Drawer slides - I'm so angry I can't think straight - need advice

[Tom Jones III]

A friend of mine, who doesn't have a lot of money, was flooded in the hurricane. This is a nice family, hardworking and kind, but without much money. Exactly the type of people that you love to help. After we dried out his house I offered to rebuild his kitchen for him.

I typically use Blum slides but I was trying to save a little money on this project so I ordered Accuride 3832C Full Extension Slide Self-Close Slides. I wanted to give him a nicer kitchen than he had before, so I made 12 drawers out of solid poplar with hand-cut dovetails. Given the amount of work being done on the drawers I printed the Accuride instructions and followed them meticulously.

I went to his house yesterday to install the drawers. The first drawer was really tight, I had to use a lot of force to close it. I assumed that I had made the drawer too big so I moved on to the next drawer. It was also too tight. So I moved on to the third drawer, yes too tight as well. At this point I was frustrated so I took out my hand plane and planed off a 1/16" from the sides, still too tight, so I planed off another 1/16". Mostly I'm angry at myself, I rushed into working without slowing down to think. I checked the drawers and they are very square and they were exactly the right size, at least they were before I started hand planing in anger!

Finally, I slowed down and started thinking. I pull out the next drawer slide from the box. I extend the slide and hold it straight up and down. It doesn't move. My drawers were fine all along. The slides are so stiff that the slide, by itself, barely closes. I go through the whole box and only one slide out of 24 seems correct. Maybe 6 more are adequate but not good. The other 17 are horrible. My son removed a drawer from our kitchen with a Blum side. He blew on the slide and it rolled 21" and closed from the strength of him blowing on it!

So at this point I don't know what to do.

Do I return the Accuride slides and request more to replace the bad ones? With a score of 1 out of 24 will the rest be any better?
Maybe switch brands to another side mount slide and hope that they require the same dimensions?
Do I switch to Blum undermount slides that I am used to? This will require me to rebuild all 12 drawers!
Is it stoopid to make solid wood, dovetailed drawers? Should I just make them out of plywood and be done in a single day?
Is there a better option than one of the above?

[John TenEyck]

I know that feeling of being frustrated and not being able to think straight as a result. Don't beat yourself up. On the contrary, you deserve huge kudos for helping out a friend in need.

When you mate the two halves of side mounted slides back together you often have to open and close them again a couple of times before they work correctly. It takes quite a bit of force to do that but once the parts are properly mated they glide very easily. Have you done that? It sounds strange that so many of them are bad.

If they indeed are bad then I would go with the equivalent length KV slides. I've never had a problem with a single one of their side mounted slides, soft close or otherwise. Both brands have the same mounting tolerances so you can use your existing drawers, even the ones you planed down if you put a couple of washers between the slides and cabinet to shim them out the correct amount.

John

[andy bessette]

...Do I return the Accuride slides and request more to replace the bad ones? With a score of 1 out of 24 will the rest be any better?...
Is it stoopid to make solid wood, dovetailed drawers?...

Yes and yes.

[Malcolm McLeod]

...Do I return the Accuride slides and request more to replace the bad ones? With a score of 1 out of 24 will the rest be any better?...
Is it stoopid to make solid wood, dovetailed drawers?...

Yes and No.

Yes :: If Accuride (or their dealer) can replace them in a timely fashion, I'd give them the opportunity to make it right. Have them open a package of the replacements and demonstrate that they do function to your satisfaction.

No :: A kindness for a neighbor is never stupid.

(If you decide against the Accuride's, take a look at Hettich. I've used their under-mounts - which performed as expected and are much less than Blum and (their side-mount style) have what seems to be the standard 1/2" (12.7mm) mounting width. Plywood Co. of Ft. Worth carries their products.)

[Bill Adamsen]

I'm surprised, I have used a fair number of that slide and the 3832SC and never had an issue requiring a return. I like that the drawer math is easy (opening -1"+0.062/-0.0) but that points out that the drawer can be a bit narrower but not wider. The tech sheet says #6 euro screw or #8 pan/truss head. I have used the later because the slide is sensitive to fastener head height and I have had issues where I had to change screws. What JTE mentioned above is ringing a faint bell. Many bearing systems have issues if the middle race is not in the right place. Typically just operating them like John suggests does the trick.

I am impressed that you hand cut the drawer dovetails and I don't think that is an issue at all. If I don't buy manufactured drawers because of scheduling I make them though rarely with hand cut dovetails. Your buddy is fortunate to have such a friend!

[Raymond Fries]

I would try to fix what was made. Maybe there was just a bad batch for the glides you got.

IMO - Quality is never stoopid.

Good luck with your solution.

[Tom Jones III]

Thanks for the suggestions. I really hate subjective statements like "it feels too stiff" so I measured the amount of force required to close the freestanding drawer slides.


On average, this batch of Accuride slides required 22 oz (1.3 pounds) of force to close, with a peak of 50 oz for one slide.
I remembered that I had an Accuride slide leftover from a project 10 years ago. I dug it out of a back cabinet. You could literally hear the rust grinding in the bearings. It required 9 oz. to close!
Finally, I measured the Blum undermounts that are in my kitchen. They required 3 oz to close but really the force that was required was so small that I couldn't accurately measure it.


Tomorrow I'll call up the store I bought them from and get their opinion. I'll try for simply getting a new batch. If that doesn't work out then I'll switch to another brand of side mounts that will still fit my drawers.

It is really not much credit to me to help this family, he is former navy, works two jobs but simply doesn't make a lot of money. He has a great family with hard working and respectful young kids. It is a real joy to be able to help people like that.

[Jacques Gagnon]

Tom:

You do deserve credit; it would have been very easy to ignore their need.

On the design side: are your drawers inset or overlay? with or without false front? Just curious, since different options are available to you to avoid starting from scratch.

Along with Bill, I commend you for the hand cut dovetails. Many things qualify as stupidity; good craftsmanship and generosity are certainly not among them.

[Tom Jones III]

Thanks. The drawers are overlay using a false front. I was able to use much of the existing cabinetry so I'm in a strange place of half new build but trying to match 50 year old cabinetry that escaped the flood.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

You a great man indeed. I have no additional comments about the slides, but the world needs more people like you.
Thank you very much for helping others in need.

[Wayne Cannon]

I have the same experience that John TenEyke described -- "When you mate the two halves of side mounted slides back together you often have to open and close them again a couple of times before they work correctly. It takes quite a bit of force to do that but once the parts are properly mated they glide very easily."

I was concerned about how stiff they were initially, the same as you.

[glenn bradley]

I have had no problems with Accu ride. Something is obviously wrong here. They do move easier under load IME. The grease acts as a damper to a noticeable degree so they do not slide out quickly under their own weight if you aim one at the ground like a sword for example. There could be an 'expectation delta' that is messing you up.

[Robert Engel]

+1 on the KV slides. Never had an issue.

I ran into some stiff slides that sat around for a while. I attributed to the grease drying out. WD40 loosened them up.

[Tom Jones III]

I have the same experience that John TenEyke described -- "When you mate the two halves of side mounted slides back together you often have to open and close them again a couple of times before they work correctly. It takes quite a bit of force to do that but once the parts are properly mated they glide very easily."

I was concerned about how stiff they were initially, the same as you.

I measured the force required to close them on the first try, then I cycled the slide 10 times. It was easier to close after 10 cycles but it still required 22 oz of force to close them compared to less than 3 oz for the Blum. Finally, I cycled one of the slides 100 times. There was no change it still required 22 oz of force.

[Robert Stanton]

I have had success making drawers from 3/8" plywood. My garage drawers are regular junk Lowes ply. The drawers for my dresser were made from 3/8" baltic birch using the PC blind dovetail jig. The manual says not to use plywood but I found with patience and sufficient trial and error they make good affordable drawers.

As others have mentioned...An act of neighborly kindness is nice to see. However, do you ever wonder if non-woodworkers can really appreciate the effort of something like hand cut dovetails?

[Malcolm McLeod]

This thread may have gone stale, but a random thought found its way out. Could the fixed guides be out of parallel? If either the sides of the drawer box (that you checked), or the fixed guide mounts are out of parallel - - it might explain some of the binding.

(That you used a 'strain gauge' to measure the required force tells me a lot. So guessing that you've checked this, but thought I'd throw it over the fence...)

[Julie Moriarty]

Is it stoopid to make solid wood, dovetailed drawers? Should I just make them out of plywood and be done in a single day?
Is there a better option than one of the above?


I'm making a number of drawers for our kitchen cabinets. In the past I used solid wood but this time I went to sanded plywood. My thinking is when this house is sold it will probably be torn down and a million dollar house will be built in its place so I've been looking at all the upgrades we're doing as temporary. And if we ever get a storm surge like what was predicted with Irma, those new cabinets will be under water. As for dovetails - same line of thinking.

To me kitchen cabinets don't merit the same attention to detail as fine furniture. I've seen too many videos of new homeowners coming in with a sledge hammer and having demolishing kitchen and bathroom cabinets.

Your friend lost his kitchen cabinets in a flood. It may happen again. And all that time you spent making furniture grade cabinets will be for naught. If it were me, I'd make sure whatever I built would work well and won't make me cry next time they are submerged.