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Derek Cohen
02-05-2018, 5:58 AM
There have been jigs around for eons to slip into the one side of a vise to prevent it racking. Such as this rather nice version from Veritas ...

http://www.leevalley.com/us/images/item/Woodworking/Clamps/09a0235s1.jpg

I was going to write that it is one more jig than I want to have lying under my bench, but I have several lying there already! Really what I just wanted to do was build an anti-rack jig into the leg vise.

This is what I mean by racking - you place a board into the one side of the vise, and it looks like this ...

https://s19.postimg.org/flia1fepv/Fa.jpg

That is not good for the vise, and the vise does not hold the board securely.

Under my bench is a jig that is simply a bolt that can screw outwards towards the chop. This is attached to the bench leg with an L-bracket ...

https://s19.postimg.org/bp4y5ejfn/Ba.jpg

Place the board at the "other" side of the vise, and lightly close it down ...

https://s19.postimg.org/7ha5wokkz/A-a.jpg

Now screw the bolt out until it hits the chop (the chop has a metal insert in its face - one can countersink a bolt head - to prevent harm to the chop) ...

https://s19.postimg.org/ogj4bxo2r/Da.jpg

Now you can work on the other side of the vise without any racking. Remember to retract the bolt when finished.

https://s19.postimg.org/9xbzaj2nn/Ea.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

ken hatch
02-05-2018, 6:19 AM
Derek,

Clever.

ken

William Fretwell
02-05-2018, 7:22 AM
My traditional shoulder vise has no such problem as you clamp in the middle. It can twist from top to bottom so I added a groove up from the bottom face for various sized stepped inserts. I can also use the traditional shoulder vise which has no racking.
Those traditional Scandinavian vises are good for something..............holding wood!

Derek Cohen
02-05-2018, 7:34 AM
William, the type of situation I am describing is more typical of the leg vise when holding large panels, such as doors or, as in the picture below, the frame-and-panel side of a chest of drawers (waiting to be rebated) ...

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/MovingForward_html_34b3515c.jpg

I am not sure whether you can do this on your bench?

Regards from Perth

Derek

Malcolm Schweizer
02-05-2018, 7:39 AM
Brilliant! Also that brass knob looks familiar!

ernest dubois
02-05-2018, 8:22 AM
William, the type of situation I am describing is more typical of the leg vise when holding large panels, such as doors or, as in the picture below, the frame-and-panel side of a chest of drawers (waiting to be rebated) ...

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/MovingForward_html_34b3515c.jpg

I am not sure whether you can do this on your bench?

Regards from Perth

Derek

He can do it on his bench but in combination with an adjustable support from the floor, I only know it as the bankknecht, to hold up the side not in the klamp, or as you have by being creative with clamps.
This is the anti-rack proof vice on a kind of workbench once made in The Netherlands. In the bottom right you see the notched wheel which turns out to but against the skirt of the bench top.
378326

Robert Engel
02-05-2018, 9:01 AM
I also have a Scand bench with shoulder vise. I use a bench slave to support the other end.

378329

ernest dubois
02-05-2018, 9:10 AM
Ok, it's a more brutal term, but that's the helper I was referring to also for such work.

andy bessette
02-05-2018, 11:33 AM
How about using an old deck of cards? Just cut it to the same thickness as the workpiece.

Malcolm Schweizer
02-05-2018, 11:44 AM
How about using an old deck of cards? Just cut it to the same thickness as the workpiece.

Simple, yet brilliant.

Jim Koepke
02-05-2018, 1:46 PM
My Anti-Rack Spacer Stack is still working fine for me:

378358

https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?183743

It would need a change of design for a leg vise.

The 1/8" blade is the week point. It doesn't hold up to be hit with a mallet, stepped on or other rough handling. Since it was made a rasp was used to round over some corners so it closes up easier.

jtk

Graham Haydon
02-05-2018, 4:01 PM
Derek, as always you come up with a neat solution to your situation. It's interesting to reflect that my favorite style of vise, the metal QR/Record style, has been defined by some as a poor choice due to racking. Seems like the leg vice has equal flaws/limits/compromise in the same situations.

Jim Koepke
02-05-2018, 4:10 PM
Derek, as always you come up with a neat solution to your situation. It's interesting to reflect that my favorite style of vise, the metal QR/Record style, has been defined by some as a poor choice due to racking. Seems like the leg vice has equal flaws/limits/compromise in the same situations.

There is a style of leg vise with the leg angled so the top of the center line is right of vertical center of the screw.

My pre-1936 Parker metal bench vise shows signs of racking from years of things being held in the left side of the jaws.

Almost any vise will rack, it is just some will be more evident than others.

An advantage can be derived from a weakness. With anti-racking devices the closing of the vise can be controlled to overcome the tendency of vises to bow thin stock. Though this might not work with a leg vise because there isn't any built in guide rails to help diminish racking.

jtk

Graham Haydon
02-05-2018, 4:47 PM
After over 82 years we'd all show a bit of racking, I'd be pleased to get to 82 with just racking as an issue :)

William Fretwell
02-05-2018, 6:30 PM
Well Derek that looks like it will be one GEORGEOUS chest of drawers. Lots of work in a project like that! You Australians get some great wood. Canadians have lots of Maple, Ash, Oak; some Cherry and Walnut. After that it gets expensive.
Yes my bench will do that ;).
It's not quite traditional........... I made the tail vise twice as long as normal so I could move the right leg further out than the right jaw opening (13" opening). This means the right leg is not in the way which I didn't like on the original design. It also meant I could add a dead man to the front of the right leg all the way to the foot without it being in the way, along with a row of hold downs.
Also have an apron at the front to clamp shorter pieces.
The whole premise for my bench was to make full size doors (needed some sort of premise!).

Bill Sutherland
02-06-2018, 8:46 AM
What a great idea. I have racking all the time on my Moxon vise. My solution is a wedge shaped wood but it has contact on only a small part of the vise at the top of the vise.

ken hatch
02-06-2018, 9:22 AM
Derek, as always you come up with a neat solution to your situation. It's interesting to reflect that my favorite style of vise, the metal QR/Record style, has been defined by some as a poor choice due to racking. Seems like the leg vice has equal flaws/limits/compromise in the same situations.

Graham,

I've DTDT with many of the popular vises. For me, of course YMMV, the best all around, easiest to use and for that matter to install on the bench is the metal English QR vise.

Having said that, I expect to start on a portable bench with a wood screw leg vise as soon as I finish MsBubba's kitchen cart. I expect I will build into it something like Derek's anti-rack device.

ken

Derek Cohen
02-06-2018, 9:49 AM
Well Derek that looks like it will be one GEORGEOUS chest of drawers. Lots of work in a project like that! You Australians get some great wood. Canadians have lots of Maple, Ash, Oak; some Cherry and Walnut. After that it gets expensive.
Yes my bench will do that ;).
It's not quite traditional........... I made the tail vise twice as long as normal so I could move the right leg further out than the right jaw opening (13" opening). This means the right leg is not in the way which I didn't like on the original design. It also meant I could add a dead man to the front of the right leg all the way to the foot without it being in the way, along with a row of hold downs.
Also have an apron at the front to clamp shorter pieces.
The whole premise for my bench was to make full size doors (needed some sort of premise!).

Hi William

Actually, that chest of drawers' carcase was built from Makore, a West African timber. The drawer fronts were West Australian Jarrah.


This was completed 18 months ago ...

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/TopOfTheWorldToYou_html_m11845893.jpg

Do you have a picture of your bench?

Regards from Perth

Derek

Jeff Heath
02-06-2018, 12:00 PM
That's a pretty fancy anti-racking device, Derek. I still have my pieces of scrap, with T's screwed across the top so they don't fall through, in the thicknesses that I work, on my clutter-table behind my bench. I like your idea, though, and may have to incorporate that at some point.

Graham Haydon
02-06-2018, 3:21 PM
Graham,

I've DTDT with many of the popular vises. For me, of course YMMV, the best all around, easiest to use and for that matter to install on the bench is the metal English QR vise.

Having said that, I expect to start on a portable bench with a wood screw leg vise as soon as I finish MsBubba's kitchen cart. I expect I will build into it something like Derek's anti-rack device.

ken

Ken, I'm always amazed how close our preferences are. I too feel the Record style QR is the best all round vise. Godspeed with the kitchen cart :)

William Fretwell
02-06-2018, 5:55 PM
The two woods blend very well. The Jarrah grain is most striking.
I did post pictures of the top & under my bench top a while back in a thread, can't find it now. I will post some more in a proper build thread when I'm not so crazy busy with work. A lengthy project but very enjoyable.

ken hatch
02-07-2018, 5:55 PM
Ken, I'm always amazed how close our preferences are. I too feel the Record style QR is the best all round vise. Godspeed with the kitchen cart :)

Thanks Graham,

I'm doing glue up on the cart tomorrow, waylaid an extra set of hands for tomorrow or it would be tonight.

I think it has something to do with using "em :)

ken