Using Dominos Without The Festool Investment

[George Bokros]

In a recent issue of Woodsmith magazine (Vol 39 / No 230) there is an article discussing using 8 mm dominos but cutting the mortise with a 5/16 router bit or end mill. If my math is correct the 8 mm domino is thicker than 5/16 not by much but it is still thicker.

5/16 = .3125
8 mm= .31496

Difference is the domino is .00246 thicker than 5/16.

This being said will the domino fit into the mortise and allow for glue? If the domino was that much thinner than 5/16 then I think it would work. Is the accuracy of the mortise cut with the router bit off that much or more?

Thoughts and opinions?

Thanks

[Floyd Mah]

A piece of paper is 0.0035 to 0.005 inches in thickness. It would seem that the 8 mm domino is so close to a 5/16 mortise that you can just swipe the side of a domino on a piece of sandpaper and get as good a fit as with the 8 mm bit/domino combination. The other consideration is that it is common for people to make their own "dominos" for convenience or even cost, so the real convenience of the domino is being able to make matching cuts on your work pieces quickly.

[Dave Richards]

You're assuming the 8mm Domino is really 8mm thick and that the 5/16 in. router bit is really 5/16 in. and there's no run out in the router. The difference in thickness is a thin human hair.

[Cary Falk]

The Dominos that I had fit the slots pretty tight. Some I had to remove with a pliers. I can't imagine getting them to fit if the slot was smaller. It would be cheaper to make your own Dominos

[Mike Kreinhop]

Why not use an 8mm up-cut spiral router bit?

http://www.eagleamerica.com/product/v106-0372/ea_-_spiral_bits

[Jim Dwight]

If the jig to guide the router has a tiny bit of "slop" in it, that could also make the slot a little wider.

[Prashun Patel]

Buy the right sized bit, if you are using store-bought dominos.

However (I'm in the minority here), I prefer to make my own dominos/loose tenons. For dominos < 10mm, if you don't have the right roundover bit, you can just chamfer the edges.

I hand plane them for a perfect fit. I know there's irony in this, but once you have a good set up (for shooting) it goes extremely fast, and gives you more width and depth flexibility.

[glenn bradley]

Tenons are not a one-size-fits-all sort of thing so making my own makes sense in my shop. I make loose tenon stock out of spoil from the project. I generally end up with extra but, it doesn't take up much room either in stick form or pre-cut to length. Is there a reason you want to use commercial Dominoes instead?

[Jim Becker]

I absolutely agree with Mike...use a cutter that's sized appropriately for the tenon stock you intend to use.

That said, Festool's dominos are not inexpensive. For many folks, they acquire the tool and other than the initial supply of Festool produced tenons, they ultimately start making their own tenon stock from scrap. Not everybody, because for some commercial operators, time is money and making the dominos would use unavailable time. I recently bought a Domino 700 XL and did acquire an initial supply of stock. But I'm already planning on the setups to make my own domino stock going forward.

[John TenEyck]

Pick whatever router bit you want to use and make loose tenons to fit the mortises. It's a simple process. Spiral upcut router bits cut amazingly consistent mortises quickly and easily. But recognize that mortises in edge grain vs. end grain may vary, which requires a little massaging on one end of the tenons so they fit the smaller mortise. Usually all it takes a few swipes on a piece of sandpaper.

I intentionally make tenon stock at least 1/16" narrower than the mortises they will fit into. That makes everything easier with milling and glue up.

John

[Edwin Santos]

Pick whatever router bit you want to use and make loose tenons to fit the mortises. It's a simple process. Spiral upcut router bits cut amazingly consistent mortises quickly and easily. But recognize that mortises in edge grain vs. end grain may vary, which requires a little massaging on one end of the tenons so they fit the smaller mortise. Usually all it takes a few swipes on a piece of sandpaper.

I intentionally make tenon stock at least 1/16" narrower than the mortises they will fit into. That makes everything easier with milling and glue up.

John
+1 on this. There's nothing magical about a Festool Domino. All the device is doing is making traditional loose tenon/slip tenon joinery more convenient and faster. In other words, the machine is the special thing, not the tenons.

The nice thing about loose tenons is you can just make them quickly in a variety of ways from whatever stock you have lying around. Sometimes I use baltic birch plywood for tenons. Like John T., I mill them (slightly) undersized so they don't seize up once glue hits them and we're in the middle of assembly.

[Mike Henderson]

To me, the big advantage of the Domino system is the tool that makes the mortise, not the loose tenon. It's quick, easy and accurate. I'd rather go the other way and use the tool and make my own dominoes, if I had to only choose one.

Mike

[Simon MacGowen]

Don't forget the humidity factor.

Anyone who builds a lot of cabinet/furniture pieces has no excuse not to have a DJ if they are serious about efficiency or productivity.

The costs of dominoes compared to the lumber costs and my time I spend on a typical furniture project are immaterial. I also do not make my own dominoes as the time spent on set-up and fine-tuning isn't worth it. I would rather use such time on project building. The two local cabinetmakers I know swear they can't AFFORD not to use factory dominoes. One guy is British and always likes to say he is not a penny-wise, pound foolish woodworker. I am not going to argue with them when they make custom cabinets for a living?

Simon

[George Bokros]

I have made loose tenon stock for my Mortise Pal setup but thought it might be easier to just pre made tenon material hence my interest in the article in WoodSmith.

Thanks for all the replys. I will keep making my loose tenons.

[Chris Fournier]

Pick whatever router bit you want to use and make loose tenons to fit the mortises. It's a simple process. Spiral upcut router bits cut amazingly consistent mortises quickly and easily. But recognize that mortises in edge grain vs. end grain may vary, which requires a little massaging on one end of the tenons so they fit the smaller mortise. Usually all it takes a few swipes on a piece of sandpaper.

I intentionally make tenon stock at least 1/16" narrower than the mortises they will fit into. That makes everything easier with milling and glue up.

John

Floating tenons. Age old idea that still works, uses common place tools found in the shop. My favourite door and furniture building joint. Make you mortises, then make your tenons. Simple as pie. Saves you money too! John's advice on fitment is spot on in my experience.

[John TenEyck]

Don't forget the humidity factor.

Anyone who builds a lot of cabinet/furniture pieces has no excuse not to have a DJ if they are serious about efficiency or productivity.

The costs of dominoes compared to the lumber costs and my time I spend on a typical furniture project are immaterial. I also do not make my own dominoes as the time spent on set-up and fine-tuning isn't worth it. I would rather use such time on project building. The two local cabinetmakers I know swear they can't AFFORD not to use factory dominoes. One guy is British and always likes to say he is not a penny-wise, pound foolish woodworker. I am not going to argue with them when they make custom cabinets for a living?

Simon

Humidity is another reason to make your own tenon stock. Dominos can change thickness as the RH changes, but if you make your tenon stock while building your project you tune them to fit, so they fit.

I get the argument for buying Dominos vs. making your own loose tenon stock if you are pro; your time is money. A hobbiest may choose to buy them, too, but the justification for doing so is different. Me? I'm cheap, so I'll make them. I can make a whole project's worth of tenon stock in 15 or 20 minutes, and from scrap that would otherwise go in the wood stove. But the real advantage in making your own tenon stock is you can custom size them to the application, both in width and length. You can't do that with Dominos; you have to use what they offer. I hate being pigeon-holed.

John

[jack duren]

Don't forget the humidity factor.

Anyone who builds a lot of cabinet/furniture pieces has no excuse not to have a DJ if they are serious about efficiency or productivity.

The costs of dominoes compared to the lumber costs and my time I spend on a typical furniture project are immaterial. I also do not make my own dominoes as the time spent on set-up and fine-tuning isn't worth it. I would rather use such time on project building. The two local cabinetmakers I know swear they can't AFFORD not to use factory dominoes. One guy is British and always likes to say he is not a penny-wise, pound foolish woodworker. I am not going to argue with them when they make custom cabinets for a living?

Simon

As a commercial/cabinet maker I don't find a use for the Domino. As far as being a furniture maker I don't care for them and only use it because the company expects me too...

[mreza Salav]

Everybody works differently but I agree that DJ is an invaluable tool. I started with the 500 and then changed to 700 (with the adapter to use 500 bits too). Incredibly fast and accurate. For mitered cabinet doors it's excellent. And in so many other situations.