An inexpensive dust bucket saw dust level sensor new cheaper parts

[Lane Hardy]

I wanted a saw dust level detector and on SMC I found thread about building the Oneida Dust Centry Clone
I found the Banner qs18vp6d sensor on eBay for $28.00 so I ordered one from China yes it arrived about a month latter. But I could have purchased one from a US supplier north of $150.00 an ungodly price.
google the sensor. Banner qs18vp6d.
I had a power cube at 12 VDC, and I found a LED strobe light for $3.00 on eBay another item shipped by backward sailing sail boat to the US. I wired it up using this schematic found on the above mentioned
375593Thanks to Ben Rivel,

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/member.php?151774-Ben-Rivel

This works like a champ and pretty cheap depending on where you purchase your parts.

The less expensive sensor that works just as well!
You want to search for
E3F-DS30C1I found it for $4.10 at
http://www.icstation.com/mobile/ds30c4-photoelectric-switch-adjustable-sensor-p-7079.html

I wired it up just like the Banner qs18vp6d sensor I placed this one in my 5 gallon dust bucket with my home made Cyclone and a shop vac. Just like my D.C. System I wired it for sound by using and old smoke detector they have very loud sonalerts in case you don't see the strobe.
feel feel free to PM me if you want more details.

What a great place to learn how to do things! Thanks Al!

Lane

yea like Al Gore invented the internet!

[Larry Frank]

Very interesting....could you post a couple more pictures showing how you placed the sensor.

I need to build one for my dust collector and your post will help.

[Ben Rivel]

Good find on an alternate sensor! I knew there were others out there but I didnt include them in my thread on the Oneida build as I only meant to show what parts were use to build one like the Dust Sentry. Im sure there are quite a few different sensors out there that would work just fine.

[Lane Hardy]

Larry this sensor is very simple to mount unlike the Banner,
this sensor all you need to do is drill a whole and two ring nuts come on the sensor.
sandwhick the sensor nut between the top of the dust bucket and screwon the bottom nut.
the Banner is a little different because there are two flat spots on the side of the cylinder that must be plugged up to prevent an air leak.

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Let me know if you need more details
Lane

[Lane Hardy]

Dust Level sensor on the Cheap! Less than $10.00
This might get a bit long, Sorry if it does seem that way.
Parts:

E3F-DS30C4 Photoelectric sensor. $4.10
http://www.icstation.com/mobile/ds30c4-photoelectric-switch-adjustable-sensor-p-7079.html
Harbor Freight light Hft® - Item#67227 (optional) free with Coupon.
power supply 12 VDC power cube or 9 volt battery (I am testing how long the 9 volt battery will work no data at this time.)

The big picture, I am cheap so I wanted to use what I had on hand.
I decided to use the Harbor Freight light since I had several sitting around the light will turn on when the level sensor is tripped
to modify the HF light I opened it up and found the on off switch and by passed the switch with a vey simple jumper see photo below
I also removed the batteries as they will not be needed only the power cube or a 9 volt battery will be the power supply.

Wiring the sensor to the HFT light is pretty straightforward.

if you need further details contact me.

have fun

Lane

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/webkit-fake-url://2904c63e-8ad6-492e-b17a-bd67c938202b/imagejpeghttp://www.sawmillcreek.org/webkit-fake-url://94a4098b-49ba-450f-84e8-53ee3dad678d/imagepng
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/webkit-fake-url://d6932417-a8cc-422b-9346-0b0a985d9d64/imagepng
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/webkit-fake-url://b77283a8-8eaa-4039-aed7-dc069d0d688f/imagepng

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/webkit-fake-url://e2da5e9f-91ce-4415-8ac3-91b664bc60a0/imagepng
E3F-DS30C4 Photoelectric sensor.
Parameters:
[Name]: infrared photoelectric switch
[Model] : E3F-DS30C4
[Model] may substitution : E3F-DS30N1 E3F-DS30C1 E18-DS30NA
[Overall ] : M18mm*75mm cylinder
[Detection method: diffuse type
[Output state ] : NPN normally open three-wire
[Operating voltage ] : 10-36VDC
[Output Current ] : 200-300mA
[Detection distance ] : 10-30cm adjustable
[Detectable object ]: translucent or opaque objects
[Response Time ] : <2.5ms
[Case Material ] : ABS plastic




Blue = ground -
Brown = Vcc + 10-30 DC
Black= output or switched relative to Brown

[Lane Hardy]

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/webkit-fake-url://b51001fc-d0c6-4826-9d3b-8b7cba8cd9e9/imagepng

[Lane Hardy]

This is drawing should have been in the last post for the Dust Level Sensor project

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[John K Jordan]

Nice job, Lane.

For those who may have different DC hardware and are not familiar with your specific dust collector and vac/bucket setup could you sketch or describe where you mounted the optoelectronic switch? For example is it in the side or lid of the bucket/bin, aimed across or straight down? This might save some confusion. Thanks.


this sensor all you need to do is drill a whole and two ring nuts come on the sensor.
sandwhick the sensor nut between the top of the dust bucket and screwon the bottom nut.

[Lane Hardy]

This is the sensor on my home grown Cyclone with a Shop Vac.
The first photo is the top of the dust bucket with the senor pointing down mounted into 3/4 MDF.
There is a potentiometer on the top of sensor to adjust the depth of the trigger point, adjustable from 10- 30 CM
this is works very well with a 5 gallon bucket. Presently it is powered by a 9 volt battery.
Saddly the 9 volt battery is the most costly item in the build.
The knob beside the sensor is a photo cell test device that moves at paddle over the sensor and this test the circuit.
I used a 1/4 - 20 carriage bolt to act as a shaft for the paddle and the knob. I drilled and tapped the MDF to create
tight seal and not have a source for a vacuum leak.
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The underside:

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[John K Jordan]

Presently it is powered by a 9 volt battery.
Saddly the 9 volt battery is the most costly item in the build.
...

If you want to run it permanently on batteries consider that one D cell can have 30 times the capacity of a nine volt battery so six D cells in series will give you 9 volts and last 180 time as long as a nine volt battery. I'd run wires though and plug it into the wall. If no 110v outlet is nearby, two low voltage wires could carry the power from the wall wart.

[Ben Rivel]

Im surprised that sensor will even run on a 9V battery (which will actually output less) when the datasheet lists the power supply voltage at 10-30VDC (LINK (http://lra.unileon.es/sites/lra.unileon.es/files/Documents/datasheet_Cel_flex/sensor_photo.pdf), Page 6)

[John K Jordan]

Im surprised that sensor will even run on a 9V battery (which will actually output less) when the datasheet lists the power supply voltage at 10-30VDC

Published specs are sometimes optimum or target values instead of requirements so I'm not too surprised. I've tested things that were listed, for example, for 12vdc that worked fine on 9v and even "worked" so some extent down to about 2 volts. The actual useful range depends on the design of the circuits, the internal voltage regulation, and perhaps the function and even the operating temperature. Maybe it works on 9v but would work better or use less current at 12 or 15v, can't guess.

Those do look like very useful sensors to have on hand, I might get some to play with.

BTW, I like your avatar pic. Did you create that?

JKJ

[Dan Jung]

My banner sensor runs fine off of a 9v power supply. That's all I had on hand, and it works fine.

[Ben Rivel]

BTW, I like your avatar pic. Did you create that?

JKJ
Nope. Ryan Bliss did back in 2000. His website is DigitalBlasphemy.com

[Bill Space]

I like high tech and all that, but for the chip collector that precedes my dust collector, I simply put a lexan window in the door so I can see how full the trash can is, and this works brilliantly for me.

Simple, low tech, no batteries to replace, no electronic failures expected...:)

Bill

[Dave Cav]

I like high tech and all that, but for the chip collector that precedes my dust collector, I simply put a lexan window in the door so I can see how full the trash can is, and this works brilliantly for me.

Simple, low tech, no batteries to replace, no electronic failures expected...:)

Bill

I have a Plexiglas window in my chip barrel and can keep a pretty good eye on the level. However, today I thought I could plane just a few more boards and ended up filling up my filter cartridges. It was a huge mess to clean up. I ordered two of the bin level sensors this evening.

[Lane Hardy]

Update to 9 volt battery as a power supply, as I thought the 9 volt battery does work, but not very long, I had the battery attached to the my dust sensor and the battery lasted two weeks, longer than I expected. John was correct The 9 volt was not a good choice but I had it and it was good for testing the concept of the $4.10 sensor. I will be using a wall wart for the power supply.

[Dave Cav]

Anyone have a suggestion for an audible alarm? I got some cheap alarm buzzers from Amazon but I don't think they'll be loud enough. They'd be OK for an alarm clock or normal ambient conditions, but with a D/C and thickness planer running and wearing ear pro, I don't think so.

[John K Jordan]

Anyone have a suggestion for an audible alarm? I got some cheap alarm buzzers from Amazon but I don't think they'll be loud enough. They'd be OK for an alarm clock or normal ambient conditions, but with a D/C and thickness planer running and wearing ear pro, I don't think so.

The sensor/alarm device I bought from ClearVue uses an off-the-shelf fire alarm module. This has a bright strobe light and an audible alarm, powered by a low DC voltage. I'd have to take mine apart to see the exact brand and model number but a quick search shows a variety available, for example: https://www.systemsensor.com/en-us/Pages/AV-Horn-Strobes.aspx

Theirs came mounted on a red box but I removed it and wired it into the bin sensor and wireless remote circuitry I stuffed into a larger grey box from Home Depot. This thing will get your attention.

377020

JKJ

[Randy Hermann]

Lane, you are awesome for posting this! I was just looking at a DIY and saw the price of the sensor Oneida uses- crazy. I came across the sensor you used and figured someone must have tried it, thanks Google and thank you for posting. I just ordered my sensor for ~$3, shipped. I may not have it for a while, depending on shipping from China, but that $3 includes shipping.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/183505099268

Cheers!

[Matthew Curtis]

Has anyone had trouble with false alarms? If I am moving a lot of dust my sensor will alarm. As the volume decreases the ararm stops. Maybe I need to develop a shield inside the bin to limit the dust movement across the sensor. Any ideas would be helpful.

[Rod Sheridan]

Has anyone had trouble with false alarms? If I am moving a lot of dust my sensor will alarm. As the volume decreases the ararm stops. Maybe I need to develop a shield inside the bin to limit the dust movement across the sensor. Any ideas would be helpful.

Hi Matthew, I had that issue, it seems a short swirl of debris would go past the sensor, triggering it.

I built revision 2 with a time delay of 10 seconds.

Here's the information on what I built.

401246401247

[Matthew Curtis]

Hi Matthew, I had that issue, it seems a short swirl of debris would go past the sensor, triggering it.

I built revision 2 with a time delay of 10 seconds.

Here's the information on what I built.

401246401247

Rod. Where did you get the delay equipment?

[Chris Parks]

The cost of electronics these days is astoundingly cheap. We are developing a new gadget and getting the PCB made in China @ $2.86 each for ten units.

[Larry Frank]

I found the delay circuit (https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-12V-24V-Digital-LED-Infinite-Cycle-Delay-Timer-Switch-ON-OFF-Relay-Module-/122152930991?redirect=mobile) on eBay for $4.95. I used Google image search to find it.

[Dave Cav]

I built a home made system based on this thread last spring; it worked for about six months and has been dead for the last three months or so. I think the sensor failed. I may buy a new sensor and give it another try later but for now I just watch the window in the barrel.

[Paul Lawrence]

Lane, not trying to hijack your thread, but I have these switches laying around that I used in my "red-neck" outdoor pool ( :D ) to warn me of the water level changing.

Liquid Water Level Sensor Horizontal Float Switch (https://www.ebay.com/itm/2pcs-Liquid-Water-Level-Sensor-Horizontal-Float-Switch-For-Aquariums-Tank-Pool/181714999880?epid=27016166956&hash=item2a4f0eda48:g:CwwAAOSw5UFb5Bl~:rk:1:pf:0)

These have a simple reed switch in the stationary part and a magnet in the moving arm. I'm going to try them in my dust bucket, but I'm going to stack them vertically like I did in my pool. They will be wired in the #1 position or normally closed (see image) to keep the sawdust from clogging up the switch motion. The lower one will give a "yellow light" warning, and the upper one "red light" could actually control the power to the DC vacuum (with the right controller which I've already found for my pool .) A crafty person could glue a paddle or vane to the moving arm if needed for extending the reach.

Anyway, thanks for the idea that reminded me of my junk box! :D

402002

[Larry Frank]

I have all the parts ordered including the delay circuit. I am amazed at the cheap price and free shipping on the electronic devices from China. They are on a slow boat but will eventually get here.

[Larry Frank]

Who has built the sensor using the delay board and what settings did you use? Rod Sheridan helped me with what he did but I still can not get it to work.

I am very inexperienced with electronics and struggling with this. I may just find a relay board and use it without the delay part. If the light comes on occasionally, that is fine. Now, I just need to find the right relay board.

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi Larry, what problem are you experiencing?

I used a 10 second delay on mine............Rod.

Here's the drawing for mine. I've included a drawing for the PNP and the NPN sensor.

[Darrell Bade]

I bought a din rail timer from allied electronics for about 20 bucks. Set it for 30 seconds. I have it close a contactor in the power circuit and shut the collector off. As another note I also used a din rail power supply for about 15 bucks that eliminated the wall wart.

[Larry Frank]

Thanks to Ron Sheridan, I have my sensor and delay timer figured out and ready for installation. I will post pictures of it when installed.

[Kris Cook]

I am gathering pieces and parts to build one of these gizmos for the new shop. I am planning to use the delay timer as I think that is a good idea. I am planning to put everything in a sealed box, and was thinking of using a "dust-proof" box. I may also install a magnehelic gauge in the same enclosure to keep everything semi-tidy.

So, flashing light, and maybe a siren mounted on the face (lid) of the box, timer inside the box.

My question: Does anyone that has installed one of these know if the timer generates any appreciable heat? Would I need a vented enclosure?

Also thinking about activating a relay from the timer to power down the DC. If I do that I would put the relay in its own enclosure.

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi Kris, a sealed box is fine for the timer, it will not overheat....Rod

[Kris Cook]

Thanks Rod.

[Rod Sheridan]

You're welcome Kris, I look forward to hearing how you like your level sensor.............Rod.

[Larry Frank]

I finished my bin sensor today using the delay circuit and it works great. I will post some pictures of it in a day or so.

[Rod Sheridan]

I finished my bin sensor today using the delay circuit and it works great. I will post some pictures of it in a day or so.

Glad to hear that you are happy with it........Rod.

[Chris Holder]

Hey guys, super information! I built this based on the design. I am just finishing with the install of my clearvue 1800. Question: I ran the clearvue with flex hose into 6" PVC and noticed appreciable static build up. This is not surprising from what I've heard, especially on dry days and when using flex hose in conjunction with PVC. I got zapped a couple of times and then noticed that the static was discharging (arc-ing across the O-ring visibly and audibly) into the sensor. I shut it down and checked and my power supply for the sensor was fried. I had to order a new one, but I am guessing that the sensor is likely fried too. Anyone else have a similar issue? I am using a steel 55 gal drum for my collection barrell. Any thoughts on how to avoid this going forward?
Thanks,
Chris Holder

[Kris Cook]

Wow. Hopefully someone will chime in that has dealt with this specifically. A couple of thoughts/questions that might help:

Do you have anything else in the circuit; just wall wart with power going through the sensor to a light?

Where are the components mounted?

At a minimum I would think you would want to ground the steel drum. You can do that by using a bonding jumper from the DC ground or run a separate ground from a bonding lug on the drum to ground.

[Chris Holder]

That's right. Simple wall wart power supply to the sensor. My first thought was to ground the drum separately, maybe with a mag ground to avoid putting another hole in it, but just not sure as I've read so much conflicting info about trying to ground PVC DC pipe.

[Kris Cook]

I agree it is confusing on PVC and static in general.

You can't really ground PVC - any grounding is providing a "drain" for static to dissipate.

I have seen everything from spiral wrapping with copper wire, to running foil tape inside and/or outside, to doing nothing at all.

I still haven't decided whether I am using metal or plastic pipe for my DC system on the new shop build.

One thing I would say about using a magnetic grounding connection - you will need good metal to metal contact. If your drum is painted you would want to at a minimum remove the paint in the area of the connection. I would think a properly sealed hole near the top of the drum for a proper grounding connector wouldn't be an issue.

Keep us posted.

[Larry Frank]

The top of my card board dust bin is metal and grounded. My sensor is mounted in the metal lid.

[Kris Cook]

Still waiting on those pictures Larry...:rolleyes:

[George Yetka]

Built this, seems to work well. 1 thing i did notice is the sensor has a rectangular shape so i drilled a hole and caulked it. I havent reached a fill yet so im not 100% it works but it does work when i wave my hand over it.

[Rod Sheridan]

Hey guys, super information! I built this based on the design. I am just finishing with the install of my clearvue 1800. Question: I ran the clearvue with flex hose into 6" PVC and noticed appreciable static build up. This is not surprising from what I've heard, especially on dry days and when using flex hose in conjunction with PVC. I got zapped a couple of times and then noticed that the static was discharging (arc-ing across the O-ring visibly and audibly) into the sensor. I shut it down and checked and my power supply for the sensor was fried. I had to order a new one, but I am guessing that the sensor is likely fried too. Anyone else have a similar issue? I am using a steel 55 gal drum for my collection barrell. Any thoughts on how to avoid this going forward?
Thanks,
Chris Holder

Hi Chris, I assume that you have a steel drum lid?

If so, ground the lid, as it doesn't get removed from the cyclone..........I have a steel cyclone which of course is grounded so I don't have the static issue........Rod.

[Scott Rathburn]

Hey guys, I've have this setup wired and working with the time delay, but I'm having trouble finding the right settings for the time delay (P1 - P8 and timing to keep light on when bin is full but not for false trips if possible).
Thanks
Scott Rathburn

[Larry Frank]

Rod Sheridan has posted the wiring diagram and the programming. The info is in the sticky about my setup.

[Andrew More]

Just got mine installed today. This is A M A Z I N G. Got everything together and it just works. Also did a little soldering for the second time ever. Thanks a million for posting this with complete details!

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