Kitchen Knives

[Andrew Kertesz]

I'm curious what everybody uses to sharpen their kitchen knives. I'm ashamed to say it but my are in need of serious work. Any suggestions?

[Sam Murdoch]

Here is a guided steel jig that is quite popular. Though I don't use one, it is discussed and recommended by some on a blade forum. See the caution about not using it for "fine edge elite knives or Japanese knives". This is not a sharpener as much as an edge keeper. The two exclusions are likely because the edge angle on these is too acute to be properly guided without reprofiling the knives.

https://www.amazon.com/Taylors-Chantry-Knife-Sharpener-White/dp/B000IXHING/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8 (https://www.amazon.com/Taylors-Chantry-Knife-Sharpener-White/dp/B000IXHING/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8)

I use the Spyderco Tri-Angle sharpmaker - https://www.spyderco.com/catalog/details/204MF/77 This is a simple use device that is also small enough to remain on your counter (or work bench) and requires little practice to use for consistent results. It DOES SHARPEN - rather than simply "steel" the edge.

HOWEVER - it too has its limitations. The 15° or 20° angle (per side) that it is set up to maintain will not work for 10° angles on Japanes knives and some other thin blades. Also, if your blade is damaged more than just being dull - the standard two stone set could take hours to reprofile the knife edge. I have a set of diamond rods that are more aggressive as starter stones but real bad edges are best to be sent out to someone equipped for reprofiling blades. This is not likely your situation.

For maintaining sharp edges on all your knives the Sharpmaker is very convenient. Initially you might actually be changing the angle on some of your blades using this device but once you have established the 15° on each side it will be easy and fun to never have a dull knife. I find that the 15° is pretty near perfect for nearly all MY cutting needs. I use the 20° only for knives that require a more rugged edge - wood knives for example. Not to overwhelm - but my pocket knives are sharpened with a primary 15° bevel and than I add a 20° micro bevel.

Of course as a woodworker you probably know how to use wet stones and free hand sharpen but the guided systems allow anyone to keep their knife blade edges keen without oils or water and years of practice.

[Jim Becker]

I use my water stones from time to time, but have a few that I've not been able to "get there" like I prefer. I just discovered a local service that generally caters to the restaurant trade, but is now also accepting knives from homeowners at scheduled events. I plan on having them bring these more difficult knives back to spec. My Zwilling knives can be sent in to them for factory re-sharpening...for free...if I need something besides just honing.

[Kevin Perez]

I use a Chef's Choice 120 Diamond sharpener. It works well, even when my wife or kids dent or nick the edge. (*%$#!)

[andrew whicker]

I like this style:

http://a.co/hYjgJlk

[Jamie Buxton]

...I use the Spyderco Tri-Angle sharpmaker - https://www.spyderco.com/catalog/details/204MF/77 ...

Amazon sells it at a 40% discount.

[Mike Henderson]

I use my Shapton water stones and then power hone on a leather wheel.

And if you're looking for a great chef's knife, check out the LiquidDiamond (https://www.liquidiamondknives.com/)knives. I have one and have given them as gifts to cooking friends. The blade is laminated with a hard steel interior. The edge doesn't roll over, like softer steel does, but it will eventually chip if you use it for chopping. It will stay very sharp for a VERY long time. Here's (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XHWN81R/ref=asc_df_B06XHWN81R5231384/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=395033&creativeASIN=B06XHWN81R&linkCode=df0&hvadid=194953585597&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=18024490080656859623&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9031596&hvtargid=pla-312940468468)the knife at Amazon

Mike

[Mike Null]

My Henckels are 25 years old and I use a ceramic "steel" I got many years ago then I use the standard steel that came with the set. I do this about once a month on the most often used knives. Never would use any kind of grinding device. I have used my diamond stones once in a while.

[David Bassett]

It depends. (Sorry, but....) At least you narrowed it down to Kitchen knives. (All knives would be like going to the General sub-forum and asking "How do I sharpen?" You'd get everything from swap your carbide inserts from the machine guys to hone on Spanish horse butt leather (under a new moon) from some of the straight edge razor guys. :) Narrowing it to kitchen knives is more like asking in the Neander sub-forum and having the turners chime in with their grinders and the carvers with their slips & strops.) Which knives? The profile & grind vary by region / tradition, as does the target hardness. The quality of materials and craftsmanship also vary and affect how you sharpen (which stones & which grits) most effectively.

Typically, Western knives target a softer (less chippy) working edge and require a greater included angle for a sustainable edge. Japanese knives traditionally are single bevel, but now offer many types of double bevel western-style knives too. These tend to be much harder and are often laminated. Both styles also vary between the high quality well made knives and the mass produced mass market clones, causing a huge overlap and variation in characteristics. Also, many traditional "big names" in the US have expanded from their traditional Western-style lines into hybrid(?) models trying to exploit the emerging market for Japanese (style) knives.

In general, most (successful) kitchen knife sharpening seems to be free hand. (Because of the organic curves of edge, most jigs don't "swoop" correctly and make facets as small regions are sharpened.) The Sharp Maker helps, with two specific bevel angles, but is frowned upon for higher end knives on the theory it stresses the edge with it's (nearly) point contact and inflexible angle control. The high-end grinder sharpeners get mixed reviews. Again they have a fixed angle and while they could in theory grind a well shaped edge and the user could guide along the curved edge, my one experience was very poor. Most common way is to just use stones, at least for honing & most sharpening. (Pros will use belt grinders, or powered stones, for the initial edge setting and any heavy repairs.)

As far as grits, general consensus seems to be kitchen knives don't need much more than a 1K-6K finish, depending on the specific use & blade steel & tempering. (Sushi / sashimi knives being a notable exception, often being taken to 10K & beyond.) Soft (cheap) stainless knives being an extreme example where they are difficult to abrade to sharpen, but don't hold an edge well, where a 220-400 grit finish, maybe with a quick 1K finish/hone, seems the most successful plan of attack.

Sorry, for my rambles. (You want difference of options that make the sharpening threads here look like complete consensus... start searching the knife forums. Better, tell us what you've got to sharpen and to sharpen with and I'm sure we can make suggestions to make it work.)

[Edwin Santos]

I don't feel any woodworker should need to send knives out or buy a special knife sharpener. If you have a Tormek or similar power honing system, use that. If you simply use waterstones or oilstones, use those though you do not necessarily need to go to a superfine high grit like you would for polishing a chisel or plane iron. There are those that believe that a kitchen knife should have a little "tooth".
If the technique of hand honing on a flat stone is a challenge, then I highly recommend one of the hand held folding diamond hones from DMT, probably the the red one they call Fine, not the green Extra Fine. It is quite easy to hold the knife point down with a little pressure on a piece of scrap wood, move the hone down the blade at an angle of about 20-25 degrees. Or if it's easier for you, you could hold the hone fixed flat on the bench and move the knife. Either way works. Just a few strokes with a diamond hone is enough, maybe 4-6. Your knife will be razor sharp which is the safest kind of knife to use in the kitchen. This works very well for the little paring knives, boning knives, and thinner filleting knives also.

Using a steel in the kitchen routinely between honings will extend the life of the edge quite a bit. Hope this is helpful.

[Izzy Camire]

https://lansky.com/index.php/products/dlx-5-stone-system/
I have used a Landsky sharpener for over 25 years. Gets the kitchen knives nice and sharp.

[Rod Sheridan]

I use a combination of a belt grinder with different abrasives and a waterstone.

Regards, Rod.

[Andrew Hughes]

I use my tormek and Shapton stones. I also the round steel to draw out the edge. I do have one High carbon steel knive that only touches my Shapton stones. It's a Effingham blackjack, made in America.

[Shawn Pixley]

No Tormek or other method for hollow grinding here. I just use my waterstones on my kitchen knives. Most are Messermeister. A couple are from other brands. The Chicago Cutlery chef’s knife gets very sharp but nicks and chips easily. The Messermeister chef’s knife doesn’t nick easily and is more difficult to sharpen. I take the Chicago Cutlerly knife to a sharpener with a industrial belt. Saves time when I need it every couple of years or so. He gets out the nicks. I sharpen and hone on the stones. I sharpen as finely as I am able to 12,000 grit. If I need a “tooth” on a knife (tomatoes or bread), I use the serrated bread knife.

I steel the knives with each use. My knives are used heavily but are cared for well.

[Sam Murdoch]

Amazon sells it at a 40% discount.


I linked the Spyderco web site as a source for the great overview video of Sal Glesser of Spyderco demonstrating the use of the Sharpmaker. Yeah, I never buy anything from Spyderco at their catalog pricing. Plenty of sources that offer this for in the < $50.00 to $65.00 range. Worth the money in my estimation.

Anyway - watch the video (and other reviews on the famous y-tube. The learning curve to use one of these is very shallow if you have any hand to eye coordination AND, as I wrote, it is a tool that can be readily available (easily portable too) so that you never need to neglect your knives.

The unquestionable downside is the limiting angles. There are videos on how to compensate but that enters another realm of effort that mitigates the ease of use of the basic tool. Many store bought knives are perfunctorily sharpened - at best - and/or one side of the edge is at a different angle than the other. That means they need some serious work to establish a functioning apex that will allow you to consistently sharpen to a fine edge. Therefore a knife introduced to the Sharpmaker may require an extra effort or repeated sharpenings before you achieve the optimum results. This could be the same using any system short of grinding. Not all knives come ready to work OR they have been so neglected that it takes work to establish a great cutting edge. Once the edge is properly "trained" you will easily keep your knife edges tuned up with the Sharpmaker. I use mine 4 or 5 times each week and have found no better "simple" or more versatile solution - Lansky, Wicked Edge, KME, bench stones (natural or synthetic) or powered equipment, included.

[Jim Koepke]

I like this style:

http://a.co/hYjgJlk

That link doesn't work.

jtk

[Adam Herman]

I bring mine to the guy and the Farmers market, he also has an industrial shop for saw blades and anything else you want sharpened. I can even drop the knives with my blades if want!

He uses and slack belt that is mounted to his tailgate, available every Thursday evening to sharpen while you shop.

I LOVE good, old carbon steel knives. I have several that were my moms, and maybe someones before that. Eventually they will get sharpened down too far, but for now I can slice a tomato you can see through, or spatchcock a chicken with ease. We also have some Japanese Damascus from Shun that are a joy and please the loml's aesthetic sensibilities. My old carbon steels are not really lookers, and I get testy if they are left to rust with the stainless in the sink.

[andrew whicker]

here's a better link: https://v-sharp.com/

Looks like they are going out of business though! Could get a pretty good deal. Anyway, this is a cool style. Just slide it thru a few times.

Whoa! These guys are getting bad reviews left and right. Maybe they gave up. I'm not sure if this is the brand I've used before at my parents house. Here's a different brand, same idea:

https://brodandtaylor.com/knife-sharpening/

[Perry Hilbert Jr]

When tthe house and shop burned down, Mrs. and I decided that because we were "starting over" we would buy better quality to replace what we had. The cheap paring knives are Henckles and the good butcher knives are the better quality Wusthoff. I have two very old very fine oil stones of unknown source that survived the fire and do better then any other sharpening I have found or tried. I figure if I can slice a dead ripe tomato so thin, I can read through it, that is plenty sharp for kitchen work. And speaking of kids. We have 2 grown children who know better then to touch the good knives. Despite the stainless steel for the kitchen, I still prefer the old hollow ground carbon steel knives for butchering. And so do many other farm families in the area. One "plain goods" store in the region still sells the carbon steel butcher knives and does a good business in that line of merchandise. They cater to Amish and Mennonite populations and carry a great many odd items, like replacement parts for kerosene lamps and lanterns.

[Phil Mueller]

Paul Sellers has a YouTube video on How To Sharpen A Knife. I haven’t tried it yet, but looks like it would work well.

[Roger Bell]

There are many methods of achieving a sharp edge and once one becomes competent in any one method, it will work just fine.

For many years, I sharpened kitchen knives either by hand on stones, or quick and dirty on a 1" belt sander.

Now, I have settled the Apex system for kitchen knives. There are several packages available price wise, as well as differing types of water stones available. It is a jigged system somewhat similar to the Lansky, but much, more accurate in duplicating the original factory bevel and doing so quickly.

https://www.chefknivestogo.com/edgeproapex3.html

For field knives, I sharpen to a convex edge by hand and use SiC paper on an old mouse pad, and then strop.

[Ruperto Mendiones]

Tormek with their knife jig. Keeps a better edge than I could do by hand alone.

[Jim Koepke]

There are many methods of achieving a sharp edge and once one becomes competent in any one method, it will work just fine.

+1 on that.

Kitchen knife maintenance is about the only use for my diamond stones. The diamond stones stay in the kitchen. When a knife gets a few nicks or about twice a year they get taken to the shop.

If they need a touch extra a Veritas Mk II Power Sharpening System (http://www.leevalley.com/us/Wood/page.aspx?p=48435&cat=1,43072) gets the heavy lifting.

For the handwork my water stones are preferred.

If the water in the shop is frozen, then the oilstones are put to the task.

My wife once complained about the knives being "too sharp." It turns out she hadn't realized the knives had been sharpened. She didn't notice me carrying all the knives out to the shop and then washing them after bringing them back in a little while later. So now she gets told when the knives are freshly sharpened.

Over in the Neanderthal Haven there is a discussion of measuring sharpness. To me, as it seems to be with some others, thin slices of a ripe tomato is good enough for in the kitchen.

jtk

[Dave Zellers]

My wife once complained about the knives being "too sharp." It turns out she hadn't realized the knives had been sharpened.

Same here- we've experienced a few cuts since I started sharpening our kitchen knives.

Now I put a sticky note in the knife drawer that says SHARP! after I sharpen them to remind us both. I'm still learning but when I get it right you don't feel a thing until it's too late.

[Jim Becker]

A sharp-sharp knife is a safe-safe knife... ;)

[Matt Meiser]

It sounds like I'm a total hack compared to everyone above. We have Henkels knives I got at Target 20+ years ago when I had my first apartment. I have one of the worksharp knife sharpeners and think they cut really well after I use it.

[Edwin Santos]

There are many methods of achieving a sharp edge and once one becomes competent in any one method, it will work just fine.



Further to your point, in one kitchen where I worked, the sous chef used to grab the nearest ceramic bowl and give her knife a few strokes across the unglazed ring on the underside of the bowl and voila. The light bulb went off and I realized there was no difference between what she was doing and the ceramic knife sharpeners that people buy.

[Richard McComas]

Chefs Choice 1520 Fast and easy


https://www.amazon.com/Chefs-Choice-AngleSelect-Diamond-Sharpener-White/dp/B001CA5LZ6

[Andy Giddings]

We're both keen cooks in our house (hardly ever eat out) so sharp knives are a must - we use an Edge Pro Apex 3 system. Only needs doing about once every 3-4 months and then using the finest two stones. In between we use a ceramic steel to keep the edge aligned http://www.edgeproinc.com/Apex-Model-Edge-Pro-System-c3/

[Rob Matarazzo]

Paul Sellers has a YouTube video on How To Sharpen A Knife. I haven’t tried it yet, but looks like it would work well.

I've tried it, and it does in fact work well. However, it does make a lot of nasty scratches on the blade of the knife.

For the past year, I've been using the Chestnut Tools Universal Sharpener that I bought from Lee Valley. Costs about $20, is easy to use, and works very well.

[Mike Null]

I should mention my wife's knife habit. Even at 75 she cooks most every day and she is good at it but large knives are hard for her to handle and she always reaches for her 3" and 4" Henckels paring knives. Those are the knives I sharpen almost every week using my ceramic steel. The boning knife is one of my favorites and razor sharp but she refuses to use it.

[roger wiegand]

I keep a small two-sided DMT diamond stone in the knife drawer and give them quick touch-up frequently. Seems to work just fine. If I had to take them out to a shop or to an outside sharpener it would probably never happen.

[David Helm]

I have a diamond sharpening steel. I generally run a few swipes over that before I start cutting. Works well. Mike Null, why do you say "even at 75"? I too am at that age and cook every day. 75 isn't yet old, but we may be able to see old from here.

[Andrew Kertesz]

I thought a steel/ceramic rod were meant to fine tune the edge so to speak and not actually sharpen it...

[Frank Pratt]

I seem to be the designated knife sharpening guy for all my families households & have been using my waterstones. They work very well, but I'm not great at freehand sharpening & it gets pretty tedious doing it that way. So I just bought a WorkSharp KO sharpening machine, basically just a small belt sander with graduated grit belts. It's had good reviews & I see no reason why it won't work well. I'll find out in a couple of days.

As has been mentioned, there are many good ways to do the job, you just need to find the method that works for you.

[David Helm]

I thought a steel/ceramic rod were meant to fine tune the edge so to speak and not actually sharpen it...

his is a diamond steel and is used for sharpening. I also use a regular steel for edge fine tuning.
T

[Bruce Wrenn]

First, most of my knives are Chicago Cuttery (pre Walmart) rescued from thrift stores. I use an AccuSharp (about $10 at local farm store,) along with a Dexter diamond hone. The Accusharp is a couple carbide burrs. I also have a Smith's sharpener from Lowes, which in addition to carbide burrs, has a pair of ceramic rods for dressing edges. For my ULU's, use the sharpener sold by the ULU Factory

[Jim Becker]

Bruce, I have a whole bunch of older Chicago Cutlery knives and they are decent when sharp. I only keep a couple in the drawer at this point as I much prefer the Zwilling Pros and Globals as well as the Nikiri I built from a Woodcraft kit. The remainder will go to our daughters when and if they ever move out on their own. :)

[Shawn Pixley]

Like Jim, I have one Chicago Cutlery knife among the cooking utensils. It does get nicely sharp when sharpened. They tend to dull quickly and nick relatively easily. The Messermeister and japanese knives I have are more difficult to sharpen but stay sharp longer. Sounds like a conversation about chisels, right?

My fillet knife has been known to pass the hanging hair test. It of course, dulls on fish skin (Yellowtail and Tuna have tough skin).

[Jim Koepke]

Further to your point, in one kitchen where I worked, the sous chef used to grab the nearest ceramic bowl and give her knife a few strokes across the unglazed ring on the underside of the bowl and voila. The light bulb went off and I realized there was no difference between what she was doing and the ceramic knife sharpeners that people buy.

Many years ago one of my first knives was a Mac (Japanese) paring knife. The instructions indicated this was the only acceptable way to sharpen this particular knife.

Before having any sharpening stones at my disposal this was the only way the knife was sharpened. Now my waterstones or oilstones get the work.

jtk

[Bruce Wrenn]

Bruce, The remainder will go to our daughters when and if they ever move out on their own. :)You recently retired, and your daughters still live at home? Something is wrong in this picture

[Jim Becker]

You recently retired, and your daughters still live at home? Something is wrong in this picture
Older daughter is special needs adult (age 22) wiht mental health issues who is not capable of supporting herself on her own...we're working on that with SSA, etc., to hopefully make that possible someday. Younger daughter is a full time university student (age 18) and lives at home because it saves us $10K+ a year in room/board. Both girls work part time outside the home for above minimum wages (older = florist at a local supermarket; younger running the host crew at a local restaurant) and are required to contribute to the household, if not financially, in helping to keep things tidy.

The Older is now covering cooking Friday night meals under my tutelage as part of that and to learn how to prepare meals now in anticipation of having to do that for herself someday. She's also charged with maintaining the cleanliness of the kitchen so I can concentrate on the meals rather than the clean-up. The Younger bakes us cookies in addition to maintaining the "public" areas of the home. :)

It's different but it works! Not much has changed for me since retiring from full time work a little over a month ago since my office was at home for over 20 years and I'm doing the same things in the house as previous. What's changed is that I'm doing 10,000 different projects and am busier than I was before. LOL

[Andrew Pitonyak]

I have used numerous methods to sharpen knives. I have used the Tormek, it worked. Usually, however, if the knife is appropriate for it, I just use the work sharp knife sharpener. I have an older high grit polishing belt that I have applied green honing compound to. Does a great job. I consider this fool proof if it is appropriate to your knives.

https://www.amazon.com/Work-Sharp-Knife-Tool-Sharpener/dp/B003IT5F14

I have at least two different systems that hold a sharpening medium in a "V" shape. THe idea is that you hold the knife vertical, then "cut" down the sharpener. This sets your angle. It is very fast and easy to use. This is one example of one.... not one that I own, but an example.

https://www.amazon.com/Lansky-2D2C-Diamond-Ceramic-Four/dp/B008EKY5OA

One of my "V" sharpeners has triangle shaped stones, and you can sharpen against either a flat or a point. I forget the name. I also have one with round ceramic stones. By round, I mean a long cylinder. It is simple, fast, and pretty reliable.

You want something that reliably uses the same angle.

I found that I was able to get a very nice edge using my water stones, but, it was far more work than either of the other two. If your stones are always setup up and ready to go, however, you can touch them up as often as you need to.

The knife that I usually use, I keep sharp on a steel, and then I sometimes do a serious sharpening. The knifes used by the rest of my family, well, i never know what they are doing with those. I think they are using them to cut stone or something since I cannot keep them sharp. I mean, i get them sharp, then next time I check them, they are very dull, so the steel does not work from that state.

[Jim Koepke]

I'm doing the same things in the house as previous. What's changed is that I'm doing 10,000 different projects and am busier than I was before. LOL

After retirement one often starts to do so many things it makes them wonder how they ever found time to hold down a job.


The knifes used by the rest of my family, well, i never know what they are doing with those. I think they are using them to cut stone or something since I cannot keep them sharp. I mean, i get them sharp, then next time I check them, they are very dull, so the steel does not work from that state.

One bad habit many people have is to scrape things from the cutting board into a pot. This is okay if one uses the back of the knife. Many people use the cutting edge for scraping which tends to dull it quicker. Another possible dulling action is to cut things on a plate instead of a cutting board.

jtk

[Stephen Tashiro]

I'm curious what everybody uses to sharpen their kitchen knives. I'm ashamed to say it but my are in need of serious work.

Do you do a lot of cooking?

My method is not to sharpen kitchen knives.

If I sharpened them to the fine edge that professional cooks advocate then I'd get some bad cuts. Since I don't prepare a lot of food or need to do it quickly, it's satisfactory for me to let the knives get somewhat dull and use a little extra pressure and time.

[Jim Becker]

One bad habit many people have is to scrape things from the cutting board into a pot. This is okay if one uses the back of the knife. Many people use the cutting edge as for scraping which tends to dull it quicker.

I actually do this, but with my Nakiri, which is wide, flat and thin, it hasn't been an issue. The cutting board is wood and the angle is nearly flat..it's not so much scraping as sliding it under the cut/chopped veggies and scooping them up. Perhaps it's the specific knife, but it stays sharper than any other knife in the drawer outside of my Zwilling prep knife.

[Jim Koepke]

I actually do this, but with my Nakiri, which is wide, flat and thin, it hasn't been an issue. The cutting board is wood and the angle is nearly flat..it's not so much scraping as sliding it under the cut/chopped veggies and scooping them up. Perhaps it's the specific knife, but it stays sharper than any other knife in the drawer outside of my Zwilling prep knife.

More likely the method is what spares the edge since it isn't being dragged across the board.

jtk

[Jim Koepke]

Do you do a lot of cooking?

My method is not to sharpen kitchen knives.

If I sharpened them to the fine edge that professional cooks advocate then I'd get some bad cuts. Since I don't prepare a lot of food or need to do it quickly, it's satisfactory for me to let the knives get somewhat dull and use a little extra pressure and time.

This is part of why a dull knife can be more dangerous than a sharp knife. More pressure is needed and a dull knife is likely to slip off of what is intended to be cut. A sharp knife is less likely to slip across a surface as it will penetrate where it is placed on an item.

jtk

[Pat Barry]

I agree with Jim. A sharp blades cuts what you want to cut with much less effort. Needing high effort leads to mistakes and injuries. I think you should re-assess your methods of cutting.