceramic. The guides look dated

[Peter Kelly]

The original single phase motor on the two-tone S45 was a 1.5hp / 1.12Kw Arbor (black). The newer version of this saw ships with a 3hp / 2.2Kw CEG (silver).

Carter does make guides for these, I have a set on my S45. http://www.carterproducts.com/band-saw-products/band-saw-conversion-kits/scm-s45-mini-max-18

Offer him $800?

[Paul Tubergen]

I have the 18” mm saw and think it’s a very good machine. It was manufactured by MIni Max, I believe their other saws (MM line) are produced by someone else. The machine is intended for furniture makers - that was what I was told. The wheels are crowned which is different than their other machines - so set up is a bit different - teeth don’t hang over the front of the top wheel... mine resaws great with a 3/4 carbide blade and does everything I need it to do well.

[Brian Byers]

Thanks Peter, I was looking under min max and didn't see it.

[Jim Becker]

Brian...

https://www.scmgroup.com/en_US/scmwood/products/joinery-machines.c884/band-saws.895/minimax-s-45n.675

[Phillip Mitchell]

Condition is everything, but my brother just picked up an older S45 in overall decent shape for $600. It needed new tires, but still much less than $1200. I've seen older S45s offered up for sale more than once for well under $1k, so I'd keep looking if it were me.

[Brian Byers]

The saw is still for sale on CL tonight. We haven't finished our refinancing yet so i don't think I can make an offer. He said it now has a 3.6 motor. If it doesn't sell by the first maybe I'll try and make a offer off $800. I planed on selling my powermatic model 44 14" bs. It's only got 1 hp motor and 9" rip. I could put it up for sale and be in better shape to make an offer on the first of month if it's still on Redding Ca Craigslist.

[Brian Byers]

https://redding.craigslist.org/tls/d/mini-max-samco/6497012155.html

[Erik Loza]

Looks good, single-phase, does not appear to be missing any major parts (fence looks aftermarket maybe). $1,200 is way too much IMO, even $800 maybe too much. If I were shopping, I might offer $600 and see where the seller goes. Reason being that parts (except guides and electrics) will be unavailable from SCM for that age machine. Best of luck with your search.

Erik

[Peter Kelly]

I think that's actually the stock fence. Somewhat awkward setup as it needs to be completely removed to change the blade.

Curious about the 3.6hp motor now...

[Brian Byers]

I sure appreciate your input. I've been reading these forums for about 2 weeks trying to get all the wisdom I can get. We're refinancing and I'll be spending about 7k on tools. One of my biggest purchases will be a bandsaw. One bandsaw that was continually mentioned was a mm16. They were SO expensive I couldn't even begin to think about owning one. Then i see this saw and I ot real excited. If it wasn't for your wisdom I may have thought $1200 was a good price and jumped at it. Now I see that $600-$800 Is a better price for that saw. Thank you all SO much☺

[Thomas S Stockton]

Hi neighbor
I live east of redding and have the same saw, I like it a lot and it has been well used. I have never had to get parts from mini-max so I don't know about that .
I got my saw 25 years ago and what I have replaced is mostly bearings and the drive belt. I did have one bearing go and wear out the bore in the wheel but that was an easy fix for a machine shop.
I think it was around $1000 new so $600 to $800 is fair.
From my experience tools like this in the area tend to sit on craigslist for a while unless they are a great deal. I would offer him what you think is fair and he might just get back to you after a while.
Good luck
Tom

[Brian Byers]

That's good to know Thomas, I've got the owners phone number. The saw is still for sale on Craigslist. Maybe it will still be there in a month. Are you in Palo Cedro, shingletown, Burney. Its good to know there is another Creeker nearby☺

[Thomas S Stockton]

I'm in Montgomery creek. I'm hosting the shasta woodworkers next month contact or check teir web site for details
Tom

[Randall J Cox]

I have a green s45 and it has a 1.8 HP single phase motor. Bought it (jumped on it actually) locally when it showed up on CL about 8 miles away for $525, gave him $500. It was/is in great condition. Had it about a year now and love it. Bought a couple of new old Lenox diemaster II blades (144 inches) for dirt cheap off ebay. Although its called an 18" bandsaw, it actually measures 17". It has a resaw capability of approx. 10", not really great if your into that. Randy

[lee cox]

I have this bandsaw and like it a lot. I like the table size and height. It seems like a nice basic bandsaw which runs very smooth. But I am no expert. I am responding to a couple of comments which seem wrong to me. My version is 20 plus years old. Check my thread if you want to know more.

The wheels are flat not crowned and the teeth do hang over. They are bigger than 17 inches by a lot much closer to 18 inches.

The guides are the European and easy to adjust.

The motor in mine is 220v 1.8 hp. The European measurements are strange to me. There were models which had a Baldor 1.5 hp motor.
This is what I know.

[Brian Byers]

Okay guys I just saw this bandsaw. I bought his jet 1.5 hp 1100 cfm dust collector for $300. It has the filter on top. I saw this collector on Amazon for $720 so I jumped on it. I think I have fallen in love with the saw. It looks to be high quality. The guides looked to be a great design but I haven't seen them before. You guys asked me about the motor on the saw. I took a picture of the name plate on the upgraded motor. They replaced the 1.5 hp motor with a 3.6 CEG MOTOR. The motor appears to be a high quality motor that was made in Italy. Please shoot me a little more advice. Doni need to sell a kidney to get thus saw. Thanks Brian

[Peter Kelly]

CEG is a good motor, SCM uses them extensively. I'm still a bit skeptical that they were able to source and install a 3.6 hp single phase motor on that saw though. I installed a 1.8kw / 2.4 hp on mine and it was a headache w/much drilling, machining a new pulley, etc.

https://i.imgur.com/i6xqZYN.jpg

Would still offer $800.

[lee cox]

I paid $600 for my S45 a couple of years ago with no fence and the smaller motor. Bandsaw prices have gone up a lot in the last couple of years. I bet he won't let it go for $800. I would not sell mine for $800. It is too good of a saw.

[Brian Byers]

Hi Peter, I didn't hear the saw run. It looked good. The motor looked like it belonged on the saw. This is what I was told about the saw from the owner. The guy trying to sell the saw works at a huge saw Mill in Anderson Ca. It's called Siskiyou Forrest products. His boss and owner of the mill is a wood worker. The mill apparently resaws all day everyday with huge monster machines. The boss gave him the Jet Dust collector and the min max s45 bandsaw to do what ever he wanted to with it. The owner is apparently filthy rich and he just went out and bought a newer version of the saw. When I first got there I asked him what motor was on the saw. Expecting it to be some made in China motor. He said his boss is extremely wealthy and only buys and uses the best. I couldn't see the motor plate well so I took a picture. That's when I could see it was a CEG motor that was made in Italy. It said 3.6 hp and I think it said 16.8 amps. It looked like it fit perfectly. I opened the upper door and felt the tire. It felt good. I did notice the blade was really far forward on the tire like another poster said. I sure loved the saw when I was looking at it. With that Italian motor on it I felt like hmm maybe I can own this little Ferrari 😎. As I think about it more something that my friend at the cabinet shop told me I'd ringing in my ears. He told me you don't want to buy a saw from a busy shop of some sort. He said they will be really wore out. He said buy a saw that was used in a garage by s hobbyist. The bandsaw must have been used enough to kill the first high quality motor it had on it. The owner probably used the heck out of the first motor. He then bought great 3.6 motor, he probably used the heck out of it. Then he just went out and bought a brand new version of the saw. Another poster mentioned their well used s45 was a great saw but they did need to have parts fixed or made at a machine shop because they couldn't just go out and buy them. Maybe I should just stick with my plan of refinancing the house and getting a Grizzly 0514 or a Rikon 14" 10-353🙂

[Peter Kelly]

The one in the ad looks pretty clean. Offer him what you think it's worth and take it from there.

[Geoff Crimmins]

I really depends on what you're looking for, and how common used bandsaws are in your area. Where I live I have never seen a Minimax bandsaw for sale, and I've seen two Lagunas for sale in the past 15 years. There were two two old Jet JWBS-18 bandsaws on Craigslist for $1100 recently, and they both sold in less than a week. The seller of the S45 you're looking at has dropped the price to $1000. If you want it, go offer him $800 or $900 and see what happens. I've never seen one of them in person, but it's my understanding it's a step up from a Grizzly or Rikon. The 16" Walker-Turner for sale where you are is also a good saw at a reasonable price if it's in good working condition. You might have to replace the bearings and/or tires on it.

[lee cox]

I owned a Rikon 10-325 14" I think that was the model number. It was the Rikon 14 inch with the cabinet which I sold to buy the Minimax S45 bandsaw. I would never switch back from the S45 to the Rikon. Buy the S45. I think it is a lot better in every way. It has better guides. It has a bigger better table. The fence is better. It is a nice small foot print for a large saw. And it runs so smooth.

[Brian Byers]

We are refinancing our house now, it's taking longer then I thought. If I got through the refinance 2 weeks ago like I thought I would I'd be on it. In our current budget situation it was hard for me to be able to get the $300 to buy his jet Dust collector

[Brian Byers]

Okay guys, sorry to hit you up again. My mom found out I was looking at this Itialion bandsaw and is sending me $1000 but I'm not as wise as you guys are. If you were looking at the saw you'd probably be able to see or hear a problem. I may not. I was blessed to be able to ask Louis Iturra from Iturra designs about the saw. He's one incredibly nice guy who knows bandsaws EXTREMELY well. He agrees with you all. Good saw but he said he'd offer $600. He helped me figure out which bandsaw is right for me if I don't get it. I'll get the Grizzly 0514X2 for about $1900 shipped. I'd have to wait about 6 weeks to get it. Mr Iturra said new grizzly bandsaws were pretty good these days. He did say the motors are poopy and he feels I'd have to get a motor in a few years. He said at that time I could get a higher quality motor and then I'd have a great saw. I wish I could have you all on video chat as I look at the saw again. These are my current concerns.
Peter has replaced a motor on his s45. He said it was a pain in the butt . He was curious as to how this owner pulled off getting a 3.6 CEG single phase motor on that saw. This owner had to probably be creative to get this saw going. He is a wealthy man who owns a sawmill so he probably had access to the best parts a machinists around. If he did do something Mickey Mouse I wouldn't catch it.
Another concern I have is that this saw used up a high quality 1.5 motor. Then installed this, I'm sure he put a lot of miles on this saw before he decided to sell it and get a new minmax. After that many miles could this saw have a lot of hidden parts that are worn out. Somebody else a few days ago mentioned they had to take parts of his s45 to a machine shop.
I don't like the small miter slot. Don't like having only 10" of resaw. I also read the tires are different on this saw. I was told they were flat not crowned. The blade is really far forward. How would I replace tires if I had to. I probably couldn't buy Carter urethane tires.
I can only think of one more question at the moment. If the 3.6 motor dies how much would a new one cost. If this saw was modified to take this motor I'd probably have to buy another CEG 3.6 motor. I couldn't find out what that would cost.
Thomas S Stockton you live fairly close to me. How much would you charge to go with me if I decided to go take a final look at the saw.

[Phillip Mitchell]

My advice...you seem a bit new to used machines, which is totally fine.

I would wait until you have your money in hand that you want to budget for a bandsaw and take it from there. No real reason to rush the purchase. A (potentially) well-used, overpriced S45 isn't worth this much stress and probably isn't worth more than $600-800.

Keep looking and waiting until your budget situation is proper and take it from there. If you still really want the S45 at that point and feel less anxious about its potential future issues, then make an offer you're comfortable with and see where that goes. Otherwise, keep the search light on for other used machines. Broaden your distance range a bit if needed to look out for better deals.

OR - save your money a bit longer if necessary and buy a new machine with a warranty. The new Laguna, Grizzly and Rikon machines are quite nice from a practical and warranty perspective. They just aren't sexy Italian Ferraris ;)

[Brian Byers]

Thanks Phillip, I wanted to give one last post. My mom has sent a check for $1000 for this saw. She just texted me to see if the check got here yet and if I was talking to the saw owner about getting the saw. She's excited about blessing me with this saw. I don't want to jump out and buy it as soon as money gets here. I've taken my grizzly table saw apart and replaced bearings. I've took old guides off delta 14" saws and put Carter guides on. I've put urethane tires on saws. This Ferrari is a little more rare then a delta 14. I appreciate the advice. What a blessing it is to have you guys helping me☺☺☺

[Phillip Mitchell]

The timing of this thread is funny.

Tomorrow, I'm driving 3 hrs (1 way) to go and take a look at a 20" Italian bandsaw that's 30 years old and still with its original owner. The fence system is outdated, the guides are original and will likely need replacing if I buy it and use it the way I intend to. The motor is a single phase , 2hp, which seem potentially underpowered, but we'll see.

The saw wasn't really being advertised and the asking price is low enough that I'm interested in driving that far to check it out. We'll see if it comes home with me or not ;)

I say all this to really say, I know exactly where you are and how you're feeling. Of course, you want to start with a solid foundation of a machine and not someone else's headache, but many of the things you can fix or get fixed along the way if they are wear items. It likely won't be as quick or convenient as a new, warrantied saw but most things are still possible even with old machines that don't have factory support anymore. Lord knows the saw I'm going to look at (Steton 500) doesn't have anything in the way of factory support in the US.

Best of luck and keep us updated!

[Brian Byers]

Thanks again Phillip, I'm praying you get a great deal on the saw if you decide it's what you're looking for. I messaged the seller and told him I was very interested in the saw but that I was not interested in paying $1000. I asked him to check out sawmill creek forum to get an idea what other woodworkers thought the saw is worth

[Geoff Crimmins]

Do you know for sure why the previous owner upgraded the motor and then bought a new saw? Maybe he replaced the motor because he wanted more HP, and then bought a new saw because he wanted more resaw height. If the bandsaw was used in a hobby shop, then it's unlikely that's it's worn out, but I guess it's possible. Blue Max urethane tires are available for this saw on E-bay. It's also likely that Wordworkers Toolworks has rubber tires that would fit, and Minimax might sell tires for it. If you're concerned about blade tracking because of the flat tires you can always install rubber tires and crown them. It sounds like you're somewhat uncomfortable buying a used bandsaw because of the possibility that there could be something wrong with it that you wouldn't notice. Maybe there is another woodworker or a forum member in your area who could go with you and help you check it out.

[Brian Byers]

Hi guys, I offered the bandsaw owner $800. He was firm on $1000. He did say the motor was 2 years old. He works in a saw mill and the CEG aftermarket motor was installed by the mills electrician and I'm sure it was a professional motor installation. I called on a powermatic model81 today that was listed for $750. It was available in a town 3 hours away. I told that owner I'd take it I was just going to arrange a truck and it call them back in about 30 minutes. I got a truck lined up. I told them id be there in the morning to get it. They said someone local called during the time I was arranging for a truck and was already there. Well that guy decides he wanted it. So the search continues ☺